This just gone on to Daily Mail.

by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 12:58

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by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 13:00

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The title is still a little biased but there are some facts in the article.

by **Tony Bennett** 25.01.15 13:16

ScarletLaw wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Kate and Gerry McCann suffered 'anguish, rage and desperation' from ex-police chief's book about missing Madeleine, judge finds

But Emilio Melo e Castro says pain they felt existed before publication

Goncalo Amaral claims they faked disappearance to cover up death

Finding emerges ahead of final judgement in long-running libel trial

McCanns accuse former detective of hampering the search for girl

By [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Published: 11:41, 25 January 2015 | Updated: 12:12, 25 January 2015

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Parents: Kate and Gerry McCann were hurt by a controversial book about their missing daughter

Kate and Gerry McCann were hurt by a controversial book about their missing daughter written by the ex-police chief tasked with finding her, a libel judge has said.

But the pain the couple feel existed before Goncalo Amaral published astonishing claims they faked Madeleine McCann’s disappearance to cover up her death in their holiday apartment, Emilio Melo e Castro ruled.

The finding came out of a key hearing on Wednesday in Lisbon ahead of a final judgement in the long-running £1million libel trial which has pitted the McCanns against the disgraced former detective they accuse of hampering the search for their daughter.

The judge presiding over the high-profile case ruled on 37 points she found had been proven and not proven since lawyers started their court battle in October 2013.

She said statements made by Mr Amaral in his July 2008 book The Truth of The Lie and a subsequent TV documentary and Portuguese newspaper interview had left the McCanns suffering ‘rage, desperation, anguish, worry, insomnia and lack of appetite’.

But she ruled that although the book had affected the couple, those feelings pre-existed the book's publication three days after the first Portuguese investigation into Madeleine’s disappearance was shelved and the McCanns were told they were no longer ‘arguidos’ (formal suspects).

Mrs Melo e Castro also ruled it had not been proven Kate and Gerry, from Rothley, Leicestershire, were ‘completely destroyed, from a moral, social, ethical, sentimental and family perspective beyond the pain their daughter’s absence causes them’ by statements made in Amaral’s book.

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Former police chief: The judge said statements made by Goncalo Amaral in his book The Truth of The Lie and a subsequent TV documentary and Portuguese newspaper interview had left the McCanns suffering 'rage'

She also decided it had been proven the couple felt badly about being considered responsible for hiding their daughter’s body - a thesis which Portuguese police behind a new probe into Madeleine’s disappearance have publicly rubbished - but described those feelings as ‘expectable.’

But she dismissed the idea Mr Amaral’s claims about the McCanns had stopped the Portuguese police investigating Madeleine’s disappearance.

The rulings left Mr Amaral confident of court victory next month when the judge is expected to announce her final verdict in open court before releasing her sentence in writing.

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Still missing: Portuguese prosecutors reopened their probe into Madeleine’s disappearance last year

He accused the McCanns of taking him to court so they could exonerate themselves of blame for the disappearance of their daughter, who vanished aged three from their Praia da Luz holiday flat in May 2007 while they were eating tapas nearby with friends.

Portuguese papers signalled the outcome of last Wednesday’s hearing as a positive one for heart specialist Gerry and Kate moments after it finished.

But as the full findings became apparent they changed their tune to portray the judge’s rulings as a slap in the face for the couple.

Leading Portuguese daily Correio da Manha headlined an article on the result of the hearing: ‘McCanns destroyed before the book.’

Rival Jornal de Noticias reported: ‘Judge without proof that the book about Maddie "destroyed" her parents.’

The McCanns told the Lisbon court staging the Amaral libel trial last summer they were left ‘devastated and crushed’ by his book, which sold around 120,000 copies before it was withdrawn when the British couple won an injunction against the ex-police chief.

Mrs McCann, 47, said Madeleine’s twin siblings Sean and Amelie, now ten, knew Mr Amaral had written a book but didn’t know the detail.

She told the court last July after applying to make a statement: ‘I believe that’s what's in Mr Amaral’s book and the documentary is very distressing to adults. To a child it could be very damaging.’

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Legal case: The rulings left Mr Amaral (pictured) confident of court victory next month when as expected the judge announces her final verdict in open court before releasing her sentence in writing

Asked by the judge how she felt after reading the book, she said: ‘I was devastated. It made me feel quite desperate because of the injustice I felt towards my daughter and our family as a whole.

‘It was very painful to read and I felt sad for Madeleine. I also felt anxious and fearful because of the damage I felt it was doing in Portugal.’

