Re: Kate and Dogs - all sorts

by Beanie 15.03.13 8:26

Nina wrote:I find it strange that there is only one print. If I tread in anything and get it on my sole it would be in more than one place.

Agree Nina, perhaps their cleaning was not as thorough as they thought.

by Monty Heck 15.03.13 15:39

Kate dogs - Kate and Dogs - all sorts - Page 3 Npraiadaluzobeliskxs5

Re jogging to the trig point, one quite notable feature about the path up to the point is that the last section immediately below the trig point can't be jogged up. It sits on a wide concrete platform immediately below which it's practically vertical so the last few metres involve a climb to get up there. It's a farily steep hill all the way up but only moderate exercise for the reasonably fit walker but it really is a bit of a scramble at the end. This doesn't seem to be mentioned in any of the "1st hand" accounts which is a little surprising since so many seemingly irrelevant details litter so many of these accounts. Strange not to mention when, having jogged up there in 19 minutes (and it's pretty hot in the summer even in the early mornings), timed yourself and recorded this in your blog or wherever, you are silent about the additional effort to get to destination.

by **tigger** 15.03.13 15:47

Monty Heck wrote:
Re jogging to the trig point, one quite notable feature about the path up to the point is that the last section immediately below the trig point can't be jogged up. It sits on a wide concrete platform immediately below which it's practically vertical so the last few metres involve a climb to get up there. It's a farily steep hill all the way up but only moderate exercise for the reasonably fit walker but it really is a bit of a scramble at the end. This doesn't seem to be mentioned in any of the "1st hand" accounts which is a little surprising since so many seemingly irrelevant details litter so many of these accounts. Strange not to mention when, having jogged up there in 19 minutes (and it's pretty hot in the summer even in the early mornings), timed yourself and recorded this in your blog or wherever, you are silent about the additional effort to get to destination.

Their athletic prowess seemed to be regarded as a 'selling point' by the McCanns. Having to clamber the last few yards just doesn't look that good. I think it was more Chariots of Fire they were projecting.
Not for nothing was Beckham contacted within days to promote the enterprise. Beckham and Gerry have something in common, both make a much better impression if they keep their mouth shut.

by Monty Heck 15.03.13 15:55

Re tigger Today at 3:47 pm
Yes, thanks Tigger, that might explain it! Otherwise missing out such a detail diminishes the authenticity of the account for no apparent purpose, but unfortunately that seems to be true of so many of the accounts in this case.

by Miraflores 15.03.13 16:17

Beckham and Gerry have a lot in common, both make a much better impression if they keep their mouth shut.

Maybe so tigger re opening their mouths!

Otherwise, IMO not. David Beckham has been an inspiration to many youngsters and as far as we know, he's a good father.
Who has Gerry inspired?[ fill in space here ]. Is he a good father? He's the only one I know whose only claim to fame is that he lost a child in unexplained circumstances.

by T4two 15.03.13 16:25

Miraflores wrote:
Beckham and Gerry have a lot in common, both make a much better impression if they keep their mouth shut.

Maybe so tigger re opening their mouths!

Otherwise, IMO not. David Beckham has been an inspiration to many youngsters and as far as we know, he's a good father.
Who has Gerry inspired?[ fill in space here ]. Is he a good father? He's the only one I know whose only claim to fame is that he lost a child in unexplained circumstances.

Kate dogs - Kate and Dogs - all sorts - Page 3 351181

agree wholeheartedly. Beckham may not be a great orator but he is a great role model both as a sportsman and a parent.

by **tigger** 15.03.13 17:05

T4two wrote:
Miraflores wrote:
Beckham and Gerry have a lot in common, both make a much better impression if they keep their mouth shut.

Maybe so tigger re opening their mouths!

Otherwise, IMO not. David Beckham has been an inspiration to many youngsters and as far as we know, he's a good father.
Who has Gerry inspired?[ fill in space here ]. Is he a good father? He's the only one I know whose only claim to fame is that he lost a child in unexplained circumstances.

agree wholeheartedly. Beckham may not be a great orator but he is a great role model both as a sportsman and a parent.

I do apologise! I think Beckham is an advert for fatherhood and probably a lovely person altogether. It was a little mean of me to say that.

I said it mainly because it's the only thing he and Gerry have in common, whilst (Dr. Ludke said this too) the McCanns seem to have aspired to the Beckham status and popularity.
Beckham only has a very light voice whereas Gerry's voice gives me symptoms.... soz

you're both right. Tell Posh and David I didn't mean it.

by T4two 15.03.13 17:09

tigger wrote:
T4two wrote:
Miraflores wrote:
Beckham and Gerry have a lot in common, both make a much better impression if they keep their mouth shut.

Maybe so tigger re opening their mouths!

Otherwise, IMO not. David Beckham has been an inspiration to many youngsters and as far as we know, he's a good father.
Who has Gerry inspired?[ fill in space here ]. Is he a good father? He's the only one I know whose only claim to fame is that he lost a child in unexplained circumstances.

agree wholeheartedly. Beckham may not be a great orator but he is a great role model both as a sportsman and a parent.

