Re: Further Analysis of the Last Photo

by Woofer 06.08.14 17:04

PeterMac wrote:
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My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

So, if there`s ever an Inquiry into the failings of Operation Grange, no one can say they weren`t informed. (Unless of course they say all their files got lost !! which is the usual excuse these days).

by Research_Reader 06.08.14 18:02

PeterMac wrote:
My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

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This software sounds fascinating, and potentially very useful.

by **Nina** 06.08.14 18:04

Research_Reader wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

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This software sounds fascinating, and potentially very useful.

Pardon my ignorance but what happens once it is logged in?

by Research_Reader 06.08.14 18:06

Nina wrote:
Research_Reader wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

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This software sounds fascinating, and potentially very useful.

Pardon my ignorance but what happens once it is logged in?

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I believe the system cross-correlates lots of various bits of evidence, witness statements, and relationship-connections between witnesses then flags up areas of inconsistency or possible lies.

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I love the way they obviously reverse-fit the name of the system to create the acronym!

by Hicks 06.08.14 18:09

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Is this the same thing?

by tungsten tel 06.08.14 18:42

When I blow up the last photo I can vaguely see a face under the chair . It reminds me of GM for some reason (smithman efit) . Just wondered if its a photoshop error when they changed the original .

by aiyoyo 06.08.14 18:51

Nina wrote:
Research_Reader wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
This software sounds fascinating, and potentially very useful.

Pardon my ignorance but what happens once it is logged in?[/quote

HOLMES = Home Office Large Major Enquiry System

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by Guest 06.08.14 19:54

tungsten tel wrote:When I blow up the last photo I can vaguely see a face under the chair . It reminds me of GM for some reason (smithman efit) . Just wondered if its a photoshop error when they changed the original .

You mean this?

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Not as odd as this.

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by Hicks 06.08.14 21:58

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
tungsten tel wrote:When I blow up the last photo I can vaguely see a face under the chair . It reminds me of GM for some reason (smithman efit) . Just wondered if its a photoshop error when they changed the original .

You mean this?

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Not as odd as this.

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I don't want to start any silliness regarding the photos......but...if you magnify the top photo ...well... it looks demonic. Think it's time to lie down!

by Guest 06.08.14 22:33

Hicks wrote:
I don't want to start any silliness regarding the photos......but...if you magnify the top photo ...well... it looks demonic. Think it's time to lie down!

Sorry Hicks. If it's any consolation, I scared myself with that! I just had a good look at some photos of mine taken with a very similar camera model and I'm now more convinced than ever that there's something very, very wrong with this photo.

by inspirespirit 07.08.14 6:54

aiyoyo wrote:
Nina wrote:
Research_Reader wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
My guess is that it will then be logged into the HOLMES II system.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
This software sounds fascinating, and potentially very useful.

Pardon my ignorance but what happens once it is logged in?[/quote

HOLMES = Home Office Large Major Enquiry System

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Wow ! they have software that compares anomalies in statements. Surprised it didn't blow up when they input the Tapas lot's statements. No excuse for O.G then. Any copper worth his salt would know something dodgy has gone on.

by **PeterMac** 07.08.14 9:33

HOLMES II, WATSON (now sadly renamed Xanalys Link), Coplink, ANACAPA and several other computer programmes have been developed for tracking evidence, people and exhibits through an enquiry

See for example
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and Coplink
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Watson
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All very powerful, and all would immediately flag up the absurd contradictions in the Tapas statements, not to mention the more obvious changes of story by the McCanns themselves.

by Carrry On Doctor 07.08.14 9:46

Peter

It is fair to say that OG, and the 35 strong team, and the CPS who were immediately brought in by AR following him taking charge of the case, with the aid of fairly sophisticated statement and timeline analysis software, view the version of events presented on 3rd like a Swiss cheese? Would you agree ?

In light of the above, do you, as person better placed than most of us, think that this case will be (or can be) whitewashed ?

The pending retirement of AR concerns me. Do you think this is significant ?

