Re: Missing Tia Sharp

by Guest 12.08.12 15:28

jd wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:
What makes my hair stand is him making a special mention that he was not allowed to go into her bedroom? I mean what prompted that information? That is a loaded message IMHO - don't be surprised there must have been a good reason for that.

Tia lived with her mother somewhere else doesn't she? isn't it 'odd' that she went to stay with her grandparents virtually every weekend and had her own bedroom there. I think so

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A police officer stands outside a block of flats,
in Mitcham, south London, where Natalie Sharp, the mother of Tia Sharp, lives

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by aiyoyo 12.08.12 15:35

Gillyspot wrote:MWT was taken in by him as he seems to have been by the McCanns - Do any of these so called "experts" know anything?

Probably not.

Just goes to show if he can get this case so wrong, would he now concede he got it wrong about the mccanns case as well?

Yet he's supposed to be a criminologist or crime expert or something like that.......with his sort of track record...who needs expert opinion?

by Gillyspot 12.08.12 15:41

I doubt MWT has been paid a penny by the Sharps - All for glory in this case sadly. On the McCann case though I am sure someone paid MWT to show their "innocence". How many so called "experts" have toed McCann party line for a shilling?

by russiandoll 12.08.12 16:38

I am bowing out of this topic now. I am beginning to feel that out of respect for this child, when we do not know why, how or by whose hand she died, speculation and comment has gone far enough, at least for me.
I am re- reading the press coverage of this case and the media, by their portrayal of SH and snippets of info about his past, together with the information released about the family set-up, have coloured the opinions of the public and the man has not yet had a trial. He might be innocent of harming Tia in any way. He might be covering for someone else and I would not be surprised to read about more arrests of family members.

by **tigger** 12.08.12 16:50

Gillyspot wrote:Tigger I can think of at least 2 scenarios whereby a body wouldn't smell to the human nose within a loft situation.

Poor Tia to have her life snuffed out so early & those who should have been protecting her only covering their own asses.

You got me confused with SmokeandMirrors, as did Christobel. I didn't post on anything like this.

by jd 12.08.12 17:39

Gillyspot wrote: Poor Tia to have her life snuffed out so early & those who should have been protecting her only covering their own asses.

I know of another case that is exactly the same!

by Olive_Boyle 12.08.12 18:47

Tony Bennett wrote:Olive_Boyle wrote, my replies in blue

Tony - the way you have replied makes it look like I was aiming my comments at you. I wasn't.

REPLY: That's simply your perception. I was merely raising 9 matters which might suggest that Murat was 'involved' in some way, especially relating to events after Madeleine was reported missing

You have moved my words around, changing the meaning of what I said.

REPLY: That's not true, either, but here once again are your actual words: "I think you can. He has been cleared, hasn't he? - of having any involvement in the McCann case - and yet people still believe (you can read it on this forum) that he is involved".

I've seen many good explanations given as answers to your questions.

REPLY: Where are they? Have you got some links? I've not seen any.

So me trying to explain my opinion probably isn't going to alter your view.

REPLY: You've stated your opinion but you haven't explained it.

Anyway I've noticed that anyone who does have a different view to you seems to get labelled a troll so I'm not going to try.

REPLY: Once again, that's incorrect, as I think 'tigger' pointed out. My nine question marks about Murat's role in this affair (and there are many other question marks, not just those nine) are questions that have never been satisfactorily answered, so far as I am aware. Could you at least answer one of the 9 questions: why in your opinion did Murat lie in at least 17 different respects, when interviewed on 14 May 2007, about his movements between 1 and 4 May 2007?

[/quote]

Alright Tony

I'll try and explain my opinions. Here is obviously not the right place so if I can find a better place to do so I will [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by aiyoyo 12.08.12 18:51

russiandoll wrote: I am bowing out of this topic now. I am beginning to feel that out of respect for this child, when we do not know why, how or by whose hand she died, speculation and comment has gone far enough, at least for me.
I am re- reading the press coverage of this case and the media, by their portrayal of SH and snippets of info about his past, together with the information released about the family set-up, have coloured the opinions of the public and the man has not yet had a trial. He might be innocent of harming Tia in any way. He might be covering for someone else and I would not be surprised to read about more arrests of family members.

