CRIMEWATCH Update on MadeleineMcCann case tonight 19th March

Seems to me that Redwood is putting out the information that Madeleine might have died in 5A, and to justify this announcement he's wheeled out that dastardly supervillian Circleman.

jeanmonroe wrote:This is, from DCI Redwood, a 'sheer panic, rabbit caught in the headlights' response to GA interview.

He's absolutely 'cacking his pants' that GA is one person he CANNOT 'control'

He is 'cacking his pants' that a foreign 'whistle blower' (current, EX PJ?) will expose his, and the corrupt ridden Met's, utter incompetence/non cooperation in this hugely expensive, taxpayer funded, 'investigation'

All , imo, obviously.

I'm with you there. I think Dr Amaral got on the right wavelength by using the word courage.

I've been thinking: it might not be a bad development at all. It's like a striptease, slowly, slowly operation Grange (and Andy) are being revealed for the frauds they are. Every event will result in more people seeing what a farce this is.

We've had the cleaners, now the garbage men. Do they still have old fashioned milkmen in Portugal, they might be next.

dantezebu wrote:From the guardian:
Detective Chief Inspector Andy Redwood, in charge of the hunt for Madeleine, accepted there were differences between these cases and that of Madeleine's disappearance but added that there was a possibility that Madeleine had not left her family's holiday apartment alive when she disappeared in May 2007.

Redwood said the assumption that Madeleine had been alive "may not follow with all our thinking" on the case.

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Thsi is the only significant news IMO.
It seems Redwood is taking the dog indications into account.

That's a special kind of abductor then: abducting dead bodies.

What's more - if Madeleine died in 5A, then the disappearance of the body needs to be explained. I don't think it's much of a leap from that to the involvement of the McCanns.

Happened MAINLY in villa's etc etc

The rest of the time in slums with african emigrants, or what?

Tony Bennett wrote:BREAKING MADELEINE MCCANN NEWS:

Evening Standard, a few minutes ago:




Hunt for sex fiend who assaulted five young British girls on holiday in the Algarve

Detectives probing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann revealed today they are hunting a sex fiend who assaulted five other young British girls on holiday on the Algarve.

In a sensational development, Scotland Yard announced officers are investigating 12 potentially linked crimes in holiday resorts near to where Madeleine vanished in 2007.

In every case a man broke into mainly holiday villas occupied by British families -—and in four of them he assaulted five young white girls aged seven to 10 as they lay in bed. On one occasion he assaulted two girls in the same villa.

Many of the attacks were between 2004 and 2006, which was the year before Madeleine went missing from her bed in a holiday apartment in Praia de Luz. The most recent break-in was reported in 2010.

Police say that while the crimes are not identical, most are similar. There were no signs of forced entry, nothing was taken and the intruder appeared between 2am and 5am.

Most of the offences took place in the low season and on two occasions people reported hearing the noise of a bin collection lorry nearby.

Detectives believe that the suspect may have been in a villa looking around “for some time” before committing the offences.

In some cases the parent or the child woke up and disturbed the intruder but police say the man stayed calm even when confronted.

Of the 12 cases, two occurred in Praia de Luz — where Madeleine was staying when she disappeared — four in the holiday resort of Carvoeiro and six in the Vale da Parra and Praia da Gale districts west of Albufeira.

Detectives believe there could be more cases of similar crimes where victims’ families did not bother to report them to police. They urged those people to come forward and released an image of a distinctive red T-shirt linked to the hunt.

Madeleine was three when she vanished from her holiday apartment as her parents Kate and Gerry dined at a nearby tapas restaurant with friends in May 2007.

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This distinctive red hooped t-shirt is linked to the hunt

Broke into MAINLY holiday villas?

Could we be a bit more specific on where precisely the break in is purported to have occurred? Please?

(not you, mr Bennett, the other guys)

whatliesbehindthesofa wrote:What's more - if Madeleine died in 5A, then the disappearance of the body needs to be explained.  I don't think it's much of a leap from that to the involvement of the McCanns.

