Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

by Shhh 03.06.14 17:34

The first hit I get on google for the words coldwater corregated mccann is a post on steel magnolia from Stephen 'coldwater' Birch ??

Is he? Sorry, might warrant a thread of it's own. Curious

by Shhh 03.06.14 17:35

stillsloppingout wrote:
roy rovers wrote:
sallypelt wrote:I don't know if there is any truth in this, but it's being tweeted and retweeted:

Justice_forum UK Justice Forum

New car park behind the church in Praia da Luz which may be excavated as police renew search for Madeleine #McCann [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Worth a try - they found Richard III last time.
I bet if they went to Rothey now, there would be Richard III in Gerry's trousers

by Bishop Brennan 03.06.14 17:39

A quick interview with the McCanns right now would be helpful. From their faces we would soon know if the dig is about to find something or whether they are way off base. If it was the latter, you just know Gerry would be unable to hide his smirking.

by Sceptic 03.06.14 17:40

Shhh wrote:The first hit I get on google for the words coldwater corregated mccann is a post on steel magnolia from Stephen 'coldwater' Birch ??

Is he? Sorry, might warrant a thread of it's own. Curious

Coldwalter was a regular contributer to the 3 arguidos forum - made many predictions stated as facts - some checked out and we're true others were not - always stated he/she had sources within - then disappeared without a trace the day of the shelving

by SixMillionQuid 03.06.14 17:40

CynicAl wrote:
AndyB wrote:
CynicAl wrote:I'll chip in my dose of optimism again, for what it's worth...

There is a lot of speculation - understandable speculation - about a 'cover up'.

The problem is, that no one seems to understand the definition of a 'cover up.' Or its purpose.

A cover up is intended, principally, to hide the facts.

If the last seven years have seen any party make any effort at a 'cover up', then quite simply every single party that attempted a cover up has failed. If they hadn't failed, we wouldn't be discussing the glaringly obvious facts. No anomalies would be present, no evidence to contradict, no enigmas to promote legitimate speculation.
That all depends on what it is that being covered up. I happen to believe that the cover up is working extremely well and that the full truth of what happened to Madeleine McCann, and the circumstances surrounding her disappearance will never be known. I also believe that the only reason we are discussing any of this is that the Portuguese published all the case files, something that would be utterly unthinkable to our secretive rulers. Had the Portuguese not done so, I doubt that this forum would exist and none of the facts of which we are now aware would be known, let alone glaringly obvious. In other words, had the Portuguese not published their case files the cover-up would've worked from the start without the need for the Yard's current convoluted attempts to put the genie back in the bottle.

Obviously I hope I'm wrong and you're right.

But as to the original principle... if the cover-up wasn't broke, why risk everything to fix it?

As mentioned before the original investigation was archived pending further info. Fingers were still pointing therefore the issues remain unresolved that needed resolving - the cover up needed finalising.

The request for review goes back farther than 2010. I think it goes back to 2009 when Mr McCann sought cooperation with the PJ police. A bit of a strange move considering he was still under their radar. Then there was the previous Home Secretary Alan Johnson's scoping exercise for the review. I'm sure their lawyers would have warned them that a review could put them back in the frame, but they seem pretty confident about the outcome.

by Ayniia 03.06.14 17:43

Bishop Brennan wrote:
And just where are her parents? No press camped in Rothley it seems. No reaction. Perhaps they are online as we speak, watching tv and fearful of every phone call or every knock on the door...

No reaction because they know what's going to happen:
1- they (police ) won't find anything with the digs.
2- they will find something, in which case the couple knows perfectly well what it will be.
All IMO of course.

by CynicAl 03.06.14 17:44

roy rovers wrote:Hard to see why this amount of expense has been authorised without the far cheaper option of intensive 'Cracker' style interviews of the T9 first.

Portuguese hills tend not to hire expensive defence lawyers when probed, and never yield a response of 'no comment.'

by Shhh 03.06.14 17:47

Is/was he stephen birch?

Sceptic wrote:
Shhh wrote:The first hit I get on google for the words coldwater corregated mccann is a post on steel magnolia from Stephen 'coldwater' Birch ??

