Re: Timeline questiom

by Paddingtom 17.08.24 11:33

Oh I say, PeterMac, thankyou. I will digest.

by crusader 17.08.24 11:38

Steve and Carolyn Carpenter, Carolyn is the one who said she heard someone calling Madeleine at 9-30 as they left the tapas.
They stayed at FP02., very near to Murat's house.

by Paddingtom 17.08.24 11:50

thankyou Crusader, you are very well informed!! thumbsup

by Bluebagthepirate 17.08.24 12:23

Anyone know why there is no rotatory interview with Caroline Carpenter because I see it was requested?

by Paddingtom 17.08.24 12:43

PeterMac quote:
"The Oldfield check from No 1, gets whooshed for No 2, then reinstated with ludicrous detail in No 3"

In Goncalo's book, he has the two timelines the other way round.

The one with the 9.35 Matt check, he calls the second. More specifically: "In the second surveillance scheme some changes appear which will not be innocent". Bless him.
Anyway, my point is, perhaps it makes more sense for them to be Goncalo's way round. i.e. theyve realised theyve got a problem and installed a 9.35 check to sort it out and are so pleased with thier work, that for version 3 they want to put some bells and whistles on it to make it really sing.
.
what do you think?

by Paddingtom 17.08.24 13:03

Notice the timeline with the 9.35 check has Gerry spelt wrong (Jerry) it was probably written by RUss

The other timeline was probably written by Gerry as his name is spelt correctly but he mentions Jane Tanner.

Russ is unlikely to call his wife Jane Tanner -just Jane as he does in the 9.35 timeline one.

by crusader 17.08.24 13:41

"Bluebagthepirate" wrote
Anyone know why there is no rotatory interview with Caroline Carpenter because I see it was requested?

I could forward a guess.
Caroline Carpenter was on a list of people requested by the McCann's by Carlos Abreu, so not a request directly from the PJ.
By this time, the investigation had begun to suspect the McCann's.

by **PeterMac** 17.08.24 13:59

Handwriting. comparison
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by Paddingtom 17.08.24 15:27

Id say its the same handwritting. Just noticed the one with the 9.35 check is first names only. Other one is surnames too,,,, not sure what this means.

Good job doctors can write so clearly eh? god forbid one of their prescriptions was misread by the pharmacy.

by Nina 17.08.24 16:49

Paddingtom wrote:Id say its the same handwritting. Just noticed the one with the 9.35 check is first names only. Other one is surnames too,,,, not sure what this means.

Good job doctors can write so clearly eh? god forbid one of their prescriptions was misread by the pharmacy.

I agree. The name Matt is exactly the same and quite distinct.

by **PeterMac** 17.08.24 19:00

It does make sense to put them the other way round.
I had assumed that MO had realised he was being set up as the "Last to see her alive' and objected,
but putting that one first, and then the group adding bits to try to make it sound more believable,
and then doing the longer version a week later with all the extraneous detail does make slightly more sense in the Humpty Dumpty McCann world)

I have just made an EDIT and amendment to the new Chapter
Many thanks.

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by Cake Lover 17.08.24 19:21

Petermac, do you think it would have been worth while their use of 'a strange man' being queried by the police? Such as 'What do you mean by strange'? They would have to reply 'Well, not one us', or 'We didn't know him'. They were surrounded by hundreds of strangers, and were themselves strangers to others. Could they have been pinned down a bit by more questioning? I don't really think so, but I haven't got a policeman's instinct or talent for eliciting more info.

by crusader 17.08.24 19:26

In the typed timeline agreed by all the tapas and McCann's, it say's Jane Tanner saw Gerry and Jez talking outside the patio gate of 5a just up the hill from the gate.

Yet when they returned to Praia da Luz with cameras, Gerry insisted he and Jez were on the other side of the road, leaving Jane in tears by telling her she was wrong.

by Cake Lover 17.08.24 22:18

Thinking about the 'strange man'; if they had been asked 'Do you mean he wasn't one of your group?' their reaction would have been interesting. Bluster and fluster, or indignation, or silence.

by Paddingtom 18.08.24 6:57

PeterMac wrote:It does make sense to put them the other way round.
I had assumed that MO had realised he was being set up as the "Last to see her alive' and objected,
but putting that one first, and then the group adding bits to try to make it sound more believable,
and then doing the longer version a week later with all the extraneous detail does make slightly more sense in the Humpty Dumpty McCann world)

I have just made an EDIT and amendment to the new Chapter
Many thanks.

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Hey Peter, RESPECT.

Good on you for being willing to assess the information and be willing to change your mind if you have good cause.

With that endorsement I think we have good cause to definitively say the 9.35 Matt check one was the second timeline, not the first.

by **PeterMac** 18.08.24 7:14

Paddingtom wrote:
. . . I think we have good cause to definitively say the 9.35 Matt check one was the second timeline, not the first.

