Re: Sunday Express - Burglary files to aid hunt for Madeleine McCann

by Cristobell 24.02.14 14:13

Blacksmith is claiming the names on the ILRs are NOT Portuguese and two of them are women!

I know he is not popular on here but I wonder if he has some inside information?

by Guest 24.02.14 14:19

His post is pretty unambiguous (somewhat unusually for him!). He is claiming this as fact - and that the burglary 'lead' is a false one, which has come to Clarence Mitchell via Scotland Yard. Blacksmith's source may be wrong, but he certainly either has a source or is out and out lying, which would surprise me. If he is speculating he usually says so.

by Guest 24.02.14 14:32

Cristobell wrote:
No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:By coincidence PM, I have just watched a programme (Born to Kill) about Donald Neilson, the killer of Lesley Whittle and three sub-postmasters.

It does not bear thinking about what she must have gone through.

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The reality of captivity plays no part in the McCann abduction story. We are to believe she is being treated like a princess and will shortly return to her family.

Presumably clutching a twopenny piece

by Guest 24.02.14 14:35

Cristobell wrote:
PeterMac wrote:What is the legal position if it is shown that Madeleine died BETWEEN the date of some idiot / PI / SY/ Commissioner of the Met telling the world that they knew (knew)
who was responsible, and their actually standing up from behind their desks and doing something, such as finding her.

If she is then found, but the date of death was between those events, then what ?
Or are we back to the parents planing the 100 days and the sordid concert anniversary with Elton John (good GOD !) after only a week of her being reported missing

Many years ago Leslie Whittle suffered a grim fate, when a local journalist went in over the top of a police operation and told the world he knew what was going on.

This is exactly what happened in Belgium Petermac, the house of Dutroux was under surveillance by the police as the little girls were held prisoner inside. As the house was searched their voices were heard, but the official in charge claimed it was children outside. The two little girls died of starvation.

Scotland Yard via its most senior officer has claimed it has the names of the people who abducted Madeleine. The McCanns are claiming she is still alive. Why haven't they swooped? Why aren't the parents demanding they act immediately?

It looks to me as if Scotland Yard are even more unprofessional than the McCanns former PIs who were going to have Maddie 'home by Christmas'. They know who the abductors are but it is going to take several months before SY can make a move. Good grief, they are making the Belgian police look efficient.

Don't you see wha's being prepared?

The excuse: we were raring to go, but the Sardinemunchers messed up our one/two/three rogatories in their mailsystem

by Guest 24.02.14 14:36

Know after his vile outburst he is not welcome to be talked of here but will be interesting to see if the blacksmith post is accurate,Think I have heard he has been right a few times before.

by russiandoll 24.02.14 14:37

Have read the latest from BS, where does he get his info I wonder ? Interesting, given the detail.

by **PeterMac** 24.02.14 14:44

russiandoll wrote:Have read the latest from BS, where does he get his info I wonder ? Interesting, given the detail.

It certainly is.

Putting aside his rants, has he ever been seriously factually wrong ?
What he says makes much more sense than what HH said, at any rate.

by Guest 24.02.14 14:58

BS: more than three people (not burglars!) to be questioned; at least 2 of them women

These can only be people AR/SY themselves want to interview or to have interviewed by the Portuguese => in Portugal

Now, which of the protagonists from 2007 would still be around in Portugal in 2014?

Dr Goncalo Amaral is, that's for sure!

by marconi 24.02.14 15:06

Cristobell wrote:Blacksmith is claiming the names on the ILRs are NOT Portuguese and two of them are women!

I know he is not popular on here but I wonder if he has some inside information?

Cristobell, I don't think that anyone is informed about the contents of the letters, excepted for the police themselves. I believe Black... is trying to gess what is going on. I also suspect the nannies. I think they could have helped to conceal the body, also because Amaral talked about the infantário. The PJ are keeping an irritating secrecy of everything and it is the law in Portugal.

by Cristobell 24.02.14 15:09

Portia wrote:BS: more than three people (not burglars!) to be questioned; at least 2 of them women

These can only be people AR/SY themselves want to interview or to have interviewed by the Portuguese => in Portugal

Now, which of the protagonists from 2007 would still be around in Portugal in 2014?

Dr Goncalo Amaral is, that's for sure!

He says NOT Portuguese Portia, which makes it more interesting still. Are these people still in Portugual? Are we at a point where all interviews etc have be via the PJ - even if the people of interest are on British soil? Are some of the witnesses not co-operating, indeed have some of the witnesses been made arguidos?

