Kate and Dogs - all sorts

Opening this (this is not just about Eddie and Keela but about all other dogs) with page 86/87 of the Book:

4th May:
page 86
At about nine o’clock we all went out on to Rua Dr Agostinho da Silva
to find out what was going on and to look out for the PJ. The GNR patrol was still in evidence, although again, there didn’t seem to be much sense of urgency. So what had the police been doing? It was hard to tell. According to the PJ files, to which we did not have access until August 2008, two patrol dogs were brought to Praia da Luz at 2am on 4 May and four search-and-rescue dogs at 8am. I don’t remember seeing any police dogs until the morning, and if there were any specific police searches overnight, they were not apparent. The only searches I was aware of were those carried out by ourselves, fellow guests and the Mark Warner staff.
According to the files, the tracker dogs did not go out until 11pm on 4 May. At some point in the first twenty-four hours (I could not say when exactly, but probably that morning) I recall one of the GNR patrol officers asking us for some of Madeleine’s clothing or belongings to enable these dogs to identify her scent. I fetched the pink princess blanket she took to bed with her every night, which they took, and some of her clothes, which they didn’t.
unquote

This little gem is full of interest and contradiction.

According to the PJ files - there were two patrol dogs at 2. am.
Four search and rescue dogs at 8. am.
Tracker dogs at 11.00 am.
It seems Kate doesn't count the first 2 or 6 dogs as being of any use. Does she mean that the patrol dogs patrolled and didn't sniff anything?
That the s and e dogs weren't the right ones either?
That only the Tracker dogs could do the business?

Most interesting is the phrase 'and some of her clothes'. No way would I say that. I'd say 'and her little pink dress that she wore the day before, the pink hat she always wore - I would say which of her clothes I'd offered.
She also doesn't say why they didn't take the clothes.

On the 3rd: (23.40 phone call to Trish Cameron)

Sandy Cameron statement: “On the night of Thursday, May 3, 2007, Patricia received a telephone call from Gerry informing us of the disappearance of Madeleine. Gerry manifested all those emotions one expects from a father who has lost a child in the circumstances. He was distraught and spoke at the same time he cried. He seemed frustrated with the slowness of the searches in Portugal, with the fact that the borders had not been closed, and with the fact that sniffer dogs were not being used. Patricia and I contacted the British Embassy to try and help in this regard.”
unquote

'A Verdade Da Mentira', 'The Truth Of The Lie

30 - The possibility of searching the Tapas groups apartments is discussed. The interest is to locate Madeleine's clothes, the ones which she was wearing that day to check them for evidence of violence, for instance. However, at this stage it is considered that treating the Tapas as suspects might not be good for the investigation. Mr Amaral considers this, at present, a mistake. But there was too much pressure to investigate the abduction scenario.

31 - It seemed like it was forbidden to suspect the Tapas 7 or the parents. Diplomacy was always around. Publicly the case is treated as a kidnapping to avoid media speculation, although all possibilities are being investigated by the police and many question arise. The media frenzy gets bigger and bigger. The PJ has difficulties dealing with that. At the same time the preoccupation of the McCanns in dealing with the press is noticed.

At 22.40 the police is called. (approx)
At 23.40 Gerry complains that there are no sniffer dogs. - the police arrived from some distance away at about 23.00.

That's expecting rather a lot imo.

How soon were dogs deployed in Machynlleth? Not every police station has dog standing by.

Later Gerry complains that there were no helicopters with heat-seeking equipment.

There were helicopters used (at some considerable cost) the following day.
It was pointless to use them earlier, the heat seeking equipment would have homed in on the 'hundreds' of searchers.

Processos Volume V

Pages 1335 – 1337

Witness Statement

Date: 2007-05-16

Carlos Manuel Carvalho Lacão

Occupation: GNR Officer

He has been a GNR officer since 1988. He holds the post of soldier and currently works in the Portimao Territorial Group, working within the forensics service.

