Re: WOW A MUST READ -Madeleine clues hidden for five years - Sunday Times Full article now on Page 1

by Curioser 28.10.13 3:04

Here's The Australian article. It's a direct copy of The Times apparently:

Madeleine McCann e-fit pictures overlooked for 5 years

DOMINIC KENNEDY

THE TIMES

OCTOBER 28, 2013 11:01AM

NEW MCCANN APPEAL INVOLVES E-FITS2:28

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Detectives investigating Madeleine McCann's disappearance will publish e-fits of men they want to contact.

FIVE years have been wasted in the hunt for Madeleine McCann while pictures of the prime suspect in her abduction were suppressed.
The e-fits were produced by a private detective agency hired by Madeleine's parents, Kate and Gerry. The investigators based their pictures on a description provided by an Irish holidaymaker in Praia da Luz, Portugal, where Madeleine vanished shortly before her fourth birthday in 2007.
The Irishman's account was overlooked at the time because it clashed with an earlier sighting by Jane Tanner, one of the McCanns' dining companions. Scotland Yard has now established that Ms Tanner's description appeared to match an innocent holidaymaker who had been collecting his child from a creche.
The e-fits were produced as part of an unpublished report by the private detective agency Oakley International that has been seen by The Sunday Times. They were finally broadcast on a BBC Crimewatch program this month, attracting 1,000 telephone calls and e-mails, some naming the same man.
One of the Oakley investigators told The Sunday Times: "I was absolutely stunned when I watched the programme. It most certainly wasn't a new timeline and it certainly isn't a new revelation. It is absolute nonsense to suggest either of those things. And those e-fits you saw on Crimewatch were ours."
The McCanns declined to renew Oakley International's $843,000 contract in 2008 after suggestions that it was too expensive. The firm's founder, Kevin Halligen, was alleged to have failed to pass money to an investigator on the McCanns' case, although he denies this. This summer Halligen was jailed for 41 months by a US judge for an unrelated multimillion-dollar fraud.
Nonetheless, Oakley's e-fits have now become the centrepiece of Scotland Yard's investigation. The Oakley report deduced that a sighting of Madeleine by Martin Smith from Drogheda, Co Louth, was credible. Mr Smith, returning to his apartment in Praia da Luz about 9.50pm, saw a British-looking man carrying a motionless, barefoot girl in pyjamas. Madeleine was noted to be missing by her mother at 10pm.
The Oakley investigation concluded that an over-emphasis had been given to Ms Tanner's account. She described seeing a man about 9.15pm. There was a potential difficulty with Mr Smith's version. He estimated that he was 60 to 80 per cent certain that the man he saw was Mr McCann. Mr McCann's movements for that time have been established: he was seen by witnesses to be in a tapas restaurant.
Mr Smith's suggestion that he might have seen Mr McCann carrying Madeleine shortly before her disappearance was seized on by Goncalo Amaral, the Portuguese detective leading the search. The McCanns are suing Mr Amaral for alleging in a book that they might have faked their daughter's abduction.
An Oakley source told The Sunday Times that the Find Madeleine fund's lawyers had required the report to remain confidential.
The Portuguese authorities formally cleared the McCanns and have just reopened their investigation.
The e-fits were in the possession of both Portuguese police and Scotland Yard for some years before this month's publication.
Scotland Yard said yesterday: "Where we have been able to make massive steps forward is by drawing together all the material gathered to date and reviewing it as a whole."
The Sun newspaper claimed yesterday that the e-fits resembled the Scottish paedophiles Charles O'Neill and William Lauchlan. Both are serving life sentences for murdering a woman to prevent her from reporting them for child abuse. At the time of Madeleine's disappearance they were living in Spain and using false passports. Leicestershire police questioned them about Madeleine in jail in 2011.
The Times
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by indigoblue12 28.10.13 3:12

Okeydokey wrote:Look what the Daily Mail smuggled in:

Months after the disappearance and after seeing Gerry McCann on TV, Mr Smith told police that he thought the man he saw carrying a girl around Madeleine’s age at the very time she went missing reminded him of Gerry McCann himself.

