The NEW Tennis Balls Photo Thread - 'Photoshopped photo created on 5th May', claims YouTube video

[Tony Bennett]

Brought over from one of the 'Maddie News threads for discussion:

BlueBag wrote

ll the "photoshopped" stuff is nonsense and it's the usual suspects, I haven't seen a single claim that stands up.

It's totally irritating.

@ sharonl

Probably no-one's fault really, but the 'trouble' regarding the topic veering on to another photo discussion started innocently enough with GRACEFUL1 (agree with 'plebgate', nice to see you back) posting the Sunday Express article today which featured a very large 'Tennis Balls' photo (page 10 of thread).

However, as the subject has been raised and some interesting and strong points discussed, I will take a slight liberty here and continue the discussion, if only to raise some issues which we could possibly discuss more appropriately on another photo therad.

@ BlueBag

I am with you, as you know, on the 'Last Photo' - genuine photo, but taken on another day. NOT photoshopped.

I am with you about the photo of Madeleine on the green slide - she is gripping on the rails in a way that is quite normal for, say, someone climbing up towards the top of the slide. So - also NOT photoshopped.

However, you have made the sweeping comment that "All the 'photoshopped' stuff is nonsense". On the subject of the Tennis Balls Photo, however, I tend to part company with you.

I am more impressed with the arguments of those who suggest the possibility that Madeleine's head was shopped on to a photograph of an older girl clutching tennis balls.

I would invite forum members to research the following:


1. Look at this YouTube video: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Its title is: 'Madeleine McCann: "What they Don't Want You to Know", and it has had a remarkable 210,418 views to date.

The maker claims to have used a software program to have extracted the EXIF data. These EXIF data clearly show that the Tennis Balls Photo was created on Saturday 5th May.

This immediately raises the possibility that the Tennis Balls Photo is of another child, taken on 5th May.

If that is correct, and it wasn't taken on Tuesday 1st May nor on Thursday 3rd May, then that immediately raises the possibility that this photo is a clever forgery.

And if it is a forgery i.e. it's a photo taken on 5th May that we are meant to believe was taken on 1st May, then it is also permissible to discuss the possibility that Madeleine's head has been deliberately shopped on to the body of another - probably older - girl.


2. Visit this thread on CMOMM ('Video Analysis of Tennis Court Photo'):

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It contains much useful research, analysis and discussion.

In particular I would mention a still photo analysis of the 'Last Photo' and the 'Tennis Balls Photo' which purports to prove that the arm on the Tennis Balls Photo is significantly longer than Madeleine's arm on the Last Photo. I find it persuasive.

There is also a significant couple of posts by 'Khalgregar', who convincingly argues the case that the Last Photo is a genuine photo taken on another date but that Madeleine's head has been shopped into the Tennis Balls Photo which is of an older girl.

Incidentally this hypothesis may explain the marks (scrapes?) on the girl's knee and the apparent bruising, which I tend to think are nothing out-of-the-ordinary for an active young girl or boy.


3. Finally, read the post below, from 'tigger' back in 2012 quoting a typically astute set of observations by the much-missed 'jd':

QUOTE

jd wrote:

Just a reminder on the Tennis photo:

* Rachael Oldfield is claiming in her rogatory interview the Tennis photo was taken by Jane Tanner on Thursday 3rd at 10.30 am

* But Catriona Baker claims in her rogatory interview that on Thursday 3rd at 10.30 am Maddie is sailing and crying at the launch of the yellow safety boat

* Kate mccann says in her book that she took the photo on Tuesday 1st in the morning. "Standing there listening intently to Cat’s instructions, she looked so gorgeous in her little T-shirt and shorts, pink hat, ankle socks and new holiday sandals that I ran back to our apartment for my camera to record the occasion."

* Jane Tanner says the picture was taken on the Wednesday (But tennis was cancelled due to the rain)

* The creche schedule puts mini tennis as the activity for Monday morning not Tuesday as Kate McCann suggests

* The police say they know this photo was taken at 10.29am on Thursday May 3rd with a racquet during Fiona Payne’s rogatory interview...Quote Payne "Because Jane TANNER had actually taken a picture of Madeleine with the racquet'' (To me it looks like Maddie is holding tennis balls?)

-----------

* This photo is not on the list of photos the PJ took from their cameras (coincidentally on the 9th May 2007)

* On May 9th 2007 back in the UK, Philomena McCann sends this photo as part of the 'e-poster' campaign

-----------

How can they all get it so wrong?

