Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

by beijos 30.05.14 14:39

aiyoyo wrote:
Nina wrote:

" />
Is that last photograph the cemetery?

Dunno.

But the cemetery (freaky coincidence the name) road area was mentioned in the T7's (off the cuff can't remember which member) interview.

It looks like the type of swampy area one can hide a body provided no dogs are inside the house next to it, or the dogs would go berserk at the odour of dead body.

[/quote]
That is the back of the cemetery taken from the waste ground....you can see there is quite a lot of rubble, reducing the wall height to about 2 feet (from 6 feet)

by Mirage 30.05.14 14:47

aiyoyo wrote:
Nina wrote:

" />
Is that last photograph the cemetery?

Dunno.

But the cemetery (freaky coincidence the name) road area was mentioned in the T7's (off the cuff can't remember which member) interview.

It looks like the type of swampy area one can hide a body provided no dogs are inside the house next to it, or the dogs would go berserk at the odour of dead body.[/quote]

It was MO, aiyoyo, at Leics rog 2008
-----------------------------------------------------

4078 "Okay. So, by the Wednesday then, Rachael was pretty much confined to the apartment, if you like?"

Reply "Yeah".

4078 "And do you remember what you did that day?"

Reply "Erm, I remember I went running with Kate at lunchtime, she's quite a good runner, and we went out on the road all the way up to the main junc... erm, the sort of main road where you access Praia da Luz from and then back".

4078 "What sort of distance would that be?"

Reply "Erm, yeah, I think it'd be about three or four miles, maybe each way".

4078 "And you run, do you often run?"

Reply "Erm, no, I don't like it, but I quite like it on holiday when it's a bit warmer and it's not so bad on your joints and I quite like running on the beach, because it feels quite sort of Bay Watch and it's kind of Californian".

4078 "In your own mind, yeah".

Reply "Yeah, yeah, yeah, and then I woke up. But, erm, yeah, but, erm, no, she's quite a good runner and I quite enjoy it every now and again, but, if it's sort of unusual and you're sort of exploring a bit".

4078 "And how did..."

Reply "I can't remember how that came about".

4078 "That is what I was going to ask".

Reply "Yeah, erm, it may have been that, because I think Kate might have run most days, because she was quite a keen runner, and it may just be that either I thought I'd go for a run and she was already changed, or I was changed and, or Gerry might have said that, erm, I'm speculating, it may just have been coincidence that we both got into running gear and then decided to run together".

4078 "But you went on this route and are saying you found it quite hard to keep up?"

Reply "Yeah, well, yeah, she's quite a good runner".

--------------------------------
AND LATER IN THE ROG HE RECOUNTS HIS SEARCHING ACTIVITIES OF CIRCA 36 HOURS LATER:

And then, erm, after that we did more headless running around, checked on G****, erm, you know, at times we were sort of like crossing each other, there was Dave, and running on my own, and sort of the other way, and I then went out on the coast road a bit further down, erm, I don't know what we thought we could do, but it was just better than being close to them and being there, erm, and so we ran out on that, I think this road unfortunately is called, erm, which road is it, Cemetery Road I think it's called, I seem to remember noticing it because it seemed like a horrible, I think it’s this bit here".

4078 "It covers quite a lot of area".

Reply "You're basically out on, I think this is Cemetery Road or one of these roads and it just takes you out down the coast and there's lots of new build sort of resorts going up".

4078 "And all the areas that made a search, with hindsight or at the time, there was nothing that you can think of that might be relevant to?"

Reply "No, because as you went on you'd meet other groups, there was Nathan, one of the waterfront people, who managed the waterfront, who we'd met previous on a MARK WARNER holiday, so, you know, you'd sort of cross paths with people who were sort of searching and then, you know, it'd get deserted and there were dogs barking at you as you sort of wandered around, because some of the apartments were occupied and some were still being built, so there was a kind of a bit of, a sort of a lonely sort of isolated place, but, you know, it was all very sort of close, and there was nothing, you know, looking for sort of like funny parked cars or, erm, you know, anything really that seemed a bit odd".

by **PeterMac** 30.05.14 14:55

Plan showing the Cemetery on Cemetery Road, and the triangle of land behind - to the North

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 <a href=

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 333_j10

" />

Close up showing cemetery niches

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 <a href=

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 3331_j10

" />

Close up showing hard stoney packed ground. NOT swampy - sorry !

