Re: Latest from PeterMac's FREE e-book: CHAPTER 63 SMITH-GERRY-MAN SCRUTINISED

by **Bluebagthepirate** 16.09.24 22:12

Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:Your pushchair comment was a pathetic joke.
My pushchair comment in it's entirety wasn't meant to be a pathetic joke. I apologise if it came across that way. I genuinely do believe holding the child in his arms up to his face may have made a difference. That doesn't mean it was Gerry, but I do believe there's a reasonable chance if the man wasn't holding the child to his face, the Smiths would have had a much better chance of confirming if it wasn't Gerry, or if was. It's all about the knowing for sure with me. I'm not bothered what the sure is and what the sure isn't. The more we all know for sure the better.

Rubbish.

You were saying how you couldn't see how someone could move the body.

crusader told you an easy way in very simple terms.

You couldn't accept that and came up with a reason - being that you can't hold a pushchair up to your face.

A stupid comment - you can't see anything other than smithman or you are taking the piss.

Your battleship has been well and truly sunk by the demolition the other day.

Tell your mates.

by **Bluebagthepirate** 16.09.24 22:12

silly wrote:
Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:
Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:Jeeze.

Why are you so obsessed with Smithman?
It's nothing to do with an obsession with Smithman at all. It's all because it's a Smithman thread. If you'd prefer I say no more on the subject, I'll be more than happy to oblige. Just say the word.
Carry on.

You're making a fool of yourself.
I just don't get it with the hostility. I'm thick skinned, it's not a problem and I don't even need to try to understand it. I'm still open minded to Smithman not being Gerry, I just want to see the proof and I know it's not there.
There has been a concerted effort since 2013 on this forum to shout down and personally attack anyone who believes the Smith family .

For very sound reasons.

by Buzz Shine 16.09.24 22:21

Bluebagthepirate wrote:A stupid comment - you can't see anything other than smithman or you are taking the piss.

Because I see a strong case for Smithman being Gerry, doesn't mean I'd rather no-one ever seen the evidence to prove it isn't him. I just want to know for sure. If it isn't Gerry, no-one has proved it, no more than I have prove he is. I do have a better understanding of Smithman for myself now though. I now understand the evidence to prove it one way or the other just isn't there.

by **Bluebagthepirate** 16.09.24 22:29

Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:A stupid comment - you can't see anything other than smithman or you are taking the piss.
Because I see a strong case for Smithman being Gerry, doesn't mean I'd rather no-one ever seen the evidence to prove it isn't him. I just want to know for sure.

You said you knew.

100%

If it isn't Gerry, no-one has proved it,

No one has proved it wasn't Boris Johnson.
So what?

I do have a better understanding of Smithman for myself now though. I now understand the evidence to prove it one way or the other just isn't there.

Do you understand that the smith family forgot it was Gerry by January 2008?

by Buzz Shine 16.09.24 22:34

Bluebagthepirate wrote:Do you understand that the smith family forgot it was Gerry by January 2008?

It's almost as if you want the Smiths to forget because you don't want Gerry to be Smithman, even if he is. I find it very difficult to believe anyone who was in PDL on May 3, 2007 could ever forget identifying Gerry McCann to police by January 2008.

by **Bluebagthepirate** 16.09.24 22:38

Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:Do you understand that the smith family forgot it was Gerry by January 2008?
It's almost as if you want the Smiths to forget because you don't want Gerry to be Smithman, even if he is. I find it very difficult to believe anyone who was in PDL on May 3, 2007 could ever forget identifying Gerry McCann to police by January 2008.

No... they actually forgot.

And also said they wanted to help the McCanns any way they could.

It's all there in their January 2008 interviews.

Which I'm sure you are aware of... oh maybe not, but I forgot how wet behind the ears you are.

by **AnneCGuedes** 16.09.24 22:49

Why should the thought of recognising G and M a few minutes after 10 in rua da Escola Primaria prevent Martin and Mary S from feeling sorry for the MCs and wanting to help them?

by Buzz Shine 16.09.24 22:56

Bluebagthepirate wrote:
Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:Do you understand that the smith family forgot it was Gerry by January 2008?
It's almost as if you want the Smiths to forget because you don't want Gerry to be Smithman, even if he is. I find it very difficult to believe anyone who was in PDL on May 3, 2007 could ever forget identifying Gerry McCann to police by January 2008.
No... they actually forgot.