UNQUOTE

[canada12]

Thanks TB.

Offered for your perusal, a closeup of the head and hands area of the tennis ball photo.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Just a few observations, in support of the suggestion that this is Madeleine's head on a different body:

A peculiar roll of skin running around the neck area, which may indicate a join where the head has been pasted onto the body

An odd vertical pink line running down the right cheek, from about mid-ear, to her chin.

An odd strip of white on the left side of her head (right side as we look at the photo), just above the second tennis ball, running up into her hair. What is it?

Additionally, if you're a child running around picking up tennis balls and wearing that hat, the brim is going to flop forward when you bend over to pick up the balls. It's not fixed in place by the clip (which we can see in her hair). We know the hat can appear in the brim-down position as we've seen it on Amelie in The Last Photo. So, my question is, when and how did the brim get pushed back after picking up the tennis balls? Her hands are full.

ETA: Also a dark blue or black line drawn between her sleeve and her arm - looks like it was added after the fact to delineate the edge of the sleeve. Makes it look like a shadow. However - there's no sun and no shadows anywhere else.

[The Wood beyond the Trees]

Thanks TB.

Offered for your perusal, a closeup of the head and hands area of the tennis ball photo.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Just a few observations, in support of the suggestion that this is Madeleine's head on a different body:

A peculiar roll of skin running around the neck area, which may indicate a join where the head has been pasted onto the body

An odd vertical pink line running down the right cheek, from about mid-ear, to her chin.

An odd strip of white on the left side of her head (right side as we look at the photo), just above the second tennis ball, running up into her hair. What is it?

Additionally, if you're a child running around picking up tennis balls and wearing that hat, the brim is going to flop forward when you bend over to pick up the balls. It's not fixed in place by the clip (which we can see in her hair). We know the hat can appear in the brim-down position as we've seen it on Amelie in The Last Photo. So, my question is, when and how did the brim get pushed back after picking up the tennis balls? Her hands are full.

ETA: Also a dark blue or black line drawn between her sleeve and her arm - looks like it was added after the fact to delineate the edge of the sleeve. Makes it look like a shadow. However - there's no sun and no shadows anywhere else.

There appears to be a defined line around her wrist, her hand being very pale compared to her tanned arm above the line.

[ChippyM]

the strange 'roll of skin' and the white line on the other side could simply be strings for holding the hat on. that's what it looks like to me.

[ultimaThule]

This thread [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which was created by PeterMac more than a year ago contains some interesting information to which I would like to add the following which was posted yesterday on sharonl's more recent thead on an unrelated topic [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Tuesday 1/5/7
"On Tuesday 1 May, after my tennis lesson, two maintenance workers came to have a look at our washing machine, which I couldn’t get to operate. Gerry had also managed to break the window shutter mechanism in our bedroom shortly after we’d arrived, in spite of the sign asking guests to be gentle with it. What can I say? It’s the Gerry touch . . . The two men looked at the washing machine first. Once they’d established that the problem was something simple – not quite as simple as me not having pressed the ‘on’ button, but not much more complicated than that – I went to meet Gerry, whose lesson had started at ten-fifteen, leaving them to fix the shutter.
During Gerry’s tennis lesson, Madeleine and Ella came to the adjoining court with their Mini Club for a mini-tennis session. Jane and I stayed to watch them. It chokes me remembering how my heart soared with pride in Madeleine that morning. She was so happy and obviously enjoying herself. Standing there listening intently to Cat’s instructions, she looked so gorgeous in her little T-shirt and shorts, pink hat, ankle socks and new holiday sandals that I ran back to our apartment for my camera to record the occasion. One of my photographs is known around the world now: a smiling Madeleine clutching armfuls of tennis balls. At the end of their session, the children had been asked to run around the court and pick up as many balls as they could. Madeleine had done really well and was very pleased with herself. Gerry loves that picture."

And the activity sheet for Lobsters - Madeleine's group
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />


Mini tennis - wherever it was - was scheduled for MONDAY 30th
OOOPS   ! !

Mini tennis for young children is played on a shortened court with scaled down tennis racquets, mini tennis balls which are made of sponge for indoor courts and felt for outdoors, and mini tennis nets which are portable and can be set up anywhere.

