Re: CRIMEWATCH ON BBC ***Part 1 DISCUSSION****

by Lance De Boils 14.10.13 23:44

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Neil Berry.
Can someone put the photofit here? (Sunglasses man)

I was discussing this a few weeks on another thread - that he is the "dodgy stairwell man" - but now I can't find the thread. Anyone remember?

by Cristobell 14.10.13 23:44

MRNOODLES wrote:
Lance De Boils wrote:Imagine that, hey? You "invent" an abductor and the Met then go and bloody track him down and eliminate him!
GM, 'You just made that up about eliminating night creche man'.

SY, 'Oh yeah, what makes you say that?'

GM, 'Cos we made him up in the first place...... oh shit!'

Night creche man must have been on the moon this past six years.

by Newintown 14.10.13 23:45

loopzdaloop wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:

Police say one reading of Madeleine McCann's disappearance in Portugal in 2007 is that it has "all the hallmarks of a pre-planned abduction".
Ah these were the exact words, thank you for posting that link.
I believe the above is a very good disclaimer that Redwood made whilst leading the Mccann's nicely down the garden path.

I don't remember hearing about the man GM said could have been hiding in the apartment while he (GM) went to the loo, or did I miss it?

by Searcher 14.10.13 23:45

I am glad to have a chuckle, Moongoddess, on a very difficult night! nah

by mouse 14.10.13 23:46

susible wrote:
candyfloss wrote:
susible wrote:
annemab wrote:In most of the trailers I saw yesterday and today, there was a little girl dressed like Maddie in the 'last' photo (the pool one) either playing tennis or collecting tennis balls - but this was not shown on the programme? or did I blink and miss it?
No, it wasn't on the programme, also not on the programme was Kate's proclamation of "we've done nothing wrong" changed to "we have not committed a crime" probably due to the backlash of the public...Yeah you did do something wrong"

But you are right, all of these scenes were touted at the start as being part of the programme....Hmmm what's changed I wonder
Yes you are right susible, they CHANGED tonights programme from the trailer from we're not the one's who've done something wrong........

Now why would they change that Candyfloss? Admittedly my daughter had to restrain me in my seat when I heard that, How can they change a trailer for a crimewatch special in that way..thought this was pre-recorded..how many versions do they have?

Lots of questions for the BBC!

Exactly - why would they change that? I've been listening to that trailer for the last few days, even heard it, I think, on the radio - and now they leave it out? Perhaps they tested the water and your average joe didn't like this, caused a backlash and they - whoever they are - decided to remove it. Or the Mccanns demanded this. It seems to me that they are running the show so far - or at least they are calling the tune. They whistle and action is taken, maybe not straight away, but eventually...by who...who knows, but someone connected.

by Prehensile 14.10.13 23:46

Lance De Boils wrote:Imagine that, hey? You "invent" an abductor and the Met then go and bloody track him down and eliminate him!

Is that the subliminal message to the Mc's "you are in the clear" or conversely "we know the truth"?

by loopzdaloop 14.10.13 23:46

littlepixie wrote:If you KNEW you had fabricated seeing a man carrying off Maddie (Jane Tanner) and now the Police have told you they have found the non-existent man how would you feel?

If you KNEW a witness had seen you disposing of your child and now the Police were looking for that man and had asked you on to Crimewatch to help find him, how would you feel?

Ribisl wrote:I'd like to think SY and Andy Redwood withheld certain elements in this 'reconstruction' because the main purpose of the programme was to draw people's attention to Smiths' sighting and to try to identify the man in question. This is not the McCann agenda at all. They are trying to find out where Madeleine was taken - dead or alive.

Some of the things intentionally omitted in Crimewatch but hugely significant in this investigation imo:
David Payne
Eddie and Keela
Cleaners

Yes, I can see that. I wonder where Gerry was going. Please can some-one point out where on the route that place was that Murat owned which has the freezer in it? Also, didn't the Mccann's replace another freezer in the holiday apartment? or did I dream that?
I also can't quite bring to mind what the conclusions of Pat Brown were around the beach about where Gerry may have gone?

