Did paedophile Raymond Hewlett really know what happened to Madeleine McCann?

But none of that pressure exists at the moment does it? It’s past, potential or imaginary and public pressure isn’t getting a voice.

In the end, the public will not criticise them for an honest and competent investigation.

Common sense observation however indicates there may be pressure from other arenas, political if you like, to bring the case to a *satisfactory* conclusion. Now if they surrender or sell their own integrity, honesty and allegiance to the oath they and every other police officer past, present and future swears, and if it exists, bow to that pressure then they will deserve everything that comes their way, in this life and the next.

One thing is for sure. Time will definitely tell, and it can’t be too much longer.

tcat wrote:I do because the case still has the potential to return to the media hysteria we saw in 2007/8. Mr Redwood had a taste of that when he gave his interviews. I'm sure they are well aware they have to be very careful.

Mr. Redwood had no business appearing in public and on camera stating the progress in the case. He had no business appearing on morning time TV either. He had no business stating any conclusion reached at that stage. He should never have been in front of the cameras and never have cooperated with the McCanns - stating this publicly too - to generate an age advanced photo. He was in the middle of a long investigation/review!
He generally gave the impression that close cooperation with TM took place, that there was a good chance that Maddie was still alive (end of sentence 'but also sadly, dead' is never as important as the start of a sentence).
I don't think anything will come of this. SY is allegedly now looking into the Hewlitt evidence - it's going to be a whitewash, what's to be hidden from the public? They're not even looking at it themselves.

tigger wrote:

tcat wrote:I do because the case still has the potential to return to the media hysteria we saw in 2007/8. Mr Redwood had a taste of that when he gave his interviews. I'm sure they are well aware they have to be very careful.

Mr. Redwood had no business appearing in public and on camera stating the progress in the case. He had no business appearing on morning time TV either. He had no business stating any conclusion reached at that stage. He should never have been in front of the cameras and never have cooperated with the McCanns - stating this publicly too - to generate an age advanced photo. He was in the middle of a long investigation/review!
He generally gave the impression that close cooperation with TM took place, that there was a good chance that Maddie was still alive (end of sentence 'but also sadly, dead' is never as important as the start of a sentence).
I don't think anything will come of this. SY is allegedly now looking into the Hewlitt evidence - it's going to be a whitewash, what's to be hidden from the public? They're not even looking at it themselves.

Who says they're looking at Hewlett? The Mirror? If that's the only source then I'd not take it too seriously.

Certainly I agree with you about Mr Redwood - he may or may not be a great policeman, but he's certainly not a PR specialist.

I don't share your pessimistic view of what the review has been doing these past 18 months. Nor do I expect them to swoop on K&G in a dawn raid either. I really don't think we have any idea at all what they're going to end up saying. But presumably they are going to produce a report of some kind, and it will be made public?

monkey mind wrote:But none of that pressure exists at the moment does it? It’s past, potential or imaginary and public pressure isn’t getting a voice.

In the end, the public will not criticise them for an honest and competent investigation.

Common sense observation however indicates there may be pressure from other arenas, political if you like, to bring the case to a *satisfactory* conclusion. Now if they surrender or sell their own integrity, honesty and allegiance to the oath they and every other police officer past, present and future swears, and if it exists, bow to that pressure then they will deserve everything that comes their way, in this life and the next.

One thing is for sure. Time will definitely tell, and it can’t be too much longer.

Yes, that pressure exists constantly. If it wasn't there, would the papers still have the case on the front pages regularly? They know other cases may have faded in the public's memory, but this one hasn't. I don't think it ever will.

tcat wrote:

monkey mind wrote:But none of that pressure exists at the moment does it? It’s past, potential or imaginary and public pressure isn’t getting a voice.

In the end, the public will not criticise them for an honest and competent investigation.

Common sense observation however indicates there may be pressure from other arenas, political if you like, to bring the case to a *satisfactory* conclusion. Now if they surrender or sell their own integrity, honesty and allegiance to the oath they and every other police officer past, present and future swears, and if it exists, bow to that pressure then they will deserve everything that comes their way, in this life and the next.