While it appears that childcare in some Mark Warner holiday resorts owes much to the holiday camps of the 1950's where infants/children slumbered in 'chalets' while their parents enjoyed the evening entertainment and uniformed nannies walked or cycled endlessly round the camp listening for the sound of crying, I find it hard to credit that MW or any other reputable organisation in the 21st century would encourage 3-5 year olds to run around on the unforgiving surface of a hard tennis court.

Quite apart from the issue of whether children are suitably equipped for the activity with appropriate clothing, footwear etc - which clearly, if we are to believe that the 'tennis photo' was taken sometime between 28 April-3 May, Madeleine McCann wasn't - any such lack of care and concern for its young charges would be asking for a lawsuit if one of the little darlings tripped causing a wound which needed stitches, or sustained a fracture or worse.  

It seems to me more likely that the MW mini tennis session took place on a taped out mini court with a mini net situated on a grassy area, in which case the 'tennis photo' may have been photoshopped most probably by using shots from the tennis club in Rothley whose courts, as has been remarked on elsewhere, bear a marked resemblance to the one in the photo.

Quite.
And it does in fact say Mini Tennis GRASS TIME

But on the wrong day, obviously !

[plebgate]

Thanks Canada 12 for posting the photograph on the other thread.   Well done.   I agree with those who commented on the child's body.

[Guest]

Please excuse me, but doesn't the expression 'grass time' rather suggest an activity out on a lawn somewhere, instead of some tarmac or clay court as in the tennis picture?

[Guest]

Thanks TB.

Offered for your perusal, a closeup of the head and hands area of the tennis ball photo.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Just a few observations, in support of the suggestion that this is Madeleine's head on a different body:

A peculiar roll of skin running around the neck area, which may indicate a join where the head has been pasted onto the body

An odd vertical pink line running down the right cheek, from about mid-ear, to her chin.

An odd strip of white on the left side of her head (right side as we look at the photo), just above the second tennis ball, running up into her hair. What is it?

Additionally, if you're a child running around picking up tennis balls and wearing that hat, the brim is going to flop forward when you bend over to pick up the balls. It's not fixed in place by the clip (which we can see in her hair). We know the hat can appear in the brim-down position as we've seen it on Amelie in The Last Photo. So, my question is, when and how did the brim get pushed back after picking up the tennis balls? Her hands are full.

ETA: Also a dark blue or black line drawn between her sleeve and her arm - looks like it was added after the fact to delineate the edge of the sleeve. Makes it look like a shadow. However - there's no sun and no shadows anywhere else.

Maybe there's a better quality picture out there that would take 3 seconds to find, one without as many compression articfacts (like lines on the face).

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Maybe there's some pictures out there that would take 3 seconds to find of people with their shoulders hunched and what that does to the neck appearance?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

[Tony Bennett]

Thanks TB.

Offered for your perusal, a closeup of the head and hands area of the tennis ball photo.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Just a few observations, in support of the suggestion that this is Madeleine's head on a different body:

(1) A peculiar roll of skin running around the neck area, which may indicate a join where the head has been pasted onto the body

(2) An odd vertical pink line running down the right cheek, from about mid-ear, to her chin.

(3) An odd strip of white on the left side of her head (right side as we look at the photo), just above the second tennis ball, running up into her hair. What is it?

(4) Additionally, if you're a child running around picking up tennis balls and wearing that hat, the brim is going to flop forward when you bend over to pick up the balls. It's not fixed in place by the clip (which we can see in her hair). We know the hat can appear in the brim-down position as we've seen it on Amelie in The Last Photo. So, my question is, when and how did the brim get pushed back after picking up the tennis balls? Her hands are full.

(5) ETA: Also a dark blue or black line drawn between her sleeve and her arm - looks like it was added after the fact to delineate the edge of the sleeve. Makes it look like a shadow. However - there's no sun and no shadows anywhere else.

@ canada 12

I've looked at your observations. I've taken the liberty of numbering of them.

I'll be honest, I don't find any one of them persuasive. I agree for example with Blue Bag that a fold of the skin in the neck area is common, depending on the position of the head. Some of the other points you've noted could, as he says, be compression artifacts. 

However, it is four lines of evidence that make me wonder if the phtoto is genuine:

1. The extraordinary muddle over who took it and when

2. The girl's body appearing to belong to an older girl than 3 years old   

3. The elaborate attempts, e.g. in Dr Kate McCann's book, 'madeleine', to 'prove' that this was a genuine photo of Madeleine, and

4. The EXIF data which show that the photo was 'created' on 5 May. It is to that issue that I now turn:


@ Blue Bag

You wrote: "The photo may have been cropped and saved as a new image on 5th May using software".