She went on to accuse Mr Amaral, thrown off the Madeleine McCann investigation in 2007 for criticising British police, of ‘consistently smearing’ she and Gerry - and claimed they feared the book may have stopped people coming forward with information about their daughter’s whereabouts.

It has already been revealed Mr Amaral, 56, earned at least £344,000 from his book and TV documentary. The ex-police chief, who is being sued for £1million, is denying defamation.

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Case: Mr and Mrs McCann arrive for the libel case against Mr Amaral at Lisbon's Palace of Justice last June. "I was devastated. It made me feel quite desperate because of the injustice I felt towards my daughter and our family as a whole" - Kate McCann

His lawyer Miguel Cruz Rodrigues claimed in the last open court hearing in December the McCanns had taken legal action against his client ‘to rid themselves of guilt for their negligent conduct’ in leaving Madeleine and her siblings alone.

He also claimed their lack of cooperation with the Portuguese police authorities had led to the archiving of the investigation in 2008.

Portuguese prosecutors reopened their probe into Madeleine’s disappearance last year and are conducting a separate investigation to one led by Scotland Yard.

No date has been set yet for the final judgement in the libel case. The judgement will be read out in court before being released in writing on the same day.

A source close to the McCanns said last night: ‘We expect it to be ready for next month.’

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by aiyoyo 25.01.15 13:20

None of the news outlet mention the WOC documentation which Mcs are tasked to produce.

The public should know Mcs made Madeleine WOC and have no authority to represent her unless granted permission by the Court. And that unless they produce said documentation, Maddie's name has to be deleted from the suit.

by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 13:22

Tony Bennett wrote:
ScarletLaw wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Kate and Gerry McCann suffered 'anguish, rage and desperation' from ex-police chief's book about missing Madeleine, judge finds

But Emilio Melo e Castro says pain they felt existed before publication
Goncalo Amaral claims they faked disappearance to cover up death
Finding emerges ahead of final judgement in long-running libel trial
McCanns accuse former detective of hampering the search for girl

By [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Published: 11:41, 25 January 2015 | Updated: 12:12, 25 January 2015

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Parents: Kate and Gerry McCann were hurt by a controversial book about their missing daughter

Kate and Gerry McCann were hurt by a controversial book about their missing daughter written by the ex-police chief tasked with finding her, a libel judge has said.

But the pain the couple feel existed before Goncalo Amaral published astonishing claims they faked Madeleine McCann’s disappearance to cover up her death in their holiday apartment, Emilio Melo e Castro ruled.

The finding came out of a key hearing on Wednesday in Lisbon ahead of a final judgement in the long-running £1million libel trial which has pitted the McCanns against the disgraced former detective they accuse of hampering the search for their daughter.

The judge presiding over the high-profile case ruled on 37 points she found had been proven and not proven since lawyers started their court battle in October 2013.

She said statements made by Mr Amaral in his July 2008 book The Truth of The Lie and a subsequent TV documentary and Portuguese newspaper interview had left the McCanns suffering ‘rage, desperation, anguish, worry, insomnia and lack of appetite’.

But she ruled that although the book had affected the couple, those feelings pre-existed the book’s publication three days after the first Portuguese investigation into Madeleine’s disappearance was shelved and the McCanns were told they were no longer ‘arguidos’ (formal suspects).

Mrs Melo e Castro also ruled it had not been proven Kate and Gerry, from Rothley, Leicestershire, were ‘completely destroyed, from a moral, social, ethical, sentimental and family perspective beyond the pain their daughter’s absence causes them’ by statements made in Amaral’s book.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Former police chief: The judge said statements made by Goncalo Amaral in his book The Truth of The Lie and a subsequent TV documentary and Portuguese newspaper interview had left the McCanns suffering 'rage'

She also decided it had been proven the couple felt badly about being considered responsible for hiding their daughter’s body - a thesis which Portuguese police behind a new probe into Madeleine’s disappearance have publicly rubbished - but described those feelings as ‘expectable.’

But she dismissed the idea Mr Amaral’s claims about the McCanns had stopped the Portuguese police investigating Madeleine’s disappearance.

The rulings left Mr Amaral confident of court victory next month when the judge is expected to announce her final verdict in open court before releasing her sentence in writing.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Still missing: Portuguese prosecutors reopened their probe into Madeleine’s disappearance last year

He accused the McCanns of taking him to court so they could exonerate themselves of blame for the disappearance of their daughter, who vanished aged three from their Praia da Luz holiday flat in May 2007 while they were eating tapas nearby with friends.

