Re: Netflix probes Madeleine McCann disappearance in new documentary

by sandancer 19.03.19 13:18

I did point out in my previous post that it was IMHO

I spent a long time looking at posts from others who had watched the documentary
not only on here but many other places . I read comments from those who thought it was good , balanced and had changed their minds regarding the McCanns involvement , from those who now questioned their previous thoughts and are now " on the fence " from those who thought it was aimed at attacking Portugal , the PJ and Amaral and created with the McCanns approval if not assistance . I tried to remain open minded , however like everyone else I am entitled to have an opinion . If you disagree with me fair enough I have no problems with that .

I would like to respectfully ask Kkcmp88 how she/he came to the conclusion that G.A planted the cadaver odour that Eddie alerted to ? How did he do it, what did he use and why select behind the sofa in the lounge and the area by the wardrobe in the parents bedroom ?
I am aware of the availability of " pseudo scents " but Grime says in his statement his dogs never reacted to these. So did G.A visit the morgue and wipe swabs over a body then transfer said swabs to 5a , wouldn't it have been better to contaminate the bed Madeleine slept on for example ?
I do hope Kkcmp88 has read Martin Grimes statements and the rest of the Files .

Thank you .Peace .

by Phoebe 19.03.19 14:29

A perfect example of the bias in this Netflix offering is the airbrushing of Mrs. Fenn's testimony (though they did go to the bother of getting her niece to comment because they like what she had to say).
Now , the McCanns claimed they were checking their kids regularly, at least every half hour. Mrs. Fenn, who lived directly above the McCann apartment claimed that on Tuesday night she heard a child crying with increasing volume and distress and yelling for "Daddy" for one and a quarter hours without ceasing. These claims are irreconcilable. If the McCanns were checking their children regularly, they would have noticed the crying and done something about it.
Rather than admit the existence of such contradictory statements given to the police the Netflix offering ignores the sworn evidence given by Mrs. Fenn.
I wonder how uninformed viewers might regard the dogs' findings had they been made aware that a witness living directly above the flat gave sworn evidence that on Tuesday night a child - in her opinion older than a baby - was obviously awake, completely unsupervised and highly distressed for 90 mins. in the flat beneath her.
But alas! This "unbiased" programme neglected to mention that!

by Verdi 19.03.19 14:41

sandancer wrote: I would like to respectfully ask Kkcmp88 how she/he came to the conclusion that G.A planted the cadaver odour that Eddie alerted to ?

I think this might give some indication ..

I was totally perplexed. Although this news, if true, seemed to add weight to the possibility that Madeleine had at the very least been physically harmed, unusually I didn’t dwell too much on the frightening implications. I can only assume this was because what we were being told didn’t make sense. If, as the PJ alleged, Madeleine’s blood was in the boot of our car, which we had not rented until 27 May, how on earth had it got there? Did this mean someone had planted it? I could see no other explanation. The police theory, it seemed, was that we had hidden Madeleine’s body, then moved it later, in the car, and buried it elsewhere.

madeleine by KATE MCCANN

Having said that, it would be mighty interesting to learn how they managed to plant evidence on Kate McCann's harlequin pantaloons affraid

!!!

by Verdi 19.03.19 14:47

As a matter of interest, who and where are all these people who have apparently changed their minds after watching the Netflix propaganda?

Press report comments? Social media?

Face it - it could be any-one writing comments in support of the production.

by Doug D 19.03.19 15:28

Someone picked up on this and posted on the Textusa blog, from @15.38 in Episode 1:

‘Did you notice that Jez Wilkins got threw under the bus right from the very start. The Jenson sister was at pains to let us know she spoke to him outside the apartment immediately after the alarm was raised even though he says he was asleep in bed and was woken by a visit from one of the Tapas 7 informed and went back to sleep’

After all of this time they still can’t get their stories straight!

‘After leaving each other, Gerry walked downward in the direction of the Tapas Bar and I began to walk in the other direction, up the pathway. I turned left at the crossing and passed the apartment. I did not meet anyone else during my walk and once in my apartment, I did not venture out again.………….’

