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Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

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Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 4:55

Can ANYONE explain why the DISCREPANCIES and CONTRADICTIONS (mostly based on comparing statements) started on TUESDAY MORNING?

Was it to HIDE something?

Could it be because something had happened to Maddie BEFORE Tuesday morning and they were trying to cover the TRUTH up?



Here is a compilation of some of my research to be able to come to this likely conclusion:

Title: DISCREPANCY LIST & ALL RESEARCH LINKS (from witness statements)
http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/WELCOME-to-HDH-Controversy-Info/DISCREPANCY-LIST-ALL-RESEARCH-LINKS-from-witness-statements-1-2309815.html







Discrepancy Questions..
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Matt-Meets-the-Paynes-1-743842.html
1 Why did the Paynes and Matthew Oldfield claim to have passed each other in very different places on the way to the tapas and Dianne Webster claimed to have not seen him until her Rogatory when she remembered because Dave and Fiona had reminded her.

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Why-did-JT-ROB-RMO-FP-GM-KM-contradict-each-other-1-833711.html
Why did Rachael claim the last time she saw Madeleine was at mini tennis on Thursday. Madeleine's group played on Tuesday. Is Tuesday the last time she saw her?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Why-did-JT-ROB-RMO-FP-GM-KM-contradict-each-other-1-833711.html
3 Why did Rachael describe the mini tennis as played on Court 1, when the records show it was Court 2. (the police seemed to find it important by questioning her)

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/High-Tea-Thursday-May-3rd-1-827328.html
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Curiosities-regarding-Catrion-Baker-1-836815.html
4 Why did Catriona claim that Gerry wasn't at high tea on May 3rd and that she thought he was at tennis, when both Kate and Gerry claim he was there.

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/High-Tea-Thursday-May-3rd-1-827328.html
5 Why did Gerry claim to have entered the front door and opened the patio doors for Kate who was carrying Madeleine back from high tea on May 3rd. Kate says they all went in through the front doors.

Why did they give different accounts of Madeleine asking about why they didn't come to her. (She asked her father, she asked Kate, it was the twins crying, it was her crying etc)
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Why-did-JT-ROB-RMO-FP-GM-KM-contradict-each-other-1-833711.html
Why did Gerry claim that he picked Madeleine up from the creche on Thursday lunch (he remembered taking the short cut) when Kate and Fiona claim they walked together. Kate says she went to the apartment first, Fiona said they left from the pool area.

Why did the police compile the Diagram of Events according to Catriona telling them that she only went to the beach twice, on Tuesday and Wednesday afternoon, not mentioning the mini sail.
9 Why did they not release Thursday diagram or twins creche record for Thursday morning?
10 Why, after the family's trip to the beach Tuesday lunchtime (for 5 ice creams) did they drop Madleine off at the creche in time for her to go on another trip (to the beach?) for ice cream trip
11 Why did Catriona claim they went to the beach 15.30 to 16.30 on Tuesday and Wednesday and did not mention the ice cream trip, 2.30pm-3.30pm Tuesday according to the Activity sheet.
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/QUIZ-NIGHT-1-836731.html
12 Why did Kate receive a 'flurry' of phone calls (between 10.16pm and 10.27pm) in the 15 minutes prior to Mrs Fenn hearing the crying Was she at the tapas as she claims they did not arrive back until 11.00pm?

13 Why did Kate make (unusual) very early morning calls to her friend (Amanda, her husband is a pathologist) on Wednesday morning?
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/QUIZ-NIGHT-1-836731.html
14 Why did Najoua the quiz mistress claim that no-one (including Gerry) left the table during the time she was there (9.00pm-9.50pm?) and she does not recall seeing Kate or David Payne at the table. Just an empty place setting.

15 Why did Catriona claim to have seem Jane and David at the beach when she was at the mini sail. Why would she have known David?
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Why-did-JT-ROB-RMO-FP-GM-KM-contradict-each-other-1-833711.html
16 Where are the pictures of Ella taken at the mini sail and why (with only a few children) was Madeleine not in the picture.

17 Did Catriona take the children to the mini sail alone? Why is there no statement from the other nannies to say they went?
18 Why did the police not interview Alice Stanley and Chris Unsworth, the mini sail instructors?
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Who-Saw-Madeleine-Credibility-Statement-Highlights-1-780252.html
19 Why is there not one credible sighting of Madeleine after Sunday lunchtime when she was seen by the cleaner's daughter leaving the apartment for lunch at the Paynes?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/Comparison-Daytime-Timetable-Creche-Times-updtd-April-1-816825.html
20 Why did Kate claim the shutters were broken on Sunday and the maintenance fixed them on Monday when records shows it was Tuesday. Why did they need to show her how to use the washing machine?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/Comparison-Daytime-Timetable-Creche-Times-updtd-April-1-816825.html
21 Why did the cleaner claim there was a cot in the parents bedroom on Wednesday morning and both Gerry and Kate denied it was there?

22 Why did Madeleine's bed not show signs of being used, when it was made up by the cleaner on Wednesday morning and should have been slept in Wednesday night as well as Thursday evening? (the other bed was messy)
23 Why did the pictures from the apartment show a (relatively) normal amount of clothes left around when the cleaners daughter said that her mother had mentioned to her about the mess of their apartment (indicating something abnormal).
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/Comparison-Daytime-Timetable-Creche-Times-updtd-April-1-816825.html
24 Why did Matthew Oldfield claim to have been sick because of what he had eaten on the plane, and yet suggested that Rachael's sickness on Wednesday may have been the same as his.

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/T9-EARLY-STATEMENTS-ComparisonTables-1-816802.html
25 Why is there very little information regarding the week from David Payne's statements?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/May-3rd-6-00-8-00pm-1-816781.html
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/TENNIS-Table-THURSDAY-with-T9-Loctions-1-816817.html
26 Why did the police question Fiona about the time after the Paraiso vist and then push her to admit that she didn't know what David was doing between 6.00pm and 7.00pm?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/May-3rd-6-00-8-00pm-1-816781.html
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/TENNIS-Table-THURSDAY-with-T9-Loctions-1-816817.html
27 Why did David claim to have arrived back at the apartment approx 8.00pm when Fiona claims he was there at 7.10 (while he was 'supposedly' playing tennis at the Mens Social')

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/May-3rd-6-00-8-00pm-1-816781.html
http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/TENNIS-Table-THURSDAY-with-T9-Loctions-1-816817.html
28 Why did Kate claim that David didn't enter the apartment when David claims to have entered and described the children at length?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/May-3rd-6-00-8-00pm-1-816781.html
29 Why did Rachael claim that Ella may have been given a bath at their apartment on Thursday evening?

http://madeleinemccann.aimoo.com/ALL-TIMETABLES/Comparison-Daytime-Timetable-Creche-Times-updtd-April-1-816825.html
30 Why was there a lot of 'avoidance of specifics' and 'days rolled over' in the statements?