Portuguese papers signalled the outcome of last Wednesday’s hearing as a positive one for heart specialist Gerry and Kate moments after it finished.

But as the full findings became apparent they changed their tune to portray the judge’s rulings as a slap in the face for the couple.

Leading Portuguese daily Correio da Manha headlined an article on the result of the hearing: ‘McCanns destroyed before the book.’

Rival Jornal de Noticias reported: ‘Judge without proof that the book about Maddie "destroyed" her parents.’

The McCanns told the Lisbon court staging the Amaral libel trial last summer they were left ‘devastated and crushed’ by his book, which sold around 120,000 copies before it was withdrawn when the British couple won an injunction against the ex-police chief.

Mrs McCann, 47, said Madeleine’s twin siblings Sean and Amelie, now ten, knew Mr Amaral had written a book but didn’t know the detail.

She told the court last July after applying to make a statement: ‘I believe that’s what's in Mr Amaral’s book and the documentary is very distressing to adults. To a child it could be very damaging.’

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Legal case: The rulings left Mr Amaral (pictured) confident of court victory next month when as expected the judge announces her final verdict in open court before releasing her sentence in writing

Asked by the judge how she felt after reading the book, she said: ‘I was devastated. It made me feel quite desperate because of the injustice I felt towards my daughter and our family as a whole.

‘It was very painful to read and I felt sad for Madeleine. I also felt anxious and fearful because of the damage I felt it was doing in Portugal.’

She went on to accuse Mr Amaral, thrown off the Madeleine McCann investigation in 2007 for criticising British police, of ‘consistently smearing’ she and Gerry - and claimed they feared the book may have stopped people coming forward with information about their daughter’s whereabouts.

It has already been revealed Mr Amaral, 56, earned at least £344,000 from his book and TV documentary. The ex-police chief, who is being sued for £1million, is denying defamation.

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Case: Mr and Mrs McCann arrive for the libel case against Mr Amaral at Lisbon's Palace of Justice last June. "I was devastated. It made me feel quite desperate because of the injustice I felt towards my daughter and our family as a whole" - Kate McCann

His lawyer Miguel Cruz Rodrigues claimed in the last open court hearing in December the McCanns had taken legal action against his client ‘to rid themselves of guilt for their negligent conduct’ in leaving Madeleine and her siblings alone.

He also claimed their lack of cooperation with the Portuguese police authorities had led to the archiving of the investigation in 2008.

Portuguese prosecutors reopened their probe into Madeleine’s disappearance last year and are conducting a separate investigation to one led by Scotland Yard.

No date has been set yet for the final judgement in the libel case. The judgement will be read out in court before being released in writing on the same day.

A source close to the McCanns said last night: ‘We expect it to be ready for next month.’
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"He also claimed their lack of cooperation with the Portuguese police authorities had led to the archiving of the investigation in 2008" - This is a good bit to get in.

by stillsloppingout 25.01.15 14:21

speaking of the daily mail check out there report about calpol

doctors are warning that overdosing on the stuff can cause serious illness or in some cases four a year DEATH .
could somebody please post the link .as it exactly fits my theory she od d on calpol . administered by more than one doctor hence the pact . imo

by String 25.01.15 14:28

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by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 14:31

stillsloppingout wrote:speaking of the daily mail check out there report about calpol

doctors are warning that overdosing on the stuff can cause serious illness or in some cases four a year DEATH .
could somebody please post the link .as it exactly fits my theory she od d on calpol . administered by more than one doctor hence the pact . imo

I've always felt in order for the twins to have slept so long that they weren't give Calpol and more likely something like Benedryl, or something connected to making someone drowsy. I think this medicine is the reason Gerrys' credit cards disappeared because there's something on here that shows a drug brought.

by stillsloppingout 25.01.15 14:49

ScarletLaw wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:speaking of the daily mail check out there report about calpol

doctors are warning that overdosing on the stuff can cause serious illness or in some cases four a year DEATH .
could somebody please post the link .as it exactly fits my theory she od d on calpol . administered by more than one doctor hence the pact . imo

I've always felt in order for the twins to have slept so long that they weren't give Calpol and more likely something like Benedryl, or something connected to making someone drowsy. I think this medicine is the reason Gerrys' credit cards disappeared because there's something on here that shows a drug brought.

for sure she was probably given a combination of stuff with deadly concequences . could this piece be pre emptive ?.
i think it needs its own thread .

by Doug D 25.01.15 14:59

Isn’t it good to read the bollocks in The Mail:

‘the disgraced former detective’

‘Portuguese papers signalled the outcome of last Wednesday’s hearing as a positive one for heart specialist Gerry and Kate moments after it finished.
But as the full findings became apparent they changed their tune to portray the judge’s rulings as a slap in the face for the couple.’