Err...you could well be right that more arrests of family members may be imminent but err...isn't it reported that SH's arrested charged with her murder? Have the papers got that bit wrong or just twitterers speculating?

"Christine Sharp very often provided accommodation for Tia at weekends. She told us when we spoke to her on Monday that Tia used her home
as a bit of a refuge."

If Christine Sharp is to be believed that Tia Sharp used to stay with her at weekends, it's hardly " a bit of refuge" rather it's regular refuge, but question is refuge from what? what was she avoiding or running away from from her own home?

I suspect her demise might have been common knowledge among at some family members so question has to be asked why did they help the perpetrator cover up?

by **PeterMac** 12.08.12 19:04

Am I correct in thinking that so far all those who have said the dogs might have got it wrong were commenting about dogs that had alerted to a corpse, but the humans had not been able to find the body.
In other words to quote one of the dogs -
"Grrrr wuf wuff wuff-ing Humans"

(translation by google !)

by Woof 12.08.12 19:06

PeterMac wrote:Am I correct in thinking that so far all those who have said the dogs might have got it wrong were commenting about dogs that had alerted to a corpse, but the humans had not been able to find the body.
In other words to quote one of the dogs -
"Grrrr wuf wuff wuff-ing Humans"

(translation by google !)

Woof woof

by Guest 12.08.12 19:17

August 2012 Last updated at 17:56

mother visits Croydon shrine to daughter

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Stuart Hazell has been charged with murdering Tia Sharp

Tia Sharp's mother and stepfather have laid a tribute at the makeshift shrine near her grandmother's south London home where a body was found on Friday.

Tia, 12, was reported missing on 3 August and was last seen at the house in New Addington, Croydon.

Natalie Sharp and David Niles left a Hello Kitty doll and a white orchid.

Stuart Hazell, 37, has been charged with Tia's murder and his partner, Tia's grandmother Christine, 46, has been bailed on suspicion of murder.

A 39-year-old man who was arrested on suspicion of assisting an offender has also been bailed to return to a south London police station.
'You are safe now'
Ms Sharp and Mr Niles also left a card to Tia which read: "We love you very much, always will. Sorry baby that this should have happened."

It continued: "I wish I was there to protect you.

"We know you are safe now and and you are at home with us everywhere we go."

Ms Sharp was unable to walk unaided after she placed the tributes and kept her head buried in her partner's shoulder as they left.

On Saturday Scotland Yard apologised to Ms Sharp, from Mitcham in Surrey, over the length of time it took to find the body at her mother's house.

Dozens of bunches of flowers and toys have been left near the house by the public over the past two days.

Mr Hazel is due to appear before magistrates on Monday.

Although police are awaiting formal identification of the body found on Friday, the victim is named in the murder charge as Tia.

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by Olive_Boyle 12.08.12 19:24

I read in a newspaper today that Tia's body was found wrapped in a rug in the loft.

If this is true it seems weird that this was not spotted on the first inspection. Surely it would stick out like a sore thumb.

Also it might suggest that the Gran knew more than she is letting on, if it was a rug that was in use of course, wouldn't she be suspicious that it had suddenly gone missing.

Would a man physically be able to carry the body of a 12 year old (wrapped in a rug) up a loft ladder on his own?

I'm thinking the neighbour might have helped him carry the body up and use his side of the loft to hide her body which would explain why the Police missed it.

by Guest 12.08.12 19:26

Mother and step-father tribute Tia: 'Sorry baby, I wish I was there to protect you'

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Floral tributes for Tia Sharp
Tia Sharp's mother and step-father have left a card on the front step of her grandmother's house.

The card reads:

"Our baby Girl

We love you very much, always will

Sorry baby this never should have happened I wish I was there to protect you.

We know you're safe now and you're at home with us everywhere we go.

Love you

Mum and Dad."

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by Smokeandmirrors 12.08.12 19:35

aiyoyo wrote:
russiandoll wrote: I am bowing out of this topic now. I am beginning to feel that out of respect for this child, when we do not know why, how or by whose hand she died, speculation and comment has gone far enough, at least for me.
I am re- reading the press coverage of this case and the media, by their portrayal of SH and snippets of info about his past, together with the information released about the family set-up, have coloured the opinions of the public and the man has not yet had a trial. He might be innocent of harming Tia in any way. He might be covering for someone else and I would not be surprised to read about more arrests of family members.