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 <a href=

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 3332_j10

" />

View showng how IDEAL it is for digging a hole with a JCB or a Kango hammer, totally unnoticed by neighbours, passing police patrols, passing cyclists, motorists, dog walkers, ex-pats . . . !
Just the place for a Snark

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 <a href=

Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14 - Page 9 3333_j10

" />

by **PeterMac** 30.05.14 14:58

And No. I don't believe that they are going to dig there. They just want us to believe that they are going to dig there.

by jeanmonroe 30.05.14 15:00

Maybe the 'carrier' decided to stop there for a rest, as his achilles 'injury' had started to 'play up',.......AGAIN!

by beijos 30.05.14 15:06

More pics of the cemetery here:

https://s1290.photobucket.com/user/access_guru/library/?sort=3&page=1

by aiyoyo 30.05.14 15:08

PeterMac wrote:And No. I don't believe that they are going to dig there. They just want us to believe that they are going to dig there.

I don't too.

It's a built up area, too many surrounding apartment blocks, and no trees to hide digging activity, not to mention difficult rocky ground.

by **PeterMac** 30.05.14 15:09

Perhaps we are misunderstanding what is going on.

Perhaps they are searching for something more intangible,
Forensic traces of decency
Some last threads of conscience
A tiny particle of dignity, or failing that, of virtue,

They may be using the latest GPC - a ground penetrating conscience detector
looking for any last remnant of moral sense or standards,
a clue to any values and principles once held
any remains of ethics and beliefs;
and any relics of compunction, scruples, or qualms.

by russiandoll 30.05.14 15:16

Have been studying maps of areas not too far from PdL and noticed that there is a nature reserve

by aiyoyo 30.05.14 15:18

Mirage wrote: Thanks mirage, my comments in red

.
It was MO, aiyoyo, at Leics rog 2008
-----------------------------------------------------

4078 "Okay. So, by the Wednesday then, Rachael was pretty much confined to the apartment, if you like?"

Reply "Yeah".

4078 "And do you remember what you did that day?"

Reply "Erm, I remember I went running with Kate at lunchtime, she's quite a good runner, and we went out on the road all the way up to the main junc... erm, the sort of main road where you access Praia da Luz from and then back".

4078 "What sort of distance would that be?"

Reply "Erm, yeah, I think it'd be about three or four miles, maybe each way".

4078 "And you run, do you often run?"

Reply "Erm, no, I don't like it, but I quite like it on holiday when it's a bit warmer and it's not so bad on your joints and I quite like running on the beach, because it feels quite sort of Bay Watch and it's kind of Californian".

4078 "In your own mind, yeah".

Reply "yeah, yeah, yeah, and then I woke up. But, erm, yeah, but, erm, no, she's quite a good runner and I quite enjoy it every now and again, but, if it's sort of unusual and you're sort of exploring a bit".

"Woke up" - What a strange thing to say !

4078 "And how did..."

Reply "I can't remember how that came about".

4078 "That is what I was going to ask".

Reply "Yeah, erm, it may have been that, because I think Kate might have run most days, because she was quite a keen runner, and it may just be that either I thought I'd go for a run and she was already changed, or I was changed and, or Gerry might have said that, erm, I'm speculating, it may just have been coincidence that we both got into running gear and then decided to run together".

"Speculuating " again, what a strange thing to say !
Why would he say that? Can he not remember how he ended up doing a run with Kate?

4078 "But you went on this route and are saying you found it quite hard to keep up?"

Reply "Yeah, well, yeah, she's quite a good runner".

--------------------------------
AND LATER IN THE ROG HE RECOUNTS HIS SEARCHING ACTIVITIES OF CIRCA 36 HOURS LATER:

And then, erm, after that we did more headless running around, checked on G****, erm, you know, at times we were sort of like crossing each other, there was Dave, and running on my own, and sort of the other way, and I then went out on the coast road a bit further down, erm, I don't know what we thought we could do, but it was just better than being close to them and being there, erm, and so we ran out on that, I think this road unfortunately is called, erm, which road is it, Cemetery Road I think it's called, I seem to remember noticing it because it seemed like a horrible, I think it’s this bit here".

4078 "It covers quite a lot of area".

Reply "You're basically out on, I think this is Cemetery Road or one of these roads and it just takes you out down the coast and there's lots of new build sort of resorts going up".

4078 "And all the areas that made a search, with hindsight or at the time, there was nothing that you can think of that might be relevant to?"

Reply "No, because as you went on you'd meet other groups, there was Nathan, one of the waterfront people, who managed the waterfront, who we'd met previous on a MARK WARNER holiday, so, you know, you'd sort of cross paths with people who were sort of searching and then, you know, it'd get deserted and there were dogs barking at you as you sort of wandered around, because some of the apartments were occupied and some were still being built, so there was a kind of a bit of, a sort of a lonely sort of isolated place, but, you know, it was all very sort of close, and there was nothing, you know, looking for sort of like funny parked cars or, erm, you know, anything really that seemed a bit odd".

by aiyoyo 30.05.14 15:29

PeterMac wrote:Perhaps we are misunderstanding what is going on.