Clearly not the reliable English papers though (duh! Express?) And it’s the papers that are blamed for the story, when we are reliably informed by Anne Guedes that there were no reporters in Court and the three 'outside' people in the courtroom were not given direct access to the Judges ‘facts’.

‘No date has been set yet for the final judgement in the libel case. The judgement will be read out in court before being released in writing on the same day.
A source close to the McCanns said last night: ‘We expect it to be ready for next month.’

CM not in complete hiding then!

eta. Just re-reading:

'The judgement will be read out in court before being released in writing on the same day.'

I don't think that's right either.

by mysterion 25.01.15 15:19

Just checked our medicine cabinet. We have 3 types of otc cought medicines. Only one allowed for children under 12 years of age. A mistaken double dose on a 3 year old of either of the other 2 sound dangerous.

by **Tony Bennett** 25.01.15 15:29

Daily Mail/Mail on Sunday allowing comments - but only of course if they back up the official version that Madeleine was abducted when the McCanns were dining at the Tapas bar...

+++++++++++++++++++++++++

The comments below have been moderated in advance.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], London, about 2 hours ago

I know this might sound cruel, and most people feel sorry for the McCanns, but this story has been kept going by the press for far to long now, how many other parents have lost their child, and come to terms with it. Let them not forget but look forward to the future.

Like: 195

Unlike 51

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Southampton, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

I wonder how much "anguish and desperation" the poor little girl suffered as a result of her parents being absent when she was at her most vulnerable?

Like: 412

Unlike: 49

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Doncaster, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

i am sorry but like me many people would love the mcanns to do a lie detector test because i still think there is and always have been something fishy about this case

Like: 353

Unlike: 68

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Basingstoke, about 2 hours ago

Don't forget DM after initiating this action against the Portuguese copper several years ago, the poor parents have less than 30 days to provide the proof from the High Court in London that they have a legal right to sue in their daughters name.....a bit crucial that.

Like: 91

Unlike: 36

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], York, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

If only..........

Like: 66

Unlike: 4

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], manchester, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

Some of us felt anger and rage at the thought of you leaving your very young children alone while you went out for a meal.

Like: 369

Unlike: 34

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Stoke-on-Trent, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

Fact...they should never have left that child alone. Full stop.

Like: 384

Unlike: 35

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], uk, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

Grieving parents eh!

Like: 224

Unlike: 35

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], upnorth, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

What about Ben Needams parents. There was no world wide search for him.

Like: 304

Unlike: 14

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Darlington, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

The parents' anguish, rage and desperation will be as nothing compared to Madeleine's if she is still alive, not to mention her confusion and terror.

Like: 264

Unlike: 17

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Luxor, Egypt, about 3 hours ago

Just think: if they hadn't left the poor kid alone that night, they could have saved themselves all this aggro, not to mention that they'd still be the happy parents of little Maddie as well! I hope that everyone else has learned this hard lesson?

Like: 322

Unlike: 28

The views expressed in the contents above are those of our users and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Mail on Sunday

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by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 15:37

stillsloppingout wrote:
ScarletLaw wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:speaking of the daily mail check out there report about calpol

doctors are warning that overdosing on the stuff can cause serious illness or in some cases four a year DEATH .
could somebody please post the link .as it exactly fits my theory she od d on calpol . administered by more than one doctor hence the pact . imo

I've always felt in order for the twins to have slept so long that they weren't give Calpol and more likely something like Benedryl, or something connected to making someone drowsy. I think this medicine is the reason Gerrys' credit cards disappeared because there's something on here that shows a drug brought.
for sure she was probably given a combination of stuff with deadly concequences . could this piece be pre emptive ?.
i think it needs its own thread .