‘………After having gone to sleep on the 3rd of May, we were woken around 01H30 by the manager of the resort, John Hill and by a friend of Gerry's. It was them who told me what had happened. I did not see or hear anything else than what has been stated in this statement. I did not take part in any searches. I offered my help but it was not necessary.’

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by worriedmum 19.03.19 16:02

sandancer wrote:I did point out in my previous post that it was IMHO

I spent a long time looking at posts from others who had watched the documentary
not only on here but many other places . I read comments from those who thought it was good , balanced and had changed their minds regarding the McCanns involvement , from those who now questioned their previous thoughts and are now " on the fence " from those who thought it was aimed at attacking Portugal , the PJ and Amaral and created with the McCanns approval if not assistance . I tried to remain open minded , however like everyone else I am entitled to have an opinion . If you disagree with me fair enough I have no problems with that .

I would like to respectfully ask Kkcmp88 how she/he came to the conclusion that G.A planted the cadaver odour that Eddie alerted to ? How did he do it, what did he use and why select behind the sofa in the lounge and the area by the wardrobe in the parents bedroom ?
I am aware of the availability of " pseudo scents " but Grime says in his statement his dogs never reacted to these. So did G.A visit the morgue and wipe swabs over a body then transfer said swabs to 5a , wouldn't it have been better to contaminate the bed Madeleine slept on for example ?
I do hope Kkcmp88 has read Martin Grimes statements and the rest of the Files .

Thank you .Peace .

by Guest 19.03.19 16:47

Doug D wrote:Someone picked up on this and posted on the Textusa blog, from @15.38 in Episode 1:

‘Did you notice that Jez Wilkins got threw under the bus right from the very start. The Jenson sister was at pains to let us know she spoke to him outside the apartment immediately after the alarm was raised even though he says he was asleep in bed and was woken by a visit from one of the Tapas 7 informed and went back to sleep’

After all of this time they still can’t get their stories straight!

‘After leaving each other, Gerry walked downward in the direction of the Tapas Bar and I began to walk in the other direction, up the pathway. I turned left at the crossing and passed the apartment. I did not meet anyone else during my walk and once in my apartment, I did not venture out again.………….’

‘………After having gone to sleep on the 3rd of May, we were woken around 01H30 by the manager of the resort, John Hill and by a friend of Gerry's. It was them who told me what had happened. I did not see or hear anything else than what has been stated in this statement. I did not take part in any searches. I offered my help but it was not necessary.’

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Funnily enough I did notice that however I thought it was Jensen lying rather than throwing Wilkins under a bus.

Within minutes of the start of episode one we have Jensen claiming that and then there was Berry. He claims Maddie jumped in the water to retrieve his daughter's hat whilst they were on the boat and they became good friends after that. Apart from this being highly unlikely the boating was on Thursday morning and his daughter didn't go to crèche that afternoon (according to his rogatory). From the outset it was clear that the PJ files meant nothing to the documentary makers and it would be whatever message they wanted to portray.

by Phoebe 19.03.19 18:50

@ HKP. Hi there smilie

. The mini sail allegedly happened on the morning of Thurs May 3rd between 10 -11 a.m. and Berry's daughter is indeed registered as having present that morning (signed out at 12.15 p.m) but not in attendance in the afternoon. That being said, his story of Madeleine "launching herself" from a boat into the sea does not tally with Cat Baker's account who claims Madeleine was scared and fearful in the boat and sat on her lap crying and saying "I'm scared".

Snipped from Cat's rogatory statement -

"I never noted anything strange in Madeleine's comportment during the time I stayed with her. There was one occasion, on Thursday, 3rd of May 2007, around 10H30 in the morning, where she cried at the launch of the yellow safety boat in the ocean where all the children were sailing. She was scared and fearful and cried on my lap "I am scared, I am scared."

by Guest 19.03.19 19:06

Hi [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
The all important comma was missing from my post, the highly unlikely was Maddie jumping in the water (to retrieve the hat). The point I was trying to make was Berry says they became good friends after this, the boat trip was Thursday morning so no time to establish this friendship and it is in my opinion, a made up story.