It was Kate's suicidal ideation in her book that always struck me.

Mrs McCann has written before that she was plagued by depression and suicidal thoughts after the abduction of Madeleine.
In a book chronicling her daughter’s disappearance and the toll it took on her family, she wrote that she had an overwhelming urge to swim out to her death at sea.
She wrote: “I had an overwhelming urge to swim out across the ocean, as hard and as fast as I could; to swim and swim and swim until I was so far out and so exhausted I could just allow the water to pull me under and relieve me of this torment.
“I wasn't keeping that desire to myself, either. I was shouting it out to anyone who happened to be in the room. Both this urge and the expression of it were, I suppose, an outlet for the crucifying anguish.
"Somehow, inflicting physical pain on myself seemed to be the only possible way of escaping my internal pain,” she wrote in the book published two years ago. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

wishing to drown in the sea is very specific, which made me wonder if the body was disposed out to sea.

by plebgate 14.10.13 23:47

MRNOODLES wrote:
Lance De Boils wrote:Imagine that, hey? You "invent" an abductor and the Met then go and bloody track him down and eliminate him!
GM, 'You just made that up about eliminating night creche man'.

SY, 'Oh yeah, what makes you say that?'

GM, 'Cos we made him up in the first place...... oh shit!'

Did the parents make a direct appeal to the abductor, only I seem to remember that when the programme was first announced it said that they would be?

by annemab 14.10.13 23:48

Cristobell wrote:For anyone interested in the body language of DCI Redwood, note, he visibly flinches when the word 'charity' is used. The question was about the charity collectors in PDL prior to the arrival of the world's best parents, but I picked up that 'charity' was a sensitive word.

I didn't notice that - must watch it again! - but I did notice he was shaking his head a lot when he should have been nodding.

Do you think he is thinking of the Fund?

by juliet 14.10.13 23:49

russiandoll:
All I saw was a man scrabbling to keep his masters happy.

Glossing over how this night creche person came forward to be eliminated
Underplaying how this huge shift from Tanner seeing abduction to Martin Smith seeing bloody Gerry!!!

by Truthandjustice 14.10.13 23:49

russiandoll wrote:I suggest we forget the media and concentrate on what was said /not said on CW. What we saw / did not see.

We did not see any attempt by Redwood to demonstrate how and when there was an opportunity for an abductor to strike.

He was absolutely clear imo that the info he wants is on the man seen by the Smiths.

He wants closure, 6 years has been long enough.

He was not alongside the parents, for some reason.

He made no mention of finding Maddie and getting her home iirc.

I don't believe for a minute that a senior detective considering a missing child after 6 years thinks there is any chance that the child is alive.

He does seem determined to establish what happened to her imo.

I still maintain my opinion that if this were a cover up of some huge establishment secret there would have silence years ago.

I don't believe that every detective in this case lacks a conscience.

I really hope you are right. Bit in bold, good point. I am finding it so frustrating having read a lot of the PJ files to be presented with kindergarten style information in CW and in the press.

by MRNOODLES 14.10.13 23:49

Newintown wrote:
loopzdaloop wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:

Police say one reading of Madeleine McCann's disappearance in Portugal in 2007 is that it has "all the hallmarks of a pre-planned abduction".
Ah these were the exact words, thank you for posting that link.
I believe the above is a very good disclaimer that Redwood made whilst leading the Mccann's nicely down the garden path.
I don't remember hearing about the man GM said could have been hiding in the apartment while he (GM) went to the loo, or did I miss it?

It's been flipped now. Person in 5a when Kate checked. There's a reason I reckon.

by russiandoll 14.10.13 23:50

Missed which front page WAS KIDNAPPER STILL IN ROOM WHEN KATE CHECKED ON MADDIE ?