Could be. From other accounts Madeleine was a sparky little girl and quite a handful and maybe, just my opinion, she could've been given something quite regular for sleeping or if she developed a tolerance level, a dose to strong maybe. Also being doctors they could have been giving the kids something that they weren't allowed to from the hospital, or the other doctors in the group giving it to them (explaining their involvement to not squeal). But my feeling is that there's something implicated on those credit cards. Either way, with Kate checking on the twins breathing and insisting on running their own tests on the Twins hair, only for much later her mother saying that the twins could've been drugged, while the McCanns denied flatly to the press at the beginning that any sedation took place? All very suspicious. Amaral should've grabbed those twins hair straight away, I'm not sure why he didn't but it was a big mistake on his part not to have done.

by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 15:47

ScarletLaw wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:
ScarletLaw wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:speaking of the daily mail check out there report about calpol

doctors are warning that overdosing on the stuff can cause serious illness or in some cases four a year DEATH .
could somebody please post the link .as it exactly fits my theory she od d on calpol . administered by more than one doctor hence the pact . imo

I've always felt in order for the twins to have slept so long that they weren't give Calpol and more likely something like Benedryl, or something connected to making someone drowsy. I think this medicine is the reason Gerrys' credit cards disappeared because there's something on here that shows a drug brought.
for sure she was probably given a combination of stuff with deadly concequences . could this piece be pre emptive ?.
i think it needs its own thread .

Could be. From other accounts Madeleine was a sparky little girl and quite a handful and maybe, just my opinion, she could've been given something quite regular for sleeping or if she developed a tolerance level, a dose to strong maybe. Also being doctors they could have been giving the kids something that they weren't allowed to from the hospital, or the other doctors in the group giving it to them (explaining their involvement to not squeal). But my feeling is that there's something implicated on those credit cards. Either way, with Kate checking on the twins breathing and insisting on running their own tests on the Twins hair, only for much later her mother saying that the twins could've been drugged, while the McCanns denied flatly to the press at the beginning that any sedation took place? All very suspicious. Amaral should've grabbed those twins hair straight away, I'm not sure why he didn't but it was a big mistake on his part not to have done.

Also as a colleague pointed out; " the twins could've been put to sleep because the party of people knew they be busy that night and wouldn't have the time to get them back to sleep if they woke up." Chilling, but could be true.

by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 15:53

Tony Bennett wrote: Daily Mail/Mail on Sunday allowing comments - but only of course if they back up the official version that Madeleine was abducted when the McCanns were dining at the Tapas bar...

+++++++++++++++++++++++++

The comments below have been moderated in advance.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], London, about 2 hours ago

I know this might sound cruel, and most people feel sorry for the McCanns, but this story has been kept going by the press for far to long now, how many other parents have lost their child, and come to terms with it. Let them not forget but look forward to the future.

Like: 195

Unlike 51

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Southampton, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

I wonder how much "anguish and desperation" the poor little girl suffered as a result of her parents being absent when she was at her most vulnerable?

Like: 412

Unlike: 49

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Doncaster, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

i am sorry but like me many people would love the mcanns to do a lie detector test because i still think there is and always have been something fishy about this case

Like: 353

Unlike: 68

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Basingstoke, about 2 hours ago

Don't forget DM after initiating this action against the Portuguese copper several years ago, the poor parents have less than 30 days to provide the proof from the High Court in London that they have a legal right to sue in their daughters name.....a bit crucial that.

Like: 91

Unlike: 36

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], York, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

If only..........

Like: 66

Unlike: 4

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], manchester, United Kingdom, about 2 hours ago

Some of us felt anger and rage at the thought of you leaving your very young children alone while you went out for a meal.

Like: 369

Unlike: 34

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Stoke-on-Trent, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

Fact...they should never have left that child alone. Full stop.

Like: 384

Unlike: 35

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], uk, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

Grieving parents eh!

Like: 224

Unlike: 35

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], upnorth, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

What about Ben Needams parents. There was no world wide search for him.

Like: 304

Unlike: 14

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Darlington, United Kingdom, about 3 hours ago

The parents' anguish, rage and desperation will be as nothing compared to Madeleine's if she is still alive, not to mention her confusion and terror.

Like: 264

Unlike: 17

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Luxor, Egypt, about 3 hours ago

Just think: if they hadn't left the poor kid alone that night, they could have saved themselves all this aggro, not to mention that they'd still be the happy parents of little Maddie as well! I hope that everyone else has learned this hard lesson?

Like: 322

Unlike: 28

The views expressed in the contents above are those of our users and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Mail on Sunday

Read more: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

They're still weary of Carter Ruck but depending on who's moderating, you can push things through. So keep an eye on it.

by tiny 25.01.15 16:07

Poor Madeleine,do these papers who write shit like this even care about the fate of Madeleine. I think not.Shame on the %$^%&^%% lot of them.

If one paper can print some thing nearer the truth about the trial in Lisbon, why cant they all.

by Joss 25.01.15 16:45

tiny wrote:Poor Madeleine,do these papers who write shit like this even care about the fate of Madeleine. I think not.Shame on the %$^%&^%% lot of them.

