Madeleine before Portugal

by tuom 30.07.12 0:08

In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

by Zozo 30.07.12 0:17

tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

Yes very little know and I'm not sure if one day we will know more about her.
There is for example her health records which was never submitted to the PJ, held back by the UK police if i remember well. Why?

by tuom 30.07.12 0:25

Zozo wrote:
tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

Yes very little know and I'm not sure if one day we will know more about her.
There is for example her health records which was never submitted to the PJ, held back by the UK police if i remember well. Why?

Quite ! , this must be the only case I have ever followed where there are no interviews or stories from neighbours, local shops, nursery , I mean there is nothing wrong in saying something about a child "like : she is a lovely girl , she is at nursery with my child, they played together, " or " she has been to a birthday party here " you know , normal things , strange that is IMO

by Newintown 30.07.12 3:30

tuom wrote:
Zozo wrote:
tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

Yes very little know and I'm not sure if one day we will know more about her.
There is for example her health records which was never submitted to the PJ, held back by the UK police if i remember well. Why?

Quite ! , this must be the only case I have ever followed where there are no interviews or stories from neighbours, local shops, nursery , I mean there is nothing wrong in saying something about a child "like : she is a lovely girl , she is at nursery with my child, they played together, " or " she has been to a birthday party here " you know , normal things , strange that is IMO

If Madeleine didn't live with the McCann it is possible that nobody actually knew her, if for some reason she was living with a relative or foster parent, then it would have probably been kept quiet, been "respectable" doctors and all that. That is why Kate had no real affinity towards Madeleine as she didn't spend much time with her, therefore, she didn't really know her.

by Zozo 30.07.12 4:26

@ Newintown

Spot on; the point you are making could be possible.

by **tigger** 30.07.12 8:11

tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

The information we have about Madeleine as a person is highly contradictory.
In the bewk Kate tells us how difficult she was, how much she cried and they thought she might have colic. Surely two doctors with good contacts could have got to the bottom of this?
Imo she does look ill in a lot of photographs, right from the start. I'm not the only one who thinks so.
Link that to the health records which were denied and a lot of questions come up.

There are two Maddies: the incredibly beautiful, articulate and intelligent little girl who looked after the twins like a little mother and was best friends with her mother and the 'screamer' who could throw a tantrum is she wanted to, who doesn't seem very articulate in videos and of whom Kater herself said that the twins were all right because they didn't have much to do with her.

Same girl, same source.

But many have complained that we know absolutely nothing about her, how and what she played, funny things she did and said, food she like to eat. Only once in the book there's a story how she pushed a medical toy trolley into a room where one of the adults had had a heart attack. With two doctors present we are asked to believe she used the plastic stethoscope on the stricken man's chest and said

by **tigger** 30.07.12 8:12

tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

The information we have about Madeleine as a person is highly contradictory.
In the bewk Kate tells us how difficult she was, how much she cried and they thought she might have colic. Surely two doctors with good contacts could have got to the bottom of this?
Imo she does look ill in a lot of photographs, right from the start. I'm not the only one who thinks so.
Link that to the health records which were denied and a lot of questions come up.

There are two Maddies: the incredibly beautiful, articulate and intelligent little girl who looked after the twins like a little mother and was best friends with her mother and the 'screamer' who could throw a tantrum is she wanted to, who doesn't seem very articulate in videos and of whom Kater herself said that the twins were all right because they didn't have much to do with her.

Same girl, same source.

But many have complained that we know absolutely nothing about her, how and what she played, funny things she did and said, food she like to eat. Only once in the book there's a story how she pushed a medical toy trolley into a room where one of the adults had had a heart attack. With two doctors present we are asked to believe she used the plastic stethoscope on the stricken man's chest and said 'Boom, boom'. I for one don't believe it....

by pauline 30.07.12 10:20

I'm wondering would there be much in her medical records if they were made available. As they are both doctors (Kate a GP) would they not treat her themselves and write prescriptions for her as necessary. I think doctors are allowed to treat their own children. If they did treat her themselves, why not release the records as they could ensure nothing in them of relevance.

by tuom 30.07.12 11:59

tigger wrote:
tuom wrote:In an effort to stay focused on this case , can anyone point me in the direction to answering some questions about "Madeleine before Portugal" , there is almost four years of a life that we seem to know little about , apart from what TMC have told us .