Keep fighting the good fight big grin

by Phoebe 19.03.19 19:55

HKP wrote:Hi [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
The all important comma was missing from my post, the highly unlikely was Maddie jumping in the water (to retrieve the hat). The point I was trying to make was Berry says they became good friends after this, the boat trip was Thursday morning so no time to establish this friendship and it is in my opinion, a made up story.

Keep fighting the good fight

Gotcha. Yes, the absent comma threw me. You raise a very interesting point - I hadn't taken in that Berry claimed the friendship bloomed as a result of Madeleine's aquatic heroics!! They were thick as thieves after that, according to Berry. As you point out - WHEN!!! His daughter didn't go back to creche that afternoon, Madeleine didn't go to the playground that evening and she was missing by the following day. Therefore, any blossoming friendship was nipped in the bud before it began.

by sandancer 19.03.19 22:10

If Madeleine had " launched herself " into the water to retrieve Jessicas hat , as Neil Berry states , surely Cat or someone would have had to inform Kate or Gerry as she would need to be taken back to the apartment to be dried off and her clothes changed ?

The alleged last photo was supposed to be taken after lunch before she returned to the crèche , Kate goes into much detail about her new outfit then so an explanation about her being wet and having to change clothes is hardly likely to be forgotten ?

Much like " whizzing down the water slide and playing football for an hour "

Fantasy land ! They take us all for gullible fools who haven't read their statements .

by G-Unit 19.03.19 23:41

The adults wore wetsuits when sailing. If the children did the same they wouldn't be wearing their clothes.

by Verdi 19.03.19 23:53

Netflix has had it's day - it's five minutes of fame. Team McCann have again achieved their objective, to detract from important matters and spiral public opinion, more to the point dangerous revelations, into oblivion.

Time to get back to important matters like the Complete Mystery Of Madeleine McCann yes

Onwards and upwards ....

by Phoebe 20.03.19 12:00

It's interesting to take a close look at the new photo which Neil Berry claims shows Madeleine. It is obviously taken on a sunny day and this might accord with the only time allocated in the creche records for "Parachute Grass Time" that week - Sunday 10-11 a.m.
"Madeleine" is wearing a cerise pink dress featuring a dropped waist with a pleated skirt below the drop. This might accord with the cleaner's description of her wearing a "skirt" since the skirt below the dropped waist is an obvious feature.
It is, however, clearly NOT the same smock top she is wearing in the last photo. One is plain, deep cerise pink (like her pedal pusher trousers in the airplane bus video) with dropped waist and pleated "kick out skirt" below the drop (Berry's photo).
The other is of a shorter, pale pink smock with a typical smock-gather just below the bust and free flow from there down. This smock also features a flower-sprig pattern.
If both of these photos were taken on Sunday, then Madeleine must have had a change of clothing during her lunch break that day. Grass stains, maybe....

by **Jill Havern** 20.03.19 12:17

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Madeleine McCann vanished from her holiday apartment in Paia da Luz, Portugal, while her parents were out for dinner nearby. What followed the events of May 3, 2007, was arguably the most heavily ...
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It also includes appearances from authors Anthony Summers and Robbyn Swan, whose book “Looking for Madeleine” became a bestseller at the time.

The book sheds light on a key moment on the night of the disappearance from the view of the “Tapas Seven”, including Fiona Payne.

It reads: “At Apartment 5A, the McCanns’ emotions were spiralling out of control.

“Kate and Gerry were both, Rachel Oldfield recalled ‘pretty much most of the night hysterical and screaming, it was awful.’

Would this be the same night that Kate sat in silence staring at a candle flame and keeping 'vigil' whilst Gerry went to sleep on a camp bed . . . ?
Or another night ?

by **Jill Havern** 20.03.19 14:04

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IS THE STRANGE MAN AT THE GATE MATT OLDFIELD? Why do Netflix & Sun want us to believe a strange man coming out of McCann apartment? Carole Tranmer describes someone similar to MATT OLDFIELD coming out of the 1ST GATE ALONG THE PASSAGEWAY (ie HIS OWN APARTMENT!) [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

by Doug D 20.03.19 20:24

Not going to get involved in the reliability of the Smiths sighting as I've made my views quite clear in the past, but wished to highlight this.