One thing is for sure. Time will definitely tell, and it can’t be too much longer.

Yes, that pressure exists constantly. If it wasn't there, would the papers still have the case on the front pages regularly? They know other cases may have faded in the public's memory, but this one hasn't. I don't think it ever will.

That assumes the deck hasn't been or isn't being stacked. That assumes an investigation of honesty and integrity, a genuine effort to get to the truth. Personally speaking, I hope you are right, but in a review whose inception coincided with the publishing of her book, and when the SIO takes to the airwaves breaking a vow of silence at a time that also coincides with the launch of the paperback book, and spouts what frankly appears to be a load of hogwash and rhetoric backed up by long retired mates – amongst many other things - then I feel entitled to raise a monkey eyebrow. And it wasn’t just the age progression photograph. There was the nonsense of 195 new leads. That was nothing more than an attempt to impress the public and justify expenditure with numbers. I can say with absolute certainty that if after a year a major investigation has two hundred outstanding actions it is more than likely headless and going nowhere. The idea is to close down those avenues. When a senior officer starts broadcasting how many people they have spoken to, how many witnesses, how many statements taken, how many man hours, how much overtime, how much its cost yada yada its a sure sign all is not well.

Silence would have spoken far louder.

I hope I am wrong, I really do. But if I am not if it is fudged whether through incompetence or otherwise, it will be the betrayal of a small child, victim of some heinous act and it will taint and cast shame on every decent man or woman that ever held a warrant card, here, and in Portugal.

Yes, I sincerely hope I am wrong.

monkey mind wrote:

tcat wrote:

monkey mind wrote:But none of that pressure exists at the moment does it? It’s past, potential or imaginary and public pressure isn’t getting a voice.

In the end, the public will not criticise them for an honest and competent investigation.

Common sense observation however indicates there may be pressure from other arenas, political if you like, to bring the case to a *satisfactory* conclusion. Now if they surrender or sell their own integrity, honesty and allegiance to the oath they and every other police officer past, present and future swears, and if it exists, bow to that pressure then they will deserve everything that comes their way, in this life and the next.

One thing is for sure. Time will definitely tell, and it can’t be too much longer.

Yes, that pressure exists constantly. If it wasn't there, would the papers still have the case on the front pages regularly? They know other cases may have faded in the public's memory, but this one hasn't. I don't think it ever will.

That assumes the deck hasn't been or isn't being stacked. That assumes an investigation of honesty and integrity, a genuine effort to get to the truth. Personally speaking, I hope you are right, but in a review whose inception coincided with the publishing of her book, and when the SIO takes to the airwaves breaking a vow of silence at a time that also coincides with the launch of the paperback book, and spouts what frankly appears to be a load of hogwash and rhetoric backed up by long retired mates – amongst many other things - then I feel entitled to raise a monkey eyebrow. And it wasn’t just the age progression photograph. There was the nonsense of 195 new leads. That was nothing more than an attempt to impress the public and justify expenditure with numbers. I can say with absolute certainty that if after a year a major investigation has two hundred outstanding actions it is more than likely headless and going nowhere. The idea is to close down those avenues. When a senior officer starts broadcasting how many people they have spoken to, how many witnesses, how many statements taken, how many man hours, how much overtime, how much its cost yada yada its a sure sign all is not well.

Silence would have spoken far louder.

I hope I am wrong, I really do. But if I am not if it is fudged whether through incompetence or otherwise, it will be the betrayal of a small child, victim of some heinous act and it will taint and cast shame on every decent man or woman that ever held a warrant card, here, and in Portugal.

Yes, I sincerely hope I am wrong.