On 4th May he was called at about 01h15 when he was asleep at home, requesting him to appear at the Lagos GNR post as a small girl had disappeared. After arriving at the GNR post with his colleagues Morais and two dogs (Numi and Kit), German Shepherd dogs, which made up the search team, they immediately left for P da L. They arrived at about 02h30.

When they arrived at the scene, they entered the McCanns' apartment by the front door, and entered the living room, where there were some PJ officers as well as the McCann couple. They just talked to some colleagues from the PJ and asked for a piece of clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently. They were given a pink/orange blanket that the child had been covered with in her bed. (Kate makes this some time later in the morning - see above. She said she doesn't know about the dogs earlier than 11.00 am!)

They began searching with the dogs from the main entrance to the apartment, having given the blanket to his dog Numi to smell and begin to search.

The route initially taken was from the front entrance door to the passageway between Blocks 4 and 5, along the corridor and then along the passage that leads past the entrance to the small reception to the resort's swimming pool. After that the whole of the area surrounding the resort was searched.

With regard to the indications transmitted by his dog Numi, he says that at the beginning he was only “a little interested”, he let the dog "get on with it" .

They finished the searches at about 07h00 AM.

His dog's speciality is patrolling (Maintenance of Public Order) although the dog also has some training in "tracking".
[...]

There were some unknown people helping in the searches, especially when they arrived at the resort. Their number decreased as it got later. Between 04h00 and 07h00 basically the only people searching were the witness, his colleague and another GNR officer.

During this night as well as the following night, when he repeated the searches from 23h00 to 08h00 he did not see anyone suspicious.

He did not see Robert Murat on either of the nights. He did not search inside the apartment, just the verandas and surrounding areas.

No more is said. Reads, ratifies, signs.

Processo Volume III

Pages 762 to 765

Witness Statement

Antonio Freitas Silva

Date: 2007.05.09

Location: DIC Portimao
Occupation: 1st Sergeant GNR
Location: GNR-Queluz

The deponent states that:

• He comes to the process in the role of Chief of the GNR Search and Rescue Team. He coordinated all the work carried out by the two sniffer dogs in the Luz zone and the immediate areas relating to the disappearance of the English minor Madeleine McCann from the Ocean Club.

• He remembers that on the 4th of May of the current year, around 23h00, they attempted to tentatively identify and thus reconstruct the path taken by the missing minor. They gave the dogs a Turkish bath towel which was supposedly used by the child in question. This operation was realised by two different dogs.

• That after having given the sniffer dog the towel and next to the residence of the missing girl, more specifically, next to apartment block 5A and 5, the first sniffer dog headed toward the door of that apartment. Immediately afterward, he headed in the direction of block 4, returned around block 5, and came down a road that exists between this block and the leisure area (pools, restaurants, etc). He turned right; in the direction of the aforementioned apartment and headed toward the main road. There, he crossed the street and next to the wall of block 6, turned right, and headed toward the contiguous parking area. More concretely, he headed next to a light post and sniffed the ground around that post. After this, he crossed the street again and headed toward the access zone to the restaurants and pool area, sniffing the door which was closed at that time. He again went to the parking zone, and at that point, lost the scent.

• When carrying out this operation with the second dog, he followed the same rout, took the same direction and headed toward the light post in the parking lot mentioned above. He sniffed the area and at that point appeared to have lost the scent. The only difference was that this dog did not head toward the entrance of the restaurant or the pool area.

• None of the dogs used in this search, after having been given the towel supposedly used by the child, entered into block 5 but went immediately to the street between the apartment and the leisure area. It should be taken into account that the second sniffer dog may have been conditioned by the first sniffer dog. That is to say that in the case of doubt, the second dog may have followed the second of the first.

• Taking into account the aforementioned results, he states that it can be confirmed with a certain degree of certainty that the missing child passed by that location, on that day or on a previous day. This situation can be explained by the nature of the terrain, that is, it is a small space enclosed by walls and as such lingering scents would take longer to dissipate.