The information we have about Madeleine as a person is highly contradictory.
In the bewk Kate tells us how difficult she was, how much she cried and they thought she might have colic. Surely two doctors with good contacts could have got to the bottom of this?
Imo she does look ill in a lot of photographs, right from the start. I'm not the only one who thinks so.
Link that to the health records which were denied and a lot of questions come up.

There are two Maddies: the incredibly beautiful, articulate and intelligent little girl who looked after the twins like a little mother and was best friends with her mother and the 'screamer' who could throw a tantrum is she wanted to, who doesn't seem very articulate in videos and of whom Kater herself said that the twins were all right because they didn't have much to do with her.

Same girl, same source.

But many have complained that we know absolutely nothing about her, how and what she played, funny things she did and said, food she like to eat. Only once in the book there's a story how she pushed a medical toy trolley into a room where one of the adults had had a heart attack. With two doctors present we are asked to believe she used the plastic stethoscope on the stricken man's chest and said 'Boom, boom'. I for one don't believe it....

Tigger , the above in blue could be my eldest daughter , colic is very common in new borns , there is no cure for colic , it takes time and a lot of patience , at the time I would have said it was the quickest route to a stay in a mental home for me .......... it passes , there are lots of over the counter medicines and old wive's tales on helping with colic , nothing cures it but time.................. just for the record if racehorses get colic they are usually shot ! please take this comment in respect to horses and nothing else.

I remember taking my daughter to a doctor in desperation and his remedy was "farm her out" to a nurse who would keep her for a while and let her cry it out and eventually it would pass and I would have her returned to me "trained" Uncanny but this is True , it was 1984

I did not do this , well I could not afford it , If I could ? I dont know I as desperate at the time ...

Just a few thoughts for you all .........

I need to know MMC as the child not the marketing product she has been turned into .

by Miraflores 30.07.12 14:13

I too believe that all this could be found in one child. As has been said, she could have grown out of the colic. Being a little mother, and a lively extrovert and one who could throw a tantrum? Yes, I can think of children like that, who need a lot of attention - the ones for whom you need eyes in the back of your head.

What is surprising is, as someone said, that no-one has come forward to say they knew her, how their children played with her at nursery,which activities she liked.

by **tigger** 30.07.12 16:33

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by Guest 30.07.12 18:48

Miraflores wrote:I too believe that all this could be found in one child. As has been said, she could have grown out of the colic. Being a little mother, and a lively extrovert and one who could throw a tantrum? Yes, I can think of children like that, who need a lot of attention - the ones for whom you need eyes in the back of your head.

What is surprising is, as someone said, that no-one has come forward to say they knew her, how their children played with her at nursery,which activities she liked.

Did anyone bother to ask around in Rothley, in the neighborhood, at the nursery, at the grocers, the supermarket, the local priest, the mayor?

Has anyone tried to locate the place where KH worked, soiling her trousers with the body fluids of -at least- six corpses in the week before her holidays? Has anyone searched for the relatives of those dear deceased Missing Six, to see what they had to say?

Why not?

by **tigger** 30.07.12 19:43

Of course not, Portia. The word of the McCanns and all their kin and disciples is gospel. To think otherwise would be heresy.

by Miraflores 30.07.12 21:59

Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

by tuom 30.07.12 22:16

Miraflores wrote:Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

Ah Yes ! and the ambulance driver , the flight attendents, other passengers , the kind thief who sent the wallet back ( iirc) and I repeat again all of Rothley FGS ! someone must have something to say about MMC , toy shop ? swimming pool ? McDonalds ? sweet shop ? playground ? Santa ? anyone ???????

by **Nina** 31.07.12 9:11

tuom wrote:
Miraflores wrote:Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

Ah Yes ! and the ambulance driver , the flight attendents, other passengers , the kind thief who sent the wallet back ( iirc) and I repeat again all of Rothley FGS ! someone must have something to say about MMC , toy shop ? swimming pool ? McDonalds ? sweet shop ? playground ? Santa ? anyone ???????

I remember that a resident once did, a woman.
No one dare, at least not with their identity known, their life would be made hell. I have no doubt there will be some from the group you have mentioned above who could tell us a lot but just don't dare.

by Guest 31.07.12 16:39

Slightly off topic but I've found this clip from a woman apparently from Rothley who hadn't fallen for the "we all do it" wonderful parents line.