But apart from those PR statements/gaffs, there has been silence from the team, hasn't there? For most of the 18 months? I don't doubt any group of policemen and/or public officials can be influenced by those above them with the actual power and an agenda, but I'd argue that in the current climate - with the phone hacking, bribing, Savile and child abuse investigations and inquiries - it is actually less likely the review will be compromised by political or media pressure than might possibly have happened otherwise?

tcat wrote:

monkey mind wrote:

tcat wrote:

monkey mind wrote:But none of that pressure exists at the moment does it? It’s past, potential or imaginary and public pressure isn’t getting a voice.

In the end, the public will not criticise them for an honest and competent investigation.

Common sense observation however indicates there may be pressure from other arenas, political if you like, to bring the case to a *satisfactory* conclusion. Now if they surrender or sell their own integrity, honesty and allegiance to the oath they and every other police officer past, present and future swears, and if it exists, bow to that pressure then they will deserve everything that comes their way, in this life and the next.

One thing is for sure. Time will definitely tell, and it can’t be too much longer.

Yes, that pressure exists constantly. If it wasn't there, would the papers still have the case on the front pages regularly? They know other cases may have faded in the public's memory, but this one hasn't. I don't think it ever will.

That assumes the deck hasn't been or isn't being stacked. That assumes an investigation of honesty and integrity, a genuine effort to get to the truth. Personally speaking, I hope you are right, but in a review whose inception coincided with the publishing of her book, and when the SIO takes to the airwaves breaking a vow of silence at a time that also coincides with the launch of the paperback book, and spouts what frankly appears to be a load of hogwash and rhetoric backed up by long retired mates – amongst many other things - then I feel entitled to raise a monkey eyebrow. And it wasn’t just the age progression photograph. There was the nonsense of 195 new leads. That was nothing more than an attempt to impress the public and justify expenditure with numbers. I can say with absolute certainty that if after a year a major investigation has two hundred outstanding actions it is more than likely headless and going nowhere. The idea is to close down those avenues. When a senior officer starts broadcasting how many people they have spoken to, how many witnesses, how many statements taken, how many man hours, how much overtime, how much its cost yada yada its a sure sign all is not well.

Silence would have spoken far louder.

I hope I am wrong, I really do. But if I am not if it is fudged whether through incompetence or otherwise, it will be the betrayal of a small child, victim of some heinous act and it will taint and cast shame on every decent man or woman that ever held a warrant card, here, and in Portugal.

Yes, I sincerely hope I am wrong.

But apart from those PR statements/gaffs, there has been silence from the team, hasn't there? For most of the 18 months? I don't doubt any group of policemen and/or public officials can be influenced by those above them with the actual power and an agenda, but I'd argue that in the current climate - with the phone hacking, bribing, Savile and child abuse investigations and inquiries - it is actually less likely the review will be compromised by political or media pressure than might possibly have happened otherwise?

Less likely?

What child abuse investigations make this appear so? Past whitewashes? Currently they can pin what they wish on Saville and Smith, both are dead (as is RH), round up one or two of the usual suspects and you have the simulation of an investigation whilst the real criminals go unchallenged.

MP Tom Watson challenged Cameron in parliament that there was a paedo network which ran to the very heart of a previous Tory government. Where is the enquiry into that? Has the issue simply been lost behind the banner headlines of Star, Glitter and the unfortunate DLT?

I see obfuscation, smoke and mirrors.

I see signs of the establishment protecting itself, as it always does.

I certainly don’t see ‘less likely.

Again though Tcat, I genuinely hope I am wrong......

agree with all you say above MM...
But what is the link between the McCann case and the establishment? I have read a theory that one or both McCanns have dirt on a senior politician and have used that as leverage to get protection..
Whatever the theories, the truth could have been buried without the setting up of a review, that is the stumbling block for me. Why bother with a charade of a review?

Points taken MM, and the more I think about it, the more I think you may be right in your fears. But hopefully not as you say. I guess it's hard not to be cynical after recent UK history (or was it always thus?)

russiandoll wrote:agree with all you say above MM...
But what is the link between the McCann case and the establishment? I have read a theory that one or both McCanns have dirt on a senior politician and have used that as leverage to get protection..
Whatever the theories, the truth could have been buried without the setting up of a review, that is the stumbling block for me. Why bother with a charade of a review?