Err...you could well be right that more arrests of family members may be imminent but err...isn't it reported that SH's arrested charged with her murder? Have the papers got that bit wrong or just twitterers speculating?

"Christine Sharp very often provided accommodation for Tia at weekends. She told us when we spoke to her on Monday that Tia used her home
as a bit of a refuge."

If Christine Sharp is to be believed that Tia Sharp used to stay with her at weekends, it's hardly " a bit of refuge" rather it's regular refuge, but question is refuge from what? what was she avoiding or running away from from her own home?

I suspect her demise might have been common knowledge among at some family members so question has to be asked why did they help the perpetrator cover up?

"a bit of refuge" might be another bit of forensic linguistics. There were two young boys by Mr Niles - if for example Christine did not get along with Mr Niles, it might be a little bit of a swipe at his family. Implying Tia enjoyed getting away from her family home. Or, it could be to create the impression that her home was a cosy safe place for Tia to be, hence no harm could befall her there, so said perhaps as a defensive comment?

This may be a piece of speculation too far, and only my idea and not based on anything I've heard or read in media, but just an observation, but there has been no mention whatsoever as far as I am aware that either of Christines grandson's (Tia's half brothers) spend or spent any time at that home with their grandma. Perhaps it will be revealed in due course.

by Guest 12.08.12 20:01

So many heartbreaking pictures here of Tia's mother and all her family laying flowers..........

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by Guest 12.08.12 20:27

candyfloss wrote:So many heartbreaking pictures here of Tia's mother and all her family laying flowers..........

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I don't know how Tia's mum will ever come to terms with the fact her own mother was involved in her daughters death.

by Guest 12.08.12 20:31

admin wrote:
candyfloss wrote:So many heartbreaking pictures here of Tia's mother and all her family laying flowers..........

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I don't know how Tia's mum will ever come to terms with the fact her own mother was involved in her daughters death.

She hasn't been charged with anything though, but released on bail. Don't quite know what that means, as they charged SH quick enough. I know that Rebekah Brooks was bailed wasn't she then charged a couple of months later. Can someone explain, does it mean they are going through more evidence?

by Woof 12.08.12 20:37

admin wrote:
candyfloss wrote:So many heartbreaking pictures here of Tia's mother and all her family laying flowers..........

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I don't know how Tia's mum will ever come to terms with the fact her own mother was involved in her daughters death.

May they find the strength and courage to face the difficult road ahead. And may those who have lied and covered up now do the decent thing.

by Guest 12.08.12 20:45

Tia Sharp: Father speaks of horror at being yards from her body during search

Tia Sharp’s father has spoken of his horror at being only feet away from his daughter’s dead body when he joined the desperate hunt to find her last week.

By Martin Evans, Crime Correspondent

1:56PM BST 12 Aug 2012

Steven Carter said he has been left devastated by her death adding: “I didn’t think it would end like this.”

His comments came as Stuart Hazell, 37, the boyfriend of Tia’s grandmother, was charged with murdering the schoolgirl.

Mr Carter, who lives in Northampton, said he had travelled to south London to help in the search when his daughter was first reported missing.

He said his first stop had been at her grandmother, Christine Sharp's house, but he had not been allowed entry.

He explained: “Now it seems so much harder, because when I was outside that house, I was probably only feet away from her body, and to know that is heart-breaking.”

Mr Carter, who is separated from Tia’s mother, Natalie, added: “It has hit us all very hard. In my wildest thoughts I didn't think it would end like this.

"I know the police have done their job and I'm grateful, but I think they could have investigated that house more from the start.

"I am devastated. I will never get to see my little girl again. I will never be able to hold her and kiss her."

Mr Hazell, who was charged with Tia’s murder overnight and will appear in court tomorrow.

Tia’s grandmother Mrs Sharp, was also arrested on suspicion of murder but has since been bailed.

Paul Meehan, 39 - Tia's grandmother's next door neighbour - was arrested on suspicion of assisting an offender, but has also been bailed.

Mr Carter revealed how he had received a telephone call from David Niles, Natalie's current boyfriend, to say she was missing at 1.15am last Saturday.

The 30-year-old claims Mr Niles told him not to worry because he thought Tia was staying at a friends' house - but later on Saturday morning he received another call "to say it had turned to critical".

