Ferreira do Alentejo

by Cheshire Cat 14.09.13 11:33

Yesterday there was an interesting comment on the Diario Da Noticias discussion thread. It was copied on to this forum but was censored almost immediately due it being potentially libellous. I will not reproduce the comment.

However, the poster in the Portuguese newspaper, who used the name Luis Arriaga, made a statement that Madeleine was cremated at Ferreira do Alentejo, where there is a public crematorium that serves the Algarve region. Luis Arriaga claimed to have represented Amaral in court and there is a Luis Arriaga who runs the Justice for Gonacalo Amaral campaign in Portugal.

Of course this could be a distraction and not genuine but intriguing never-the-less!

by Guest 14.09.13 12:32

Maybe a Portuguese speaker could contact the Luis Arriaga who claims to be connected with the case and ask if he made the comment?

For now though, I'm thinking it's more likely to be a hoaxer.

by Mustardseed 14.09.13 12:48

According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.

by Guest 14.09.13 12:56

Cheshire Cat wrote:Yesterday there was an interesting comment on the Diario Da Noticias discussion thread. It was copied on to this forum but was censored almost immediately due it being potentially libellous. I will not reproduce the comment.

However, the poster in the Portuguese newspaper, who used the name Luis Arriaga, made a statement that Madeleine was cremated at Ferreira do Alentejo, where there is a public crematorium that serves the Algarve region. Luis Arriaga claimed to have represented Amaral in court and there is a Luis Arriaga who runs the Justice for Gonacalo Amaral campaign in Portugal.

Of course this could be a distraction and not genuine but intriguing never-the-less!

Dont know if this is the same person?

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The name is also mentioned here, "The English Gag"

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by Cheshire Cat 14.09.13 15:12

Cherry Blossom wrote:
Cheshire Cat wrote:Yesterday there was an interesting comment on the Diario Da Noticias discussion thread. It was copied on to this forum but was censored almost immediately due it being potentially libellous. I will not reproduce the comment.

However, the poster in the Portuguese newspaper, who used the name Luis Arriaga, made a statement that Madeleine was cremated at Ferreira do Alentejo, where there is a public crematorium that serves the Algarve region. Luis Arriaga claimed to have represented Amaral in court and there is a Luis Arriaga who runs the Justice for Gonacalo Amaral campaign in Portugal.

Of course this could be a distraction and not genuine but intriguing never-the-less!
Dont know if this is the same person?

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The name is also mentioned here, "The English Gag"

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I have not seen the original message on Diario Da Noticias, only the translation on the Trial Discussion thread. Does anyone have a link to the original message in Portuguese?

by Woofer 14.09.13 15:56

Mustardseed wrote:According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.

It seems the crematorium could have been re-opened by then. It was closed at the beginning of May 2007 for maintenance and was supposed to re-open on 5th June 2007.

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by Guest 14.09.13 19:09

Mustardseed wrote:According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.

Do we know how he came to be there?
It's not quite near PdL.

Any information on his own blog, as to how he ended up there, or passed through there?

Will check self.

Special date August 20th?
Mentioned in the Book?

Anything relevant in the media at the time

OK: why was mr McCann in Ferreira de Alentejos on August 20th 2007?

How, why, with whom; witnesses?

And where was dr Kare McCann that day?

by Guest 14.09.13 19:11

Woofer wrote:
Mustardseed wrote:According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.
It seems the crematorium could have been re-opened by then. It was closed at the beginning of May 2007 for maintenance and was supposed to re-open on 5th June 2007.

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Oops

by Ayniia 14.09.13 19:41

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:Maybe a Portuguese speaker could contact the Luis Arriaga who claims to be connected with the case and ask if he made the comment?

For now though, I'm thinking it's more likely to be a hoaxer.

He is not a hoaxer, in fact he is kinda "famous" as a radio presenter back in the 90's.
I could try contacting him but I dunno if he would say anything to me,anyway if you guys think it's worth it,I'll call him ,I found his contact online yesterday. I very much doubt he would post that comment online with his name if it wasn't true,or at least if he didn't believed it. He really had contact with Amaral so ...

Cheshire Cat wrote:
I have not seen the original message on Diario Da Noticias, only the translation on the Trial Discussion thread. Does anyone have a link to the original message in Portuguese?

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by Cheshire Cat 14.09.13 20:22

Ayniia wrote:
No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:Maybe a Portuguese speaker could contact the Luis Arriaga who claims to be connected with the case and ask if he made the comment?