RD, Well, we are obviously talking hypothetically here, but if it were a charade perhaps the real purpose of the review may be exactly what they have been trying to do behind the scenes. Liaise with Portugal and persuade them to reopen the investigation and investigate the leads that the clever detectives at Scotland Yard hand to them.

Hypothetically speaking – and that’s all it is I assure you - I try to place myself in a similar position, having been accused of some scandalous and outrageous crime in another country, arrested and broadcast across the globe. I ask myself what one thing would I want more than anything? I would crave for the people that arrested me, accused me, to free me from my unseen bonds and declare my innocence. I should crave this whether I were innocent, guilty, or somewhere in betwixt. It would make no difference I should want it just the same. Until I am officially acquitted in such a manner, it never really goes away, I will always carry that bad perfume of cadaverine and I want to be sweet smelling again. And the same aroma would pass on to all the important people who had ever helped me. Until my accusers publicly admit their folly, until then, I can never be truly free. I would be vindicated, my friends would be vindicated, people who knew me could now be sure of my innocence, my employers and the world would know it, my family would truly know it and my children would never question it.

That’s purely how I would feel in a similar situation you understand, my own personal speculation. And that one objective would be my absolute priority. That is what I personally would want.

Yep.

monkey mind wrote:I try to place myself in a similar position, having been accused of some scandalous and outrageous crime in another country, arrested and broadcast across the globe. I ask myself what one thing would I want more than anything? I would crave for the people that arrested me, accused me, to free me from my unseen bonds and declare my innocence. I should crave this...

As, of course, did some of these folk:

https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t6036-reported-missing-but-harmed-by-their-families-or-friends

Gallagher, Bernard, Fraser, Claire, Christmann, Kris and Hodgson, Beth (2006) International and internet child sexual abuse and exploitation. Project Report. University of Huddersfield,
Huddersfield, UK.

Abstract

There has, in recent years, been growing awareness and concern over cases of child sexual abuse (CSA) which have an international dimension or which involve the Internet. However, relatively little is known about these cases, as a result of which the policy and practice response may not be as appropriate or effective as it should be. This research project, directed by Bernard Gallagher, and funded by The Nuffield Foundation, was designed to further knowledge of international and Internet CSA, and in doing so contribute to the development of policy and practice.

• While this research was focused upon cases known to law enforcement agencies (police and HM Revenue and Customs - HMRC), it has implications for the wider criminal justice system, a range of other statutory agencies, NGOs and industry, and governance at a national and international level.

Chapter 5 International child sex abuse victims

Victims

5.4.1 Several types of international CSA victim case can be grouped together in terms of victim characteristics. These comprise children on organised trips (clubs, exchange and school) or holiday,
migrant children, and those involved in Internet-initiated child sex abuser networks or receiving medical treatment. In some respects at least, the children involved in these cases appeared to be similar
to those in known CSA cases in general (Creighton, 1992; Gibbons, Conroy and Bell, 1995), their being quite diverse in terms of their age, gender, family background, socio-economic classification
(SEC)20 and ethnicity.

5.4.2 By contrast, trafficking and ‘fostering’ cases tended to involve a much narrower group of victims. The former were largely comprised of older girls (secondary school age i.e. 11-17 years),
whereas ‘fostering’ cases consisted principally of older boys. These two particular types of case were also similar in that both groups of victim were drawn primarily from developing countries (especially
Africa, Eastern Europe, South and South-East Asia) and/or family backgrounds that were acutely disadvantaged. It was this latter feature which enabled abusers, who were invariably from outside the
family, to exert such control over the children’s lives whereby they could, not only sexually abuse them, but also abduct them, in effect, and then move them across international borders, and
permanently so, if they wished.

5.4.3 Virtually all the children abused through international, Internet-initiated grooming were older girls. Other than this, these victims appeared to be unremarkable in terms of family background, SEC
and ethnicity. That said, these cases did appear to include a higher proportion of children from more middle class and stable family backgrounds than might usually be seen in police and children’s
services child protection caseloads.