Thanks

by aiyoyo 07.08.14 10:58

Super expensive software tool to have but how useful to the Police force?

How much time is spent mastering the academic of software to work for your benefit than field work?

by Carrry On Doctor 07.08.14 11:18

Peter

In hindsight, I may be asking questions you would rather not give an opinion on. Apologies.

Any thoughts on the matter would be welcome though.

by canada12 07.08.14 19:54

Carrry On Doctor wrote:Peter

In hindsight, I may be asking questions you would rather not give an opinion on. Apologies.

Any thoughts on the matter would be welcome though.

Just say "No comment," PeterMac, and we'll know the answer, LOL big grin

by tungsten tel 07.08.14 21:00

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
tungsten tel wrote:When I blow up the last photo I can vaguely see a face under the chair . It reminds me of GM for some reason (smithman efit) . Just wondered if its a photoshop error when they changed the original .

You mean this?

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Not as odd as this.

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by NickE 08.08.14 22:12

Witness statement Amy Tierney:

"When on the night of 3rd May, at about 24.00, she was at her desk at the Tapas bar, inside the resort, when at a certain time, one of the friends of the McCann couple, Russell, asked for a USB memory stick reader, in order to print photographs of Madeleine. Immediately the deponent replied that she did not have an USB reader, but that she had a printer with this hardware, which could read from memory sticks.

She went to her room and returned to the Tapas with the printer where she printed out 20 to 30 photographs of the girl, using her own paper, in 10x15 format mentioned previously. The memory stick containing the photos belonged to the McCann couple, and came from their camera".

Did PJ had access to all 20-30 photographs?

by TheTruthWillOut 08.08.14 22:23

I don't think that is 20-30 photographs NickE, but 20-30 copies of a single image of Madeleine? Could be wrong, but I sadly doubt 20-30 photos of Madeleine were taken on that holiday with how little time she spent with her parents:(

by Guest 08.08.14 22:37

That's what I think, TTWO.

These are all the holiday photos.

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There are only five, plus the grainy airport video.

by canada12 08.08.14 22:52

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:That's what I think, TTWO.

These are all the holiday photos.

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There are only five, plus the grainy airport video.

Is the photograph that Amy printed out, the one which was distributed on the initial posters, this one?

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or was it this one?

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Both were used, IIRC, in the initial posters that went up around PDL, and I believe were likely the ones that were distributed around the town in the first instance. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

What I'm wondering is, if the police are able to tell which camera these photos came from? According to PeterMac, The Last Photo came from the camera which was not confiscated by the police for some reason. Did the above two photos also come from the camera which was not confiscated by the police? Or did they come from the camera which was taken by the police and examined?

Or did they come from someone else's camera entirely - ie, NOT the McCanns' cameras at all.

by **PeterMac** 09.08.14 8:03

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />

The pixel aspect ratio shown indicates that this was not taken on the Canon, but may have been on the Olympus

by canada12 09.08.14 9:02

PeterMac wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />

The pixel aspect ratio shown indicates that this was not taken on the Canon, but may have been on the Olympus

So, Olympus handed in, Canon not handed in, correct?

If this was taken on the Olympus, why is it not in the police files? Or was it just not shown in the police files that we can see on Pamalam's site? Or was it on a separate memory stick that was never handed over to the police at all?

Just wondering.

by aiyoyo 09.08.14 9:11

Date the photo is created for AFP release is shown.

Date photo is taken is unknown.
Was it taken at holiday or an old photo?

by canada12 09.08.14 9:25

aiyoyo wrote:Date the photo is created for AFP release is shown.

Date photo is taken is unknown.
Was it taken at holiday or an old photo?

If it was taken on holiday and on the McCanns Olympus then it should have been handed in to the PJ.
If it was taken on holiday and taken on the McCanns Olympus and it was not handed in to the PJ, then was it on a different memory card than the one that was in the camera that was handed to the PJ?
if it was not taken on holiday and it was on the McCanns Olympus (ie it was taken before the holiday) and it was not handed in to the PJ, then it must have been on a different memory card than the one in the camera that was handed to the PJ. Does that make sense?