Is he? Sorry, might warrant a thread of it's own. Curious
Coldwalter was a regular contributer to the 3 arguidos forum - made many predictions stated as facts - some checked out and we're true others were not - always stated he/she had sources within - then disappeared without a trace the day of the shelving

by Guest 03.06.14 17:47

From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by frost 03.06.14 17:47

I wonder if a police officer has been posted outside the McCann residence or if they will be taken into custody for their own protection ie placed in a safe house of some kind as obviously with the developments of the last 24 hrs especially feelings are running high .

Im not worried about them but I do worry about the safety of Sean and Amelie hopefully they have already been moved somewhere safe .

I would have thought some kind of police presence would be in Rothley yet no mention of anything like this on the news .

The McCanns would have usually been stood infront of a camera by now declaring their innocence yet unless I have missed it nothing .

All this going on in Portugal yet not a dickie bird about what is happening over here

by SchrodingersBody 03.06.14 17:49

roy rovers wrote:
sallypelt wrote:I don't know if there is any truth in this, but it's being tweeted and retweeted:

Justice_forum UK Justice Forum

New car park behind the church in Praia da Luz which may be excavated as police renew search for Madeleine #McCann [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Worth a try - they found Richard III last time.

I'm currently catching up, but thought I'd tip my hat to this as it had me giggling.
thumbup

by CynicAl 03.06.14 17:49

shabba wrote:
SixMillionQuid wrote:
AndyB wrote:
CynicAl wrote:I'll chip in my dose of optimism again, for what it's worth...

There is a lot of speculation - understandable speculation - about a 'cover up'.

The problem is, that no one seems to understand the definition of a 'cover up.' Or its purpose.

A cover up is intended, principally, to hide the facts.

If the last seven years have seen any party make any effort at a 'cover up', then quite simply every single party that attempted a cover up has failed. If they hadn't failed, we wouldn't be discussing the glaringly obvious facts. No anomalies would be present, no evidence to contradict, no enigmas to promote legitimate speculation.
That all depends on what it is that being covered up. I happen to believe that the cover up is working extremely well and that the full truth of what happened to Madeleine McCann, and the circumstances surrounding her disappearance will never be known. I also believe that the only reason we are discussing any of this is that the Portuguese published all the case files, something that would be utterly unthinkable to our secretive rulers. Had the Portuguese not done so, I doubt that this forum would exist and none of the facts of which we are now aware would be known, let alone glaringly obvious. In other words, had the Portuguese not published their case files the cover-up would've worked from the start without the need for the Yard's current convoluted attempts to put the genie back in the bottle.

Obviously I hope I'm wrong and you're right.
Also the shelving and publishing of the case left the finger of suspicion pointing at certain individuals - they needed it rectified. Now why would they publicly demand a review? If they were not confident in the outcome they would not have called for a review of the case.

Someone please reply to this post as I asked the same question in my first post on this forum,but no-one could explain why they would do that?

They demanded a review, probably based on the assumption that they were safe, that they were untouchable, that the evidence was disposed of and that no tricks were up police sleeves. Their arrogance bred stupidity, and the guilty often try to 'tinker' with investigation into themselves in order to reassure themselves that they are safe and in control. Maybe they've got more than they bargained for. Maybe they never expected to be taken on their word.

by frost 03.06.14 17:50

Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .

by stillsloppingout 03.06.14 17:50

I noted Exclusive pix [ the Mets paid agency [ Getty, Reuters ,AP , the Spanish & Portuguese Equivalant's , and a staffer from the Mirror all filed pics today . They must know there is going to be a show . more freelancers will join tomorrow , in the hope they get that shot . unlikely to be exclusive ,bearing in mind they all know where the scene is but you never know, especially if they start lighting the area .

by stillsloppingout 03.06.14 17:53

frost wrote:
Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .

Looks like they are digging a trench and that is to support the sides . if it was what you think there would have been screens up pronto . was at a exhumation dig the other week in Blackpool . when x marks the spot the screen goes up . UNLESS THEY ARE POSTURING

by Miraflores 03.06.14 17:53

Nothing since 7th May on the Find Madeleine website either, with the last update being one where Kate and Gerry "are dismayed with the way the media has behaved over the last couple of days in relation to our daughter’s case".