If one paper can print some thing nearer the truth about the trial in Lisbon, why cant they all.

I don't think MSM is there necessarily to bring us much of the truth, but to skew public opinion. It has worked for them for a very long time, but their time of that is hopefully coming to an end as more people are realizing that you can't believe everything you read in MSM.

by ScarletLaw 25.01.15 17:19

We've managed to get some on through campaigner Helly on to Mail comments. She has good connections with the Mail. There's also a few others addressing the truth. Appreciate anyone who can like them as support because the McCann will have people red arrowing them.

by ultimaThule 25.01.15 19:36

aiyoyo wrote:None of the news outlet mention the WOC documentation which Mcs are tasked to produce.

The public should know Mcs made Madeleine WOC and have no authority to represent her unless granted permission by the Court. And that unless they produce said documentation, Maddie's name has to be deleted from the suit.

The public should also know that the McCanns were made aware of their requirement to produce authorisation from the High Court to represent its Ward in these legal proceedings on 1 June 2014 and, furtheremore, that their continued failure to comply with the Lisbon Court's request has resulted in there being no possibility of the verdict being handed down 'next month' as reported in the UK press. . .

by j.rob 25.01.15 19:57

Also as a colleague pointed out; " the twins could've been put to sleep because the party of people knew they be busy that night and wouldn't have the time to get them back to sleep if they woke up." Chilling, but could be true.

-----

I have little doubt about this. It was imperative, imo, that the twins did not wake up that night.

There are probably multiple reasons for this.

Ostensibly, because the McCanns would not want them to witness the sheer chaos unfolding around them. Which would not doubt have been scary and destabilizing for them. But the Mcs are not that straightforward.

I suspect it is far more cynical and calculated than that.

By Kate raising the question of whether Madeleine and the twins had been sedated on Thursday night, and quite possibly the previous night, by the alleged 'abductor', she covers tracks in case the Portuguese police carry out toxicology tests on the twins, or - at the least - try to wake them up that night only to find they are literally comatose. (Which I strongly suspect.)

Kate can then claim: "Oh, that's because the abductor drugged them. That's why the twins didn't wake up when Madeleine was taken and with all the subsequent noise. "

They are so sneaky. They try to cover every base with their lies, distortions,lies of omission and deliberate obfuscation, imo.

And, given that Kate raises the suggestion that the 'abductor' may have tried to drug and abduct Madeleine (and possibly the twins to, is the implication) the previous night - Wednesday - but fled empty-handed - the implication being s/he was disturbed in some way or otherwise freaked out - this suggests to me that Madeleine and/or the twins had, indeed, been sedated the previous night. Could this mean that the (staged, faked) abduction might have been intended to happen on Wednesday evening instead of Thursday? But for some reason was put back a night? Was it so TM could do a bit of a 'dummy run', perhaps? Or was it for other reasons? Perhaps to make sure that the twins were pretty 'out of it' during the (final days of) the holiday. So that, in the event of their being questioned about that week, they would be unable to recall much or reveal anything incriminating about that week, for instance? The last time they saw Madeleine would be a bit of a blur, perhaps? (Which I suspect was Saturday or Sunday which is when 'something happened', imo - I don't think they saw her after that. In which case they would have very little recollection of Madeleine from that holiday.

Given that you often have to reverse what Kate says, or re-adjust it to fit the truthful scenario, I wonder if either Sean or Amelie did ask where Madeleine was, only earlier on in the week when they noticed she was no longer around?? This seems much more likely, if 'something' happened to her early in the week. And would explain why the Mcs hid away in the apartment each breakfast after Sunday. Plus had lunch there.)

Kate writes in her book that the twins were not told about Madeleine's 'abduction' until Sunday 6th May when Sean, according to Kate, first (hmmmmm...) asked: "Where's Madeleine, Mummy?"

Kate writes: "Oh, God, oh, God......I answered as calmly as I could, and my reply soon became our stock response to this question. 'We don't know, honey. She's missing but we're all looking for her."

I think this speaks volumes. Neither parent - allegedly - sat the twins down after Madeleine had allegedly been stolen from her bed on Thursday night and explained that their elder sister was missing? A somewhat glaring omission, methinks. Which makes me strongly suspect that the Mcs and the tapas had already had to come up for an excuse earlier in the week as to why Madeleine was no longer around....

The twins and Tapas children are, of course, vital eye-witnesses. As, indeed, are other children who were holidaying at OC that week - especially ones using the creche and kids' club.