And also said they wanted to help the McCanns any way they could.

It's all there in their January 2008 interviews.

Which I'm sure you are aware of... oh maybe not, but I forgot how wet behind the ears you are.

Additional statement from Martin Smith 2008.01.30 He has been contacted by Mr Brian Kennedy who is supporting the McCann family to take part in a photo fit exercise. (So the McCanns had found out what the Smiths had told the PJ by then. But no e-fits ever got released)

In relation to the video clips of Gerard McCann and the person I saw on 3rd May 2007 when I saw the BBC news at 10 PM on 9th September 2007 something struck me that it could have been the same person

During that time I spoke to all my family members who were with me on the night of 3rd May 2007 about this and the only one who felt the same way as me was my wife.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_SMITH.htm#p10p3276

by **AnneCGuedes** 17.09.24 0:39

Buzz Shine wrote:

Additional statement from Martin Smith 2008.01.30 He has been contacted by Mr Brian Kennedy who is supporting the McCann family to take part in a photo fit exercise. (So the McCanns had found out what the Smiths had told the PJ by then. But no e-fits ever got released)

In relation to the video clips of Gerard McCann and the person I saw on 3rd May 2007 when I saw the BBC news at 10 PM on 9th September 2007 something struck me that it could have been the same person

During that time I spoke to all my family members who were with me on the night of 3rd May 2007 about this and the only one who felt the same way as me was my wife.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_SMITH.htm#p10p3276

Had the MCs found what MS had told the Garda Síochána? Did Joao Carlos, who was very suspicious of Smithman, let them know ? Or their very protective Call Me Stu? Possibly, but it's also possible that they only knew that MS had spoken again and wanted to know what he had said.

by **PeterMac** 17.09.24 6:58

crusader wrote:Anyway if we wait until Bernt's next instalment, all will hopefully be revealed to shed light on whether the Smithman sighting was relevant.
I just hope he's not being led in the direction the McCann's want.

It will be
He isn't

by **PeterMac** 17.09.24 7:09

'In relation to the video clips of Gerard McCann and the person I saw on 3rd May 2007 when I saw the BBC news at 10 PM on 9th September 2007 something struck me that it could have been the same person
During that time I spoke to all my family members who were with me on the night of 3rd May 2007 about this and the only one who felt the same way as me was my wife"

it could have been = in the sense that he was not black or of restricted growth or in a wheelchair. He was just a normal European looking bloke.

the only one who felt the same way as me was my wife" = In in the sense of "Yes, Dear, If you say so. I have no idea, but OK, it that is what you want to say. But leave me out of it."

NOTE: Mrs Smith did not make a statement even the first time.
Only Martin, grown up son Peter and 12 yrs daughter Aiofe did.

Rest of family "Oh come off it Dad. That's really pushing it too far."

by **PeterMac** 17.09.24 7:17

Shash T wrote:In Bernt's book, he suggests that M was carried away in the blue sports bagbag.

NO he doesn't.

Please read it again

The sports bag was on the shelf in the parents' bedroom on the night of 3/5/7 and the early morning of 4/5/7
Which is why IT IS IN IN THE PHOTOS.

by **Bluebagthepirate** 17.09.24 8:10

Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:
Buzz Shine wrote:
Bluebagthepirate wrote:Do you understand that the smith family forgot it was Gerry by January 2008?
It's almost as if you want the Smiths to forget because you don't want Gerry to be Smithman, even if he is. I find it very difficult to believe anyone who was in PDL on May 3, 2007 could ever forget identifying Gerry McCann to police by January 2008.
No... they actually forgot.

And also said they wanted to help the McCanns any way they could.

It's all there in their January 2008 interviews.