Perhaps they are searching for something more intangible,
Forensic traces of decency
Some last threads of conscience
A tiny particle of dignity, or failing that, of virtue,

They may be using the latest GPC - a ground penetrating conscience detector
looking for any last remnant of moral sense or standards,
a clue to any values and principles once held
any remains of ethics and beliefs;
and any relics of compunction, scruples, or qualms.

Good one !

But, what about the dogs ?

by jeanmonroe 30.05.14 16:12

aiyoyo wrote:
PeterMac wrote:Perhaps we are misunderstanding what is going on.

Perhaps they are searching for something more intangible,
Forensic traces of decency
Some last threads of conscience
A tiny particle of dignity, or failing that, of virtue,

They may be using the latest GPC - a ground penetrating conscience detector
looking for any last remnant of moral sense or standards,
a clue to any values and principles once held
any remains of ethics and beliefs;
and any relics of compunction, scruples, or qualms.

Good one !

But, what about the dogs ?

Unfortunately, FP, RO, JT and KM, the people who SAY they would do ANYTHING to get Madeleine 'back', WON'T be going to PDL next week, Sandra!

by **PeterMac** 30.05.14 16:24

jeanmonroe wrote:
Unfortunately, FP, RO, JT and KM, the people who SAY they would do ANYTHING to get Madeleine 'back', WON'T be going to PDL next week, Sandra!

No Lawyer would let them.

by Lance De Boils 30.05.14 16:47

The bit of land I referred to as having been dug up can be seen in the aerial map PM posted. It's immediately next to the cemetery (North.) Could you do a zoomed in one for us please, PM?

In the photograph views and Street view, it hasn't been dug over, but on the satellite map it has.

I'm just wondering when it was dug over.

by jeanmonroe 30.05.14 17:01

GA:

Q - What is your opinion?

A - To me, Gerry hid Madeleine's body on the beach. And after a few days he moved her with his car. We work following this lead. Trying to find out the date of the switch, some details, but we were on the way. The Irish was about to arrive in Portugal, but everything was delayed too much, he even received external pressures. In the end, he didn't testify for the Police.
------------------------------------------------------

So, IF GM 'moved' the 'body' after a few days, WTF are the taxpayer funded Met actually 'looking/digging' for, or EXPECT to 'find'?

'REPLICA' Maddie pj's, like the ones the McCanns had in their possession and 'displayed' at press conferences AFTER Madeleine had been 'missing' for weeks, anyone?

There's NOTHING there is there, IF GM had 'removed' her from the beach area, after a few days?

BUT 'something' MIGHT be there NOW, put there by 'someone' who visited PDL 'on the quiet' these 3 years Operation Grange has been 'active'

And why are the taxpayer funded Met NOW 'convinced' by what the Irish family have 'said/seen' when the Irish family 'recieved EXTERNAL pressures'?

EXTERNAL 'pressures' received from WHOM, WHERE and WHEN?

It used to be called 'witness nobbling' if indeed that is what did occur!

And the Irish family DIDN'T testify for the Police.

Now there's a surprise.............NOT!

by margaret 30.05.14 18:38

Pershing36 wrote:

This all brings back memories of the Ben Needham case when the police traveled to Kos and randomly started excavating a field. Unsurprisingly they found nothing and I believe it was done for show to make it look like they were doing something rather than it being based on some viable lead.

How can you write something as fact when you don't know what you're talking about? The field wasn't 'randomly excavated' it was next to Bens grandparents house where he disappeared from and it was having building work done at the time. It had to be ruled out.

I suppose in the times of austerity you think SY police just fancied a jolly in the sun?

The British team, led by Detective Superintendent Matt Fenwick, of South Yorkshire Police, is understood to be about 18-strong and includes dog teams and a forensic archaeologist.
Their search will focus on the grassed mound which is near a farmhouse next to the one Ben's grandparents were renovating in 1991 and where the youngster was last seen.
One theory is that it is building material which was dumped at the time the toddler went missing and the youngster could have been accidentally buried beneath it.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/9620584/British-police-begin-digging-for-missing-toddler-Ben-Needham.html

by Guest 30.05.14 18:44

@ margaret

and didn't his mother say "If they find his bones my life is ended" or words equally moving and understandable.

by margaret 30.05.14 18:56

daffodil wrote:@ margaret

and didn't his mother say "If they find his bones my life is ended" or words equally moving and understandable.