I wonder what excuse the Mcs gave if either of the twins or indeed any of the TM children noticed Madeleine's absence on Monday/Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday. What would they have said, I wonder, to explain her no longer being around. Or is this were the substitute child comes in, perhaps? But that would still leave the twins wondering where Madeleine was. And Madeleine's friend Ella. Maybe the Mcs had to pretend to the twins that Madeleine was playing over at Ella's apartment or something?

The sheer enormity of the web of lies they must have had to concoct for all this is mind-blowing, imo.

by Guest 25.01.15 19:57

@ultimaThule 7.36pm today

Thank you for confirming that information, ultimaThule. Earlier today I read this topic as I wondering what was happening re the WOC. So they still haven't provided the court with the information, seven months after being ordered to do so?

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by j.rob 25.01.15 20:02

Kate writes: "Oh, God, oh, God......I answered as calmly as I could, and my reply soon became our stock response to this question. 'We don't know, honey. She's missing but we're all looking for her."

------

The Mcs and their friends really do repulse me. How about the answer to Sean's question being: "We know where she is and we're not looking for her but we're pretending that we are and want everyone else to so we can make money to cover our legal and PR fees."

by **Tony Bennett** 25.01.15 20:44

ScarletLaw wrote:We've managed to get some on through campaigner Helly on to Mail comments. She has good connections with the Mail. There's also a few others addressing the truth. Appreciate anyone who can like them as support because the McCann will have people red arrowing them.

Well, the tone of comments on the Mailonline site has most certainly hardened!

Why, some of the comments almost suggest that the McCanns have lied.

That's a whole different ball game from criticising them for leaving their kids unattended for half an hour:

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The comments below have been moderated in advance.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], bath, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

How could his book stop people from looking? Considering not only the vast amount of money they raised for their own investigators and now the £10,000,000 and rising that Scotland Yard are throwing at this case? Just doesn't make sense.
Like: 106
Unlike: 5

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], London, about 4 hours ago

What is it about these two that just makes my flesh crawl when I see them?
Like: 158
Unlike: 26

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Nottingham, about 4 hours ago

Yawn, yawn, yawn. I am very tired of this couple's search for publicity on Madeleine. If she is still alive, then surely she would have found some means of going to the press.
Like: 106
Unlike: 22

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Romford, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

Maybe, just maybe, we are getting nearer to finding out the facts.
Like: 83
Unlike: 8

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], London, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

These comments astound me. They are so harsh and self righteous. Of course they should not have left their children -- and neither should the other parents on holiday who did the same -- but we never hear of them. However, who has not made an error of judgement like this? It does not mean they were not good and loving parents whose suffering has been made worse by this ex-policeman who profited hugely by giving a false account of the events which could not properly be substantiated by evidence. They are right to sue and I hope they win.
Like: 30
Unlike: 129

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], waterlooville, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

A lie detector test would clear up a lot of mysteries ,WHY refuse?????????
Like: 138
Unlike: 4

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], glasgow, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

I am sure they'll donate all the compo to the police investigation, in order to repay some of the £millions their own actions resulted in, possibly costing the life of their daughter and the cost to the public purse , won't they ?!?!?!
Like: 111
Unlike: 13

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], Melbourne, Australia, about 4 hours ago

The anti-McCann trolls are out in force again. Remember that the person or persons who abducted Madeleine are the wrong-doers here, not the grieving parents!
Like: 36
Unlike: 137

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], cali, United States, about 4 hours ago

Take lie detector tests…
Like: 131
Unlike: 6

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], waterlooville, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

If lie detector test will get to truth,WHY NOT,if you speak true no worries,sniffer dogs can't talk but can smell good.
Like: 118
Unlike: 5

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], bath, United Kingdom, about 4 hours ago

"He also claimed their lack of cooperation with the Portuguese police authorities had led to the archiving of the investigation in 2008." This is worrying. I'd like to read the book to see what the media isn't telling us.
Like: 108
Unlike: 6

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by Guest 25.01.15 21:00

ultimaThule wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:None of the news outlet mention the WOC documentation which Mcs are tasked to produce.

The public should know Mcs made Madeleine WOC and have no authority to represent her unless granted permission by the Court. And that unless they produce said documentation, Maddie's name has to be deleted from the suit.

The public should also know that the McCanns were made aware of their requirement to produce authorisation from the High Court to represent its Ward in these legal proceedings on 1 June 2014 and, furtheremore, that their continued failure to comply with the Lisbon Court's request has resulted in there being no possibility of the verdict being handed down 'next month' as reported in the UK press. . .