5.4.4 The victims of forced marriages, likewise, tended to be over-represented by older girls. However, in terms of ethnicity they were distinct in terms of being of South Asian heritage.

Offenders

5.4.5 The different types of international CSA victim case shared one major feature in that virtually all the offenders were male. A very small proportion of cases involved female offenders but they
always acted in concert with males. Other than this, though, there was considerable diversity, even within case types, in the SEC, sexual orientation and ethnicity of offenders, and their cohabiting,
relationship and parenting status.

5.4.6 Where there were differences between cases was in terms of the victim-offender relationship. As indicated above, one group of cases - children on organised trips and holidays, migrant children, and those involved in Internet-initiated child sex abuser networks or receiving medical treatment - were akin to known CSA cases in general (Cawson et al, 2000). Thus, offenders tended to be the children’s parents/carers, other close family members or neighbours/‘friends’, or persons who worked with the children.

5.4.7 Offenders in ‘fostering’ and trafficking cases, and those in Internet grooming cases, were, initially at least, complete strangers, to the children, and had set out to secure a child for sexual abuse. That said, immediate and extended family members, and their ‘acquaintances’, did sometimes have a role at the start of a child being trafficked. One difference within this sub-group of cases, though, was that while in each of the last two of these cases - trafficking and grooming - offenders and victims tended to come from broadly similar ethnic and socio-economic backgrounds, the ‘fostering’ cases were characterised by abusers from developed countries who went to developing countries where they targeted especially disadvantaged children.

5.4.8 As before, forced marriages were somewhat unusual - by dint of their specificity - with virtually all cases being characterised by immediate and/or extended family members engaging in quite
elaborate plans to force the marriage of - invariably - their daughters to adolescent or adult men in South Asia.

Modus operandi

5.4.9 The first group of cases cited above - children on organised trips and holidays, migrant children, and those involved in Internet-initiated child sex abuser networks or receiving medical treatment -
were, in terms of modus operandi, similar to known CSA cases in general. Many of these children were abused in the context of what were, or could be thought of as, domestic settings, for example,
family holidays, and trips organised by persons working with children. As with known CSA in general, some of the offenders used coercion to bring about the abuse, while others used grooming.

5.4.10 What was particularly distinct about these cases was that they tended to exist along a continuum, at one end of which the international dimension to the case was incidental, while at the
other it was instrumental. Thus, for some victims, international CSA was an extension of the CSA they experienced in their own country. In other cases, though, taking the child abroad appeared to be
central to the offenders’ efforts both to abuse the child and prevent the abuse from being detected.

5.4.11 Trafficking cases appeared to be rather diverse in terms of the modus operandi used by offenders. In some cases, quite specific arrangements were made to bring a child from a developing
country to the UK to be abused in the context of ‘sex work’. In other instances, a child ended up in the UK only after having been passed between several different pimps and abused (again in the context of
‘sex work’) in a number of different countries. In yet other cases, the UK was used as a transit point for children en route to be abused through ‘sex work’ in another European country.

5.4.12 All these cases, though, seemed to share a number of marked features, including the degree of sexual abuse the child suffered, the perpetration of other forms, and serious levels, of abuse against thechild (especially physical abuse) and the complete absence of any form of support in the child’s life. As these features should indicate, offenders in trafficking cases had great control over their victims.

5.4.13 Whilst there are allegations of the involvement of organised crime in child trafficking (for sexual abuse), the impression gained from this research is that it is orchestrated by small groups of
individuals who are linked only informally, if at all.

5.4.14 ‘Fostering’ cases typically arose as a result of an offender travelling to a developing country (from the UK), ostensibly to carry out voluntary or religious work with disadvantaged children, but
subsequently sexually abusing children in that setting and then ‘fostering’ one particular child with whom he returned to the UK and who was then the focus of further sexual abuse. The research
identified one case of an offender, who officially fostered a child in the UK, whom he then took abroad to live and abused over a number of years. Like trafficking cases, fostering (whether official or
unofficial) afforded offenders - who were, in essence, strangers - a great deal of control over the children concerned. This control was used to remove children from their native country, facilitate CSA
and prevent detection of that abuse.