Which I'm sure you are aware of... oh maybe not, but I forgot how wet behind the ears you are.
Additional statement from Martin Smith 2008.01.30 He has been contacted by Mr Brian Kennedy who is supporting the McCann family to take part in a photo fit exercise. (So the McCanns had found out what the Smiths had told the PJ by then. But no e-fits ever got released)

In relation to the video clips of Gerard McCann and the person I saw on 3rd May 2007 when I saw the BBC news at 10 PM on 9th September 2007 something struck me that it could have been the same person

During that time I spoke to all my family members who were with me on the night of 3rd May 2007 about this and the only one who felt the same way as me was my wife.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_SMITH.htm#p10p3276

But he forgot it he thought it looked like Gerry at this point in January.

You have disingenuously conflated earlier statements with January 2008 media interviews.

Why?

by Buzz Shine 17.09.24 8:27

it could have been = in the sense that she was not black or of restricted growth or in a wheelchair. She looked just like Madeleine McCann would have looked being carried by her normal European looking abductor, right round the corner from where the McCanns own little girl was abducted.

[size=32]So WHY [/size][size=32]were Maddie suspect E-fits kept SECRET for five years? Images and evidence of sighting uncovered by private detectives were suppressed[/size]
The McCanns are now fully behind the fresh police drive and release of the E-fits – but five years ago they were reluctant to issue them, possibly in part because witness Mr Smith’s account seemed inconsistent and unreliable.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2478087/Why-Madeleine-McCann-suspect-E-fits-kept-secret-5-years.html#comments

by **Bluebagthepirate** 17.09.24 8:39

It is inconsistent and unreliable.

Number one being the time of seeing Smithman.

Anyway, why did you conflate Smith statements with later ones to the media as though they were the same?

You don't seem very honest to me in your search for understanding of smithman.

Are you invested in smithman for some reason?

by Buzz Shine 17.09.24 8:54

Bluebagthepirate wrote:It is inconsistent and unreliable.

Number one being the time of seeing Smithman.

Anyway, why did you conflate Smith statements with later ones to the media as though they were the same?

You don't seem very honest to me in your search for understanding of smithman.

Are you invested in smithman for some reason?

Sorry, but I don't rely on anything from Bell Pottinger, that's why I posted the link to Martin Smith's additional statement from the PJ files.

Anyway, we can all relax, all is going to be revealed in Brent's next instalment. My investment with Smithman on here ends with this post.

Please forgive me Lord for wanting to know the truth.

Amen

by **Bluebagthepirate** 17.09.24 9:27

/Buzz Shine wrote:

Sorry, but I don't rely on anything from Bell Pottinger, that's why I posted the link to Martin Smith's additional statement from the PJ files.

As I said, disingenuous. I really don't see the point of you doing that here it can be spotted from a mile off.

You do admit that by January 2008 Smith was no longer saying he thought Smithman was Gerry?

You do admit that in January 2008 Smith was saying he wanted to help the McCanns in any way he could?

You do admit that he changed his sighting from "normal" to "not usual" by January 2008?

Please forgive me Lord for wanting to know the truth.

I don't think you are interested in anything other than gerry as smithman and will move any number of goalposts to maintain that as has been seen here.

You could shock me by acknowledging what I just said though.

by **PeterMac** 17.09.24 14:10

Buzz Shine wrote:it could have been = in the sense that he was not black or of restricted growth or in a wheelchair. She looked just like Madeleine McCann would have looked being carried by her normal European looking abductor, right round the corner from where the McCanns own little girl was abducted.

Or Perhaps more accurately . . .
... right round the corner from where the McCanns ALLEGE their own little girl HAD BEEN ABDUCTED an HOUR or even more earlier

by **Silentscope** 17.09.24 15:33

@Buzz Shine wrote: She looked just like Madeleine McCann would have looked being carried by her normal European looking abductor.

Apart from her wearing long sleeved Pyjamas and not short sleeved ones?

by **AnneCGuedes** 17.09.24 15:47

Silentscope wrote:@Buzz Shine wrote: She looked just like Madeleine McCann would have looked being carried by her normal European looking abductor.

Apart from her wearing long sleeved Pyjamas and not short sleeved ones?

K continually insisted on the detail of the short sleeves, repeated ad nauseam in the hope that the length of the sleeves would prevent a child so similar to M from being identified with M.

by Shash T 17.09.24 15:55

PeterMac wrote:
Shash T wrote:In Bernt's book, he suggests that M was carried away in the blue sports bagbag.
NO he doesn't.