Gemma O’Doherty tweet, 3^rdFeb 2018:

Louth man Martin Smith has confirmed he remains 60-80% sure he saw Gerry McCann carrying a child on the night Madeleine disappeared. Police are keen to talk to the man he saw, who has yet to come forward and identify himself. My report is in @VillageMagIRE today [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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In Episode 5 @ 48.38, so more than twelve months on from the BBC apology, the Netflix programme states:

‘Couldn’t have been Gerry McCann because so many witnesses place him at the Ocean Club at the same time.
The Smiths themselves now believe they saw someone else.’

Has Martin Smith now contacted Netflix to inform them of their inaccuracy or maybe Gemma could be asked to approach the Smith family again for confirmation of this alleged about turn.

Surely Netflix/Pulse wouldn’t lie to us!!!!!!!???????

by Phoebe 20.03.19 23:57

Given that the Daily Star was one of the newspapers "Carter Rucked" by the McCanns in Feb 2008, (Leveson Inquiry evidence) one wonders why the McCanns took no action over the article by the Daily Star on (Feb 24th 2018) which reported that -

"The BBC has been forced to edit a Madeleine McCann documentary after (Panorama) wrongly accused a key witness of changing his evidence. .... he said at no point had he changed his statement or changed his mind about the sighting and he had contacted the BBC to complain. T.V. bosses have now edited the episode on iplayer to remove any suggestion he had retracted his evidence. The BBC said "the SUGGESTION that the Smith family had changed their minds was made in good faith" (my emphasis)

I expect Netflix will make an excuse - that Netflix episode was made before they were aware of this correction, it was an oversight - yada yada yada.

by Verdi 21.03.19 0:23

Phoebe wrote:Given that the Daily Star was one of the newspapers "Carter Rucked" by the McCanns in Feb 2008, (Leveson Inquiry evidence)

Citation please.

by Phoebe 21.03.19 1:09

THE LEVESON INQUIRY

INTO THE CULTURE PRACTICES AND ETHICS OF THE PRESS

Part I : Module I

WITNESS STATEMENT OF GERALD PATRICK McCANN

Libel Claims - Express Group Newspapers 65. Carter-Ruck sent a letter before action on 30 January 2008 to the editor of the Daily Express. On 6 February 2008 they sent a similar letter to the editor of the Daily Star. These letters attached a schedule of the most serious articles we complained of. A copy of these schedules and articles is attached to this statement as ’Exhibit GM2’ and ’Exhibit GM3’

edited to add it's paragraph 65.

by Verdi 21.03.19 1:26

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by Doug D 21.03.19 16:36

Tracey’s been missing out on bylines over the last few days, but pops up today with an ‘exclusive’ on ‘Harrisonman’.

Good one Trace.

‘so credible’, ‘grubby thin man….scouring the beach resort for a suitable child’, snatched to order for wealthy family or pedo ring’, ‘description was similar to one given by Jane Tanner’ (eggman? I thought he was the ‘going the wrong way’ Totman.), ‘collecting money for an orphanage’, ‘Moroccan’, ‘trolling’,

got it all in there, but ‘exclusive?

And Gail Cooper may not have agreed to have been in the new programme, but obviously happy for all of the old footage to have been used.

Brian Kennedy says in the programme, ‘80% likeness to the man she (Tanner) saw”.

Got to feel sorry for Totman. Did he really look like this?