• Yesterday (08/05/2007) around 23h45, this search action was repeated but this time the dogs were sent into blocks 5 and 4 of the 'Ocean Club' resort. During this operation, and given the time that had passed combined with the heat, the results that were achieved are very relative given that the dog will confirm all the odours it scents, certainly alerting to those that are most active, namely due to the fact that the apartment was occupied. It is also noted that the dog’s perception in the interior may be affected by noise.

• The initial diligence carried out with first sniffer dog, after having sniffed the towel used in the previous operation, began searching and showing interest in some doors leading to other apartments. He did not show any interest or even approach other apartments. In none of these actions did the dog give the signal to his trainer, Soldado Fernandes. It is certain however, that the dog signalled next to apartments 5J, 5H, and 4G. He showed great interest in sniffing these doors and the immediate areas. Next to door 5H there were two bags of rubbish and the odour may have distracted the dog. Outside 4G was a tray of plates, cutlery and cloth napkins that had apparently been used. This apartment is where the parents of the missing child were staying (at the time). Concerning apartment 5J, the same may have been conditioned by the presence of people in the interior or he could have sniffed an odour that needed to be confirmed.

• He states that after the search inside block 5, and whilst in the exterior, the sniffer dog took the same route on 04/05/07, being the existent road of that apartment and the leisure area (pools and restaurant) and then went to the same parking area. At that point, the scent was lost. This situation may be related to the fact that the biggest concentration of odours are in that area and due to the fact that odours are better preserved near walls and away from major winds. It is certain that upon reaching the main road and turning right is where the biggest concentration of odours exist. This is where the dog lost interest.

• The second dog was taken through the same operation and also showed interest at the door of apartment 5J. This same dog jumped on his hind paws to the parapet of the veranda and raised his head as though in search of an odour. As related above, this interest could have been the result of various factors but it is certain that in this area the scent was intense. In the exterior, the sniffer dog immediately headed to the parking area next to block 6 and there apparently lost the scent.

• I would like to clarify that a search in a bad area, where a more intense odour perceived by the sniffer dog, such as in an urban area due to the large concentration of external odours, make it possible to confuse the dog. In this situation, search activity is very difficult as is the case when some time has passed since the event in question.

• Because he is asked, he states that in relation to this, it is difficult to evaluate precisely the work of the sniffer dog. It is clear that some conditions involved in this action augment the degree of uncertainty. The signalling of the dog may only signify that they are confirming an intense odour in a zone. On the other hand, given the interest of the dog(s) in some of the apartment doorways, this could signify nothing, but could also very well mean that the dog has caught the odour. The dog did not demonstrate to its owner that it had found the scent it was searching for.

• And nothing more was said. Reads, ratifies and signs.

from Kate's book : " I don’t remember seeing any police dogs until the morning,"
well how would she have seen the dogs there at 2 am....she did not leave to" resume" her search until 6 am did she?

I can't find it, but there are towels found at the apartment listed by the PJ. I was surprised that, IIRC, none of the towels seem to be British makes, ie brought from home. If the towels in the apartment are Portuguese, does this mean that towels are provided by Mark Warner? I would expect to take beach towels on holiday, and I would have thought this would be a source of DNA/ scent. Does anyone know if you have to provide towels?

russiandoll wrote:from Kate's book : " I don’t remember seeing any police dogs until the morning,"
well how would she have seen the dogs there at 2 am....she did not leave to" resume" her search until 6 am did she?

GNR officer: [..] and asked for a piece of clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently. They were given a pink/orange blanket that the child had been covered with in her bed. [..]

and:

Kate: GNR patrol officers asking us for some of Madeleine’s clothing or belongings to enable these dogs to identify her scent. I fetched the pink princess blanket she took to bed with her every night, which they took, and some of her clothes, which they didn’t.

No corroboration imo: the GNR asked for clothes and state clearly although they asked for clothes, they were given a blanket. No choice implied.
It does not seem that they were given a choice. The next lot got a Turkish towel.

The dismissive 'some of her clothes' not specifying anything makes me wonder if there were any clothes of Maddie left in 5a, if they were ever there in the first place. I wouldn't be so nit-picking if we hadn't been given the full description on the 'pink princess blanket' one of the main props.