At the beginning of the investigation he categorically ruled out the McCanns and the tapas friends. Since then, there have been two huge leaps, they have got rid of the McCann's abductor and DCI Redwood has now revealed she may have been dead.

If she was dead, there is absolutely no way the McCanns could be ruled out. If she died behind the sofa, she then spent some time in the wardrobe. The abductor also cleaned up! During all of this time the McCanns and their friends were visiting the apartment regularly. Not to mention that at 9.10 her father saw her and she was alive and well.

That he said 'died in the apartment' does imo, mean its all over. If they were completely innocent, his saying that could/would lead to all sorts of law suits. Look how sensitive the McCanns were over the recent Mirror article that described Madeleine's disappearance as a mystery.

The media have seen so many ridiculous suspects, if they have an ounce of common sense (questionable) they will skip the latest McCann suggestion (I feel they are involved in the investigation) and focus on the words 'died in the apartment'. It may take them a few days, but it will sink in. No abductor has been found in 7 years, and putting a new one forward every week, is convincing no-one.

Coming back t the computer, I found a 19 pages on this subject, so haven't read it all yet.

Could someone, please, direct me again to the link, where I can watch BBC1 whilst living in France?
[I promise, that this time I will take proper note and remember ...]

ETA I take it that K&G will not be present tonight ... ?

SixMillionQuid wrote:

Andrew77R wrote:

tiny wrote:Im sorry but this is another load of bollox from sy,they have the culprits at there finger tips and they are still chasing these make believe people

whitewash any one.

Certainly looking that way.

After reading GA's interview i naively felt extremely encouraged that the 'net' at last could be closing.

Now feeling utter despair at the new crock that's coming out. Christ almighty. What the hell are AR and SY playing at. 

Absolute disgrace.

I think GA's interview has highlighted that there was a lot political influence that forced him of the case, leading to the situation we're in now. I think he's 110% correct.

The man Operation Grange is looking for now never abducted a child. It's clear that he checked on children's passports to see if they were British and if one wasn't available he conducted an on the spot English test.

Only if they were white; why bother with a swarthy Portuguese child?

I just wonder why the parents of the children who were allegedly sexually assaulted after 2007 did not contact Pinkie or his clients? The info. could have helped with their PI's investigation.    It would have been so easy to contact them via their website.

lj wrote:

dantezebu wrote:From the guardian:
Detective Chief Inspector Andy Redwood, in charge of the hunt for Madeleine, accepted there were differences between these cases and that of Madeleine's disappearance but added that there was a possibility that Madeleine had not left her family's holiday apartment alive when she disappeared in May 2007.

Redwood said the assumption that Madeleine had been alive "may not follow with all our thinking" on the case.

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Thsi is the only significant news IMO.
It seems Redwood is taking the dog indications into account.

That's a special kind of abductor then: abducting dead bodies.

Taking us into Burke and Hare territory and bodies sold for medical research, so it then follows that the Portuguese medical establishment comes into it ?

Doug D wrote:This has just been added to the Met Police Press page following the press briefing:

Adding to the statement issued earlier today, DCI Andy Redwood said at the subsequent media briefing:

“In six of the 12 potentially linked offences the suspect either sat or lay on the bed, before committing the sexual assault in four of those cases (where there were five actual victims). In nine of the 12 cases there was no forced entry or stolen property; and where there was it was minimal. 

“Nine of these offences were reported to police at the time (including the four where there had been a sexual assault); two were reported to a holiday rep and then subsequently to the authorities back in the UK; and one was not reported at the time. 

“In terms of the ongoing investigation, we have submitted three International Letters of Requests (ILORs) to date, consisting of 41 priority areas of work, which in turn contain 287 separate requests. There will be further ILORs to come to ensure that we bring our complete investigation to the Portuguese and they include our multiple priority lines of inquiry.

“We have also submitted 30 ILORs to other countries to assist our inquiries. The team has taken over 500 statements and the process itself has raised 5569 actions.