PS - Was it really "months" after?
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Am I correct in reading that the above is a quote from one of the McCanns friends? Or someone closely connected to them? ... and,has Mr Smith totally withdrawn his suggestion?-maybe this isn`t a new thing though,I may not have picked up on it before.

by ultimaThule 28.10.13 4:21

For one of their 'friend's to claim the McCanns were victimised' by the Portuguese is a gross distortion of the truth, which is that they have used money donated by an unsuspecting public to aid a search for their missing child to victimise the Portuguese police officer who was in charge of the initial investigation and who, rightly IMO, suspected they were complicit in the disappearance of their daughter.

But fear not, folks. 'Tis but another move in the game and I suspect the Fail will have caught up with the times, if not The Times, by Thursday.

Meantime, it's the Telegraph's* turn today to run with the Times' story before handing over to another title who'll headline it on Tuesday morning, but this plan may change if vast swathes of the south are decimated by the storm that's raging around the outside of my house as I write.
n
We'll have to try and be patient as the press have got to eke this story out and recycle it with embellishments until fresh news arrives from Portugal or the Met, and it's in the interests of all concerned for TM to believe they'll be able to paint themselves out of the corner they've painted themselves into. big grin

*I can't link to the article at the moment but it can be found by googling McCann or browsing the Telegraph to find 'Madeline McCann: critical evidence is from 5 year old suppressed report'.

by Seek truth 28.10.13 6:26

StraightThinking wrote:
Okeydokey wrote:
StraightThinking wrote:This is an explosive development, but each media outlet will have to independently check the story before running it, to avoid the possibility of legal action. It isn't enough to say "the Sunday Times said it", or to include it as part of a newspaper review. If the ST is wrong, everyone mentioning the story would be guilty of defamation
Nonsense, no one has ever been successfully sued for libel for reading off a front page from a newspaper on TV.
It isn't nonsense actually, in my line of work I have to work within the laws of defamation and am only too aware of them, as you will find if you ask a specialist lawyer. But thanks for your input

Why can't you remember a case of someone being sued for reading off a front page? Simple - because if the story is potentially libellous and hasn't been checked out by the TV station in question, they don't read them out (and this morning was a prime example)

So, as they read all the other papers front pages, does it mean they are true?

Nobody would be reading any front pages, or they'd have to check all of them first before reading, every day.

by Tangledweb 28.10.13 6:39

The tide is, indeed, turning.

Daily Mail says, 'Madeleine's presumed abduction (my bold).

Here we go.....

by Praiaaa 28.10.13 7:03

Saturdaygirl, I am also on that mumsnet thread, and have also been banned without notice or reason a few years ago for simply posting on a McCann thread that ' I hope the perpetrators will be brought to justice'. No mention of who they might be, but apparently the use of the plural was in itself deemed to be libellous...????('someone' had complained and reported my post...) Had to promise not to post on any more McC threads to be let back onto mumset!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - unprecedented as I have been a regular poster on hundreds of other unrelated threads over the years before and since without trouble.. What I have noticed is that the threads are typically derailed when posters come on blaming the McCs for neglecting their children, have often wondered if these are agents provocateurs to get the threads deleted...

by Tangledweb 28.10.13 7:04

Why were Maddie suspect E-fits kept secret for five years? Images and evidence of sighting uncovered by private detectives were suppressed

Images of man seen carrying child through Praia da Luz on the night of Madeleine's disappearance were unveiled on Crimewatch two weeks ago

Based on evidence from Irish holidaymaker Martin Smith and his family

Emerged yesterday that E-fits were contained in files from five years ago

Produced by private investigators hired by the McCanns

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PUBLISHED: 01:15, 28 October 2013 | UPDATED: 01:15, 28 October 2013