[..] GNR asked for clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently.[...] so what's wrong with that much written about pink top and Monsoon shorts?

tigger Today at 3:47 pm




Opening this (this is not just about Eddie and Keela but about all other dogs) with page 86/87 of the Book:

4th May:
page 86
At about nine o’clock we all went out on to Rua Dr Agostinho da Silva
to find out what was going on and to look out for the PJ. The GNR patrol was still in evidence, although again, there didn’t seem to be much sense of urgency. So what had the police been doing? It was hard to tell. According to the PJ files, to which we did not have access until August 2008, two patrol dogs were brought to Praia da Luz at 2am on 4 May and four search-and-rescue dogs at 8am. I don’t remember seeing any police dogs until the morning, and if there were any specific police searches overnight, they were not apparent. The only searches I was aware of were those carried out by ourselves, fellow guests and the Mark Warner staff.
According to the files, the tracker dogs did not go out until 11pm on 4 May. At some point in the first twenty-four hours (I could not say when exactly, but probably that morning) I recall one of the GNR patrol officers asking us for some of Madeleine’s clothing or belongings to enable these dogs to identify her scent. I fetched the pink princess blanket she took to bed with her every night, which they took, and some of her clothes, which they didn’t.

unquote

An interesting passage, revealing an interesting attitude. That there were any searches with dogs (or indeed any police searches per se that night) taking place is apparently being questioned by the author despite the fact that, at the time of writing, the police files containing confirmation that KMcC's suppositions regarding searches were incorrect had been accessible to her since August 2008. There is no "that is how it looked at the time" or "I was not outside so unable to verify my impression that no searches were being done", simply that she was not aware at the time, therefore it must be so up to and including the time or writing. There is also a contradiction to the oft repeated claim that they were all alone that night, there was no police and nobody to help them because, as K states, at about 9am on 4 May 2007, the GNR patrol was still in evidence. Not a GNR patrol, the same one were still there not having gone away after all, which she was clearly aware of, so why say the opposite to all their friends, family and press the very next day?

worriedmum wrote:I can't find it, but there are towels found at the apartment listed by the PJ. I was surprised that, IIRC, none of the towels seem to be British makes, ie brought from home. If the towels in the apartment are Portuguese, does this mean that towels are provided by Mark Warner? I would expect to take beach towels on holiday, and I would have thought this would be a source of DNA/ scent. Does anyone know if you have to provide towels?

I expect towels were provided along with the bedding? A beach towel one would also expect, but perhaps not used.
However, a towel of Aztec design was found in a barn plus fibres that connected to the Renault. Aztec design would be likely for a beach towel I'd think.

What struck me most though is the neat way the not-so-stupid dog handler phrased this:..... asked for a piece of clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently. They were given a pink/orange blanket...

Almost biblical,asking for bread and being given a stone.

Let's think, hard to remember for Kate what Madeleine had worn or used recently - like today - like that vivid recollection - like that poolside photograph with the expensive GAP and Monsoon outfit. That must still have been knocking around the apartment. Maddie had taken it off only just before bedtime allegedly. :bad:

Kate says she was asked around or past 11.00 a.m. - the GNR say they asked her around 2.30. Nine hours difference.

Nina wrote:

tigger wrote:

worriedmum wrote:I can't find it, but there are towels found at the apartment listed by the PJ. I was surprised that, IIRC, none of the towels seem to be British makes, ie brought from home. If the towels in the apartment are Portuguese, does this mean that towels are provided by Mark Warner? I would expect to take beach towels on holiday, and I would have thought this would be a source of DNA/ scent. Does anyone know if you have to provide towels?

I expect towels were provided along with the bedding? A beach towel one would also expect, but perhaps not used.
However, a towel of Aztec design was found in a barn plus fibres that connected to the Renault. Aztec design would be likely for a beach towel I'd think.

What struck me most though is the neat way the not-so-stupid dog handler phrased this:..... asked for a piece of clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently. They were given a pink/orange blanket...

Almost biblical,asking for bread and being given a stone.