Mr Carter dropped his partner Melissa and son Thomas, 8, in south Devon, where they were heading at the time for a holiday, and then drove up to New Addington.

He arrived at 4pm on Saturday and immediately began helping to search for missing Tia.

Mr Carter added: "That first night I got to New Addington, I stayed outside the house and they wouldn't let me in.

"If I had known then what I know now, I would have gone into the house and searched it myself. I hope the police get everyone involved in this now for justice for my daughter."

Police removed the body from 20 The Lindens, at around 11.30pm on Friday night but on Saturday the Met admitted "human error" had delayed finding the body for days.

Officers released a statement apologising for any "distress" caused and said a personal apology had been given to Tia's mother, Natalie.

A post-mortem examination to formally identify the body and determine a cause of death is due to resume today.

Meanwhile locals on the New Addington estate have said they are frightened to let their children play outside.

Karen Browns, 52, said: "For the first couple of weeks of the summer holidays that park was full of children playing. But in the past week there has been an eerie silence.

"Parents aren't letting their kids play outside. It is like a ghost town. People in this area are scared. They don't know who to trust anymore."

Mother-of-two Collette O'Brien spent everyday last week handing out leaflets and talking to shopkeepers trying to find Tia Sharp.

She said: "Tia was just a baby, she was only 12 years-old. It is so tragic this has happened.

"I am scared for my 12 year-old daughter to go out. I make her text me 24/7.

"This has happened on my doorstep and I'm scared. You don't know who might be living next door to you.

"The area has been emptied because of this. It is like a ghost town. The parks and streets are empty because people are afraid. For a child to die, it is just horrific."

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by **Tony Bennett** 12.08.12 21:07

candyfloss wrote:She hasn't been charged with anything though, but released on bail. Don't quite know what that means, as they charged SH quick enough. I know that Rebekah Brooks was bailed wasn't she then charged a couple of months later. Can someone explain, does it mean they are going through more evidence?

It means:

1. They think they have enough evidence to charge Stuart Hazell with murder

2. At present, they do not have enough evidence to charge either of the other two with anything. The grandmother was arrested on SUSPICION OF MURDER ('grounds to suspect...'). They do not have enough evidence to charge her but are continung to investigate the matter. Normally you are bailed for a specified period, say 4, 6 or 8 weeks, and asked to report at a police station at a certain date or time.

Then you will either be released, charged, or maybe bailed again for another few weeks while they gather more evidence

by Guest 12.08.12 21:10

Tony Bennett wrote:
candyfloss wrote:She hasn't been charged with anything though, but released on bail. Don't quite know what that means, as they charged SH quick enough. I know that Rebekah Brooks was bailed wasn't she then charged a couple of months later. Can someone explain, does it mean they are going through more evidence?
It means:

1. They think they have enough evidence to charge Stuart Hazell with murder

2. At present, they do not have enough evidence to charge either of the other two with anything. The grandmother was arrested on SUSPICION OF MURDER ('grounds to suspect...'). They do not have enough evidence to charge her but are continung to investigate the matter. Normally you are bailed for a specified period, say 4, 6 or 8 weeks, and asked to report at a police station at a certain date or time.

Then you will either be released, charged, or maybe bailed again for another few weeks while they gather more evidence

Thanks Tony, [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by AskTheDogsSandra 12.08.12 21:11

It's a tragic, shocking and numbing thing to happen to this child. You can feel the pain in the words that these people are saying. So many lives affected. I hope Tia didn't suffer too much. You have to wonder why people have tried to cover up her death and parade themselves in Tshirts claiming she was missing. Only evil scum would do something like that to a child.

by aiyoyo 12.08.12 21:23

It is believed, however, that the bus driver told police he saw Tia leave her grandmother’s house and walk down the path towards the end of the street the day she was reported missing.
His information may have thrown officers off the scent after their initial line of inquiry had been that Mr Hazell had been the last person to see Tia alive.

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So it goes to show not only sardine munchers can be thrown off the trail or line of inquiry?