There is more, but thats all for now...
Food for thought? (especially considering most of it is earlier than 5.30pm May 3rd)


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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 4:55

[size=32][size=42]Non committal memory

[size=31]Sunday/Monday/Tuesday/ Wednesday confusion
[/size]
[/size]* When the blinds were broken and fixed- Kate says Sunday and fixed Monday - Documents show fixed on Tuesday

* ROB not at Tapas Bar because sick child - Monday or Tuesday .- JT cannot remember ROB at Tapas - Monday or Tuesday ------ Easy to remember the quiz and the quiz mistress, should not have created confusion with a little thought

* When Rachael was at the tapas - Tuesday/Wednesday

* When JT saw Madeleine playing tennis (thoughts were Thursday, then changed to Wednesday but Madeleine's portion of the creche played on Tuesday)

* McCanns at Paynes for lunch - FP Sunday or Monday or Tuesday (cleaner confirmed Sunday)

* Beach visits - Monday /Tuesday Fiona and others (she can't remember if K&G also) at beach in the evening - Monday or Tuesday

* MO running with Kate - Monday or Tuesday ------ According to Kate's diary it was Wednesday and it was the day that Rachael was sick (Wednesday)

* Kayaks Monday or Tuesday

* Maddie's crying incident,Monday/Tuesday or Wednesday - Gerry clams: Monday or Tuesday MADELEINE had slept for some time in his bedroom, with KATE, as she had told him that one or both twins were crying, making much noise.


[size=23]Pre-emptive comments

[/size]* Removing the hair bead

* Washing the tea stain

* Buying New Zealand wine

* Madeleine asking where they were on Thursday morning (Both Gerry and Kate quoted Madeleine had said twins were crying in one statement and Madeleine and Sean in another and in one statement Gerry states she asked where HE was)

* Gerry clams: Monday or Tuesday MADELEINE had slept for some time in his bedroom, with KATE, as she had told him that one or both twins were crying, making much noise. (Keep in mind this is from his statement from May 10th...Mrs Fenn did not tell them about the crying....so they were maybe pre-empting any possible witness statements, maybe attempting to confuse which day, not realising Mrs Fenns statement.)


[size=31]Discrepancies

[/size]* ROB using key to enter MO's apartment Sunday night...MO was supposedly sick and in the apartments at the time....

* The cleaner states that she saw a cot in the McCann's bedroom Wednesday morning and yet Kate AND Gerry deny it...WHY?

* Everyone states that K&G did not go to the Millenium for breakfast after Sunday and yet, not only does Dianne Webster remember POSSIBLY seeing them, in Kates diary she wrote this... WEDNESDAY -→ Millennium K and G - meet F, D and D
* The window in Kate’s room was closed and she admits they used the blinds, because Gerry broke them and they were repaired on the Monday; the incident occurred on Sunday.(documents show it was Tuesday)
She consciously tried to make it seem that it was the Sunday when it was actually Monday...a day they have trouble being truthful about?
Monday 30.04.2007

*? washing machine / blinds

* WHY did Kate drop Madeleine off at the creche on Monday at 3.15pm...Someone? dropped the twins off at 3.25 and pick Madeleine up 5 minutes later at 3.30pm (no notation of the twins being picked up that afternoon) and yet NO reference to what they did that afternoon? Surely that day would have stood out and be worthy of a mention if Madeleine was with them all afternoon?

* Was it a coincidence that Kate had a flurry of phone activity just PRIOR to the time Mrs Fenn heard the crying. Was she (and the phone) at the tapas restaurant or more than likely in the apartment?

* When asked, he says that on one night, he cannot say which, Madeleine slept in his room and in his bed. He thinks it might have been shortly after their arrival at the apartment. Madeleine came to his room saying that Amelie was crying and she couldn’t sleep. He thinks that he didn’t hear the crying before, and was alerted to this by Madeleine. He does not know if it was him or his wife that comforted Amelie. That night Madeleine slept in his bed.

* 11min 42 sec phone call on May 4th made to an ex-directory landline in Leicester. That number belongs to Dr Paul Whitaker, a pathologist at University Hospitals of Leicester NHS Trust. Same address as Amanda Coxon

* Madeleine's bed looks barely used. Cleaner made beds Wednesday morning so she SHOULD have slept in it on Wednesday night

* MO was 'supposedly' going to Paynes to 'chivy' them up but Dianne did NOT see him in her first statement but 'remembered' in the Rogatory that David and Fiona had reminded her. They ALL describe a different place they passed each other.

* Kate states DP visit as short and he didn't enter. DP says he entered through the patio doors and spent some time (with a long diatribe describing the children)

* FP finally admitted to the police that she could not confirm DP's whereabouts between 6.00pm and 7.00pm at the men's social.

* FP states DP returned to the apartment at 7.10pm but DP says he was playing tennis until nearly 8.00pm

* FP states they were back by 7pm but Rachael says differently)
[/size]
Quote:
RACHAEL
we headed back, yeah probably about half seven, half seven, twenty to eight, which was kind of later than we would normally”.
1578 “Who’s we”?
Reply “Erm well G***e and I went back to our apartment and Jane went back with E**a and E**e to theirs and Diane and Fi and Lilly and Scarlet went up to theirs, erm”.
1578 “Leaving the men to continue”?
Reply “Yeah continue their tennis


.

[size=31]Observed in statements

[/size]* Difficult to find (credible) confirmation of Kate's whereabouts, particularly on Thursday afternoon. Police question her activities for the lost 7 hours. Tennis schedules do not show her name as participating

* Possibility/probability that the children were watched by a designated T9 (as suggested by statements) but to facilitate the opportunity of an abductor, and to avoid one person being 'responsible' when Madeleine was 'supposedly' abducted they reverted to quoting the 'checking system' to keep it 'generic' with no one person targeted.

* Tuesday night the quiz mistress did not remember seeing Kate at the tapas. On Wednesday night Stephen Carpenter (or Jez..need to confirm) said that Gerry arrived with Russell (Kate not there?)

* On Thursday Jez noted that two of the usual females weren't there (previous statements for earlier in the week he recognised them from the group on the plane JT and RMO?)

* I find there is an extraordinary amount of people who DIDN'T see her.

It was an absolute that she was seen dancing with her dad at Paraiso, only to be discovered that the pictures proved they were mistaken.

Cecilia at the Millenium, but non specific and easily could have been mistaken...Tennis on Tuesday morning....even there she may have been mistaken for another child...A few other 'vague' sightings of her.