[You also wrote: "Tony, don't get sucked into this. They will drain the life out of you by leading you down blind alleys about nothing. "Arms longer than they should be..." Cameras are strange things that do not record images faithfully. But we've done all that in the last photo thread". ]

REPLY:   I am no expert on photography, digital or otherwise.

Have you actually looked at the purported EXIF data on the video, Blue Bag? (see here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] )

Do the EXIF data not normally shiow both the date created and the date of any amendment?

The EXIF data shown in that video are clear...PHOTO...CREATED...5 MAY 2007 (the Saturday).

If you (or any other expert) can say: "Yes, I can say 100% that this photo was taken earlier in the week (or at some earlier date) and it was simply cropped on 5 May", I will let that particular aspect rest.

But for the moment, I wonder if that photo coulod have been TAKEN on 5 May.

Also - I'm appealing to photo experts here - do the EXIF data tell us which camera this shot was taken on - the Canon Sureshot/Powershot, or the Olympus -  or maybe another one.

I am also interested in the transmission process of how it got from Praia da Luz on 5 May to becoming part of a viral e-mail sent out by  Gerry McCann's sister Mrs Philomena Rickwood three days later.

[canada12]

Hello Blue Bag

Thank you so much for the high-res version of the tennis photo. Could you also find a full-length version? You're a much better researcher than I... in 7 years of searching I've not been able to find such an excellent version of this picture.

[Guest]

@ Blue Bag

Have you actually looked at the purported EXIF data on the video, Blue Bag? (see here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] )

Do the EXIF data not normally shiow both the date created and the date of any amendment?

The EXIF data shown in that video are clear...PHOTO...CREATED...5 MAY 2007 (the Saturday).

It's not EXIF data Tony.

This is a screen shot from the video.

That is not EXIF data.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

It's from something created on the 5th of May, by "AP" associated press - possibly a scan of the handout.

Someone is yanking chains.

They will suck the life out of discussions by getting people going round in circles over nothing.

Meanwhile... the dogs.

It's simple.

[canada12]

Blue Bag - quick question....do you work for The Mirror? I've done an image search online using the photo name you supplied and it doesn't come up anywhere. However I note that the link back to this photo goes immediately to an incoming server for The Mirror.

Also please note the very distinctive burn / scar on the child's wrist. If this image is genuine, this is indeed very revealing. Thank you Blue Bag. This photo ranks up there with Gestalt's Last Photo.

[Guest]

Blue Bag - quick question....do you work for The Mirror?

No.
 

I've done an image search online using the photo name you supplied and it doesn't come up anywhere. However I note that the link back to this photo goes immediately to an incoming server for The Mirror.

I use google images. It;s very simple to use.

Also please note the very distinctive burn / scar on the child's wrist. If this image is genuine, this is indeed very revealing. Thank you Blue Bag. This photo ranks up there with Gestalt's Last Photo.

Whatever.

[canada12]

Blue Bag - quick question....do you work for The Mirror?

No.
 

I've done an image search online using the photo name you supplied and it doesn't come up anywhere. However I note that the link back to this photo goes immediately to an incoming server for The Mirror.

I use google images. It;s very simple to use.

Also please note the very distinctive burn / scar on the child's wrist. If this image is genuine, this is indeed very revealing. Thank you Blue Bag. This photo ranks up there with Gestalt's Last Photo.

Whatever.

I used Google images too! I bow to your superior knowledge of search strings! Can you provide me with the search string you used in order to locate this excellent photo?

Many thanks.

[joyce1938]

Looking closely at neck line and sleeve line ,it could be that a vest or another t shirt could have been underneath top one , would make her body look more bulky? please look carefully at both . joyce1938

[canada12]

Blue Bag - quick question....do you work for The Mirror?

No.
 

I've done an image search online using the photo name you supplied and it doesn't come up anywhere. However I note that the link back to this photo goes immediately to an incoming server for The Mirror.

I use google images. It;s very simple to use.

Also please note the very distinctive burn / scar on the child's wrist. If this image is genuine, this is indeed very revealing. Thank you Blue Bag. This photo ranks up there with Gestalt's Last Photo.

Whatever.