“Within the investigation we have identified 60 persons of interest, of which we have been able to discount 22. We are still working on the remaining 38, which are at various stages of completion.

“In addition to persons of interest we are aware of 530 sex offenders from the UK and elsewhere whose whereabouts are unaccounted for. These have been broken down into high, medium and low priority. 59 are currently considered high priority; and some of those have also been declared persons of interest.

“There have been 26 visits to Portugal at both a strategic and tactical level; and officers have travelled to and worked with the authorities from Spain, Belgium, Jersey, Switzerland, Holland and Germany; as well as colleagues from across the UK.” 


I think my previously stated 'ray of hope' about eliminating everybody else in order to eventually 'prove the circumstantial' can be discarded, because with these figures it's never going to happen, not in our lifetimes anyway.

Is there any evidence that the disappearance of little Maddie McCann had anything to do with sex, sexual assaults, sex offenders, sex fiends, and what have you?

No? Thought not

Then why does AR/SY assume a link with some sexual deviant, if that?

Châtelaine wrote:Coming back t the computer, I found a 19 pages on this subject, so haven't read it all yet.

Could someone, please, direct me again to the link, where I can watch BBC1 whilst living in France?
[I promise, that this time I will take proper note and remember ...]

ETA I take it that K&G will not be present tonight ... ?

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(Stream 5)  

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Meanwhile back in Belgravia

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dantezebu wrote:From the guardian:
Detective Chief Inspector Andy Redwood, in charge of the hunt for Madeleine, accepted there were differences between these cases and that of Madeleine's disappearance but added that there was a possibility that Madeleine had not left her family's holiday apartment alive when she disappeared in May 2007.

Redwood said the assumption that Madeleine had been alive "may not follow with all our thinking" on the case.

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Thsi is the only significant news IMO.
It seems Redwood is taking the dog indications into account.

That's is a very important breakthrough, a veritable milestone!

So only two things remain to find out now:

1. who killed her;
2. who removed the body

DCI Redwood states 

Whilst not identical, there are many similar aspects to each of the incidents in that in most cases

• there were no signs of forced entry to the property,
  
• nothing was taken,
  
• and the intruder appeared in the early hours of the morning between 02.00hrs and 05.00hrs
  
  

well, as Meatloaf once said, two out of three aint bad, DCI Redwood. Keep going.   

Oh yes, the intruder called by with a most inconspicuous means of transportation, that ideally unobtrusive and quiet vehicle....a bin lorry!

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tasprin wrote:DCI Redwood has discounted Tannerman and the 9.15 timeline. The focus is on the time between 9.40 - 10 pm. SY are still looking for Smithman and now they think there is a possibility Madeleine did not leave the apartment alive:

'there was a possibility that Madeleine had not left her family's holiday apartment alive when she disappeared in May 2007.

Redwood said the assumption that Madeleine had been alive "may not follow with all our thinking" on the case'

They are clearly investigating the theory that Madeleine died in the apartment. Gerry must be hopping mad right now and Kate will be battering the walls. They have spent all those millions stopping people from saying that, and now the Chief Detective in their case is saying it on National television!

Will be interesting to hear the Portuguese Media's response to this latest "Hot" news, particularly a certain outspoken editor of a certain Portuguese Newspaper who has not held back on his opinions of SY and their line of investigation. Love to hear his take on this latest suspect particularly when it involves allegations of past possible sexual attacks on children in Portugal - surely they would have some new on this in their archives if it were reported, as they say, at the time.

Not buying any of this. One might concur that AR has been reading this forum and has seen that tricky little issue of 'the dogs' coming up again and again. A lifeless abduction would be a cover-all - but how can they explain the rest, and why....who knows? Possibly...a work still in progress perhaps? Still, CW will be interesting to watch tonight. And for those who think it is just a slow step forward...I really hope you are right, but to waste the public's time and money for this length of time - only to bring up another possible suspect for them to consider when they haven't even discounted the others yet. Or perhaps they will discount them tonight and explain who the other pos. suspects were...Not holding my breath though.