The E-fits of a ‘new’ suspect for Madeleine McCann’s disappearance were drawn up five years ago – and suppressed.
Images of a man seen carrying a child through Praia da Luz at 10pm on the night the then three-year-old vanished were unveiled on BBC1’s Crimewatch two weeks ago.
They are based on evidence from Irish holidaymaker Martin Smith and his family. At the same time, the British police team behind a new investigation revealed they had discounted a 9.15pm sighting of a man with a child by Jane Tanner, a friend holidaying with parents Gerry and Kate McCann and their three children.
It meant there was a new ‘timeline’ of Madeleine’s presumed abduction. Yet it emerged yesterday that the recently released E-fits were in fact contained in files produced five years ago by private investigators hired by the McCanns. Similarly, those private detectives had questioned the Tanner sighting and the timings associated with it.
But the E-fits were kept private, and the questioning of the Tanner sighting and related timeline were kept quiet. One detective said he was ‘utterly stunned’ to see his five-year-old dossier suddenly presented as new on TV.
The investigator told a Sunday newspaper: ‘I was absolutely stunned when I watched the programme... it most certainly wasn’t a new timeline and it certainly isn’t a new revelation. It is absolute nonsense to suggest either of those things... and those E-fits you saw on Crimewatch are ours.’
The McCanns are now fully behind the fresh police drive and release of the E-fits – but five years ago they were reluctant to issue them, possibly in part because witness Mr Smith’s account seemed inconsistent and unreliable.

Months after the disappearance and after seeing Gerry McCann on TV, Mr Smith told police that he thought the man he saw carrying a girl around Madeleine’s age at the very time she went missing reminded him of Gerry McCann himself.
Mr Smith has reportedly since withdrawn that claim – just as Portuguese police have officially told the McCanns they are no longer suspects for their daughter’s disappearance.
The couple have also won libel damages for false suggestions that they were in any way involved.

Numerous witnesses have also given statements making clear that Mr McCann was at his holiday complex at the moment the sighting occurred – which was at the very time when he and his wife started calling for help looking for Maddie.

Madeleine McCann went missing in Praia da Luz in May 2007

But shortly after Mr Smith told police Mr McCann may have been the man he had seen carrying a little girl, a friend of the McCanns said: ‘Look at the facts. This man sees an individual carrying a child on the night Maddie vanished.
‘He waits 13 days to report this to the police, going back to Ireland in the meantime. At this stage he admits he has no idea who the man is. Almost four months go by before, after seeing him on TV, he feels that it could be Gerry.
‘The truth is that this is part of the victimisation of Gerry and Kate which has gone on from the very beginning by the Portuguese.’

Portuguese police have officially told Kate and Gerry McCann they are no longer suspects for the disappearance
In 2008, the McCanns used money from their charity fund to hire investigators from a firm called Oakley International, led by former MI5 surveillance officer Henri Exton, to look into the mystery – and they focused on the Smith sighting.
They produced a dossier and called for the E-fits to be published. They also suggested Madeleine could have died after wandering off.
The McCanns, who became embroiled in an unconnected financial dispute with Oakley International at around the time they received the dossier, responded by warning the detectives of legal action if they publicised their report.
A source close to the fund said the report would have been ‘completely distracting’ if it had become public.
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by DonNewbery 28.10.13 7:07

Praiaaa wrote:Saturdaygirl, I am also on that mumsnet thread, and have also been banned without notice or reason a few years ago for simply posting on a McCann thread that ' I hope the perpetrators will be brought to justice'. No mention of who they might be, but apparently the use of the plural was in itself deemed to be libellous...????(

The irony abounds when one considers that the very first pronouncement made by KM was 'They've taken her!'

by DurhamGuy1967 28.10.13 7:32

If SY did come straight out and said they were treating GM, KM as suspects there would have been a massive backlash from the public and the press and polititians would have had to react. There would have been calls to have the SY investigation stopped and stories about a waste of public money.

People feel sorry for the McCann's they have raised and donated money to the fund and would find what most of us on here know and think unbelievable... they just wouldn't believe it! they wouldn't accept it!

They also don't see the significance. so what a man was seen carrying a girl at 10:00 so what....