Let's think, hard to remember for Kate what Madeleine had worn or used recently - like today - like that vivid recollection - like that poolside photograph with the expensive GAP and Monsoon outfit. That must still have been knocking around the apartment. Maddie had taken it off only just before bedtime allegedly.

Kate says she was asked around or past 11.00 a.m. - the GNR say they asked her around 2.30. Nine hours difference.

Tigger on this link on Photos 12 and 13 there is what looks like a towel over the back of a dining chair, zoom in if you can...http://www.mccannfiles.com/id155.html

Definitely towel with Aztec type look about it. Would this have been issued by Mark Warner's? If not, where did it come from? bought at Baptista's? brought in the family suitcases leaving no room for Maddie's toothbrush, after the pink gap top and monsoon shorts had been squeezed in, oh, along with the little sneakers with a flashing light.

There's another Aztec looking towel visible in the background in the photo with the passports. Nr. 18.

tigger wrote:On the 3rd: (23.40 phone call to Trish Cameron)

Sandy Cameron statement: “On the night of Thursday, May 3, 2007, Patricia received a telephone call from Gerry informing us of the disappearance of Madeleine. Gerry manifested all those emotions one expects from a father who has lost a child in the circumstances. He was distraught and spoke at the same time he cried. He seemed frustrated with the slowness of the searches in Portugal, with the fact that the borders had not been closed, and with the fact that sniffer dogs were not being used. Patricia and I contacted the British Embassy to try and help in this regard.”
unquote

A father who has lost a child?

Whose child had been discovered to be not in her bed 1-2 hours ago?

Portia wrote:

tigger wrote:On the 3rd: (23.40 phone call to Trish Cameron)

Sandy Cameron statement: “On the night of Thursday, May 3, 2007, Patricia received a telephone call from Gerry informing us of the disappearance of Madeleine. Gerry manifested all those emotions one expects from a father who has lost a child in the circumstances. He was distraught and spoke at the same time he cried. He seemed frustrated with the slowness of the searches in Portugal, with the fact that the borders had not been closed, and with the fact that sniffer dogs were not being used. Patricia and I contacted the British Embassy to try and help in this regard.”
unquote

A father who has lost a child?

Whose child had been discovered to be not in her bed 1-2 hours ago?

Very odd behavior definitely. No urgency to go out and physically search. Priority was to call UK?

Kate's behavior is even odder.
To say in her bewk she was not aware that the Police deployed dogs that night is complete bullock. What did she think the Police want to do with the towel when she handed it over?

@ Aiyoyo

But see how cleverly she juxta positions the 11.00 am dogs with the 'first' search and forgets about the fact that she handed over a blanket between 2.30 and 3.00 am.

page 86:
According to the files, the tracker dogs did not go out until 11pm on 4 May. At some point in the first twenty-four hours (I could not say when exactly, but probably that morning) I recall one of the GNR patrol officers asking us for some of Madeleine’s clothing or belongings to enable these dogs to identify her scent. unquote.

See? Magic. The 2.00 am, 8.00 am dogs - six dogs - all disappeared. The handing over of the blanket is now post 11.00 am - 9 whole hours later.
The woman really annoys me sometimes.

I would be really interested to know what had happened to the clothes MM had been wearing all day on 3rd May, they would have been the most obvious thing to give to the police, unless KM had decided to wash them before going to the Tapas.

With regard to the 'last photo' is it possible that it took so long to appear either because -
a) the McCann's didn't want the police to know what MM had actually been wearing on the afternoon of May 3rd, or
b) the McCann's wanted the police to think that outfit was what MM had been wearing on 3rd May?

suzyjohnson wrote:I would be really interested to know what had happened to the clothes MM had been wearing all day on 3rd May, they would have been the most obvious thing to give to the police, unless KM had decided to wash them before going to the Tapas.

With regard to the 'last photo' is it possible that it took so long to appear either because -
a) the McCann's didn't want the police to know what MM had actually been wearing on the afternoon of May 3rd, or
b) the McCann's wanted the police to think that outfit was what MM had been wearing on 3rd May?