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'HE WAS SO CREEPY'
Madeleine McCann – Brit gran who saw ‘scruffy weirdo’ lurking near Maddie apartment is still convinced he was sex gang’s ‘lookout man’

Nottinghamshire grandmother Gail Cooper's sightings were deemed so credible she was quizzed by cops and an FBI-trained artist sketched an impression of the suspect that was released publicly

EXCLUSIVE

By Corey Charlton and Tracey Kandohla
21st March 2019, 11:38 am
Updated: 21st March 2019, 2:36 pm

A BRIT who saw a creepy man lurking around Madeleine McCann's room when the toddler vanished believes he was the "lookout" for a child snatching gang.
Grandmother Gail Cooper exclusively told The Sun Online that she fears Maddie is now dead, adding: "Whatever her fate, her parents need answers."

Gail said: "It is possible she is alive after nearly 12 years but not probable."
The retired care home manager's sightings of the suspect were deemed so credible she was quizzed by police and an FBI-trained artist was brought in to sketch him.
She drawn into the media frenzy and was quizzed by cops after revealing she had spotted a "disturbing and dirty" man lurking near the Portuguese apartment days before Maddie vanished.
Gail recalled how during a family holiday to the pretty Algarve resort of Praia da Luz to celebrate her 50th birthday in April 2007 she saw "a strange long-haired, grubby, thin man” she is convinced was scouring the beach resort for a suitable child to snatch.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] disappeared from her bed on May 3, 2007, while on holiday with her parents and family friends at a resort in Praia da Luz, Portugal.
Her parents, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], had left her sleeping with her siblings while they had dinner at the hotel's restaurant - only realising at about 10pm that she was gone.

'HE WAS THE LOOKOUT MAN'

Speaking exclusively to The Sun Online, Gail said: "I don’t know if he was the kidnapper but I think he was involved in her disappearance. I think he was the lookout man.
"He was so creepy and I first saw him on the beach watching my friend’s little grandchild."
Gail 61, spoke out again to[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]which parents [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] in amidst fears it could "hamper" the search for their daughter.
The tourist - who still visits her favourite destination Portugal three times a year with machine operator hubby John, 58 - was invited by the American global streaming giant to participate in the eight part series but chose not to.
Mum-of-three Gail from Newark, Nottinghamshire, said: "This programme has bought all the memories flooding back. I hope it has some positivity in the search for Maddie.”
She is convinced [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] either on order for a wealthy family desperate for a child or by a sinister paedophile ring.
"I think the kiddie was [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] by someone wanting a blonde blue eyed child and if that is the case then there is a good chance she is wanted and loved and being looked and is hopefully still alive.
"But if she was taken by a sex gang I doubt there’s any real chance she’s alive today, it’s possible but sadly not probable. Her poor parents need answers whatever her fate."
Gail’s sighting of a potential abductor led to an FBI-trained artist drawing a sketch of the suspect which was released in January 2008.
Her description was similar to one given by Jane Tanner, a holiday pal of Maddie’s parents who saw a man carrying a barefooted child in pyjamas on the night Maddie vanished.

HAUNTED BY 'SCRUFFY WEIRDO'

Today - nearly 12 years after the youngster was snatched in the world's biggest ever missing child mystery - Gail remembers the “scruffy weirdo” whose face still haunts her.
She had been staying in a private villa in Luz in April 2007 and clocked him before the McCann’s arrived for their ill-fated holiday at a nearby Mark Warner complex.
She first spotted him on the beach, getting drenched in a sudden downpour of rain.
On another occasion he knocked on her villa door saying he was collecting money for an orphanage in the neighbouring village of Espiche.
Gail recalled: "He was very pushy and intimidating. He said the parents of some British kids had been killed in a traffic accident.
"But I didn’t believe his story, he didn't seen genuine and I didn’t give him any money.
"He kept staring at me, imploring me. He spoke in English but it wasn’t really with a Portuguese accent.
"He was olive skinned and shabby, I thought he may have been Moroccan."
She added: "He was a horrible-looking, really creepy, unkempt and dirty. There was just nothing in his eyes or soul, nothing."
Gail saw the same man again watching children going to the beach from the holiday club which Maddie joined just days later.
After returning home and hearing of Madeleine’s abduction a week later, Gail contacted police and gave a statement to the Leicestershire force which was liaising with Portuguese officers.