Did I read that right? what the hell if I did........

where was Maddie then?

by Willo 14.10.13 23:51

Did not see the programme but skyped England not long after.
The first response I got was "See, I told you they were innocent"

When I argued the fact all I got was "If the UK police are backing them up, they must be innocent I blame the Portuguese police for not doing a better a job". I think the McCann's will be happy with the outcome. I can't see it being a trap. Too convoluted and not really required.

The whitewash has worked. UK mainstream still have not a clue. And I might add the UK police have really gone to a very dark place, to protect who or what I wonder. What else have they /will they cover up?

On the bright side there are a probably more than a few VIP's with more relaxed sphincters, drinking to the fact that the upper establishment can carry on looking after their own and preying on others.

Keep Calm Carry On.........pfffftt

by russiandoll 14.10.13 23:52

juliet wrote:russiandoll:
All I saw was a man scrabbling to keep his masters happy.

Glossing over how this night creche person came forward to be eliminated
Underplaying how this huge shift from Tanner seeing abduction to Martin Smith seeing bloody Gerry!!!

can you please tell me why he has been instructed to do this in your opinion?

by plebgate 14.10.13 23:53

Well she checked all the apartment before running out and leaving the twins in the room alone again and she hasn't said that she saw the abductor in the apartment.

by Guest 14.10.13 23:53

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by Guest 14.10.13 23:54

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by tiredofthebs 14.10.13 23:55

Willo wrote:Did not see the programme but skyped England not long after.
The first response I got was "See, I told you they were innocent"

When I argued the fact all I got was "If the UK police are backing them up, they must be innocent I blame the Portuguese police for not doing a better a job". I think the McCann's will be happy with the outcome. I can't see it being a trap. Too convoluted and not really required.

The whitewash has worked. UK mainstream still have not a clue. And I might add the UK police have really gone to a very dark place, to protect who or what I wonder. What else have they /will they cover up?

On the bright side there are a probably more than a few VIP's with more relaxed sphincters, drinking to the fact that the upper establishment can carry on looking after their own and preying on others.

Keep Calm Carry On.........pfffftt

They happily covered up the skulls and 60 milk teeth found at Haute De La Guarenne. And they covered up Jimmy Savile's exploits for the past 50 years.

As for why they cover it up..the answer is obvious. They are up to their necks in it.

by Guest 14.10.13 23:55

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by Guest 14.10.13 23:56

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by plebgate 14.10.13 23:56

plebgate wrote:Well she checked all the apartment before running out and leaving the twins in the room alone again and she hasn't said that she saw the abductor in the apartment.

ETA in response to Russain Doll's post about headlines in one of the papers. "Was kidnapper still in room when Kate got back?

by juliet 14.10.13 23:56

I have no faith in Redwood. He looks like a fool.
As for Kate Mccann-she is beginning to look like Sonia Sutcliffe, wife of the Yorkshire Ripper. Same bulges under the lower lip.

by Guest 14.10.13 23:56

Metropolitan Police ‏@metpoliceuk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
The Madeleine [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] reconstruction is now available to view online [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

by susible 14.10.13 23:56

russiandoll wrote:I suggest we forget the media and concentrate on what was said /not said on CW. What we saw / did not see.

We did not see any attempt by Redwood to demonstrate how and when there was an opportunity for an abductor to strike.

He was absolutely clear imo that the info he wants is on the man seen by the Smiths.

He wants closure, 6 years has been long enough.

He was not alongside the parents, for some reason.

He made no mention of finding Maddie and getting her home iirc.

I don't believe for a minute that a senior detective considering a missing child after 6 years thinks there is any chance that the child is alive.

He does seem determined to establish what happened to her imo.

I still maintain my opinion that if this were a cover up of some huge establishment secret there would have silence years ago.

I don't believe that every detective in this case lacks a conscience.

Brilliant analysis...am with you 100%

The few things that were said by Redwood (and re-jigged by the producers the words of the McCanns) speak volumes for me...I am not disheartened yet (okay a bit annoyed at the sycophantic approach, but meh nothing new there)

Overall though..I DO believe that SY will crack this case

by Guest 14.10.13 23:57

Do I remember correctly, that the McCanns were "expected" to be live on TV tonight?
Sitting, as announced sitting side by side with Mr. Redwood?
And did they ????