Probably !!!!

by Bluebagthepirate 18.08.24 7:55

crusader wrote:In the typed timeline agreed by all the tapas and McCann's, it say's Jane Tanner saw Gerry and Jez talking outside the patio gate of 5a just up the hill from the gate.

Yet when they returned to Praia da Luz with cameras, Gerry insisted he and Jez were on the other side of the road, leaving Jane in tears by telling her she was wrong.

Did anyone get a statement from Jez?

by crusader 18.08.24 8:00

Jez Wilkins statements.

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by Bluebagthepirate 18.08.24 9:50

crusader wrote:Jez Wilkins statements.

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Great... look where Jez drew an X on his map for his meeting Gerry.

Very clear.

The Jane Tanner walk by never happened as Bernt pointed out.

by crusader 18.08.24 10:12

And the typed timeline handed to the PJ on the 10th May
was before the second round of interviews began.
This was in my opinion the one they wanted the police to take notice of.
Jez Wilkins wouldn't commit to a definite time he spoke to Gerry.

by Silentscope 18.08.24 13:19

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The Jane Tanner walk by never happened as Bernt pointed out.

The reasons why JT had to walk past GM and JW.

She according to her Script had to check the rear window to Madeleine's room.
She had to be far enough up the Road to be able to see the Abductor carrying a Child towards Murats house.
She had to be close enough to make her pre-arranged Description believeable.

Which is why neither JW or Gerry saw her - because she never passed them. If she was ever even there, she went left up the Pathway behind the Gardens.

by crusader 18.08.24 13:40

That is true but in her statements she said what she said.
She was not under caution so she was free to tell as many lies as she wanted wasn't she?

by Silentscope 18.08.24 14:04

Do only Suspects get Cautioned under Portugeuse Law?

Or potential Witnesses as well?

Making a False Statement to any Police force would be at least wasting Police time, or at worst Perjury / attempting to Pervert Justice if it was ever produced in Court.

by crusader 18.08.24 15:20

Perhaps that's one of the reasons they are keeping quiet.

by AnneCGuedes 18.08.24 19:23

Paddingtom wrote:
Honesty wrote:Shouldn't it be in chronological order? Perhaps it's not because it's a draft as at this stage she had not decided where to try and fit everything in.
Goncalo says it was drawn up days after the alleged disappearance.

we know this is true because it has an alarm time of 10p.m. there ia a lot of evidence, agreed by Goncalo, that the alarm was actually raised at 9.30.

21:50 according to the waiter Ricardo (Russell had only eaten 3 bites of steak when all except for Diane, left the table). The BBC, informed by Rachel's friend, said 21:45.

by AnneCGuedes 18.08.24 20:04

Silentscope wrote:
The reasons why JT had to walk past GM and JW.

She according to her Script had to check the rear window to Madeleine's room.

Where have you found this, Silentscope ?

by Silentscope 18.08.24 20:29

I believe Tanner was Verbally instructed or directed. not that she was given a written Script which she had to follow.

No actual paperwork Scripts exists as far as I am aware.

by AnneCGuedes 18.08.24 20:43

Bluebagthepirate wrote:

The Jane Tanner walk by never happened as Bernt pointed out.

The most remarkable point about these two timelines is that there is no reference to Jane walking past G and J chatting outside the gate of 5A, rua Francisco Gentil Martins, and then seeing a man with a child crossing the same street. In both timelines, the checking of 5D is associated with the presence of a stranger with a child. When she checks 5D, J sees a stranger with a child. Moreover, in Jane's account to the GNR (not the PJ) on the night of 2/3 May (reported by Silvia Baptista), she was in the corridor along the front of building 5 when she saw a man with a child in Agostinho da Silva street.
According to Russell's statement, Jane is then not going, but returning from 5D. Finally, it is worth recalling G and K's statements on this subject.
(KMC), in her statement of May 4 afternoon, "highlights that a member of the group, Russell's partner Jane, when she went to her apartment to see her children at around 9.15pm, saw about 50 metres away, in the street bordering the complex (it has to be Agostinho da Silva str), the back of a long-haired person, in what she thinks were jeans, with a child in his arms and walking very quickly."
K says ‘in her arms’ and not ‘lying on her arms’, a detail that struck Jane. This statement is very similar to the one given by GMC on May 4 morning.
Curiously, these two statements differ markedly, not from Jane's accounts during the night, but from Jane's statement on 4 May, particularly as there is no mention of Jane seeing Tannerman as she passes Gerald and Jeremy W in Francisco Gentil Martins Street.

by AnneCGuedes 18.08.24 20:47

Silentscope wrote:I believe Tanner was Verbally instructed or directed. not that she was given a written Script which she had to follow.

No actual paperwork Scripts exists as far as I am aware.

OK, thanks for replying.

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