Why should either a or b be of any importance? It was a standard outfit for a sunny climate. Kate could have offered any other kind of clothing and they'd have been none the wiser. This was just hours after she disappeared.
The real points here imo are:
a) that Kate does not specify what clothes she allegedly offered the GNR.
b) that the GNR officer specifically states they asked for recently worn clothes and were given a blanket. No mention of clothes being offered or that they had a choice between clothes and the blanket.
They asked for x - they were given y. My guess is that y - the blanket had been recently washed or had been on a walk round the block with someone else.

To add:
- and why were the other dogs given a towel? She particularly mentions the tracker dogs not turning up until 11.00 why were they given a towel, one remove at least from a much-used blanket?

suzyjohnson wrote:I would be really interested to know what had happened to the clothes MM had been wearing all day on 3rd May, they would have been the most obvious thing to give to the police, unless KM had decided to wash them before going to the Tapas.

With regard to the 'last photo' is it possible that it took so long to appear either because -
a) the McCann's didn't want the police to know what MM had actually been wearing on the afternoon of May 3rd, or
b) the McCann's wanted the police to think that outfit was what MM had been wearing on 3rd May?

I don't think Madeleine had been wearing anything on 'May 3rd'. I think the clothes she had last worn were washed just as soon as the maintenance man had shown Kate how to use the machine, and that was much earlier in the week.
Kate has stated in her book, which is her version of the truth, so she cannot go back on it or it would be perjury, that she had bought the gap top and monsoon shorts expressly for the holiday.
If Maddie had been wearing them on 3rd, and had taken them off to get into her pyjamas, then the clothes would have been immediately ready, to hand to the police for the dogs to try to track their child, because genuine parents would so desperately have been willing to help.
Kate did not wash the clothes that evening. She has not put this in her diary, she has not written it in her book, she has not claimed or referred to it in any of her interviews on television, nor in any of her statements or questioning by police.
Even if she had done so, the clothes, wet, would still have been evidence of Maddie having had these clothes.
Furthermore cadaverine is not removed by washing as shown by Kate's magic trousers which met 6 dead bodies before she went on holiday, or did she in fact not wash them. Ugh.
Also wasn't cuddle cat washed, suncream oil and sand etc. and still get 'chosen' by the cadaver dog.

There is another fact that stands out here.

At 2.30sh AM on the 4th, the GNR were given the blanket. The very one which was seen on the first set of photographs on the bed.

The next lot of dogs were given a towel. The blanket has never been seen since.

Sometime between returning the blanket to the McCanns - it may only have been used for a short while - it disappeared. As did a blue tennis bag from the wardrobe. (I'm sure it was empty). A certain anxiety re cadaver scent? Which at the time was thought to last for no more than 30 days.

A lot of last -minute adjustments took place. If you invent a scenario you need a continuity department. Just like in the movies and even there you find big mistakes.

I think i read that clothes were given to the cleaner and were washed on the wednesday?joyce1938

joyce1938 wrote:I think i read that clothes were given to the cleaner and were washed on the wednesday?joyce1938

They were washed on the Saturday I believe. Just two days later. It was done in the OC laundry.

tigger wrote:There is another fact that stands out here.

At 2.30sh AM on the 4th, the GNR were given the blanket. The very one which was seen on the first set of photographs on the bed.

The next lot of dogs were given a towel. The blanket has never been seen since.

Sometime between returning the blanket to the McCanns - it may only have been used for a short while - it disappeared. As did a blue tennis bag from the wardrobe. (I'm sure it was empty). A certain anxiety re cadaver scent? Which at the time was thought to last for no more than 30 days.

A lot of last -minute adjustments took place. If you invent a scenario you need a continuity department. Just like in the movies and even there you find big mistakes.

It's a bit like war (remember the 'fighting fund') the first thing that goes out of the window (forgive the pun) in a war is generally the battle plan.

aquila wrote:

tigger wrote:There is another fact that stands out here.

At 2.30sh AM on the 4th, the GNR were given the blanket. The very one which was seen on the first set of photographs on the bed.