For now though, I'm thinking it's more likely to be a hoaxer.
He is not a hoaxer, in fact he is kinda "famous" as a radio presenter back in the 90's.
I could try contacting him but I dunno if he would say anything to me,anyway if you guys think it's worth it,I'll call him ,I found his contact online yesterday. I very much doubt he would post that comment online with his name if it wasn't true,or at least if he didn't believed it. He really had contact with Amaral so ...

Cheshire Cat wrote:
I have not seen the original message on Diario Da Noticias, only the translation on the Trial Discussion thread. Does anyone have a link to the original message in Portuguese?
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Thank you. I have looked at the link and the comment is still there. I translated it with Google and it also mentions Freeport - it appears to be suggesting a deal was done which is preventing the case being reopened even though there is sufficient evidence to charge the perpetrators. There is then the claim that Madeleine was cremated at the public facility.
This is astonishing!

by Ayniia 14.09.13 20:31

Cheshire Cat wrote:
Thank you. I have looked at the link and the comment is still there. I translated it with Google and it also mentions Freeport - it appears to be suggesting a deal was done which is preventing the case being reopened even though there is sufficient evidence to charge the perpetrators. There is then the claim that Madeleine was cremated at the public facility.
This is astonishing!

I cropped the part about Freeport because I didn't thought it was important but now that I read it again,he's clearly implying that there was an "agreement " between the governments , Portugal wouldn't arrest Gerry, Britain would drop the Freeport case. Anyway I'm not good at researching and I don't have Kate's fairytale book to see if she says anything about that day, but I'm certainly curious.

Mustardseed wrote:According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.

Gerry's blog 20/08/2007:
I had a predominately quiet but productive day. I spent most of it at the computer or on the phone. We keep in regular touch with both the Portuguese and British police but there has been no major news in the last couple of days.
We did not do any exercise today but plan to run tomorrow morning- especially as I am off to bed for an early night!
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Google says the distance between PDL and Ferreira is 182 km , aprox 1h,53mn drive...
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by Guest 14.09.13 21:35

20th August

The news today suggests that they're going to arrest a "new suspect" in the UK. It's likely to be more tabloid fabrication. There's so much shit that's written, much of it outrageous. And coupled with the void of information from the police, who knows what's going on!"

By this time, we felt as if we had been completely cut adrift. The police ignored us, we were up against a convoluted system neither of us really understood and the media juggernaut was now well and truely out of control. If we were going to have any chance of protecting ourselves, we needed somebody familiar with the system, a Portuguese lawyer, to represent our interests. Later that day, Gerry contacted Carlos Pinto de Abreu, a human rights lawyer in Lisbon, who'd been recommended to us, and arranged to see him the following afternoon.

We left for Lisbon at lunchtime, with our kind and trustworthy taxi-driver. At his office Carlos was joined by three colleagues and his wife, a doctor, who helped with interpretation where needed.

We took them through as much as we could; the night of 3 May, our relationship with the police, the leaks to the media and the scandalous headlines. We felt better knowing that Carlos and his team would be able to advise us.

A bit upset on the way back... I had 'flashes' of Madeleine in my head being hurt, abused and screaming for us - but we weren't there. So awful.

We arrived in Praia da Luz late in the evening and discovered Sean and Amelie still in our bed. They were quiet but still awake, which, I have to admit, secretly pleased me. I needed them with me. Thank God for Sean and Amelie.

by Woofer 14.09.13 22:18

Its a bit confusing whether it was actually the 20th or the 21st that the pings occurred when going through Ferreira do Alentejo. Anyway it looks as though there was only about 25 mins between Agueda A2 and Ferreira do Alentejo but no idea of the distance between these two places.

"AUGUST 2007 (Report pages 23 to 27)

It is only the 20th that Gerald McCann again leaves the coverage area of the antennae of Luz. On this day at 10:04:23 and 10:06:08 only the antenna called "Lagos" is activated. They are the exceptions to the remaining 34 records.

It remains in the Luz until 13:31:52 ("Praia da Luz") on 21st. On this day it comes to Lisbon. Along the way the [following] activations were made: "S.Bartolomeu de Messines" - 14:05:42; "Agueda A2" - 14:11:12; "Ferreira do Alentejo" - 14:36:30; "South Grandola" - 14:42:56 and 14:44:54; "Palmela A12" - 15:15:05 and 15:20:48; "Auto Europa" - 15:21:33; "Coina" - 15:22:40 and 15:23:34; "South Central" - 15:31:56; "Avenue of Nations" - 16:04:54, 18:05:00, 18:05:05, 18:05:39, 18:29:17, 18:44:37 and 18:55:52; "Telheiras South" - 19:13:54; and "Airport of Portela" - 19:20:19. The record following this last one occurs at 21:44:38 already on [back at] the antenna "Praia da Luz Centre".