Apart from the creche where are the witness statement of people that DID see her?

The cleaner on Sunday is becoming the last credible sighting I can find. I would welcome any suggestions that I have forgotten (I will search the statements for them).

The high tea sighting at 5.30pm (some say 6.00pm) is the last 'sighting' though Pennington/Cat Nanny statements are questionable.

If Madeleine died earlier it would have given them time to go through the grief and get everything in place and arranged.

There was already someone in place to deal with the situation.....

- "calm, decisive, confident."
- "if he’s got a project, he’s sort of very focussed and sort of fairly, fairly driven"
- "his way of coping is to do, to, to feel like he’s doing something in a positive way"
- " he’s more able to, to sort of see through all that and just think, hang on what’s right for, what’s right, what’s going to get us further forward here,"
- "he’s a very pragmatic person, in an emergency he’s the person you’d want to call on because he thinks straight and he thinks clearly"

Quotes from the T9 who may have known how he dealt with the situation.


* They shared the bathing of the children..maybe they DID stay in each others apartment?

Quote:
RACHAEL-"we went back to the apartments, erm I think err, we all headed off at the same time I think and erm, can’t remember whether that night E**a and, E**a might have had a bath in our apartment with G***e, not sure
"




[size=31]There are questions about who was and wasn't at the table on May 3rd.

[/size]* JT may have not 'arrived' until after the 'apparent' bundleman sighting

* Once she returned it was very short time before ROB left which was needed to complete the tasks of looking after the youngest child who was ALSO ill on Tuesday night (I have wondered whether he described E**e's sickness of Tuesday as happening on Thursday to account for his time away from the table..maybe trying to 'jemmy' the shutter in preparation?)

* Dianne has trouble remembering if Gerry was at the table when she arrived

* MO 'supposedly' met the Paynes on their way down (all describing different locations of seeing him) and upon his return, after telling Gerry he had listened at their apartment, Gerry left immediately. WHY?

* Remember that ROB admits to 'creating' the timeline for that night so everyone would have their times imprinted in their statements to 'match'. It is not necessarily what REALLY happened as we know there was no abduction so the 'created timeline' was to distract from what was REALLY happening.
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 4:59

For all clickable links for the following tables, please refer to this page:


Title: DISCREPANCY LIST & ALL RESEARCH LINKS (from witness statements)

http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/WELCOME-to-HDH-Controversy-Info/DISCREPANCY-LIST-ALL-RESEARCH-LINKS-from-witness-statements-1-2309815.html










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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:13






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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:17





Now I remember what I did before I started on the videos...over 150 Timelines/Timetables!

Here are a few for Thursday

Title: Tennis Timetable (and more) from Statements
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Tennis-Timetable-Statements/Tennis-Timetable-1-929037.html

Title: Gerry & Kate THURSDAY May 3rd Timetable
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/All-Timetables/Gerry-Kate-THURSDAY-May-3rd-Timetable-1-816810.html

Title: Thursday MAY 3rd (Updated Feb 2010)
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Comparison-Timetables/Thursday-MAY-3rd-d-Feb-2010-1-743325.html

Title: May 3rd Thursday - Hourly Timeline Comparison

http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Comparison-Timetables/May-3rd-Thursday-Hourly-Timeline-Comparison-1-503751.html

-----------------------------------------------------


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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:24









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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:26

Many people ask me how I arrived at my 'theory' about what happened.

Initially I knew nothing...and was asked by a non related forum what my thoughts were...

At that point i couldn't answer because I didn't have the knowledge to make an informed opinion, so I joined some of the forums discussing the case.
The rest is history...

Like most others, I was intrigued with the discrepancies and started checking some of the timelines etc.

At that point the files had not been released, but SOL newspaper gave us an idea of what may have happened (later confirmed by the files)

I opened a forum to file everything as I found myself repeating myself so often, so for times sake it was easier to have the details filed and easily accesible to add to posts.

Remembering Madeleine Forum

http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann

In August of 2008 the files were released.

There was a major effort to have then translated, and one of the first set of translations was that of the Ocean Club staff..

I was confused with names and nicknames so decided to do a 'Staff Rota' so I could make it easy to see who was working that night...


Category: Staff Rota and Statements
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Staff-Rota-and-Statements-1-65276


I took the relevant parts of the statements and started highlighting them for the portions that were applicable....and that when I started to see discrepancies...or oddities that made me curious.


Title: Discrepancy List
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/DIscrepancies-by-Topic/DISCREPANCY-LIST-1-829580.html


I then took the groups statements and separated all the comments into a timetable so I could compare what each member said regarding a particular time (15 min intervals). Thats when I saw MANY DISCREPANCIES. (not memory related)  Approx 200 in total but not included in this list


Title: All Timetables
    http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/All-Timetables-1-79313

It also gave me an 'overview' of the activities of that week.

With so many discrepancies happening on Thursday I felt that something had happened on Wednesday and the Thursday was 'covering up the truth' day.

By this time I had seen all the other files and statements and could not find anything to dispute something happening on Wednesday.

Further down the road I was discussing with someone about when Madeleine was last seen.


Title: Nanny Info & Statements Highlighted
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Creche-Records-Timeline/Nanny-Info-Statements-Highlighted-1-930240.html


Title: Nannies that saw Madeleine...
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Creche-Records-Timeline/Nannies-that-saw-Madeleine-1-930559.html




I started to look at the statements of those claiming to have seen her.  The Tapas Cook said she saw her every day going into the creche.  Madeleine did not attend that creche.  She went to the creche above reception about 10 mins away so she may have been mistaken.

I then decided to do a thorough compilation of all the people that claimed to have seen Madeleine throughout the holiday

Title: Who Saw Madeleine - Credibility and Statements
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/DIscrepancies-by-Topic/Who-Saw-Madeleine-Credibility-Statement-Highlights-1-780252.html

At that point I saw that the tennis coach mentioned  the mini tennis on Tuesday morning.

I then decided nothing could have happened to her prior to Tuesday UNTIL I scrutinised the statement and saw that she did not specifically say she saw her...Just a reference to Madeleine's group playing mini tennis.

None of the statements were PROOF she was not there but none of them were proof that she WAS there.

This took me back to Sunday with the cleaner's daughter's statement that said she saw Madeleine and her family at lunchtime coming out of their apartment and Madeleine was carrying bread and possibly going up to the Payne's apartment (which we know from statements likely happened).

This was the ONLY credible statement in my opinion that confirmed Madeleine was seen Sunday lunchtime.  I have seen no others that were specific or confirmed credible after that.

I looked at the discrepancies of Tuesday....and saw how something was not right.  Everything started to fall into place.