Yes, and both his parents went out there to be there while it was done. Poor couple.

Contrast their actions and words with the Mccanns who don't wish to be anywhere near in case evidence is found.....

by **Tony Bennett** 30.05.14 19:15

MarleneP wrote:You could see it like this:

1 SY believes Smith family. The children do not lie, they saw a man with a child. There was a Smithman and it could be Gerry.

2 There is the smell of corpses in the apartment = the child died hours before disappearance

3 The man with a child did not have time in the evening to dig a hole. So grave was earlier (afternoon?) Excavated.

In which case:

(1) all the stories about Madeleine being seen alive at 2.29pm (Last Photo), 5.30pm (High Tea), 6.30pm (David Payne), 7.00-8.30pm (McCanns) and 9.10pm (Gerry's check) would be wholly false

(2) rigor mortis might have set in to the child's body, and

(3) a man would have been running a fantastic risk carrying a dead body, probably stiff by now, for several minutes through the streets of Praia da Luz.

I can't see that scenario being realistic, nor do I think it's Redwood's latest sham theory

by NickE 30.05.14 20:25

[color:e03f=000000]A trail of her scent picked up by police dogs at the flat was followed to Batista supermarket just 400 yards away where it disappeared'.

"The Chief of the GNR Search and Rescue Team, who coordinated all the work carried out by the two sniffer dogs, states that the dogs took the same route on both 04 May 2007 and 08 May 2007 - i.e. around the apartments and into the nearby car park, where the trail was lost".

My personal theory is that there is a "Smithman" but the girl was not Madeleine.
"Smithman" was a smokescreen for a fake kidnapping.
Is there any independent witness who saw what baby J Wilkins had in his buggy?
"The Smithman baby" maybe?
I think there was a car parked by the Batista supermarket and this was probably earlier on Thursday or Wednesday.

by **PeterMac** 30.05.14 21:51

aiyoyo wrote:
PeterMac wrote:Perhaps we are misunderstanding what is going on.

Perhaps they are searching for something more intangible,
Forensic traces of decency
Some last threads of conscience
A tiny particle of dignity, or failing that, of virtue,

They may be using the latest GPC - a ground penetrating conscience detector
looking for any last remnant of moral sense or standards,
a clue to any values and principles once held
any remains of ethics and beliefs;
and any relics of compunction, scruples, or qualms.

Good one !
But, what about the dogs ?

Or perhaps they are looking for the Blue tennis bag Gerry did not have, except in the PJ photographs, containing the pink blanket which went missing, and then Kate on Oprah hoped the abductor would give to Madeleine, which was also photographed on the bed.
Almost as bizarre as the pyjamas she was wearing when she went missing, which they showed the world some weeks later.
Perhaps one of the many pairs will be there as well. (The ones with the washed T stain, or the ones she was wearing, or the ones they demonstrated)

For newbies, - Dr Amaral took the view that the red blanket might have been used as a Shroud for the final interment or disposal.
As a fellow RC he would understand the importance of a small ritual like this.
And this would explain why it went missing some time after the original events.

Entirely consistent with some purported theories, and consistent with grief stricken parents who have lost a child - in the sense of lost to death - and are trying to make personal amends with what remains of their consciences.

So the dogs will be looking for what they always do so well. Human cadaverine and human blood, either from a body directly, or traces on material.

by TheTruthWillOut 30.05.14 22:00

Bottom line is if anything is found that belongs to the McCann's/Tapas 7, they got some 'splaining to do.

They wouldn't be able to say a abductor took any items now as they are on record that the only thing missing is Madeleine, I believe?

by Guest 30.05.14 22:02

Oh yes, Peter, the pink blanket. Another of those Freudian slips ...

by jeanmonroe 31.05.14 2:00

So, if the new 'better' UK cadaver and blood dogs, 'find' something related to Madeleine, the $64,000 question will be.................will G&KM be screaming from the roof tops about how 'notoriously unreliable' the dogs are OR be praising the 'reliability' of the dogs for 'finding' something, related to their daughter, that might ultimately lead to the 'solving' of the mystery surrounding their daughter's 'disappearance'?

by Naz_Nomad 31.05.14 2:10

jeanmonroe wrote:So, if the new 'better' UK cadaver and blood dogs, 'find' something related to Madeleine, the $64,000 question will be.................will G&KM be screaming from the roof tops about how 'notoriously unreliable' the dogs are OR be praising the 'reliability' of the dogs for 'finding' something, related to their daughter, that might ultimately lead to the 'solving' of the mystery surrounding their daughter's 'disappearance'?