My head hurts spin

by AndyB 24.02.14 15:15

[quote="marconi"I also suspect the nannies. I think they could have helped to conceal the body imo, also because Amaral talked about the infantário. Only my opinion [/quote]
What motive would they have for helping conceal the body?

by Doug D 24.02.14 15:17

He always comes across as though he has an inside line. ‘The Grange Mouth’ I wonder, p’d off with the limitations imposed and direction it’s going?

Mix that with a bit of scurrilousness (is that a word?), obtrusiveness and general diversion to protect the source and that’s about where we’re at.

‘When the team were questioned by HH as to which one of them was 'Grange Mouth', he received 35 replies of ‘no comment’ and that was the end of the matter’.

by marconi 24.02.14 15:23

AndyB wrote:[quote="marconi"I also suspect the nannies. I think they could have helped to conceal the body, also because Amaral talked about the infantário.

What motive would they have for helping conceal the body?[/quote]

AndyB, manipulation.
"We will lose the twins, our jobs, our friends. "We can not change it "(Gerry's words, very often), we pay you for the favor...
Within 3,4 weeks people will forget it..."

Wasn't Pennington the one who refused to "recognize" Murat, after he was made arguido? She realized that the whole thing had ran out of hands?

by AndyB 24.02.14 15:27

It just doesn't seem plausible to me. Trusting what were essentially strangers with their guilty secret would be too big a risk IMO. Besides, its difficult to see what help the nannies could give that their trusted friends couldn't

by plebgate 24.02.14 15:29

Cristobell wrote:
Portia wrote:BS: more than three people (not burglars!) to be questioned; at least 2 of them women

These can only be people AR/SY themselves want to interview or to have interviewed by the Portuguese => in Portugal

Now, which of the protagonists from 2007 would still be around in Portugal in 2014?

Dr Goncalo Amaral is, that's for sure!

He says NOT Portuguese Portia, which makes it more interesting still. Are these people still in Portugual? Are we at a point where all interviews etc have be via the PJ - even if the people of interest are on British soil? Are some of the witnesses not co-operating, indeed have some of the witnesses been made arguidos?

My head hurts

Hi Cristobell, I can understand why your head hurts. Yesterday I read a post from you (I think it was you, apologies if not) which said that it looked as though BS was packing up shop and preparing to make apologies to Mr.. & Mrs.

What are we supposed to make of it all, I don't know, but I don't think BS knows any more than we do although time will tell. smilie

by HelenMeg 24.02.14 15:32

Well all of this certainly is thought provoking. Better this than sitting hearing nothing whatsoever.
Perhaps the tempo really is becoming more upbeat

Kate and Fiona perhaps

by Cristobell 24.02.14 15:33

marconi wrote:
Cristobell wrote:Blacksmith is claiming the names on the ILRs are NOT Portuguese and two of them are women!

I know he is not popular on here but I wonder if he has some inside information?

Cristobell, I don't think that anyone is informed about the contents of the letters, excepted for the police themselves. I believe Black... is trying to gess what is going on. I also suspect the nannies. I think they could have helped to conceal the body, also because Amaral talked about the infantário. The PJ are keeping an irritating secrecy of everything and it is the law in Portugal.

In fairness to Blacksmith, he has given us some 'leaks' in the past that have proved to be true, although I believe at that time he had some sort of working relationship with people close to Goncalo Amaral. I don't know if that continues. The most significant snippet, imo, was a quote from GA, to say 'it is not going well for the McCanns'. This was just prior to the Portuguese opening their review if I remember rightly.

He has suggested previously that there is a mole in the SY investigation leaking stories to the press. That wouldn't surprise me, the task force are up against a highly accomplished media machine. This case is being played out on the front pages of the UK tabloids and a lot of people are jockeying for position for when the REAL news breaks.

Looking at the what the police must investigate to build a case, they have 7 years of media reports and hundreds of interviews to examine. The blatant obvious lies that had the sane among us, saying WTF, have been captured for evermore on celluloid and will return to haunt the starry pair as every reel, and every lie is scrutinized and analysed by REAL criminologists and Lie experts.

I am not sure why you suspect the nannies Marconi? They have never, ever, been put forward as people of interest, but imo, there is good reason for this. Should the finger be pointed at the nannies, people will ask why on earth the McCanns put their twins in the creche the following day, and indeed throughout their stay in Portugal.

by marconi 24.02.14 15:46

I am not sure why you suspect the nannies Marconi? They have never, ever, been put forward as people of interest, but imo, there is good reason for this. Should the finger be pointed at the nannies, people will ask why on earth the McCanns put their twins in the creche the following day, and indeed throughout their stay in Portugal.
[/quote]

Cristobell, of course the police didn't attracted the attention to the nannies. It would harm the investigation.
Twins back to the crèche?
The twin's life went on, a stranger abducted Madeleine and besides the parents needed contact with the nannies, checking how things were going because the concealing was improvised on the 3rd.