The next lot of dogs were given a towel. The blanket has never been seen since.

Sometime between returning the blanket to the McCanns - it may only have been used for a short while - it disappeared. As did a blue tennis bag from the wardrobe. (I'm sure it was empty). A certain anxiety re cadaver scent? Which at the time was thought to last for no more than 30 days.

A lot of last -minute adjustments took place. If you invent a scenario you need a continuity department. Just like in the movies and even there you find big mistakes.

It's a bit like war (remember the 'fighting fund') the first thing that goes out of the window (forgive the pun) in a war is generally the battle plan.

Ya, imagine calling the fund "fighting fund" at that stage! It's so telling.

With regard to the 'last photo' is it possible that it took so long to appear either because -
a) the McCann's didn't want the police to know what MM had actually been wearing on the afternoon of May 3rd, or
b) the McCann's wanted the police to think that outfit was what MM had been wearing on 3rd May?

Tigger - I thought this was important because, this picture did not appear until 2 or 3 weeks after MM's reported disappearance, if something had happened to her whilst she was wearing these clothes then they would not be able to hand them over to the police, therefore they wouldn't want police to see the photo of her wearing them (until they had washed them or maybe collected another set?)

Alternatively, was this picture produced so that they could avoid handing over the outfit that she was actually wearing at the time, to make it look as though she was wearing those clothes that afternoon?

I suppose your view of it's importance varies according to whether you believe something happened to MM on the 3rd or earlier in the week.

suzyjohnson wrote:With regard to the 'last photo' is it possible that it took so long to appear either because -
a) the McCann's didn't want the police to know what MM had actually been wearing on the afternoon of May 3rd, or
b) the McCann's wanted the police to think that outfit was what MM had been wearing on 3rd May?

Tigger - I thought this was important because, this picture did not appear until 2 or 3 weeks after MM's reported disappearance, if something had happened to her whilst she was wearing these clothes then they would not be able to hand them over to the police, therefore they wouldn't want police to see the photo of her wearing them (until they had washed them or maybe collected another set?)

Alternatively, was this picture produced so that they could avoid handing over the outfit that she was actually wearing at the time, to make it look as though she was wearing those clothes that afternoon?

I suppose your view of it's importance varies according to whether you believe something happened to MM on the 3rd or earlier in the week.

I can't see how this is important. If the police saw the picture some three weeks later and in the unlikely event of them asking about these clothes in particular - there are thousands of excuses that could be made. It was a borrowed dress given back, it was taken home by family etc. etc.

As far as the bolded line goes - you've totally lost me. Pass.

Wed 2nd May 2007

"... I left a little while later again, to go for a run with Matt. I'd bought a new pair of running shoes a few days before we left for Portugal, and they were certainly getting a good initiation. They were pink, which I wasn't quite sure about - I wondered how seriously a runner in pink trainers could be taken - but after a few outings in the sand they weren't looking quite so glaring and girly. As we ran along the promenade, a small dog jumped out from under a bench and attacked my right calf" unquote

I'm trying to find the other instance of her being attacked or bothered by dogs - I remember something about her being surrounded by up to 12 dogs - again when out running. Kate seems to understand dogs at least as well as she understands children..

You're right, Tigger. Dogs will go after anything which and anyone who is running [away from them]. It's their instinct :-)

tigger wrote:Wed 2nd May 2007

"... I left a little while later again, to go for a run with Matt. I'd bought a new pair of running shoes a few days before we left for Portugal, and they were certainly getting a good initiation. They were pink, which I wasn't quite sure about - I wondered how seriously a runner in pink trainers could be taken - but after a few outings in the sand they weren't looking quite so glaring and girly. As we ran along the promenade, a small dog jumped out from under a bench and attacked my right calf" unquote

I'm trying to find the other instance of her being attacked or bothered by dogs - I remember something about her being surrounded by up to 12 dogs - again when out running. Kate seems to understand dogs at least as well as she understands children..

I also recall, think she had run up the hill and the dogs were at the top apparently, as far as I remember, she said she was alone.