'I'D DO ANYTHING TO HELP'

In January 2008 she was contacted by the McCanns’ private investigators and agreed to sit for 10 hours with an artist to create the first full facial image of the suspect.
She explained: "I was happy to do anything I could to help. I couldn’t get the image of the man out of my head and I was racking my brains trying to remember everything he said and every detail about him.
"I am left with a strong sense of frustration because this is still unresolved."
Scotland Yard detectives, who took over the high profile search in May 2011, have interviewed her several times as part of their painstaking inquiries, which have so far unearthed no new clues as to Maddie’s whereabouts.
Gail, who is in the process of viewing the Netflix documentary, declined to take part despite request from producers who visited her at home two years ago during early inquiries.

TROLLED BY CONSPIRACY NUTS

She said: "At the time I wasn’t in the best of health and following my co-operation with the police and media I received a lot of online abuse."
She claims she was trolled by web haters who thought she was "giving a potential alibi" to Maddie’s parents who were [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].
She said: "It was very offensive and upsetting and I didn’t want any repeat so I said no to Netflix although I helped them with background inquiries and gave them photos of our holiday."
Heart doctor Gerry, 50, and former GP Kate, 51, of Rothley, Leicestershire, have been bombarded with criticism over the years, with people accusing them of [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].
Gail said: "It would be amazing if the parents could be reunited with their daughter if she is alive.
"But she was three going on four when she went missing and would she even remember her previous life?"
The McCann's cling onto a[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and waiting to be found. She would [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].
Maddie was snatched from her bed in a holiday flat while her parents were dining in a nearby restaurant with their friends, a group that came to be known as the "Tapas 7".
She had been left sleeping alone with her younger twin siblings[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] while Kate and Gerry made their own half hour checks on the children.
…………………………………………….
And then we get the naf schematic of the OC showing the Tapas Bar in the tree, and the apartment and kids room with the great big open window, plus a video schematic to boot!

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by Constablekid 22.03.19 1:02

In episode 3 Gonçalo mentions that when Kate discovered MBM missing, apparently Kate said that she checked under her daughters bed when looking for her, but can’t have done, because the divan style bed went all the way to the floor.

This is a new piece of info to me. Anyone else heard of this before or can elaborate?
Thanks !

by **PeterMac** 22.03.19 8:08

This photo is from the Mirror. Madeleine's bed shown.

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by willowthewisp 22.03.19 14:05

PeterMac wrote:This photo is from the Mirror. Madeleine's bed shown.

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What happened to the Bedroom Door(opening inwards) during the Photograph?

by crusader 22.03.19 16:38

Stephen Carpenter said Maddie was in the new photo with his daughter, who he said were friends. I know they were both in the Lobsters, but not in the same group. He also said Maddie jumped into the water to retrieve his daughter`s hat. Does anyone know, if when they went on outside activities, both groups went together. It was`nt how Cat baker described the outing.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________

Topic merged with existing thread. Mod

by Doug D 22.03.19 18:28

As shown in the Mirror photo, the door hinges back towards the wall, which allowed for 'flatman' to hide behind it, squashed against the wall when GM did his alleged check!

by Doug D 22.03.19 19:13

Neil Berry, not Carpenter.

Three girls and two boys in the photo actually ties in with the crèche records for the Sunday, as does the schedule for parachute time, with Cat Baker supervising.
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by crusader 22.03.19 19:24

Yes sorry about the confusion, I think Ill go and lie down in a dark room.

by Verdi 22.03.19 20:50

The story is utter tripe. If this photograph was legitimate, it would be included in the PJ files and would have been splashed across the headlines years ago.

I'll wager someone received a nice little financial incentive to participate in the Netflix propaganda.

Makes you wonder why the McCanns haven't sued. Oh no, of course, it's to their advantage to allow the production of a film documentary that favours their version of events.

Showing one of the last ever pictures taken of Maddie before she went missing, Neil revealed they were playing with a parachute before the McCann family was turned upside down.

The Mirror [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

To use the vernacular .... cobblers !!!