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Somewhere recently (either here or on the Missing Madeleine site) I read a newspaper article from a woman who claimed that her son had played with Madeleine on the PDL holiday - nothing to do with Philip Edmonds and his sons. I'm hoping that someone might be able to find it again. I don't think it was a British tabloid; it's a wonder that it wasn't regurgitated in all the tabloids as all the silly sightings stories are.

by **Nina** 31.07.12 16:57

Jean wrote:Slightly off topic but I've found this clip from a woman apparently from Rothley who hadn't fallen for the "we all do it" wonderful parents line.

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Somewhere recently (either here or on the Missing Madeleine site) I read a newspaper article from a woman who claimed that her son had played with Madeleine on the PDL holiday - nothing to do with Philip Edmonds and his sons. I'm hoping that someone might be able to find it again. I don't think it was a British tabloid; it's a wonder that it wasn't regurgitated in all the tabloids as all the silly sightings stories are.

Thanks for the link Jean, and this woman was quite vociferous in her blame for neglecting the three children and had spoken to a named Social Services person who said if that had been her then her children would have been removed from her care, and rightly so, but it wasn't for the McCanns. Different rule book it seems.

by Guest 31.07.12 20:29

tigger wrote:Of course not, Portia. The word of the McCanns and all their kin and disciples is gospel. To think otherwise would be heresy.

Come to think of it, finding those deceased persons shouldn't have been too difficult.
All it would have taken was having a close look at the obituaries in the regional newspapers around where KH worked.

by jd 31.07.12 20:54

Miraflores wrote:Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

I have always thought this too....who is he? where is he? Why didn't any of the other passengers say anything for their 15 mins of fame? And the drunk on the road they helped when they landed back in PDL...who is he? where is he? (apart from still being drunk on the side of a road)

by jd 31.07.12 20:56

Jean wrote:
Somewhere recently (either here or on the Missing Madeleine site) I read a newspaper article from a woman who claimed that her son had played with Madeleine on the PDL holiday - nothing to do with Philip Edmonds and his sons. I'm hoping that someone might be able to find it again. I don't think it was a British tabloid; it's a wonder that it wasn't regurgitated in all the tabloids as all the silly sightings stories are.

I remember reading this too but can't remember where it was. I'll try to find it

by Guest 31.07.12 23:32

Thanks JD. I'm glad that I didn't imagine it. It had a really unlikely quote attributed to the child concerned - on hearing of Madeleine's disappearance, he said "Isn't that the little girl I played with yesterday?"

It is indeed odd that, despite the name Madeleine McCann being known all over the world, we know so little about her. She seems to have lived her life in a vacuum with no contact with anyone outside her family.

by tuom 31.07.12 23:49

Nina wrote:
Jean wrote:Slightly off topic but I've found this clip from a woman apparently from Rothley who hadn't fallen for the "we all do it" wonderful parents line.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Somewhere recently (either here or on the Missing Madeleine site) I read a newspaper article from a woman who claimed that her son had played with Madeleine on the PDL holiday - nothing to do with Philip Edmonds and his sons. I'm hoping that someone might be able to find it again. I don't think it was a British tabloid; it's a wonder that it wasn't regurgitated in all the tabloids as all the silly sightings stories are.

Thanks for the link Jean, and this woman was quite vociferous in her blame for neglecting the three children and had spoken to a named Social Services person who said if that had been her then her children would have been removed from her care, and rightly so, but it wasn't for the McCanns. Different rule book it seems.

Yes, Thank You Jean , and I also noted the comments on this video , earlier this evening I found another video of this woman who seems to be answering some of the comments , I have no idea what I have done but now I cannot find it .... need sleep .....

by Guest 03.08.12 18:31

Jean wrote:Thanks JD. I'm glad that I didn't imagine it. It had a really unlikely quote attributed to the child concerned - on hearing of Madeleine's disappearance, he said "Isn't that the little girl I played with yesterday?"

It is indeed odd that, despite the name Madeleine McCann being known all over the world, we know so little about her. She seems to have lived her life in a vacuum with no contact with anyone outside her family.

The article has now appeared on another topic.

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It's the partial article beginning "We feel so much for Maddie's mum".

Does anyone know anything about the magazine the story is in? I've never heard of it.

by Guest 03.08.12 18:43

Jean wrote:
Jean wrote:Thanks JD. I'm glad that I didn't imagine it. It had a really unlikely quote attributed to the child concerned - on hearing of Madeleine's disappearance, he said "Isn't that the little girl I played with yesterday?"