I await to hear news on GA's civil trial - the only hope I still have, and the only Policeman I have faith in in all of this murky, but very sad mess.

Go Goncalo!

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Meanwhile back in Belgravia

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I find this post extremely poignant.

Poor, poor Madeleine.    

I truly hope Mr Redwood is doing his absolute best for her.

Redwood is poised to announce to the world that there is no evidence that Madeleine was alive when removed from the apartment, as reported in the Grauniad
The PJ told the world that 7 years ago.
Eddie and Keela, working for the English Police, told the world that 6 and three quarter years ago
The first Senior investigating officer told the world that
The second investigating officer told the world that
The archiving report told the world that
Their own highly paid mouthpiece in the form of Mrs Martorell, told the world that, in the High Court of Justice in London
BUT

The "Fund" is STILL soliciting donations for the "search"

This just seems a massive dump of drivel.

All the time that has passed, and the 'investigation' team suddenly finds some other historical line of investigation to pursue.

It really is all beyond parody.It just appears utterly incompetent, doesn't it.As has been said many times before, eliminate family members first from the investigation, and then move outwards.Don't start from the farthest point and move inwards.Otherwise, we could all be here for........

If that is the objective, then our boys are doing a good job.

MRNOODLES wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Arsenal 05 shirt innit

Exactly the first thing, I thought!

MILLIE wrote:DCI Redwood states 

Whilst not identical, there are many similar aspects to each of the incidents in that in most cases

• there were no signs of forced entry to the property,
  
• nothing was taken,
  
• and the intruder appeared in the early hours of the morning between 02.00hrs and 05.00hrs
  
  

well, as Meatloaf once said, two out of three aint bad, DCI Redwood. Keep going.   

Oh yes, the intruder called by with a most inconspicuous means of transportation, that ideally unobtrusive and quiet vehicle....a bin lorry!

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No signs of forced entry?

What happened to the jemmied shutters?

Kate writes about these incidences in her book. On page 323 she writes about 'the record of sexual crimes against children in the Algarve.'
She writes: 'I read of five cases of British children on holiday being sexually abused in their beds while their parents slept in another room. In three further incidents, children encountered an intruder in their bedrooms, who was  presumably disturbed before he had the chance to carry out an assault. I guessed these were the reports that Bill Henderson, the British consul at the time of Madeleine's abduction, had told me about.'

'These incidents has occurred within an hour's drive of Praia da Luz over the three years prior to Madeleine's disappearance. The PJ had never mentioned any of them to us. In fact, I gathered from the files, some of them hadn't even been recorded by the authorities at the time they were reported (evidently they were not considered to be actual crimes.'

' So they might not have come to light if the parents of these children hadn't been brave enough to come forward to the British police after Madeleine was taken and relive their nightmares. They did so in the belief that there could be a link between what had happened to their children and what had happened to her.'

'It broke my heart to read the terrible accounts of these devastated parents and the experiences of their poor children......there was a familiar thread running through them all. The parents had called the police; they hadn't felt that the crime was taken seriously by the police or by their tour operators; statements were often not take; DNA and fingerprint evidence was frequently not sought. In most cases there was no sign of a break-in.'

Kate then quotes from a letter of complaint from one mother to the GNR regarding the sexual abuse of her daughter and the lack of proper attention paid to it by the authorities with the mother allegedly writing: 'It did not appear to us that there was any great incentive or determination to find the offender and bring him to justice.......Furthermore, it could all have been so much worse.....indeed this man could go on to do much worse to another child if he's not stopped now.'

Kate then writes: 'Six months later our beloved Madeleine was grabbed from her bed'.  While she then acknowledges that these children were not abducted and the crimes may be completely unrelated she writes: 'What these cases do demonstrate, however, is that British tourists in holiday accommodation were being targeted. At the very least, the possibility of a link between these incidents and Madeleine's disappearance should have been investigated.'