It should be noted that the hearing only concluded on the 21st so the 30 days start then.

After that hearing is completed, the proceedings will be suspended for 30 days. During that period, Madeleine’s parents “shall arrange for the collection and documentation in the records of the British Court’s authorization for the bringing of this action on behalf of the minor Madeleine McCann”. If they fail to do so, the defendants will be “acquitted of the proceedings concerning the requests that have been formulated on behalf of the latter”.

by Guest 25.01.15 21:07

Why didn't they provide the WOC information last June?

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by Guest 25.01.15 21:27

Ladyinred wrote:Why didn't they provide the WOC information last June?

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Because the final date wasn't then,didn't Amaral sack his lawyer then.

by Guest 25.01.15 22:02

[quote="Ladyinred"]Why didn't they provide the WOC information last June?

[url=https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t9708-ward-of-court-decision-issued-by-judge-in-libel-trial-june-1st-2014][You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Some random musings:

Maybe, the WOC information will not be able to be supplied

So it will not be supplied

So the case will be thrown out

So the 38 points not proved will remain not to be definitively concluded upon

So the case will remain in limbo

Maybe the case will have been wanted to remain in limbo

Maybe donations will continue to drip in as a consequence of that

Yuck

by aiyoyo 25.01.15 23:18

WMD wrote:
After that hearing is completed, the proceedings will be suspended for 30 days. During that period, Madeleine’s parents “shall arrange for the collection and documentation in the records of the British Court’s authorization for the bringing of this action on behalf of the minor Madeleine McCann”. If they fail to do so, the defendants will be “acquitted of the proceedings concerning the requests that have been formulated on behalf of the latter”.

The case won't be thrown out, too late for that.
The bolded bits just mean that Madeleine's name has to be removed, just a technical procedure, that is all.
If it's to be thrown out it would have been done once the WOC issue came to light, but it proceeded nonetheless in spite of that.

Ironically Madeleine's the lion share of the claims, although it's irrelevant now since the wheel has fallen off Mcbus.

I don't understand when the 30-days was supposed to take effect from, or why it has been dragged on until now since this was first mentioned on 1 June 2014 that the Mcs had to obtain it.

What seems apparent is they've not produced it. I've a feeling they wont bother now. Aside from obvious extra legal cost I suspect the legal technicalities to arrive at it will be too complicated. They must be aware that their chance of being strike by lightning is probably higher than winning the case hence it's just not worth their hassle even if they were to secure it, it will be futile for purpose.

It's only useful to secure it if it is going to affect payout. Since it's very likely them who have to pay legal costs of the other side I doubt they are going to lose sleep not having that piece of documentation. They are more worried about their day of reckoning in Spring .............

by Guest 26.01.15 8:40

aiyoyo wrote:
WMD wrote:
After that hearing is completed, the proceedings will be suspended for 30 days. During that period, Madeleine’s parents “shall arrange for the collection and documentation in the records of the British Court’s authorization for the bringing of this action on behalf of the minor Madeleine McCann”. If they fail to do so, the defendants will be “acquitted of the proceedings concerning the requests that have been formulated on behalf of the latter”.

The case won't be thrown out, too late for that.
The bolded bits just mean that Madeleine's name has to be removed, just a technical procedure, that is all.
If it's to be thrown out it would have been done once the WOC issue came to light, but it proceeded nonetheless in spite of that.

Ironically Madeleine's the lion share of the claims, although it's irrelevant now since the wheel has fallen off Mcbus.

I don't understand when the 30-days was supposed to take effect from, or why it has been dragged on until now since this was first mentioned on 1 June 2014 that the Mcs had to obtain it.

What seems apparent is they've not produced it. I've a feeling they wont bother now. Aside from obvious extra legal cost I suspect the legal technicalities to arrive at it will be too complicated. They must be aware that their chance of being strike by lightning is probably higher than winning the case hence it's just not worth their hassle even if they were to secure it, it will be futile for purpose.

It's only useful to secure it if it is going to affect payout. Since it's very likely them who have to pay legal costs of the other side I doubt they are going to lose sleep not having that piece of documentation. They are more worried about their day of reckoning in Spring .............

Just to add the quote I used was from here,https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t9708-ward-of-court-decision-issued-by-judge-in-libel-trial-june-1st-2014

The wording was when the hearing is completed,it wasn't completed until this Wednesday just passed,this is when the 30 days start,thats how I read it.

by Guest 26.01.15 8:57

As the McCanns have known since last June that WOC documentation is required by the court, then presumably they have obtained it and it's in the post, your Honour!