IF something had happened to Madeleine AFTER Sunday lunchtime and BEFORE the discrepancies and curiosities started to happen on Tuesday then many of them could be explained if Kate was in grief and the 'plan' for the abduction was in place.

I do not believe that Dianne Webster knew anything and it was therefore important to not be around as a group during the day in case questions were asked.

They no longer went to breakfast and did not go to the Paynes apartment for lunch.

Tuesday morning Gerry told Jez Wilkins that they left the children alone....opening up the knowledge that there was going to be an opportunity for an abduction.

This was the day they 'supposedly' went for a walk to the beach and the 5 ice creams and a thorough description of a guitarist. (why?)

This was the chosen day to claim they bought Gerry's sunglasses.  Did they do that because they knew at this point they were going to use a picture taken on Sunday for the Last Picture that would be claimed to have been taken Thursday, but wanted to deflect from it being Sunday by claiming he didn't have the sunglasses until Tuesday?

They returned to the creche at 2.50pm approx where the activity for that afternoon was an ice cream trip to the beach!

Tuesday evening was when the quiz mistress started the quiz at 9.00pm and was invited to their table for 20 mins.  She claims that no-one got up from the table and that there was a place setting that may have indicated someone left.

She did not recall seeing Kate (at the apartment grieving?) or possibly David Payne. Russell O Brien claims to have been at his apartment looking after his youngest daughter who was sick.

Only Fiona, Gerry, Dianne, Rachael and Matt were at the tapas and yet the waiters always claimed they were all there.  Could this be why the police asked everyone if the Irwin sisters were at their table?  Did they make up the numbers?

After the quiz is when Mrs. Fenn heard the crying for 75 minutes.

Prior to the crying starting at 10.30pm Kate received a flurry of phone calls ( 10.16 - 10.27).

It is suggested she received the calls at the apartment.

The following morning she made very early calls to her friend Amanda at approx 7am and this was when the well known 14 text messages started to arrive to Gerry's phone (denied by both Kate and Gerry)

The cleaner claims to have seen a cot in the parents bedroom but they denied it.  At this point I felt there really was something that had happened and they needed to hide it

Wednesday had some discrepancies....

Wednesday evening, instead of the couples going to the tapas individually, Gerry and Russell O'Brien went together.  No indication if Jane went to the tapas but when Jez asked Gerry about Kate he was told that she was putting the children to bed...Did she EVER go to the tapas that night?  Did Jane stay with Kate?

Thursday discrepancies were too many to mention here...

Thefirst one is that we are told that Madeleine went to her parents and asked why they didn't come when she was crying.....In their statements on May 4th they BOTH claimed it was the twins that Madeleine had told them were crying...but by their next statement it had changed to Madeleine.

One would think that if they had told the police on May 4th that it was the TWINS that were crying, that the night before, if Kate had mentioned to Fiona and Jane about the crying they would have told them the same as they told the police the following day...BUT THEY DIDN'T!

Both Jane and Fiona claim they told then that it was Madeleine that had been crying....

This is what they CHANGED their statements to say later...so was it LATER that they told Jane and Fiona?

Many...Many...Many discrepancies happened on Thursday and one has to wonder why?  

Were they covering up something that happened earlier?

Category: When Did Madeleine 'Disappear' BEFORE 5.30pm or AFTER?

http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/When-Did-Madeleine-Disappear-BEFORE-5-30pm-or-AFTER-1-69230

I believe so, and have NEVER found anything in the last 7 years to prove my research incorrect.

Something happened to Madeleine earlier in the week and there is every indication that the last few days of their 'holiday' were spent 'preparing' for the faked abduction.


If my research can be disputed i will willingly change my opinion.
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:27

Based on my research, my conclusion is this....

The last credible sighting of Madeleine was Sunday lunchtime by the cleaner's daughter.

As the discrepancies started to happen on TUESDAY I feel that something happened to Madeleine between SUNDAY and MONDAY.


The last picture was likely taken on SUNDAY lunchtime, shortly after the cleaner's daughter saw Madeleine leave apartment and dressed in her new holiday clothes.  It was clear and sunny and perfect for photos.


Between that time and TUESDAY morning we know very little.

MONDAY was a day no-one seemed to want to mention in their statements.



Something could have happened during that time and it was devastating.


Maybe Madeleine became fatally ill and the doctor friends were brought in to help....What happened to cause it, is hard to say as we have no real indication apart from a few comments from Rachael about resuscitation or the checking of the twins for breathing (sedatives).


Did Madeleine die immediately or was she very ill for a day or so? We don't know.
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 07.03.18 5:35




NOTE: The following is based on 4 years of research, separating the statements into 15 minute time periods. There is a link available to EVERYTHING.

Some of the over 200 TIMETABLES based on time periods and specific events during the week can be found here:


TIMETABLES


Timelines can be viewed listed under specific headings on this page: 


Remembering Madeleine Forum










We all come to this investigation with different levels of knowledge and with different areas of interest...

Some focus on the latest news...Some focus on connections...Some like to focus on hating the McCanns...

My area of knowledge in the case is about what happened during that few days of the holiday...

You will see me repeat several times about the years I spent researching the timelines and discrepancies...That isn't because of requiring accolades... I did it because it is my passion to form an opinion based on knowledge and when asked I cannot pull a theory out of thin air...I form my opinions based on the information I have studied in the case and I hope that gives me credibility for members that have not had the time or opportunity to research to any extent.
 I base all my videos (nearly 200) on the research and details from the files.


That being said, I NEVER want anyone to believe something just because it is my, or anyone else's, opinion.  You MUST draw your own conclusions based on what you have CONFIRMED to be true.  Never blindly believe anything...that is what we try to do on HDH, is give you details and provide the links so you can confirm for YOURSELF.

After discovering some 'explosive' information yesterday I decided it was time to give you an overall knowledge of the 'week' so you could see for yourself a little of what I 'see' so you can maybe understand what my theories are based on.

This is all from memory so I will not be giving any links but will be more than happy to provide links to any  of the following information.

I will try to explain to you some of the things that happened during that week in chronological order as I recall from the research, so you can maybe understand why I believe something happened much earlier in the week.

Everything is based on the files or 'facts' that we know. Please ask if you would like a link to any of the details.

SATURDAY:

A normal holiday arrival.

They arrived mid afternoon...Went to the tapas at 5pm for information about the Ocean Club and details about its amenities.

From what I understand, half day creche was included but the second half of the day was 'extra'

They left there and went to the Millenium restaurant with all the childen. Ate their meal and went back to the apartment...ready for the start of their holiday.