Whatever?
You've single-handedly shown us a very nasty burn mark on Madeleine's wrist which has not previously been distinguishable?
I wouldn't be dismissive of this. It's such a distinctive mark, one would have thought the McCanns would have mentioned it when issuing their initial description of their child on the night she went missing.

[Guest]

Whatever?
You've single-handedly shown us a very nasty burn mark on Madeleine's wrist which has not previously been distinguishable?

"A very nasty burn mark".

I'm tired of this.

Figure it out yourself.

[Grim]

This photo courtesy of Pamalams site , shows what appears to be some kind of glove covering Madeleine's hand [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

[Woofer]

The lengths KM went to in the book to OVER-describe exactly what MBM had on, including every item of clothing, immediately raises suspicion - one thinks `why would you want to do that?`.  IMO that body is another child.  It is Amelie`s hat and Amelie`s shorts.  Goodness knows where the while sandals came from.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Besides which, it`s darned weird that there are no shadows which indicates an overcast day - so why the need for a sun hat?

[canada12]

Whatever?
You've single-handedly shown us a very nasty burn mark on Madeleine's wrist which has not previously been distinguishable?

"A very nasty burn mark".

I'm tired of this.

Figure it out yourself.

Thanks Blue Bag, I have.
It's a burn mark / bruise.
It either exists, or it doesn't.
If this is not a photoshopped picture, then it is there in reality.
If it is not there in reality, then how did it get there?
I don't believe it's an artifact.

[j.rob]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Why is she holding tennis balls that are used for adult tennis? Mini tennis uses different balls?

I agree that the hat front would flop down.

Her torso looks much too large. Far too wide. She was quite a slim child if other pics are to go by. The girth as shown here is out of all proportion to the height. 

And agree about the hunched back. This simply does not look like the torso of an average-weight nearly four year old. Not at all.

What is the band of white - diamond shaped - between her left cheek and the tennis ball furthest away from her? There is a distinctive white 'band' of something. But given her body position and posture it wouldn't make sense for it to be her left shoulder?

A most peculiar photo, imo.

I think it's more 'games' from The Joker and his entourage.

[tiny]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Why is she holding tennis balls that are used for adult tennis? Mini tennis uses different balls?

I agree that the hat front would flop down.

Her torso looks much too large. Far too wide. She was quite a slim child if other pics are to go by. The girth as shown here is out of all proportion to the height. 

And agree about the hunched back. This simply does not look like the torso of an average-weight nearly four year old. Not at all.

What is the band of white - diamond shaped - between her left cheek and the tennis ball furthest away from her? There is a distinctive white 'band' of something. But given her body position and posture it wouldn't make sense for it to be her left shoulder?

A most peculiar photo, imo.

I think it's more 'games' from The Joker and his entourage.

im sure I read some where that there was another ball in that place you indicated,wether true or not I don't know

[Guest]

Apart from the strange looking body that right arm and hand looks like it belongs to an adult to me. Toddlers arms are not defined like that and a four year old does not have defined knuckles like that - they are more podgy even when gripping something.

All in my own opinion, nothing stated as fact

[Guest]

Pink-ish nailpolish on a three-year old?

[ultimaThule]

Imported from the disrupted thread at jack dexter's request:

This photo was apparently taken at some point close to the PDL holiday...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

And here is the Tennis Balls photo:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I ou'll forgive me for suggestingan't possibly be the same child, based on the body shape alone. And even allowing for hunched shoulders.

The first picture the blonde hair has no dark roots at all  (look at the parting on top of the head)  whereas the second picture seems to show a lot of darker hair at the roots imo.  What could explain this?

Something about the slide picture looks very wrong to me. It is like one of those photos where when you see something you can not not see it. It might be just me so I won't give it away.

Left hand is wrong way round. Impossible to hold onto rail/bar with fingers to the front and yet thumb is at bottom. Thumb should be  pointing up. Hope I explained that properly

For the benefit of any media people reading this forum who are looking for ammunition to use against "conspiracy theorists"...

There are many ordinary people here who are not buying the "everything is photoshopped" nonsense.

"Left hand is wrong way round."


For goodness sake stop this crap.

Ok This might be a trick my brain is playing but i see a triangle between the two rails underneath her chin. It is the same colour as the orange bit but looks attached to the side. Only others things that do not look right are her hair is longer on one side but braided on the shorter side so that may account for it. Also her hair hangs over the triangle but the front of her t shirt is behind it. Also would her hair not fall away from her face at that angle.