5.4.15 The modus operandi of offenders in international Internet-initiated grooming cases was, likewise, relatively straightforward. Offenders utilised Internet-based chatrooms, or other Internet
protocols, to communicate with adolescent girls, invariably, who they then proceeded to groom to the point where they were able to meet and sexually abuse them. Although international grooming cases
were rare, they were by no means unique, and were indicative of the lengths to which offenders would, and could, go to sexually abuse a child. Most of these cases involved the offender travelling
internationally, to meet the child, but a few featured the child travelling internationally, either with the offender or on her own, and going either to the abuser’s country of residence or on to a third country.

5.4.16 In cases of forced marriage, the offenders’ modus operandi, again, appeared to be quite straightforward in that immediate or family members, and sometimes their friends or associates,
pressured or forced a child to travel to South Asia where she was married to an adolescent or adult male. They then either remained in the country in question or returned to the UK, to be joined,
eventually, by their partner. It seemed to be a characteristic of some of these cases, that extreme physical measures were used either to get the children abroad and/or keep them abroad, or to punish
children who managed to thwart these plans.

http://eprints.hud.ac.uk/461/

Gi' O'er Gi' O'er ‏@MrsMLouis

I think Hewlett makes the Anti #McCann s uncomfortable. He's evidence of predatory paedos in Algarve at time of Madeleine's disappearance.

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3:19 PM - 22 Jan 13

Really? Perhaps some Pro #McCann s are as equally uncomfortable.

"Most child abusers are 'paedophiles'"

Although there are sexual abuse rings and individual abusers who target large numbers of children, most children are abused by men they know. Most child sex offenders are married men, who have sex with their wives and sometimes other adult women - they are children's fathers, uncles, teachers as well as family friends and neighbours. These men do not fit the clinical definition of 'paedophile' - adults whose sexual interest is limited to children - nor do they fit most peoples perceptions of a 'paedophile' - a loner, someone with poor social skills. So most child sexual abusers are not 'paedophiles' in any clear or obvious sense.

Many people want to be able to identify a category of men who are more likely to abuse children. In fact, there is no 'type' of man who is an abuser - they come from every class, professional, racial and religious background. They are heterosexual and homosexual. They are also often very skilled at manipulating people and situations, at creating trust and respect within their community and profession, for example as clergy or youth workers.

For further discussion see: Liz Kelly, 'Weasel words: paedophiles and the cycle of abuse'.

Violence against women and children - Vision, Innovation and Professionalism in policing, VIP Guide (2003)
Author(s) : Professor Liz Kelly
ISBN 978-92-871-5121-6

Synopsis

This guide has been designed to promote awareness amongst police officers of the different forms of violence agaist women and children, including trafficking. This document will, amongst other things provide access to vision and understanding which has informed new police responses to violence against women.

http://book.coe.int/EN/ficheouvrage.php?PAGEID=36&lang=EN&produit_aliasid=673

Bumping this thread as Bruckner is not the first paedophile who allegedly claimed that he knows what happened to Madeleine.

sharonl wrote:Bumping this thread as Bruckner is not the first paedophile who allegedly claimed that he knows what happened to Madeleine.

 Yes, this is an interesting read and so many of the Brueckner details match - a campervan he allegedly travelled round in, fleeing Portugal after the disappearance, discussing Maddie with 'a friend'. Exactly the same pattern of speculation and - one might suggest - outright lies.

Exactly oh wise one ^^^ . Thanks for that, short and straight to the point.

The similarities are there for all to see. The authors of this latest blitz of codswallop have harvested a mix of grain, stuck it all together in the same combine harvester and scattered across the lands.

In short, they can't tell the wheat from the chaff.

Question: Did Raymond Hewlett know anything about the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

Answer: No he did not - and that's an emphatic no!