Why are the Paynes/Webster airbrushed out?

Justformaddie wrote:The Paynes deffo should have been included in the important crimewatch screening, but they're not mentioned even by name and I'm wondering why that is? IMO I can't think why unless they're helping with enquiries  

canada12 wrote:

Justformaddie wrote:The Paynes deffo should have been included in the important crimewatch screening, but they're not mentioned even by name and I'm wondering why that is? IMO I can't think why unless they're helping with enquiries  

This is my take on it. However SY may not be able to use his information without concrete evidence to support what he's saying. If the case went to court his testimony might be demolished by the McCann defence counsel because of the alleged pedophile connection which has been highlighted by the Gaspar statement.

So IMO SY and PJ are acting on DP's information, and they're searching for hard evidence. The deliberate omission of DP and FP from the Crimewatch program was IMO a message to Gerry and Kate.

G-Unit wrote:I have been looking at hierarchies in the NHS, but it is hard to decipher. Can anyone tell me which of the doctors present would  have been senior in 2007?

missbeetle wrote:

G-Unit wrote:I have been looking at hierarchies in the NHS, but it is hard to decipher. Can anyone tell me which of the doctors present would  have been senior in 2007?

Hi G-Unit - I'm going to have a crack at answering this for you.


Matt, Gerry and Russell were all NHS hospital Consultant Physicians in May 2007 (Senior, senior).

Kate was a part-time GP without specialist qualifications, so I would class her as junior senior.

Same for Fiona Payne, a Registrar in Anaesthetics - a junior senior.


David Payne's a funny old one, though.

In May 2007 he was working as a Senior Research fellow in cardiovascular sciences -

- which as far as I can make out is at about Registrar level -

and perhaps paid at an academic's rate (less than that of a hospital doctor).

Not sure if he had held a Consultant's post before - he is a few years older than the rest of the crew.

By the time his rogatory interview rolled around, he was working as a Registrar in Urology -

- the speciality in which I believe he is now a hospital Consultant Surgeon.


This is all just off the top of my head, and could well be wrong -

- just my opinions on the set-up.

MaybeMaybenot wrote:Could Payne actually be an undercover agent of some kind...infiltrating something in pdl

cbeagle wrote:

MaybeMaybenot wrote:Could Payne actually be an undercover agent of some kind...infiltrating something in pdl

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply    ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”


What was the right forum, why did DC 1485 MESSIAH not react in anyway to Dr Payne's reply?

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HelenMeg wrote:Find 'out' where ONLY GM/DP 'went' at 4am, 4th May, 2007, and the whole house of cards, will come tumbling 'down', imo.

jeanmonroe wrote:

cbeagle wrote:

MaybeMaybenot wrote:Could Payne actually be an undercover agent of some kind...infiltrating something in pdl

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply    ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”


What was the right forum, why did DC 1485 MESSIAH not react in anyway to Dr Payne's reply?

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Ah, one of my favourite 'quotes'!

If Payne had 'said that' (in the good ol' days) he wouldn't have left the 'station'!

aquila wrote:

HelenMeg wrote:Find 'out' where ONLY GM/DP 'went' at 4am, 4th May, 2007, and the whole house of cards, will come tumbling 'down', imo.

Is there a link to a police file that says GM and DP went out at 4am on the 4th May?

I've read a lot on this case and according to Kate, Gerry had a bit of a sleep, she and Dianne Webster sat up and then Kate and her husband Gerry went out at first light.

Rogue-a-Tory wrote:For quite some time now I've thought it interesting how Fiona Payne has tried to change her image in the 4/5 years post-May 2007. In the immediate post-disappearance pictures of her she looked quite young & fresh looking almost (dare I say without incurring to much wrath) girly. Compare that to now, the Mary Peters/Hopkins look, certainly wouldn't get a second glance in the street. Clearly an attempt to become unnoticed and disassociated with MBM.

Furthermore, Google any of the T7 & other than MBM related websites very little info comes forward. More than a wiff of the the Google right to be forgot IMO. I don't think any of them wish to be in anyway linked with this saga any longer - but especially the Pains Paynes.

HelenMeg wrote:[color:fef4=000000]There are varying accounts of what happened at 4am May 4th, according to  [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

[color:fef4=000000]The Times reports that: 'Gerry went out at about 4am with David Payne, another of their group, hoping to find something.'