It may have escaped me, but are the Media behaving differently this time with the lengthy articles on e.g. BBC, Guardian, Daily Mail websites?

by **PeterMac** 03.06.14 17:57

Thread moving so quickly, so sorry if this has been posted.
Sky are reported that an actual DIG has begun - as opposed to a search and sniff and look.

Someone on Twitter has identified (possibly) that the focus seems to be in the eastern corner, near a path entering the area.
For what it is worth that would be entirely consistent with the findings of all buried bodies. The CATCHEM data base turned up the statistic of
No further than 20 yards from a path.
No further than 200 yards from a road, if there is a path
No deeper than 1'6"

OK, the statistic obviously does not include all those which were NOT found, but nevertheless, it is confirmation of a common sense view.
You don't carry a body further than you absolutely have to . They are heavy and they leak, and you might be seen.
So you get rid, and you cannot dig more than two spits (spade blade lengths,) quickly, even in soft ground. After that it becomes almost impossible. Ploughed land is only soft to a depth of 12 - 18"
After that it is a hard pan, so you stop there and cover the best you can.

The Saddleworth Moors burials were all close to the road. Not MILES away

by FlippityGibbet 03.06.14 17:58

Hi, I'm new but I have been following the case closely since the days of the 3As and for some reason have had difficulty registering but this attempt has worked!

Re why the McCann's asked for a review, my thinking is that it was to get access to the (unreleased Portuguese) files because they have been led to believe (falsely I think) that they have police friends in high places. Hence the recent stress on a 'joint investigation'. I think both police forces are aware of this and their plans have been frustrated... Things have not gone their way.

I stumbled across this today, maybe it should be in another thread, mods feel free to move it if so. It's a couple and a car in August 2009 on google maps next to the area being investigated at the moment.They look very familiar (:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Take a stroll keeping left then do slight turn to right staying on spot. I'm not sure how to post images on here, when I figure it out I'll post some close up screenshots.

by nobodythereeither 03.06.14 17:59

Shhh wrote:Here's the coldwater post

"
Quote:
It wasn't a blanket. I understand it was on a large sheet of cold metal - forensic evidence was left behind.
"

From http://msngroup.aimoo.com/madeleinemccann/coldwater.msnw-action=get_message&mview=0&ID_Message=850&LastModified=4675673657248108147.htm

But Coldwater was a wind-up merchant, no?

by Shhh 03.06.14 18:05

I thought he was.

That thing they're digging looks like an underground hideaway. Wasn't there a case where someone kept kids they had abducted in such a thing in a field at the back of some houses? Unless it was in a film, recall watching something about it.

by Guest 03.06.14 18:09

FlippityGibbet wrote:Hi, I'm new but I have been following the case closely since the days of the 3As and for some reason have had difficulty registering but this attempt has worked!

Re why the McCann's asked for a review, my thinking is that it was to get access to the (unreleased Portuguese) files because they have been led to believe (falsely I think) that they have police friends in high places. Hence the recent stress on a 'joint investigation'. I think both police forces are aware of this and their plans have been frustrated... Things have not gone their way.

I stumbled across this today, maybe it should be in another thread, mods feel free to move it if so. It's a couple and a car in August 2009 on google maps next to the area being investigated at the moment.They look very familiar (:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Take a stroll keeping left then do slight turn to right staying on spot. I'm not sure how to post images on here, when I figure it out I'll post some close up screenshots.