Please read it again

The sports bag was on the shelf in the parents' bedroom on the night of 3/5/7 and the early morning of 4/5/7
Which is why IT IS IN IN THE PHOTOS.

PeterMac, you are correct.

Apologies to all for sending us off course.

Correction: Bernt suggests A bag.

by **PeterMac** 17.09.24 20:45

Thank you.
Brendt's Book contains a wealth of detail.
He uses the phrase
"People say 'The Devil is in the details.'
I say 'The Truth is in the details'."

When analysing his book we must all be careful that we have actually read it properly and considered what he is saying IN CONTEXT. And quote it correctly - as for example a copy and paste from the Kindle edition.
Already people are criticising individual points but it becomes clear during their argument that they have not even read it, but are extrapolating what they think he might have said.
Those of us who have read it, - more than once - frankly do not have the time to go round correcting mistakes, except on a Forum like this which has always tried to publish only verifiable or properly referenced facts,

by Buzz Shine 17.09.24 21:02

Or Perhaps more accurately . . .
... right round the corner from where the McCanns ALLEGE their own little girl HAD BEEN ABDUCTED an HOUR or even more earlier

During the day nothing unusual happened, until almost 22.30 when, being alone again, she heard the hysterical shouts from a female person, calling out.
https://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAMELA_FENN.htm
At that time, at about 22.20 - 22.30 he noticed that there was only one person sitting at the group's table, the oldest of them and he asked her jokingly whether they had left her alone.
https://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/J-T-R-Salcedas.htm

Later, between 22.00 and 22.30, when the witness was in the kitchen, he was informed by a colleague that in the meantime a client had entered the restaurant shouting and that afterwards the whole English had left in a panic.

https://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOAQUIM-J-M-BAPTISTA.htm

Declares further that on the night 03-05-07, she left the apartment at around 21H58?she remembers the exact time because she asked her friend the time and she responded after checking this on the telephone in the lounge. After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARIA-M-M-DE-SILVA.htm

Emergency call to police: 22:41.

Nothing there about the McCanns alleging their own little girl had been abducted an hour or even more earlier.

In the absence of hard verifiable proof it's always sensible to keep an open mind as far as I am concerned. That doesn't mean Gerry is Smithman. It just means there is no proof he isn't.

by **Bluebagthepirate** 17.09.24 21:23

Seriously Buzz, give it a rest.

How many times do you need your witnesses explaining to you?

Are you invested in smithman?

Are you invested on a forum that is invested in smithman?

by **AnneCGuedes** 17.09.24 22:01

May 4 1.42am - Rachel MO calls the wife of BBC News Chief Political Correspondent James Landale, There will then be eight calls until 12.59pm. Rachael contacted also the BBC News 24 office.
BBC News
"Kate and Gerry McCann returned at about 2145 GMT to find an empty bed and the apartment door and window wide open."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/leicestershire/6623127.stm

BBC Radio 4 - 8h45
Yunus Mulla: Now, the family, errr... her parents, in particular, were having dinner just a few hundred yards away and had left her with her brother and sister in the family apartment. Errr... they were keeping check, errr... on the children, every half hour, but, errr... at around, errr... quarter-to-ten last night, errm... her mother, errr... Kate McCann, discovered her daughter wasn't there.
9:45 for the declaration of abduction was rapidly changed into 10.

Ricardo Oliveira (Tapas waiter)
Statement 1 : (on May 3) Dinner finished at about 21.45, a few minutes later the witness looked at the table and saw that there was nobody there and one of his colleagues told them that all the guests had left the table in a hurry.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RICARDO-A-D-L-OLIVEIRA.htm

Statement 2 : he was the one who served the main dishes. He remembers that at this moment, the taller male, whom he now knows to be Russell, had left the table. The witness was asked to keep Russell's meal warm. After a certain amount of time (he is not able to be exact), he was asked to serve Russell, who had returned to the table. He remembers that the rest of the group had practically finished their main courses... He served Russell and shortly thereafter, he was alerted to strange movements in the restaurant perimeters... The witness went to the esplanade zone and saw that the table that had previously been occupied by nine adults was now occupied only by the older woman.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RICARDO-A-D-L-OLIVEIRA.htm#p11p2941

by **Bluebagthepirate** 17.09.24 22:06

Thank you Anne.