The Telegraph, on 09 September 2007, reports that: 'The searches continued until around 4.30am, when a shattered Mr and Mrs McCann were ushered back into their apartment, which, despite it being a crime scene, had not been sealed off at that stage.'

- It's not clear how Kate could be 'ushered back into their apartment' when she had never left it.




[color:fef4=000000]The manager at the Mark Warner resort, John Hill said the police had been doing all they could. He said around 60 staff and guests at the complex had searched until 4.30am while police notified border police, Spanish police and airports.



[color:fef4=000000]At 4.00 pm in the morning, Jane was asking a member of GNR: "Have you cut off all the roads already?". Minutes later, Gerry, given the fact that the priest didn't appear, asked another element of GNR to show him the way to the church. (sol 18/8)

Gerry went out at about 4.00am with David Payne, another of their group, hoping to find something. ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.])

Madeleine's father was also seen, in the early hours of May 4, near the temple with another British man who was with him on vacation. (CM 12/9)

tigger wrote:This is from Steel Magnolias about Payne's phone call - extracts from his rogatory interview:



[size=30][You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] :David Payne Phoned The Metropolitan Police Child Abuse Team On May 4th 2007 at 23:13:41 for 100 seconds.....[/size]

.......And when questioned about this call by Leicestershire police, David Payne tried to deny it but when questioned further Payne was forced to admit he had made that call .

--------------

Statement from social worker Yvonne Warren Martin, who thought she recognised David Payne...Yvonne saw Payne in the morning and by the evening Payne was himself ringing 'child abuse' ...possibly Payne also recognised Yvonne.


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Snippet : The phone call from Paynes rogatory...

1485

"InP ortu gal? ”

Reply

"The, I mean, the other, there was a, the other person who contacted me which I didn‟t mention while I was at the Police Station was one of the Portuguese err newspapers and err you know asking, you
know for comments and err so that could have been what the, you know, the number. I spoke, I did speak to the other, the friends of
Simon ALDRIDGE‟S who you know who kindly bought the phones and they actually bought the phones to the Portimão Police Stationand I went downstairs and got the phones and then err brought them
back upstairs. Err in terms of you know whether I, we spoke to them on the next day sorry, was that the question?”

1485

"Well you spoke to them on the next day, the next day yeah that Madeleine went missing, on the fourth.”

Reply

"Right.”

1485

"That‟s when, well, there‟s text messages but what I‟m asking you is,

did you speak to them?”

00:22:29 Reply

"Err I don‟t remember having any text conversation with any err Portuguese newspapers so I presume that Portuguese number, they, sorry yeah the other, the, the other Portuguese person I spoke with
was err there was err a Solicitor in err Lisbon who err the conversation it may well have been with Lisa LACARNIE because that was a friend of their family who they, they‟ve got a business in
the UK but they deal with Portugal and Lisa said if you need any err Portuguese advice then there‟s err Paolo, and again I‟ve got his number in my other phone which might clarify that bit.”

1485

"Yeah.”

Reply

"And err he err and I did speak to him again after that day so it may well have been him just to say oh you know do you want any help,

do you want any advice, and err and that you know that‟s how it was left at that, that stage so that might have been, piecing it together from what you‟re saying.”

1485

"Do you recall me telling you about the London number, which you couldn‟t find in your phone?”

Reply

"Yes.”

00:24:00 1485

"That number actually transcribes back to the Crime Specialist

Director inLondon.”

Reply

"Mm.”

1485

"Did you contact them?”

Reply

"Err I did yes. My, err you know my sister err had been in contact with them and she was trying to do everything that she could knowing the, err, the difficulties that we were having out there so
you know I did approach them just asking for advice but err I can‟t remember, I don‟t think I actually spoke to anyone there, but for some reason that wasn‟t carried forward.”

1485

"Yeah.”

Reply

"But I mean, you know, just into the context of the conversation you know we‟re in a strange country, we‟ve got no representeers we don‟t know what‟s going on, all hell‟s broken loose and you know to see whether you can do anything to help Madeleine come back, you know and that was the lines that we were taking.”

1485

"Do you remember who you spoke to?”

Reply

"I don‟t know.”

1485

"The call was made on the following day at twenty three thirteen, so that‟s late at night.”

Reply

"Mm.”

1485

"You don‟t recollect anything else about the conversation that you had with that, was it you that made the call?”

Reply

"Err I, yeah I know that I got phone numbers from my sister which I did you know ring them but I can‟t remember making one late at night.”