 





SUNDAY:

 

We don't know too much about Sunday. The cleaners daughter saw them all outside the apartment at around 1.15pm... Madeleine holding bread and probably heading up to the Payne's apartment for lunch. (The last credible sighting of Madeleine during that week. imo)

 

They also went to the pool around lunchtime... A  lovely sunny day...temps around 23c (I believe that the 'last photo' was taken on this day)
 

Matthew Oldfield was (apparently) sick and did not go to the tapas on Sunday night but oddly, Russell O'Brien claimed that he went to check on Matthew and Rachael's child...

They dined at the tapas restaurant that night. Meals were included as was the wine.

MONDAY:

 

They all went to the Millenium for breakfast but the McCanns decided that it was difficult walking with the twins as they didnt have a buggy.

Kate played tennis (every day?) at 9.15am - 10.15am Gerry played from 10.15 -11.15am

Jane Tanner met up with friends of hers that were staying nearby (the Gorrods).

Speculation is that the McCanns went to Sagres but this has never been confirmed.

Creche records show that Madeleine was taken out of the creche after a few minutes and the twins shortly after but also not confirmed as the records are difficult to understand/believe.

 

Something may have happened with the shutters on Sunday as the maintenance men were called in.  (came on Tuesday) Curiously Matthew claims to have had a problem with his blinds also (they were in the apartment next door) but no record of having them fixed.

No other details...it was a day when noone seemed to want to discuss.  Kate claims in her diary that everyone was at the tapas.









TUESDAY:

 

This is the day that everything started to happen....

The McCanns decided to have breakfast in the apartment rather than walk to the Millenium because they didn't have a buggy for the twins..... and bought food from the Baptiste store nearby.

 

According to tennis records and Georgina the tennis coach, this was the morning that Madeleine had MINI TENNIS.

The mini tennis was discussed by Kate, Jane and Rachael and became very confusing as Rachael claims it was Thursday and Jane claims it was Wednesday. However. for the details of the mini tennis from them all one would expect the 'occasion' is remembered more than the date  (I will address Rachael and mini tennis later regarding a separate issue of the day she claims it to have been)

MINI TENNIS was between 10am and 11am (records show 10.30-11)

Catriona (Madeleine's nanny) was present with the children so Georgina really did not have reason to know the children's names and she did not CONFIRM Madeleine was there...just mentioned it was Madeleine's group (Lobsters) that was playing.

Kate claims to have run back to the apartment to get her camera to take a pic... Rachael claims it was Jane who took the tennis balls Pic and Russell claims it was not Jane.

Neither Kate nor Jane mentions Rachael being there despite Rachael claiming Kate sitting with her for the time previous to the mini tennis (when Kate was actually playing tennis and going to see the Maintenance men who were in her apartment at some time showing her how to work the washing machine and fixing the shutters )(had something happened to Madeleine and shutters were involved before this time?)

Lets keep in mind that if Rachael was lying about being at the tennis she may have thought it was Madeleine's mini tennis on Thursday when the other group played ((Sharks)

 

One of them claimed that Gerry came over to join them while they were watching Madeleine.... Gerry was playing tennis until 15 mins after Madeleine had finished playing so he couldnt have been there....










At lunchtime Gerry walked with Jez Wilkins to the creche to pick up Madeleine at lunchtime.  Gerry made a point of telling Jez that they left the children alone... Jez explained to him that the evening creche was available and that they provided blankets to bring the children home.

After lunch they all walked to the beach with the twins in a buggy ( ?).  It was a chilly day and the twins did not want to enter the water so they bought 5 ice creams (5? was this to confirm there were 5 of them at that point?) and they watched a guitarist at the restaurant...describing him in great detail.

Returning to the place Madeleine in the creche at 2.50pm.  Gerry bought sunglasses from one of the street vendors on the way back. (was this because the last picture had been taken on Sunday so by saying he didnt have sunglasses lent credibility to it having been taken after Tuesday?)

Once Madeleine was back at the creche, she went on an 'ice cream trip' which, according to TravelAdvisor, was something that was agreed and paid for separately...(so why had they just been and had ice creams?)

 

 

TUESDAY EVENING was when things started to become odd...

They all went to the tapas except Russell who stayed in his apartment because his youngest daughter was sick.

According to the quiz mistress who supervised the TRIVIA quiz from about 9pm (and then joined the table until approx 9.50pm) NO-ONE left the table and as she recalled, she did not see Kate during that time and does not remember seeing David Payne...

There was one place setting that looked like someone had been there and left. (9pm is when they usually start the appetisers)

So...was Russell, Kate and David Payne missing?

At 10.16pm Kate starts to receieve a 'flurry' of calls (5) until 10.27pm (presumably at the apartment as they claim they didn't take their phones to the restaurant) 

Shortly after Mrs Fenn in the apartment above claims to have heard crying getting increasingly stronger with what sounded like 'Daddy, Daddy, Daddy' and it seemed to have come from a toddler for about an hour and quarter until 11.45pm.



(Turn down volume before watching - May be disturbing to some)





It is always presumed to be Madeleine but we know that Rachael claims to have bathed Jane Tanners older daughter in their apartment (while Jane was doing something else?) and their apartment was also directly next door to the McCanns and both were beneath Mrs Fenn.

 

She heard patio doors close and the crying stopped. Was someone using the patio doors to enter...or to exit?

She did not tell them about this as she didnt want to distress them further.

 

I believe this was the night they claimed that Amelie was crying and Madeleine came into their room.

There is a video clip of the hairdresser claiming that Mrs Fenn told them that the McCanns visited another bar, Chaplins that night but hearsay and may not be true.





 





WEDNESDAY MORNING

Very early around 7am Kate had 3 calls to her friend in England..Amanda (who is married to a pathologist)

Shortly after at around 8am, Gerry starts receiving the first of 14 text messages...

 

It was raining on Wednesday so the tennis was cancelled.

 

Dianne Webster decided to go to breakfast at the Millenium... Jane stayed at the apartment.

Dianne recalls seeing the McCanns at the Millenium despite them saying they didnt go for breakfast.

At some point during Wednesday morning the cleaner were let into their apartment and the McCanns left via the balcony door. (see video)











She made the beds and noticed a cot in the McCanns bedroom. Gerry and Kate BOTH deny the cot was there (why?)

 

Around lunchtime Kate went for a jog (in her pink trainers) with Matthew and apparently was bitten by a dog causing blood on her leg.

 

WEDNESDAY EVENING

Jez Wilkins was at the tapas when Gerry arrived with Russell and was told that Kate was putting the children to bed...She did not seem to arrive while he was there...

Where was Jane? With Kate?  (Had something happened to Madeleine and Kate was grieving?)

 

Did they EVER arrive?

The group stayed at the tapas late that night.  The waiters wanted to leave at midnight but the group stayed there until approx 1am. (Was there something important they needed to discuss?)