Makes the Gerry wandering around at 22.30 theory even more crazy.

The abduction was staged for between 21.00 and 21.30.

Why would Gerry think it was a good idea to go around undisguised with a child in his arms 1 hour or more later?

(Buzz... don't bother again).

by Buzz Shine 17.09.24 22:13

AnneCGuedes wrote:May 4 1.42am - Rachel MO calls the wife of BBC News Chief Political Correspondent James Landale, There will then be eight calls until 12.59pm. Rachael contacted also the BBC News 24 office.
BBC News
"Kate and Gerry McCann returned at about 2145 GMT to find an empty bed and the apartment door and window wide open."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/leicestershire/6623127.stm

BBC Radio 4 - 8h45
Yunus Mulla: Now, the family, errr... her parents, in particular, were having dinner just a few hundred yards away and had left her with her brother and sister in the family apartment. Errr... they were keeping check, errr... on the children, every half hour, but, errr... at around, errr... quarter-to-ten last night, errm... her mother, errr... Kate McCann, discovered her daughter wasn't there.
9:45 for the declaration of abduction was rapidly changed into 10.

Ricardo Oliveira (Tapas waiter)
Statement 1 : (on May 3) Dinner finished at about 21.45, a few minutes later the witness looked at the table and saw that there was nobody there and one of his colleagues told them that all the guests had left the table in a hurry.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RICARDO-A-D-L-OLIVEIRA.htm

Statement 2 : he was the one who served the main dishes. He remembers that at this moment, the taller male, whom he now knows to be Russell, had left the table. The witness was asked to keep Russell's meal warm. After a certain amount of time (he is not able to be exact), he was asked to serve Russell, who had returned to the table. He remembers that the rest of the group had practically finished their main courses... He served Russell and shortly thereafter, he was alerted to strange movements in the restaurant perimeters... The witness went to the esplanade zone and saw that the table that had previously been occupied by nine adults was now occupied only by the older woman.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RICARDO-A-D-L-OLIVEIRA.htm#p11p2941

Statement 1: 9:45
Statement 2: 9:45
Statement 3: 21:45

Emergency call to police: 22:41.

That's a fair old delay that.

by **sharonl** 17.09.24 22:26

Bluebagthepirate wrote:Thank you Anne.

Makes the Gerry wandering around at 22.30 theory even more crazy.

The abduction was staged for between 21.00 and 21.30.

Why would Gerry think it was a good idea to go around undisguised with a child in his arms 1 hour or more later?

(Buzz... don't bother again).

At 22.30 Gerry was talking to Mrs Fenn

"At that moment she offered Gerry help, saying that he could use her phone to contact the authorities, to which he replied that this had already been done. It was just after 22.30"

by **AnneCGuedes** 17.09.24 22:33

Why did G increasingly delay the time of the alleged discovery ?

At about 22.00 it was his wife Kate who went to check on the children.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN.htm

Half an hour later, without anything to report, it being 22h03 (sic), he turned to alert Kate that it was time for her to go to see the children.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-10MAY.htm

The third check was made by Kate at around 22:00. He does not know how long it was before Kate returned, but he does remember that shortly before she returned he was thinking of going to see what was going on.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-ARGUIDO.htm

by Buzz Shine 17.09.24 22:38

AnneCGuedes wrote:Why did G increasingly delay the time of the alleged discovery ?

At about 22.00 it was his wife Kate who went to check on the children.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN.htm

Half an hour later, without anything to report, it being 22h03 (sic), he turned to alert Kate that it was time for her to go to see the children.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-10MAY.htm

The third check was made by Kate at around 22:00. He does not know how long it was before Kate returned, but he does remember that shortly before she returned he was thinking of going to see what was going on.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-ARGUIDO.htm

"He was wearing cream or beige-coloured cloth trousers in a classic cut. He did not see his shoes"

What's photographed on top of Gerry's bed? A pair of cream or beige-coloured cloth trousers in a classic cut.

The last thing he should have been wearing before going to dinner was a pair of shorts to play tennis in, not a pair of cream or beige-coloured cloth trousers.

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