On 22nd, the first record takes place on antenna "Zoomarine Guia" at 8:29:06, followed by records on repeaters "Alcantarilha"; "Sobral IC4"; "Parchal" and "Arge IC4" at 8:31:10, 8:32:07, 8:36:37 and 8:37:19, respectively. It returns to the coverage area of the antennae of Praia da Luz at 9:30:56. "

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by sweetex 14.09.13 22:32

Very intriguing!

Over the years there was so many allegations/rumors/stories/comments etc... and its always been a case of distinguishing between possibilities that could be true and the blatant lies or distractions. And its not always been easy.

I don't think (if there is any truth to this) that this guy will say more when being questioned, but no harm in trying?

I sometimes wonder if we (or maybe I'm speaking for myself) are prepared to hear what actually happened. It sounds just so.... unbelievable and sad Sad

by Ayniia 14.09.13 22:36

sweetex wrote:Very intriguing!

Over the years there was so many allegations/rumors/stories/comments etc... and its always been a case of distinguishing between possibilities that could be true and the blatant lies or distractions. And its not always been easy.

I don't think (if there is any truth to this) that this guy will say more when being questioned, but no harm in trying?

I sometimes wonder if we (or maybe I'm speaking for myself) are prepared to hear what actually happened. It sounds just so.... unbelievable and sad

I am and Madeleine deserves justice. And the world needs a real good eye opener to see that the press don't ever say the truth.

by Guest 14.09.13 22:44

Ayniia wrote:
Cheshire Cat wrote:
Thank you. I have looked at the link and the comment is still there. I translated it with Google and it also mentions Freeport - it appears to be suggesting a deal was done which is preventing the case being reopened even though there is sufficient evidence to charge the perpetrators. There is then the claim that Madeleine was cremated at the public facility.
This is astonishing!
I cropped the part about Freeport because I didn't thought it was important but now that I read it again,he's clearly implying that there was an "agreement " between the governments , Portugal wouldn't arrest Gerry, Britain would drop the Freeport case. Anyway I'm not good at researching and I don't have Kate's fairytale book to see if she says anything about that day, but I'm certainly curious.

Mustardseed wrote:According to the mobile phone info on mccannpjfiles, Gerry was there on August 20th. Not that that means anything ~ he might have just been passing through. Interesting comment though.
Gerry's blog 20/08/2007:
I had a predominately quiet but productive day. I spent most of it at the computer or on the phone. We keep in regular touch with both the Portuguese and British police but there has been no major news in the last couple of days.
We did not do any exercise today but plan to run tomorrow morning- especially as I am off to bed for an early night!
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Google says the distance between PDL and Ferreira is 182 km , aprox 1h,53mn drive...
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Easily verified by his computer and iphone records. if it was GM; could have been anyone else on his PC/phone

by suzyjohnson 14.09.13 22:45

If there had been some kind of a deal between governments in August, why would the PJ have made the McCanns arguidos in September?

by sweetex 14.09.13 22:54

Ayniia wrote:
sweetex wrote:Very intriguing!

Over the years there was so many allegations/rumors/stories/comments etc... and its always been a case of distinguishing between possibilities that could be true and the blatant lies or distractions. And its not always been easy.

I don't think (if there is any truth to this) that this guy will say more when being questioned, but no harm in trying?

I sometimes wonder if we (or maybe I'm speaking for myself) are prepared to hear what actually happened. It sounds just so.... unbelievable and sad
I am and Madeleine deserves justice. And the world needs a real good eye opener to see that the press don't ever say the truth.

I know - and agree. It's just when one read things like this and possible scenario's it takes you back wondering about what really happened and what the poor little girl must have went through.

by Ayniia 14.09.13 23:49

News from 2007 regarding cremation
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and PJ report on the visit
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And the PJ pictures
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It's not the one from Ferreira do Alentejo but the PJ investigated at least this one

by Cheshire Cat 15.09.13 7:04

Ayniia wrote:News from 2007 regarding cremation
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and PJ report on the visit
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And the PJ pictures
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It's not the one from Ferreira do Alentejo but the PJ investigated at least this one

At least the one at Ferreira would provide some dignity. Perhaps we will hear again from Luis Arriaga.

by bristow 29.10.13 18:39

I can't get my head around poor Madeleine being cremated in a public crematorium, there are so many official checks to have to go through before a body can be disposed of in this way.