I do apologise! I think Beckham is an advert for fatherhood and probably a lovely person altogether. It was a little mean of me to say that.

I said it mainly because it's the only thing he and Gerry have in common, whilst (Dr. Ludke said this too) the McCanns seem to have aspired to the Beckham status and popularity.
Beckham only has a very light voice whereas Gerry's voice gives me symptoms.... you're both right. Tell Posh and David I didn't mean it.

Kate dogs - Kate and Dogs - all sorts - Page 3 759815

by plebgate 15.03.13 17:10

I see Rebecca Loos is in the news today saying she would not forgive her husband if he cheated on her. Didn't read the full story just saw the headline.

by Guest 15.03.13 18:43

I don't even want to read the headline ...
LOOS in Dutch means: false, fake, empty, sly, cunning, sneaky, wily.
And that's exactly what she is ... IMO, of course.

by Angelique 16.03.13 1:09

Late arriving as usual - sorry.

I was oddly enough reading yesterday about Madeleine's clothes. I found a reference to what happened in an interview with Oprah here

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id226.html

Clip By Sara Nuwar
26/04/2009

"And Kate told how Amelie has taken to borrowing some of Madeleine's clothes-although the oufits last worn by her in Portugal are kept tucked away and untouched."

At least I was reading if not actually here at the same time!

by aiyoyo 16.03.13 2:36

tigger wrote:
Beanie wrote:Blood footprint on wooden floor in the entrance to Maddie's room. Size 5 or 6 shoe

This quote is on Pamalam's site with a picture of bedroom entrance and marking where footprint was found. Apologies I have no idea how to post a picture.

Have to say looking at the picture the floor looks tiled not wooden.

Well, that's those pink shoes solves then! Didn't see the blood running down on the pink shoes when bitten by the dog. Got home, never noticed the bleeding or worried about rabies. Never noticed the mark on the floor.

(Beanie, I'm hopeless at moving photographs around - if you just copy and paste the address/link it's easy to find).

Here it is: v. interesting in 5a - not the villa! http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/m/press/6oct7/13_10_2007.htm

Trying to explain away the bloody footprint from the pink shoes as blood from dog bite is at par with explaining 6 corpses on the pants of ganga.

She never did explain the bruises on her arms, at least I dont remember that.

by Miraflores 16.03.13 3:24

She never did explain the bruises on her arms, at least I dont remember that.

It was - smashing up a spare bed. Not sure whether this was the book, or elsewhere. You'd think that punching a bed so violently til it broke would give you bruised fingers and knuckles. They look like bruises from where someone has grabbed her wrists hard, to me.

by **tigger** 16.03.13 7:00

Miraflores wrote:
She never did explain the bruises on her arms, at least I dont remember that.

It was - smashing up a spare bed. Not sure whether this was the book, or elsewhere. You'd think that punching a bed so violently til it broke would give you bruised fingers and knuckles. They look like bruises from where someone has grabbed her wrists hard, to me.

Yes, definitely restraining bruises. If you want to stop someone from hitting you.

by Guest 16.03.13 8:52

Angelique wrote:

I was oddly enough reading yesterday about Madeleine's clothes. I found a reference to what happened in an interview with Oprah here

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id226.html

Clip By Sara Nuwar
26/04/2009

"And Kate told how Amelie has taken to borrowing some of Madeleine's clothes-although the oufits last worn by her in Portugal are kept tucked away and untouched."

***
That's very interesting. Perhaps an idea for SY to have a dog sniff on it?

by Guest 17.03.13 18:36

This is also on the "Maddie's Clothes" topic.

I doubt whether the famous last outfits ever actually existed (not as far as Madeleine wearing them in 2007 goes) as there's no way the McCanns would have missed such a good trick as putting them on display. The headlines in the media would have brought tears to the eyes of a statue about the memories evoked of that carefree holiday before Madeleine was so cruelly abducted.......

by **tigger** 17.03.13 21:40

Jean wrote:This is also on the "Maddie's Clothes" topic.

I doubt whether the famous last outfits ever actually existed (not as far as Madeleine wearing them in 2007 goes) as there's no way the McCanns would have missed such a good trick as putting them on display. The headlines in the media would have brought tears to the eyes of a statue about the memories evoked of that carefree holiday before Madeleine was so cruelly abducted.......

I've lost count of the number of change of clothes that were fitted into the day on Thursday.
Starting with pyjamas, then on to the creche clothes, then on to tennis shorts, then for the boat trip? then a quick sunbathing moment . Pyjamas again.
There was also the little dance she'd learnt that day and was going to show Kate on Friday. Over-egging the pudding again.