If I'm not mistaken, Pennington was working with very young children at the time. Perhaps their room near the twins' room.The McCanns often going back to the older children's room, another building, it would attract the attention.

by Casey5 24.02.14 15:49

Cristobell wrote:snipped:-
He says NOT Portuguese Portia, which makes it more interesting still. Are these people still in Portugual? Are we at a point where all interviews etc have be via the PJ - even if the people of interest are on British soil? Are some of the witnesses not co-operating, indeed have some of the witnesses been made arguidos?
My head hurts

Cristobell, not Portuguese Blacksmith says!! What if they were, say German or French, not living in Portugal - neither the Portuguese or the British could interview them it would be down to the home countries via Interpol maybe. If it was someone residing in Portugal but not Portuguese e.g. Robert Murat's wife then the Portuguese could surely interview her. And if they were English then, if living in Portugal, the PJ would interview them and if living in Britain then Scotland Yard could.
I agree about the head hurting.

by sami 24.02.14 15:55

Is it about more than interviewing people though, regardless of nationality or where they reside ? If, I were a part time resident in Portugal, or a past resident there, perhaps I had a bank account or credit cards etc. with a Portugese bank. Investigations into matters like that would require the agreement of the PJ, even if I were no longer resident there. Would it ?

by marconi 24.02.14 15:56

marconi wrote:I am not sure why you suspect the nannies Marconi? They have never, ever, been put forward as people of interest, but imo, there is good reason for this. Should the finger be pointed at the nannies, people will ask why on earth the McCanns put their twins in the creche the following day, and indeed throughout their stay in Portugal.

Cristobell, of course the police didn't attracted the attention to the nannies. It would harm the investigation.
Twins back to the crèche?
The twin's life went on, a stranger abducted Madeleine and besides the parents needed contact with the nannies, checking how things were going because the concealing was improvised on the 3rd.

If I'm not mistaken, Pennington was working with very young children at the time. Perhaps their room near the twins' room.The McCanns often going back to the older children's room, another building, it would attract the attention.[/quote]

I added more to this comment.

by Cristobell 24.02.14 16:07

plebgate wrote:
Cristobell wrote:
Portia wrote:BS: more than three people (not burglars!) to be questioned; at least 2 of them women

These can only be people AR/SY themselves want to interview or to have interviewed by the Portuguese => in Portugal

Now, which of the protagonists from 2007 would still be around in Portugal in 2014?

Dr Goncalo Amaral is, that's for sure!

He says NOT Portuguese Portia, which makes it more interesting still. Are these people still in Portugual? Are we at a point where all interviews etc have be via the PJ - even if the people of interest are on British soil? Are some of the witnesses not co-operating, indeed have some of the witnesses been made arguidos?

My head hurts

Hi Cristobell, I can understand why your head hurts. Yesterday I read a post from you (I think it was you, apologies if not) which said that it looked as though BS was packing up shop and preparing to make apologies to Mr.. & Mrs.

What are we supposed to make of it all, I don't know, but I don't think BS knows any more than we do although time will tell.

I sometimes wonder if BS has some sort of multiple personality disorder Plebgate. His writing often shows flashes of genius and lunacy simultaneously. When he is good, he is very good, but when he is bad, he is incomprehensible. Unfortunately, he also has a reputation for flouncing off. A couple of years ago, like a sulky teenager, he shut up shop and offered heartfelt apologies to Mr and Mrs McCann. I can forgive the flouncing off, we all get peeved at times, but I couldn't stomach the apologies. The child is still missing and there is no abductor. Even if I were subjected to a cat o'nine tails and thumbscrews, I wouldn't apologise to that pair.

I would not write about the McCanns if I were not 100% certain that they were involved in covering up Maddie's disappearance, because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if they were innocent. If he doesn't believe in what he is doing, why is he doing it? In apologising to the McCanns, BS was attempting to take a sly leap back onto the fence, discarding all of his own work (???) and coming across as a bit of a creep.