Not sure about Portuguese regulations but here you need two doctors signatures before the cremation goes ahead ... (hmmm two doctors!)

Or are we talking about back handers? Still can't see that staff could be bribed to do this.

Personally I don't think she was cremated.

by MissDaisy 29.10.13 18:46

Interesting interesting piece from The Telegraph.
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by Okeydokey 30.10.13 0:21

bristow wrote:I can't get my head around poor Madeleine being cremated in a public crematorium, there are so many official checks to have to go through before a body can be disposed of in this way.

Not sure about Portuguese regulations but here you need two doctors signatures before the cremation goes ahead ... (hmmm two doctors!)

Or are we talking about back handers? Still can't see that staff could be bribed to do this.

Personally I don't think she was cremated.

I agree. Sounds like some nutty nonsense.

by Cheshire Cat 01.06.14 13:01

Another comment from Luis Arriaga (relocated from Portugal - was previously GA spokes person)

Só não percebo porque é que Gonçalo Amaral não vem a terreiro explicar o que sabe e dizer que os restos mortais da Maddie estão incinerados em Ferreira do Alentejo... Gonçalo, vá, enche-te de coragem e desmascara-os

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Google translate:

Just do not understand why Gonçalo Amaral does not come to yard explain what you know and say that the remains of Maddie are incinerated in Ferreira do Alentejo ... Gonçalo, check, fill yourself with courage and debunks them

by Cheshire Cat 01.06.14 16:06

Cheshire Cat wrote:Another comment from Luis Arriaga (relocated from Portugal - was previously GA spokes person)

Só não percebo porque é que Gonçalo Amaral não vem a terreiro explicar o que sabe e dizer que os restos mortais da Maddie estão incinerados em Ferreira do Alentejo... Gonçalo, vá, enche-te de coragem e desmascara-os

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Google translate:

Just do not understand why Gonçalo Amaral does not come to yard explain what you know and say that the remains of Maddie are incinerated in Ferreira do Alentejo ... Gonçalo, check, fill yourself with courage and debunks them

The above was a more recent comment - from Feb 2014. Luis also made a comment in May 2014 - he seems to be fired up by the search so will be interesting to see if he makes any further comments over the next week or two.

by kimHager 01.06.14 18:16

This is absolutely incredible considering K&G says the PJ was doing nothing, actually seems they were on top of things
This quote from the Portuguese News
: Suspicions have been raised due to the duration of the maintenance service, which commenced over a month ago, despite spokesperson of Portugal’s other four crematoriums (two in Lisbon, two in Oporto) claiming standard maintenance services take little more than three days. Local authorities have guaranteed the crematorium will be up and running by June 5th.
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So obviously they had the bases covered.. Which im not sure if K or G left luz during that month of maintenance but perhaps someone did go and inquire about a childs cremation? Hence the refrigerated cadaver hypothesis by GA appears accurate IF we believe she was kept somewhere refrigerated. Also wonder.. would she have to be unrecognizable which could makes sense as to not sending her medical/dental records. I may be wrongand this is my opinions not facts and its definitely a strange thing for Luis Arriaga to comment about so openly in the first place...unless he knows something maybe in the files that we don't?? CM must have missed this one.. I just dunno seems risky but one thing is for certain in all this.. Maddy is somewhere and we probably wont ever know where. Sad

by Cheshire Cat 06.06.14 19:52

06/06/2014 Luis Arriaga
13h50

Reintegrate Dr. Gonçalo Amaral and reopen the famous judicial process, the McCanns will be held. The remains of the child are incinerated in Ferreira do Alentejo and former Inspector knows all the details.

Comment in todays CMJOURNAL

by bobbin 06.06.14 20:17

Cheshire Cat wrote:

06/06/2014 Luis Arriaga
13h50

Reintegrate Dr. Gonçalo Amaral and reopen the famous judicial process, the McCanns will be held. The remains of the child are incinerated in Ferreira do Alentejo and former Inspector knows all the details.

Comment in todays CMJOURNAL

and then there was the video of McCs mantlepiece in Rothley, with an Urn /piggy bank ?

by whatliesbehindthesofa 06.06.14 20:38

Cheshire Cat wrote:

06/06/2014 Luis Arriaga
13h50

Reintegrate Dr. Gonçalo Amaral and reopen the famous judicial process, the McCanns will be held. The remains of the child are incinerated in Ferreira do Alentejo and former Inspector knows all the details.

Comment in todays CMJOURNAL

And Amaral did not give all of this information to the current Portuguese investigation? Really.