While it is extremely peculiar that these offences did not appear to come to light over here, could it be the the Met are painstakingly ruling out all possible suspects as advanced by the McCanns? If these crimes are proven to be entirely unrelated to what happened to Madeleine, another plank of the McCann construct is removed. The Jane Tanner sighting, which was always a key to their theory, has been eliminated. Which leaves  the Smith sighting which Kate in her book suggests is the same person  seen by Jane Tanner. 

Kate in her book is obliged to ask the obvious question about why the abductor should be wandering around with Madeleine for three-quarters of an hour but  is unable to proved an answer: 'Who knows why there was a forty-five minute gap between the two sightings, or where this man might have been in between? I long ago stopped trying to come up with answers because I don't think I need to. If the child was Madeleine - and in four years no father has ever come forward to say it was him and his daughter - why would we assume he would be behaving normally or logically? There is nothing normal about stealing a little girl from her bed, so why should his subsequent actions be predictable? The abductor would hardly have been expecting to see Jane walking towards him as he escaped, let alone have anticipated that Gerry would be standing talking round the corner. Whatever plan was in his mind, he might well have been forced by these near misses to change it pretty quickly.'

Indeed - it's interesting how the abductor walked right past Gerry McCann. Then Jez Wilkins popped up. It appears there were indeed, as Kate writes, quite a few near misses for this particular 'abductor' who it appears was forced to change his plan and pretty quickly. And odder too that the father that the Smith family spotted - who looked remarkably like Gerry McCann carrying a heavily sleeping little girl - has  never come forward to the police so he can be eliminated from the enquiry?

I love Kate's comment about not needing to come up with any answers. The exquisite irony of just about everything she write is farcical. And of course, in her own way, she has actually come up with quite a few answers.

#mccann on twitter is absolutely loving this.

Cristobell wrote:

tasprin wrote:DCI Redwood has discounted Tannerman and the 9.15 timeline. The focus is on the time between 9.40 - 10 pm. SY are still looking for Smithman and now they think there is a possibility Madeleine did not leave the apartment alive:

'there was a possibility that Madeleine had not left her family's holiday apartment alive when she disappeared in May 2007.

Redwood said the assumption that Madeleine had been alive "may not follow with all our thinking" on the case'

They are clearly investigating the theory that Madeleine died in the apartment.  Gerry must be hopping mad right now and Kate will be battering the walls.  They have spent all those millions stopping people from saying that, and now the Chief Detective in their case is saying it on National television!

Good point and has helped me through my initial slump following this development.

If it does lead to the theory that MBM died in 5A, surely the dog findings need to looked at openly - ALL of it!

NickE wrote:

Châtelaine wrote:Coming back t the computer, I found a 19 pages on this subject, so haven't read it all yet.

Could someone, please, direct me again to the link, where I can watch BBC1 whilst living in France?
[I promise, that this time I will take proper note and remember ...]

ETA I take it that K&G will not be present tonight ... ?

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(Stream 5)  

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Thank you, Nick, but it doesn't seem to work for me: I only get sound, no images ...
There were one or two other links, which I've used previously, but cannot remember.
Anyone????

And if Redwood is also exploring the possibility that Madeleine did not leave the apartment alive - challenging the McCann's assumption that Madeleine was kidnapped - that pretty much removes the last plank, doesn't it?

In any event, if these other crimes did take place, and even if they have nothing to do with Madeleine's disappearance, it is a much better use of police time than many of the CM 'sightings' that were sending everyone on a wild goose chase for so long.

I think this is reasonably promising.

Slowly, slowly catch the monkey.

5 sets of parents asleep when their children were assaulted in their bedrooms.   So all five sets of  parents went to bed and failed to secure their rental property.   HUH.  I don't get it.    I really don't.

bobby18 wrote:

MRNOODLES wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Arsenal 05 shirt innit

Exactly the first thing, I thought!

I LOVE IT. Mr Noodles.  A not so subliminal message to you-know-who that 'the gunners have got you in their sights'. 

I wonder when the troops will storm the Towers and take no two prisoners?