According to Kate and Gerry the left just before 11pm...Gerry left first and when she was back at the apartment Gerry was in bed...He claims Kate spent a few moments in bed and because of his snoring went to sleep in Madeleine and twins room...however when one looks at the bed in their room it shows no signs she laid in it.




Kate claims she was annoyed with him and didn't know if he knew she slept in the other room.












THURSDAY MORNING...















They awoke about 7am and Madeleine came to them and (according to May 4th statements) asked why they hadn't come when the TWINS were crying...

However...In Gerrys May 10th statement he changed it to MADELEINE was crying and it remains that version to this day...

What I find is curious is that Kate claims she would have not thought any more about the comment except once Madeleine was missing she recalled it and thought it was important...


Oddly, she told Jane and Fiona on Thursday night BEFORE Madeleine disappeared!


Not only that...If, as she claimed she told them on Thursday night then surely she would have told them the version she told the PJ on May 4th that it was the TWINS that were crying...so WHY did Jane and Fiona BOTH claim that she told them the version that MADELEINE was crying...this was the 'corrected' version 6 days later...so was it made AFTER they changed the version and if so WHY did they lie about being told on Thursday night?









THE FOLLOWING FEW HOURS ARE VERY IMPORTANT....and keep in mind these details are taken from their EARLY statements the following day so there should be NO QUESTION about memory...

Upon leaving the apartment Kate claims they ALL left through the front door... Gerry claims Kate and the kids left through the patio doors.

He left Kate to go down the steep steps with three children so he could lock the doors of an EMPTY apartment?

They tell us they dropped off the Twins at the tapas creche and Gerry took Madeleine to the Kids club creche at the reception while Kate played her tennis game at 9.15am (his followed at 11.15am)

 

The following hours are very difficult to explain because of the contradictions and possible lies....

Rachel claims she sat with Kate by the pool awaiting Madeleine's mini tennis and when the children arrived  (around 10.30am) claims Jane was there and took the photo of Madeleine with the tennis balls.

She ALSO claims that THIS WAS THE LAST TIME SHE SAW MADELEINE (was she trying to be helpful? Had something happened to Madeleine earlier and she saw little blonde girls, Madeleine's age playing tennis and thought that Madeleine should be there?)

The police were persistent in trying to establish with her WHICH courts the children were playing on.  The court she identified was the INCORRECT one according to the tennis records.



Jane and Russell claim to have both been at the mini tennis of the group that was NOT Madeleine's but was called the Sharks and was the same age group (Sharks) 

They both recall speaking to Nigel...he had a camera and they discussed about how difficult it was to take pictures of children and how it could be misinterpreted.

During that half hour (10.30 - 11am) Jane left and went to the beach where she met Fiona and Dvid on the way back from windsurfing...both cold and heading back to the apartment to change.

Jane arrived at the beach in time to catch her older daughter (3 months younger than Madeleine and in the same group as Madeleine) getting ready to go back to the creche after their 'mini sail'

She took pictures of her daughter but no mention of Madeleine (pics not available in the files)
Jane's statement tells us that Russell went to the beach with her.

Although Rachael tells us she was at mini tennis on Thursday, there is no mention of her by Russell or Jane.
 
Bridget O'Donnell tells us in an interview with the Guardian that she saw the children (all pink and pretty) but does not specifically mention Madeleine.

She also tells us that Gerry and Kate spent time talking with the Tennis coach.
 
Fiona claims to have been with her by the pool and they both went to pick up Fiona's youngest daughter (in the same room as Madeleine) and Madeleine.
 
Kate signed Madeleine out at 12.25.
 
Kate says in her statement that she went back to the apartment first and prepared lunch for the children.
 
Gerry says that it was HIM that went to pick up Madeleine and he remembers that because he took the short cut.
Kate says she went back to the tapas creche to see if Gerry had picked up the twins... Neither of them appear to know and Catriona the nanny does not recall WHO picked up and dropped off Madeleine on Thursday.





 
This is very interesting as the police timeline diagrams claim that although Kate and Gerry claim the twins were in the creche....there are NO creche records for them....
 
Maybe they were not released as I have always believed....but the diagrams tell us something different....

Thursday morning diagrams do not show the twins were at the creche....

Jane mentions (in the diagrams) that they were picked up from the creche and Fiona claims they were with her ALL AFTERNOON!



If that is the case then HOW was the last picture taken?

Further confirmation that it was suspicious about whether Madeleine was there for the last picture at 2.29 on May 5th comes from Rachael....

She had said in her statement that both Jane and her played tennis that lunchtime...Supported by Jane Tanners statement...
 
Jane claims that Madeleine was shouting at them through the fence...Rachael does not mention this...and fort a good reason...

Rachael claims that the LAST TIME she saw Madeleine was during mini tennis...
 
Was that mini tennis on Thursday (when she  was mistaken and Madeleine didn't play) or was it on TUESDAY when Madeleines group played (In which case the last time she saw Madeleine was Tuesday?)
 
Either way... Rachael (by default) did NOT see Madeleine by the pool when they were playing tennis as she says the LAST time she saw Madeleine was when she was playing tennis (whether Tuesday morning or Thursday morning)
 
If that was the case...is it true that Jane and Rachael were playing tennis and Madeleine wasn't there for the last picture?

Is Rachael lying about the last time she saw Madeleine?
 
Jane claims to have seen Madeleine and Rachael didnt...are they BOTH lying about being there?
 
If they are both lying about playing tennis at the time the Last Picture was supposed to be taken.....is it pssible they were 'being helpful' but both had got the story wrong?
 
How could Jane see Madeleine but Rachael didnt?

Were they both there? (If they were lying...WHY?)

Were the McCanns there?
 
Most importantly ...was Madeleine there?
 
The McCanns claim they took the twins back to the creche at 2.40 (approx) and drpped Madeleine off at her creche at 2.50pm...
 
So...WHY did Fiona claim..(according to the diagrams) that SHE had the twins that afternoon?
 
WERE the twins at the creche or is it a story made up to support the 'Last Picture' (which I believe was taken on Sunday with just the exif data changed)?

THURSDAY AFTERNOON
 
During the afternoon Gerry and Kate were able to book a tennis court where they played before Gerry continued playing with one of the other guests.

Kate went for a jog and passed the T7 who were down on the beach at the Paraiso.

Clips from the footage is available to view, showing the timeline of their duration in the Paraiso restaurant.

The owner/manager claims Miguel Mattias, claims to have seen Madeleine dancing with her daddy at the restaurant and passed the footage to the PJ.

The footage confirms that Madeleine was not there and that he appears to have mistaken one of the other T7 children as being Madeleine (confirming the possibility of other witnesses being mistaken) and looked similar to Madeleine.
 