BUT As SY keeps saying it changes the timeline

It changes form
9:15 Madedline taken but dodgy room checking didn't reveil this till alarm raised at 10:00 ( Tanner Sighting)
to
9.20 Alarm raised ( source Chef's statement) , Madeline being moved at 10:00 ( Smith sighting )

None of the Tapas 9, bar DW, has an alibi for 10:00 , the sticker book timelines don't fit...etc..., All the Tapas 9 statements don't fit

This is all about changing public opinion. Slowly , Slowly. and maybe hoping the Tapas 7 break their silence when public pressure to do this comes down on them like a tonne of bricks.

by **PeterMac** 28.10.13 7:34

And they allowed this comment

GeoffCapesBudgie, London, United Kingdom, 5 hours ago
And so, finally, the British press begins to ask the right questions...
228 green arrows 17red

by DurhamGuy1967 28.10.13 7:41

Interesting that the Sunday Times Article is short and everyone is concentrating on the suppression of the E fits but it also hints that Madeline's sleeping habits may be significant.

by DurhamGuy1967 28.10.13 7:42

DurhamGuy1967 wrote:Interesting that the Sunday Times Article is short and everyone is concentrating on the suppression of the E fits but it also hints that Madeline's sleeping habits may be significant.

What if she was known to sleepwalk!

by sami 28.10.13 7:52

A number of times now I have read that Smith has withdrawn his claim it may have been Gerry he saw. Has this been confirmed by the police or is it the usual brainwashing sentance thrown into press articles ?

by Smokeandmirrors 28.10.13 7:53

sami wrote:A number of times now I have read that Smith has withdrawn his claim it may have been Gerry he saw. Has this been confirmed by the police or is it the usual brainwashing sentance thrown into press articles ?

I think he got scared after a certain visit by McCann sponsor Brian Kennedy.

by **PeterMac** 28.10.13 7:57

Suppression of e-fits.
Suppression of evidence given
Madeleine's sleeping habits - ( which we knew anyway, star chart and other references about coming into their room at 2am)
Analysis of phone records for the entire village for a week or so - (not mentioned recently, but was about a week ago, by everyone)

Beginning to add up ?

by Praiaaa 28.10.13 8:00

Disappointing that the Times article today (Monday) is back to same old spin - glosses over the suppression by the McCs, doesn't mention the sleep or the discrepancies in timeline, and says that it has been 'established by witnesses' that GM was in the tapas bar at the time of the Smith sighting.
aaaah

by StraightThinking 28.10.13 8:03

Seek truth wrote:Nobody would be reading any front pages, or they'd have to check all of them first before reading, every day.

There is a huge difference between reading out a story that might be untrue, and reading one out that might be libellous. Take it from me, if you quote someone else who has said something libellous, you have committed libel yourself

by Smokeandmirrors 28.10.13 8:04

Morning Praiaaa, are you able to copy and paste it for the non-subscribers?

Check the Express article thread, sounds like they are making a bit of a point, particularly the last line.

by ChippyM 28.10.13 8:06

The Daily Mail's article is headed,

"Why were Maddie suspect E-fits kept secret for five years? Images and evidence of sighting uncovered by private detectives were suppressed"

They don't mention WHO supressed it though, not once! Come on DM be kind to your readers who after all these years need it spelling out!

by ChippyM 28.10.13 8:08

I'm not sure what to think about this!

Embarrassment for BBC after porn star was cast as member of Tapas Seven in Crimewatch reconstruction of Madeleine McCann disappearance

Adult actor Mark Sloan has appeared on Playboy TV and Television X
Was cast as Matthew Oldfield, who was eating with Gerry and Kate McCann
He has starred in films Tight Rider, Sherlock Bones and From Dusk Till Porn
Campaign groups and family charities have expressed surprise at casting

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by sami 28.10.13 8:18

ChippyM wrote:I'm not sure what to think about this!