It is indeed odd that, despite the name Madeleine McCann being known all over the world, we know so little about her. She seems to have lived her life in a vacuum with no contact with anyone outside her family.

The article has now appeared on another topic.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It's the partial article beginning "We feel so much for Maddie's mum".

Does anyone know anything about the magazine the story is in? I've never heard of it.

This is the topic Jean, it might be best to discuss this there, as this topic is Madeleine before Portugal.

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by tuom 03.08.12 21:59

candyfloss wrote:
Jean wrote:
Jean wrote:Thanks JD. I'm glad that I didn't imagine it. It had a really unlikely quote attributed to the child concerned - on hearing of Madeleine's disappearance, he said "Isn't that the little girl I played with yesterday?"

It is indeed odd that, despite the name Madeleine McCann being known all over the world, we know so little about her. She seems to have lived her life in a vacuum with no contact with anyone outside her family.

The article has now appeared on another topic.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It's the partial article beginning "We feel so much for Maddie's mum".

Does anyone know anything about the magazine the story is in? I've never heard of it.

This is the topic Jean, it might be best to discuss this there, as this topic is Madeleine before Portugal.

[url=https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t5390-a-witness-who-sees-maddie-the-day-before-she-disappeared

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Yes CF this topic is called Madeleine before Portugal ???? not exactly hopping with posts thought is it !!! I rest my suitcases [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by justathought 04.08.12 3:00

Nina wrote:
tuom wrote:
Miraflores wrote:Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

Ah Yes ! and the ambulance driver , the flight attendents, other passengers , the kind thief who sent the wallet back ( iirc) and I repeat again all of Rothley FGS ! someone must have something to say about MMC , toy shop ? swimming pool ? McDonalds ? sweet shop ? playground ? Santa ? anyone ???????

I remember that a resident once did, a woman.
No one dare, at least not with their identity known, their life would be made hell. I have no doubt there will be some from the group you have mentioned above who could tell us a lot but just don't dare.

forget about the rothley residents being worried to speak out. what is more important is why local people have not come forward with story's to confirm what a nice family the MCCanns were meant to be.

by **tigger** 04.08.12 8:42

justathought wrote:
Nina wrote:
tuom wrote:
Miraflores wrote:Another person who needs to be traced is the person whose life Gerry is supposed to have saved on the plane back. It's amazing that he has never been asked to speak out to say how wonderful Gerry was.

Ah Yes ! and the ambulance driver , the flight attendents, other passengers , the kind thief who sent the wallet back ( iirc) and I repeat again all of Rothley FGS ! someone must have something to say about MMC , toy shop ? swimming pool ? McDonalds ? sweet shop ? playground ? Santa ? anyone ???????

I remember that a resident once did, a woman.
No one dare, at least not with their identity known, their life would be made hell. I have no doubt there will be some from the group you have mentioned above who could tell us a lot but just don't dare.

forget about the rothley residents being worried to speak out. what is more important is why local people have not come forward with story's to confirm what a nice family the MCCanns were meant to be.

Good point!

by One 04.08.12 12:22

"We should have been at home, where we'd arranged a joint party in Leicester for Madeleine and two of her classmates at nursery, her best friend Sofia, who had been born on the same day, and a little boy called Sam whose birthday was within a few days of theirs. they had been going to have their first disco. I'd bought a couple of girl-band CDs a few weeks earlier and we'd been having singalongs in the car to warm up for it. The memory of Madeleine, sitting in the back seat, singing her heart out along with the Pussycat Dolls still makes me laugh. And cry."

Kate doesn't mention where the party was to be or who did the organizing. She also doesn't mention hearing from Sofia or Sam's parents as you'd expect.

by Fred Up 04.08.12 12:43

One wrote:"... we'd been having singalongs in the car to warm up for it. The memory of Madeleine, sitting in the back seat, singing her heart out along with the Pussycat Dolls still makes me laugh. And cry."

.

I think if I were her Mother, I think I'd cry. The Pussycat Dolls? For a four year old? Oh puh-lease!

So, along with her love of Doctor Who and Harry Potter, we now have her enjoyment of music from a slutty girl band. What precocious taste for a pre-schooler.

"Doncha wish your girlfriend was hot like me? Doncha wish your girlfriend was free like me? Doncha? Doncha?"

Kate, get a grip!