HIGH TEA

Gerry claims to have been at high tea while the children were there and Kate arrived after her jog at approx 5.30pm

Catriona the nanny claims that Gerry WASN'T there and that he was playing tennis....which is very odd as who would have told her that? WHEN?

Catriona was 'invited' to the McCanns home during November prior to the Rogatory statements and may have learned details and became confused.

Oddly, she also remembers details such as Kate wearing a jogging outfit.

Kate consistently claims that Madeleine was very tired an Madeleine asked her mother to carry her home. 
The children were signed out at 5.30pm.

 Kate then carried her back to the apartment but Gerry claims they went to the patio doors and he let them in through the back.  If, indeed, Kate had een carrying Madeleine, How did she manage the twins on her own, climbing the steep steps at the rear of the apartment.
 
This was a few hours before Madeleine disappeared and yet Kate claims she went in through the front doors.
  What mother would not remember the door used 3 hrs before she claims she saw her daughter for the LAST TIME!  Was it GERRY that got it wrong?

Did they REALLY go back to the apartment at that time?

They can't agree on what door was used even the following morning when they gave their statements?
 
THURSDAY EVENING

There are too many inconsistencies about the following few hours...

Russell claims that Kate and the children were there during the mens tennis...
 
Kate claims she went back to the apartment and took a shower AND a bath?
 
She claims she was in a towel when David Payne stopped by to pass a message on to her from Gerry ( about 6.30pm) asking if she needed help to take the children to the recreation area...

Kate claims he was there for about 30 seconds...

David Payne described the children at length....obviously from the detail he spent more than 30 seconds in the apartment.

Mrs Fenn (according to an interview with Goncalo Amaral) saw David Payne on the balcony about 7pm

Gerry had gone to tennis at 6.00pm...the others had arrived a while later from the Paraiso restaurant.

David Payne was  back at his apartment at 7.10pm.

The police asked Fiona...they finally had her agree that she had no idea where David Payne was between 6 and 7pm.

Fiona went out jogging while the children were bathed and just before it was time to go to the tapas, which made them a little late.

AT THE TAPAS
 
Gerry and Kate and Rachael and Matthew Oldfield arrived first  Jane (separate to Russell) arrived a little later.

At 9.00pm Matthew decided to 'chivvy' the Paynes as they hadn't arrived.

He walked up to the apartment and met them on the way down...but STRANGE...

Matthew claimed he saw them at the corner of the road by the frnt of the apartments....

Fiona claimed she saw him near the gate at the BACK of the apartment....

David claims he saw him near the swimming pool...
 
Dianne claimed that she CATEGORICALLY did not see him at all on her way to the tapas....at least until her Rogatories when she said she may have seen him as Fiona and David had REMINDED her... (Reminded?)
 
DINNER
 
During the dinner, the waiters claim that ONLY the men ever got up from the table and noone really knew WHY they left the table (until after the 'disappearance' when they PRESUMED they left the table to check the  children.

To be continued.... 
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by sar on 07.03.18 23:07

........always been a fan of Charlie Chaplin (s) Buster Keaton ? Harold Lloyd!

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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Phoebe on 08.03.18 2:08

  According to Gerry McCann, Monday, not Tuesday, was the day on which they they first began to take breakfast at home. This means they only breakfasted at the Millenium once, on Sunday, their first morning there.


"The following day Sunday-------- . After putting the children in their creches they went to the supermarket where they bought[things] for lunch and breakfast........... In the following days they always took breakfast at home, shopping the day before, generally maintaining the daily routine described above."
 Therefore, any "change in routine" began on Monday morning not Tuesday, although I'm not sure that a single visit to the Millenium constitutes a breakfast routine for the McCanns?
 Although Mitchell later claimed that the group had neither watches nor phones with them at the Tapas Kate's statement clearly contradicts this-

"With respect to the objects she says they took with them: their mobile phones. Gerry might have taken a wallet with money. Not sure if they took a camera."


From the early statements of the Tapas 7 taken in the immediate aftermath of the disappearance (the only ones worth paying heed to IMO) there is NO mention of the McCanns always lunching alone. The only point made is that they did not join the others at the Millenium for breakfast after the first day. Nor did the group lunch together in Paynes' apartment every day. In fact, on that Thursday, it appears that the Oldfield and O'Brien families lunched together at the O'Briens' apartment on that day. 

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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 08.03.18 19:54

@Phoebe wrote:  According to Gerry McCann, Monday, not Tuesday, was the day on which they they first began to take breakfast at home. This means they only breakfasted at the Millenium once, on Sunday, their first morning there.


"The following day Sunday-------- . After putting the children in their creches they went to the supermarket where they bought[things] for lunch and breakfast........... In the following days they always took breakfast at home, shopping the day before, generally maintaining the daily routine described above."
 Therefore, any "change in routine" began on Monday morning not Tuesday, although I'm not sure that a single visit to the Millenium constitutes a breakfast routine for the McCanns?
 Although Mitchell later claimed that the group had neither watches nor phones with them at the Tapas Kate's statement clearly contradicts this-

"With respect to the objects she says they took with them: their mobile phones. Gerry might have taken a wallet with money. Not sure if they took a camera."


From the early statements of the Tapas 7 taken in the immediate aftermath of the disappearance (the only ones worth paying heed to IMO) there is NO mention of the McCanns always lunching alone. The only point made is that they did not join the others at the Millenium for breakfast after the first day. Nor did the group lunch together in Paynes' apartment every day. In fact, on that Thursday, it appears that the Oldfield and O'Brien families lunched together at the O'Briens' apartment on that day. 


I have compiled a timetable of what each of them said regarding Sun/Mon/Tues/Wed/Thursday  Statement dates
Non Specific from Early Statements
Non specific from Rogs
Statements from Rogs referring to their early statements and the changes they requested.

Title: LUNCHTIME
http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/WELCOME-to-HDH-Controversy-Info/LUNCHTIME-1-2518243.html
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 08.03.18 19:55

@sar wrote:........always been a fan of Charlie Chaplin (s) Buster Keaton ? Harold Lloyd!


I don't understand... Could you explain?
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 08.03.18 23:16

Why did Rachael claim the last time she saw Madeleine was at mini tennis on Thursday. Madeleine's group played on Tuesday. Is Tuesday the last time she saw her?

According to the Activity planner, mini tennis/grass time was on Monday and Circle games/grass time on Thursday

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CRECHE.htm

Reposted further down with an image of the timetable for easy viewing


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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 08.03.18 23:37

@Ruffian wrote:Why did Rachael claim the last time she saw Madeleine was at mini tennis on Thursday. Madeleine's group played on Tuesday. Is Tuesday the last time she saw her?