However, I have no wish to join in squabbles, particularly as we all fighting for the same goal. Blacksmith has produced some great stuff and has supplied us with some real background news in the past before it has reached the MSM. If he is right, then things are certainly hotting up.

by Guest 24.02.14 16:08

Sceptic wrote:Maybe someone has already stated this - but the only logical explanation I can believe regarding the burglar theory is that they are on the trail of the blue bag - and they need to confirm with the burglars what was in it as we have been informed by team mccann that nothing was stolen

Maybe David Payne told them where he ~~hid~~ left it?

by marconi 24.02.14 16:15

Cristobell, perhaps the McCanns sued Blackmith, also demanding excuses.

by HelenMeg 24.02.14 16:22

For more on the Irwins please see link

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by Watching 24.02.14 16:28

How reliable Blacksmith is, I wouldn't know, but I quote from his latest:

" Make of that, if you think it is reliable, what you will."

To add a little more speculation. There were two females who dined at the tapas restaurant on the night Madeleine disappeared. Their table was booked under the name of Irwin.

Irwin is the name which has popped up during police interviews. The tapas lot were asked if they knew of anyone by this name. They all said they did not.

I have always been curious as to why they were asked specifically if they knew of anyone by this name.

IF and a BIG IF, the females named on this rogatory letter are in fact those who dined under the booking name of Irwin - Would they be witnesses? They would most surely have noticed Mr & Mrs and Co in the tapas restaurant that night.

As Blacksmith would say - 'Make of that, what you will'

by **PeterMac** 24.02.14 16:47

Watching wrote: - Would they be witnesses? They would most surely have noticed Mr & Mrs and Co in the tapas restaurant that night.
As Blacksmith would say - 'Make of that, what you will'

Or indeed on any previous night.
Chaplins, anybody ?

by Cristobell 24.02.14 16:57

Watching wrote:How reliable Blacksmith is, I wouldn't know, but I quote from his latest:

" Make of that, if you think it is reliable, what you will."

To add a little more speculation. There were two females who dined at the tapas restaurant on the night Madeleine disappeared. Their table was booked under the name of Irwin.

Irwin is the name which has popped up during police interviews. The tapas lot were asked if they knew of anyone by this name. They all said they did not.

I have always been curious as to why they were asked specifically if they knew of anyone by this name.

IF and a BIG IF, the females named on this rogatory letter are in fact those who dined under the booking name of Irwin - Would they be witnesses? They would most surely have noticed Mr & Mrs and Co in the tapas restaurant that night.

As Blacksmith would say - 'Make of that, what you will'

Sir BHH said they HAVE the names of the suspects Watching, and putting 2 + 2 together and possibly reaching 6, those will be the names on the ILRs. I would imagine all the ex pats in PDL and the surrounding areas have been interviewed to death for the past 7 years. But regardless, I would be more inclined to look towards the McCann's inner circle. The guy who stored the hire car for them (whose name I can't remember, sorry) and the caring vicar and his wife. The kind friends of David Payne, who supplied the McCanns and the Tapas group with PAYG mobile phones on 4th May.

There was a huge amount of phone traffic on the night 3/4th May, and most of it came from Apartment 5A. While others were searching, the parents and their friends were working their way through their combined address books begging for help.

by Guest 24.02.14 19:01

Cristobell wrote:
I sometimes wonder if BS has some sort of multiple personality disorder Plebgate. His writing often shows flashes of genius and lunacy simultaneously. When he is good, he is very good, but when he is bad, he is incomprehensible. Unfortunately, he also has a reputation for flouncing off. A couple of years ago, like a sulky teenager, he shut up shop and offered heartfelt apologies to Mr and Mrs McCann. I can forgive the flouncing off, we all get peeved at times, but I couldn't stomach the apologies. The child is still missing and there is no abductor. Even if I were subjected to a cat o'nine tails and thumbscrews, I wouldn't apologise to that pair.

I would not write about the McCanns if I were not 100% certain that they were involved in covering up Maddie's disappearance, because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if they were innocent. If he doesn't believe in what he is doing, why is he doing it? In apologising to the McCanns, BS was attempting to take a sly leap back onto the fence, discarding all of his own work (???) and coming across as a bit of a creep.

However, I have no wish to join in squabbles, particularly as we all fighting for the same goal. Blacksmith has produced some great stuff and has supplied us with some real background news in the past before it has reached the MSM. If he is right, then things are certainly hotting up.

Undoubtedly, 'Blacksmith' is a group of people all contributing to the blog. The style of writing is noticeably different from post to post. The obnoxious Antony Sharples is but one incarnation - his posts stick out like a sore thumb as belonging to him. It is also interesting that 'Blacksmith' often refers to 'himself' in the plural - "We at the Bureau..." is a phrase often used.

by marconi 24.02.14 19:08

[quote= It is also interesting that 'Blacksmith' often refers to 'himself' in the plural - "We at the Bureau..." is a phrase often used.[/quote]

Dee Coy, that is what is called in Latin: pluralis majestatis.

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