After this case which bears so many parallels to the other high profile one, I wonder whether Andy Redwood will change his decision or move the percentage of the chances of his belief of Madeleine being alive or sadly dead or do the wise thing and recommend that mccanns and friends should be re-looked at properly?

by ProfessorPPlum 12.08.12 21:35

After this case which bears so many parallels to the other high profile one, I wonder whether Andy Redwood will change his decision or move the percentage of the chances of his belief of Madeleine being alive or sadly dead or do the wise thing and recommend that mccanns and friends should be re-looked at properly?

Hear hear. Andy Redwood - do something out of the ordinary, in memory of Tia. Do the RIGHT thing - please.

by aiyoyo 12.08.12 21:44

AskTheDogsSandra wrote:It's a tragic, shocking and numbing thing to happen to this child. You can feel the pain in the words that these people are saying. So many lives affected. I hope Tia didn't suffer too much. You have to wonder why people have tried to cover up her death and parade themselves in Tshirts claiming she was missing. Only evil scum would do something like that to a child.

Don't forget people were fooled by the perpetrator from the word GO, and many good hearted people helped searched for her and they didn't give up until the body was discovered.

Some 60 sightings were reported in within a short few days, this in spite the fact her body laid in the house all along. Just goes to show people don't have to wait to be implored or begged to search - they naturally did it out of good faith, and a genuine belief she was missing. No wonder people are rightly fury at the deceit and the Police blunders at the initial searches.

eta: ambassador kate silence on this is deafening.......not even a word of empathic or condolence for Tia's mum and family.
It's apparent she's avoiding this like plague in case people are reminded of all the parallels and all the holes in her story.

by Woof 12.08.12 22:55

aiyoyo wrote: It's apparent she's avoiding this like plague in case people are reminded of all the parallels and all the holes in her story.

Well said, aiyoyo.

by **PeterMac** 12.08.12 23:09

It is a dreadful outcome for TM.
The dogs alerted, but the humans refused to believe them, and did not locate what the dogs were indicating.
So the humans then resorted to saying the dogs might be mistaken,
Eventually a human made the decision that the dogs were right, and the proper search, relying on the integrity of the dogs, was made.
The dogs were once again proved to be right.

This goes right to the heart of the case.

by Ribisl 12.08.12 23:22

aiyoyo wrote:[quote="
eta: ambassador kate silence on this is deafening.......not even a word of empathic or condolence for Tia's mum and family.
It's apparent she's avoiding this like plague in case people are reminded of all the parallels and all the holes in her story.

KM would also avoid these faked missing children's cases like plague because they don't fit in with her image. We must remember we are dealing with a couple of highly ambitious achievers and social climbers who want nothing better than to rub shoulders with the rich and the famous. Kate doesn't work any more; she does charities. No way she would want to be associated with the scums from sink estates.

by Guest 12.08.12 23:27

PeterMac wrote:It is a dreadful outcome for TM.
The dogs alerted, but the humans refused to believe them, and did not locate what the dogs were indicating.
So the humans then resorted to saying the dogs might be mistaken,
Eventually a human made the decision that the dogs were right, and the proper search, relying on the integrity of the dogs, was made.
The dogs were once again proved to be right.

This goes right to the heart of the case.

***
Amen, PeterMac. And all of this for the love of a toy.
Tennisball for Eddie, rubber ring for this EVRD.

by **PeterMac** 12.08.12 23:29

Email to Missing Persons

I refer to the recent entry on your web site about the girl Tia Sharp.
Now she has been found, dead, you have simply removed the entry with no explanation.
She has simply been wiped from your memory, as if she never existed, and as if her short life and death were of no value.
There is no message of condolence, no sympathy shown, and no acceptance that you were misled into thinking that she was missing, rather than the victim of a domestic murder.

May I suggest wording along these lines.

"Sorry, we made a huge error and were sucked into a long attempt to mislead you, the public.
We believed a man who has convictions and has served considerable time in prison for drug dealing and possession of offensive weapon, and who is now accused of murder, and did not listen to professionals in the field of missing persons who always say you should look at the family.
We got it badly wrong.
We are very sorry.
Lessons have been learned and we shall now re-examine every one of our other posted Missing persons in the light of what we are told by people who know what they are talking about.
We also intend, as a matter of urgency, to treat with considerable suspicion any family member of a person reported missing who seeks to put him or herself in the public eye"

That might do it, and get you some credibility back.

Yours sincerely
Peter Mac
other details
(Follower of the Madeleine case since 2007.)