They look like a couple in their twenties.

by frost 03.06.14 18:11

stillsloppingout wrote:
frost wrote:
Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .
Looks like they are digging a trench and that is to support the sides . if it was what you think there would have been screens up pronto . was at a exhumation dig the other week in Blackpool . when x marks the spot the screen goes up . UNLESS THEY ARE POSTURING

No I wasn't thinking the obvious but it does look like something that has been in situ for some time and does not look like supports for a trench to me . It looks like it could be some kind of entrance to somewhere it could even be just a kids den as in plaything I don't know if portuguese kids make dens but we made them everywhere when I was a kid

by riskybuisness 03.06.14 18:11

I don't understand why all this seems to be being done right infront of the media. I thought that the PJ had insisted that they wanted the media to stay away. Why then are they "digging" about what looks like 100 meters or so away without putting up any screens. I'm baffled!!

by MRNOODLES 03.06.14 18:17

frost wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:
frost wrote:
Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .
Looks like they are digging a trench and that is to support the sides . if it was what you think there would have been screens up pronto . was at a exhumation dig the other week in Blackpool . when x marks the spot the screen goes up . UNLESS THEY ARE POSTURING

No I wasn't thinking the obvious but it does look like something that has been in situ for some time and does not look like supports for a trench to me . It looks like it could be some kind of entrance to somewhere it could even be just a kids den as in plaything I don't know if portuguese kids make dens but we made them everywhere when I was a kid

Could it be an old bunker from WWII?

by tiny 03.06.14 18:18

riskybuisness wrote:I don't understand why all this seems to be being done right infront of the media. I thought that the PJ had insisted that they wanted the media to stay away. Why then are they "digging" about what looks like 100 meters or so away without putting up any screens. I'm baffled!!

Me too,hope some one can tell us why its being dug on full show

by Guest 03.06.14 18:20

tiny wrote:
riskybuisness wrote:I don't understand why all this seems to be being done right infront of the media. I thought that the PJ had insisted that they wanted the media to stay away. Why then are they "digging" about what looks like 100 meters or so away without putting up any screens. I'm baffled!!
Me too,hope some one can tell us why its being dug on full show

Because it is a show!
imo parapono

by nobodythereeither 03.06.14 18:23

MRNOODLES wrote:
frost wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:
frost wrote:
Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .
Looks like they are digging a trench and that is to support the sides . if it was what you think there would have been screens up pronto . was at a exhumation dig the other week in Blackpool . when x marks the spot the screen goes up . UNLESS THEY ARE POSTURING

No I wasn't thinking the obvious but it does look like something that has been in situ for some time and does not look like supports for a trench to me . It looks like it could be some kind of entrance to somewhere it could even be just a kids den as in plaything I don't know if portuguese kids make dens but we made them everywhere when I was a kid

Could it be an old bunker from WWII?

Surely the wood would have rotted by now if it was from WWII?!

by nglfi 03.06.14 18:29

I've just watched the BBC report on the digs, there was not one single mention of the parents. It does seem there's a slight shift in reporting, with only tabloids like the daily mirror talking about the parent's agony. Of course I'm sure they are in agony right niw, nothing untrue about that!

by MRNOODLES 03.06.14 18:30

nobodythereeither wrote:
MRNOODLES wrote:
frost wrote:
stillsloppingout wrote:
frost wrote:
Poe wrote:From Twitter:

Tony Stewart
‏@TellyTone
At last, police lift corrugated metal cover on hide in scrubland #praiadaluz @TomSkyNews is reporting on it. pic.twitter.com/6poIvsYnex

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

is there some kind of wooden box / container in that picture bit of a strange place for something like that .
Looks like they are digging a trench and that is to support the sides . if it was what you think there would have been screens up pronto . was at a exhumation dig the other week in Blackpool . when x marks the spot the screen goes up . UNLESS THEY ARE POSTURING

No I wasn't thinking the obvious but it does look like something that has been in situ for some time and does not look like supports for a trench to me . It looks like it could be some kind of entrance to somewhere it could even be just a kids den as in plaything I don't know if portuguese kids make dens but we made them everywhere when I was a kid

Could it be an old bunker from WWII?

Surely the wood would have rotted by now if it was from WWII?!

I was thinking, the wood on top just placed on top to cover it up. And over the years people have been ferretting around it. If it was known it was there, it's a ready made hole that doesn't need to be dug.

by aiyoyo 03.06.14 18:31

ShuBob wrote:
roy rovers wrote:Hard to see why this amount of expense has been authorised without the far cheaper option of intensive 'Cracker' style interviews of the T9 first.

They may have been interviewed already!

T7 would have been re-interviewed but not the infamous pair of couple.
The pair would be left to dawn arrest.