Embarrassment for BBC after porn star was cast as member of Tapas Seven in Crimewatch reconstruction of Madeleine McCann disappearance

Adult actor Mark Sloan has appeared on Playboy TV and Television X
Was cast as Matthew Oldfield, who was eating with Gerry and Kate McCann
He has starred in films Tight Rider, Sherlock Bones and From Dusk Till Porn
Campaign groups and family charities have expressed surprise at casting

Read more: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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How many sat down watching Crimewatch and said oh look there's your man from Tight Rider ! Even if they did so what ? God forbid it transpires any of the actors had roles playing parents involved in the cover up of their child's death, roles where a cadaver was hidden or roles where they were part of a fraudulent fund. That I would find much more interesting.

Still it's not often the DM makes me laugh so that's a first.

by DurhamGuy1967 28.10.13 8:20

In the UK there are big issues with press regulation at the moment.

This move the debate in the direction of freedom of speech.

by Truthandjustice 28.10.13 8:20

sami wrote:A number of times now I have read that Smith has withdrawn his claim it may have been Gerry he saw. Has this been confirmed by the police or is it the usual brainwashing sentance thrown into press articles ?

I don't think he has. It is never in direct quotes, always 'reported to have', probably by a mate of the Mcs. Their new argument that he is an unreliable witness is,...... errr ludicrous.

However, I think the Mcs will be vicious when backed into a corner, that's why the police are carefully building a watertight case.

by Praiaaa 28.10.13 8:23

Smokeandmirrors wrote:Morning Praiaaa, are you able to copy and paste it for the non-subscribers?

Check the Express article thread, sounds like they are making a bit of a point, particularly the last line.

Sorry cannot cut and paste as reading the paper copy, not a subscriber....

by tiny 28.10.13 8:23

sami wrote:A number of times now I have read that Smith has withdrawn his claim it may have been Gerry he saw. Has this been confirmed by the police or is it the usual brainwashing sentance thrown into press articles ?

Have we had this from Martin Smith or the PJ or is it just the newspapers putting their spin on it

by **PeterMac** 28.10.13 8:23

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Five years have been wasted in the hunt for Madeleine McCann while pictures of the prime suspect in her abduction were suppressed.
The e-fits were produced by a private detective agency hired by Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry.
The investigators based their pictures on a description provided by an Irish holidaymaker in Praia da Luz, Portugal, where Madeleine vanished shortly before her fourth birthday in 2007.

No question about who did it.

by sami 28.10.13 8:26

tiny wrote:
sami wrote:A number of times now I have read that Smith has withdrawn his claim it may have been Gerry he saw. Has this been confirmed by the police or is it the usual brainwashing sentance thrown into press articles ?
Have we had this from Martin Smith or the PJ or is it just the newspapers putting their spin on it

That's what I am asking. It has been slipped into a number of articles. My suspicion is spin because it is usually followed by the parents are no longer suspects, but I would like to know.

by Praiaaa 28.10.13 8:26

How many sat down watching Crimewatch and said oh look there's your man from Tight Rider ! .[/quote]

sorry - got quoting wrong these fab words are not mine,

by Praiaaa 28.10.13 8:30

wow - Mumsnet thread has mentioned Gaspar and people are googling the statements - both Payne and Yvonne Martin mentionedby name.
Cannot underestimate the magnitude of this - mumsnetters are the people who gossip at the school gate and word spreads like wildfire. To have all these googlable names in the open is a massive step forward.

by statsman 28.10.13 8:33

I am becoming more and more convinced that the tabloids had to come to a legal agreement in 2008 with the McCanns on a similar basis to the one that TB was obliged to accept.

It's the only explanation I can see that fits why the tabloids are so pro-McCann when the majority of their readers are patently not.

And it also explains why K&G spent so much time, money and effort in prosecuting TB. It was to show the tabloids what would happen to them if they breached their agreement in the same way as Tony did with his.

It's just a guess but I'm surmising that the ST is not part of an agreement with them and that is why Murdoch is happy to let yesterday's bombshell explode there.

There's further backup for my idea today when I see how much this story has been watered down in the dailies.

I'm guessing that we won't see much change until something happens to make the tabloids feel safe that they will not be threatened by CR again.

Once bitten ...

WOW A MUST READ -Madeleine clues hidden for five years - Sunday Times Full article now on Page 1