According to the Activity planner, mini tennis/grass time was on Monday and Circle games/grass time on Thursday

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CRECHE.htm














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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 08.03.18 23:52

3 Why did Rachael describe the mini tennis as played on Court 1, when the records show it was Court 2. (the police seemed to find it important by questioning her)

Mondays daily booking sheet is missing from the files


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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 08.03.18 23:55


Why did Rachael claim the last time she saw Madeleine was at mini tennis on Thursday. Madeleine's group played on Tuesday. Is Tuesday the last time she saw her?

According to the Activity planner, mini tennis/grass time was on Monday and Circle games/grass time on Thursday
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 09.03.18 0:04

There are MANY questions in the video above that show the likelihood of Rachael actually being at the mini tennis on Tuesday, when Maddies group played, are VERY slim.

From what I can see its POSSIBLE that Maddie was NOT at tennis on Tuesday and, in an attempt to be 'helpful' Rachael saw a group playing on Thursday and THOUGHT it would have been the Lobsters (but was the Sharks) so decided to claim she saw Madeleine.

The police seemed to be doubtful as they asked her which court the children were playing on and she named the court on the LEFT (in which Gerry McCann was playing)

She was wrong.

ALSO.... she describes Gerry being with them at mini tennis without realising that at that time he was playng in Court #1.  The court she described seeing Maddie.

The amount of discrepancies in Rachaels statements are HUGE. 

There are MANY more...and WHY?  Was she attempting to cover up by claiming to have SEEN Maddie?

These discrepancies have NEVER been discussed in forums or groups.


Maybe one day they will hopefully be recognised (which is the point of this thread)
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 09.03.18 1:15

@HiDeHo wrote:

From what I can see its POSSIBLE that Maddie was NOT at tennis on Tuesday and, in an attempt to be 'helpful' Rachael saw a group playing on Thursday and THOUGHT it would have been the Lobsters (but was the Sharks) so decided to claim she saw Madeleine.

Hideho, can you clarify MM and the ref to Tuesday tennis. I cannot find anything in the files. Please link to the relevent PJFile statements
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 09.03.18 2:30

@Ruffian wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:

From what I can see its POSSIBLE that Maddie was NOT at tennis on Tuesday and, in an attempt to be 'helpful' Rachael saw a group playing on Thursday and THOUGHT it would have been the Lobsters (but was the Sharks) so decided to claim she saw Madeleine.

Hideho, can you clarify MM and the ref to Tuesday tennis. I cannot find anything in the files. Please link to the relevent PJFile statements

I can certainly find what you need.  I am not sure exactly what you are looking for.

The video shows some of the  statements referring to Tuesday mini tennis and you have posted the Tennis records.

What exactly are you looking for?

I will be happy to find what you would like to see.
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by HiDeHo on 09.03.18 3:10

I don't expect anyone to plow through the info featured above but PLEASE if you see a discrepancy that you would like further info on, DON'T HESITATE to ask for further info.

I have all the details and research on all of those discrepancies and lots more.  I think the list posted is many years old.

REMEMBER, there are VERY FEW of those issues that have been discussed in groups and forums.  Its a LOT of info that few people are aware of.

I am hoping that this thread can finally reveal how they ALL started happening on Tuesday morning, which gives me an indication that SOMETHING had happened between Sunday afternoon and Monday night and they had to start covering the truth with contradictions and lies.

If that isn't the case, then I would appreciate someone suggesting to me WHY it was necessary to have SO MANY curiosities if it was just a 'normal' week.

Please note... I have NOT used discrepancies that I consider could be blamed on memory, particularly if attributed to rogatories.

Keep in mind also that to read ONE statement on its own would not show too much info and that is why compiled LOTS of timelines and timetable that shows ALL their statements for individual hours in the day.

THAT is the ONLY way to realise there was something VERY wrong...

Here is a timetable for THURSDAY.

It may look very confusing but once you realise you can view ALL their statements for a specific time period you can see how they were obviously getting it all wrong!

I extracted all relevant comments and laid them side by side for comparison.

Title: THURSDAY Timetables for COMPARISON
http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/WELCOME-to-HDH-Controversy-Info/THURSDAY-Timetables-for-COMPARISON-1-2404921.html






This is a better example.

I have allocated each of them a colour (TOP) so when one of the says Jane (eg) was in a specific place, you will see the comment in 'Jane' column and the colour will 'tell' you who made the comment.




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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by NickE on 09.03.18 8:27

The children were signed in at creche and the parents wrote down their phone numbers on the sheet for security reasons so why did they had their phones turned off for the entire Monday?
There's a broken pattern on this day because this is the only day, from they arrived on April 28 up to May 3, they had both their phones turned off.


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When asked if people will ever learn what really happened, Mr Amaral responded: “Yes, we will, when MI5 opens the case files, we will find out".
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 09.03.18 8:52

@HiDeHo wrote:
@Ruffian wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:

From what I can see its POSSIBLE that Maddie was NOT at tennis on Tuesday and, in an attempt to be 'helpful' Rachael saw a group playing on Thursday and THOUGHT it would have been the Lobsters (but was the Sharks) so decided to claim she saw Madeleine.

Hideho, can you clarify MM and the ref to Tuesday tennis. I cannot find anything in the files. Please link to the relevent PJFile statements

I can certainly find what you need.  I am not sure exactly what you are looking for.

The video shows some of the  statements referring to Tuesday mini tennis and you have posted the Tennis records.

What exactly are you looking for?

I will be happy to find what you would like to see.
@HiDeHo who said Madeleine WAS at tennis on Tuesday
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Re: Can Anyone Explain Why the Discrepancies Started on Tuesday Morning? Please ask if you need further info

Post by Ruffian on 09.03.18 9:16

@Ruffian wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:
@Ruffian wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:

From what I can see its POSSIBLE that Maddie was NOT at tennis on Tuesday and, in an attempt to be 'helpful' Rachael saw a group playing on Thursday and THOUGHT it would have been the Lobsters (but was the Sharks) so decided to claim she saw Madeleine.

Hideho, can you clarify MM and the ref to Tuesday tennis. I cannot find anything in the files. Please link to the relevent PJFile statements

I can certainly find what you need.  I am not sure exactly what you are looking for.

The video shows some of the  statements referring to Tuesday mini tennis and you have posted the Tennis records.

What exactly are you looking for?

I will be happy to find what you would like to see.
@HiDeHo who said Madeleine WAS at tennis on Tuesday
@Hideho - I found the ref to Tuesday tennis
Its quite clear Georgina Louise Jackson knew the family and states Madeleine was playing tennis on Tuesday

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/Georgina_Jackson.htm


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