NO, they didn't!
I am still fuming [and Maman too. Which is very dangerous at her age ...].

by phil_burton 14.10.13 23:57

Never posted on here before, but I've read Amaral's book, and I'm a firm believer that the McCanns were somehow involved in the disappearance of their daughter.

I've not seen tonight's Crimewatch, I dont know if I can be bothered to watch it - I'm fed up of the British media. This case has really opened my eyes to the lack of transparency in the higher echelons of power in this country (politics, media, justice etc).

I noticed several comments earlier by users saying that this whole Crimewatch thing might be a "trap" to lure the McCanns in to making their story/variances in stories look ridiculous, and thus bringing them closer to prosecution! Personally, I dont buy this for one minute.

If the Mccann's have backers powerful/rich enough to prevent the whole British media from reporting the WHOLE story, then it's not a stretch to imagine that their power/influence stretches to the BBC. (Incidently, is Crimewatch produced by the BBC? Or is it produced by an independent company (a bit like Top Gear is)).

I believe the only way to finding out what truly happens is if one of the Tapas 7 succumbs to guilt and reveals something (whether inadvertently or not)...but even then, with the way the British media have portrayed this case, I doubt the likelihood of the truth being found.

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by Searcher 14.10.13 23:58

It is possible that a general thought has been planted tonight, which a majority of people - not following the case in any depth - would miss. The general thought would be on the lines of: How extraordinary; one witness thought he saw GM carrying a child that night.

Even if dismissed as an "error", the thought is now out there. I wonder what cumulative effect it may have, and what other questions it may help to raise. nah

by stillsloppingout 15.10.13 0:00

loopzdaloop wrote:
littlepixie wrote:If you KNEW you had fabricated seeing a man carrying off Maddie (Jane Tanner) and now the Police have told you they have found the non-existent man how would you feel?

If you KNEW a witness had seen you disposing of your child and now the Police were looking for that man and had asked you on to Crimewatch to help find him, how would you feel?

Ribisl wrote:I'd like to think SY and Andy Redwood withheld certain elements in this 'reconstruction' because the main purpose of the programme was to draw people's attention to Smiths' sighting and to try to identify the man in question. This is not the McCann agenda at all. They are trying to find out where Madeleine was taken - dead or alive.

Some of the things intentionally omitted in Crimewatch but hugely significant in this investigation imo:
David Payne
Eddie and Keela
Cleaners
Yes, I can see that. I wonder where Gerry was going. Please can some-one point out where on the route that place was that Murat owned which has the freezer in it? Also, didn't the Mccann's replace another freezer in the holiday apartment? or did I dream that?
I also can't quite bring to mind what the conclusions of Pat Brown were around the beach about where Gerry may have gone?

It was Kate's suicidal ideation in her book that always struck me.

Mrs McCann has written before that she was plagued by depression and suicidal thoughts after the abduction of Madeleine.
In a book chronicling her daughter’s disappearance and the toll it took on her family, she wrote that she had an overwhelming urge to swim out to her death at sea.
She wrote: “I had an overwhelming urge to swim out across the ocean, as hard and as fast as I could; to swim and swim and swim until I was so far out and so exhausted I could just allow the water to pull me under and relieve me of this torment.
“I wasn't keeping that desire to myself, either. I was shouting it out to anyone who happened to be in the room. Both this urge and the expression of it were, I suppose, an outlet for the crucifying anguish.
"Somehow, inflicting physical pain on myself seemed to be the only possible way of escaping my internal pain,” she wrote in the book published two years ago. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
wishing to drown in the sea is very specific, which made me wonder if the body was disposed out to sea.

Doubt they would have disposed of the body in the sea , the sea gives up it's dead , wouldnt look good washing up on the beach .
unless they weighed it down , small child about 1 stone would do it . placed in say a large blue sports bag weighted down with some sand, bobs yer uncle .