I guess what I'm working out is whether the McCanns had more than one memory card with them for the Olympus, and whether or not they handed all the memory cards in to the PJ. Or did they just hand in the Olympus with a next to useless memory card in it?

Or was that photo of Madeleine not on the McCanns' Olympus at all - but on someone else''s memory stick?

ETA it HAD to have been a photo taken earlier than the holiday, because the little girl we've been told is Madeleine in the other photos from the holiday has much longer hair.

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as opposed to:

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by **PeterMac** 09.08.14 10:01

Hair grows at half an inch a month, so someone can work out when that upper photo was taken.
The Olympus and TWO memory sticks were sent to Hampshire (- don't ask ! -) for analysis arriving on 8th and being examined on 9th
The Canon was firmly
on the dining table during the early hours of 4th
in St Katherine's possession on 10th

Stil don't know where the other photo which was released to the British press and front cover of the book was located.

by aiyoyo 09.08.14 11:15

Apart from the tennis photo and pool photo mentioned as taken on holiday, no mention was ever made of when (as in how long ago) the rest of the earlier released photos were taken.
It's fairly obvious the initial released photos were definitely not from the holiday batch.

It's apparent they'd recklessly produced random old photos without concerns for them not being of real time for useful purpose. When real time image/s seemed of no real concern to them in initial release why was it suddenly important for them to highlight discrepancy in the last photo?

Incorrect time on the canon setting will affect all images captured on that camera.
If the tennis photo was also taken from the Cannon then it would be very odd that time discrepancy was fussed over the family photo (pool photo) and not the solo one (tennis photo).

by **PeterMac** 09.08.14 11:37

The Last Photo was released - we assume by Mitchell - to the French press agency AFP
It is bottom right on this page, with all the pixel date shown, confirming that it was the Canon
The extensive Metadata was shown on another web page.

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by Doug D 09.08.14 18:25

Camera (+video camera) & memory cards sent to Hampshire:

Snippets from statement of: Stuart William Martin dated 9^th May 2007

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2. On 8th May at 21.00 hours, the following was delivered to my home address by PC 178 Barham, requesting they be examined to establish if they contained pictures and video footage of a hotel complex in Praia da Luz.

ID ref Description NALF/1 Video tape from Sony Handicam Video Camera Re Praia da Luz holiday 28/4/07-5/5/07

NALF/2 64 MB camera memory card from Olympus C50 camera Re Praia da Luz holiday 28/4/07-5/5/07

NALF/3 32 MB camera memory card from Olympus C50 camera Re Praia da Luz holiday 28/4/07-5/5/07

3. Video tape from Sony Handicam Video Camera Re Praia da Luz holiday 28/4/07-5/5/07 (NALF 1)

On 9th May 2007 at 08.30 I delivered this video camera in the sealed bag number CD 48113 to the imaging unit at Hampshire Police Support headquarters, Netley for examination. I conducted no examination of this bag and contents.

11. I examined the data from the two cards and located 43 pictures in the live area of the two cards.

12. I produced these pictures as identification references SWM/3019/01 to SWM/3019/43

18. Using my forensic software I was able to locate 73 pictures files in the unallocated clusters which had been deleted and were no longer accessible to the camera user.

21. Unallocated clusters

22. Unallocated clusters are clusters on a drive that are not currently assigned to a file. Also called free space. A file may either occupy one or more clusters. The clusters that a file occupies are not necessarily contiguous. Some of these clusters may still contain data from files that have been deleted but not yet overwritten by other files.

23. When the data is extracted from the unallocated clusters there are not imes and dates or file names attributed to the data. My forensic software therefore saved the data in file format and named the files according to the location of the data within the unallocated clusters.

So potentially there were 116 photos available from this camera, plus the video. I don’t think we are able to attribute which photos from the collection available on the PJ files came from this camera, but the PJ & SY would have been able to, sort them into time order and also look at ‘proper’ (not greyed-out) photos.