Yes, definitely a packed programme that day. Also, a pink hat for the tennis photo and a white one for the pool.

by sami 18.03.13 8:26

With regard to the little dance. - children don't usually wait until "tomorrow" for anything, it's always now. Look at my dance I have just learned. Not I learned a dance today, I will show you tomorrow. By then they have "moved on" as Kate would say. Such an odd relationship, all very contrived, almost the thoughts of somebody who does not have children so no first hand experience to realise things rarely happen in the way the good parenting guides tell you they will.

by **tigger** 18.03.13 8:54

sami wrote:With regard to the little dance. - children don't usually wait until "tomorrow" for anything, it's always now. Look at my dance I have just learned. Not I learned a dance today, I will show you tomorrow. By then they have "moved on" as Kate would say. Such an odd relationship, all very contrived, almost the thoughts of somebody who does not have children so no first hand experience to realise things rarely happen in the way the good parenting guides tell you they will.

Quite so! She also said she'd had the best day 'ever'. Another unlikely event. A four year old doesn't have temporal awareness to that extend.

by **tigger** 25.03.13 14:58

From the Expresso Interview on the 6th September 2008:

Q – 40 apartments were investigated and the dogs only marked yours. Ten cars and they only reacted to yours.

Gerry – These dogs' frailty was proved by a study that was carried out in the USA, in the case of a man that had been accused of murder. They had ten rooms, and in each room four boxes were placed, containing vegetables, bones, trash. Some contained human remains. They stayed there for ten hours. Eight hours after the boxes were removed, the dogs came in. And the dogs failed two thirds of the attempts. Imagine the reliability when these dogs test an apartment three months after the disappearance of a child.
unquote

This video proves otherwise. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOXenTtj26E&feature=player_embedded
and very recently:
http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/news/home-news/david-gilroy-guilty-of-suzanne-pilley-murder.1331810187
Conviction without a body found with evidence from cadaver dog.

The dog handler of Eddie and Keela who searched PdL for traces of Maddie is now employed by the FBI. US don't seem to have a problem with dogs.

by Me 04.04.13 12:39

So presumably according to Kate:

Sniffer dogs = good
Cadaver dogs = bad

Why complain about the police not using sniffer dogs sooner when you later demean cadaver dogs? Dogs are dogs, was she suggesting she wanted sniffer dogs brought in earlier? But i thought her and her husband believed that dogs were "notoriously unreliable", or is that only dogs which indicate or implicate that the McCann's are in some way involved?

Unless of course she is simply trying to paint a picture of confusion and discredit the police report by claiming things are reported in the files that didn't happen.

Using dogs as the subject matter is a risky one though.

by **tigger** 04.04.13 12:47

Me wrote:So presumably according to Kate:

Sniffer dogs = good
Cadaver dogs = bad

Why complain about the police not using sniffer dogs sooner when you later demean cadaver dogs? Dogs are dogs, was she suggesting she wanted sniffer dogs brought in earlier? But i thought her and her husband believed that dogs were "notoriously unreliable", or is that only dogs which indicate or implicate that the McCann's are in some way involved?

Unless of course she is simply trying to paint a picture of confusion and discredit the police report by claiming things are reported in the files that didn't happen.

Using dogs as the subject matter is a risky one though.

The sniffer dogs came with the forensic team from Lisbon -some time during the 4th. 3+ hour drive. The sniffer/tracking dogs were deployed around 23.00. Gerry complained on the 3rd -about one hour after phoning the police who'd arrived around 23.00 that there were no dogs. Had he laid a trail for them?
No heat-seeking equipment on helicopters either. Which would have been useless and only tracked the searchers. There was a helicopter used in the following days, the McCanns simply lie about it. 'They had no Royal Navy' Gerry said. Indeed not, but a pretty good one all the same.

by Woburn_exile 23.06.13 7:32

Forget the DNA, Forget the clothes, forget the crying, forget the phone calls, forget the suspicious bogey man, forget the Gasper statements, forget the statement inconsistencies, forget Jane Tanner, David Payne, Clarence Mitchell, Robert Murat, The laundry man, forget all of these things..
The chance of the 2 proven scent dogs being worng on the same 2 different occasions, in the same 2 different places has to be Millions to 1 against.
Jobbo jobbed.
shark

by sheila.edwards 23.06.13 9:02

yes it would be easier to accept unreliable if only one dog alerted not both eddy and keela in same places !

by **tigger** 21.07.13 10:16

Came across this little item of spin - this about a week after the PJ files were released and the McCann lawyers had started to 'mine' them.

Dogs used in Madeleine McCann search not properly trained
Sunday Mail
Aug 10 2008

SNIFFER dogs used to search for Madeleine McCann were not properly trained.

Police used dogs more suited to rural work to search a 10-mile radius of the Ocean Club complex in Praia da Luz where Maddie was snatched on May 3 last year.

The dogs lost her trail in the nearby car park.

It is the latest damning revelation to emerge after the release of files from the bungled Portuguese police investigation.

Prosecutors Joao Melchior Gomes and Jose de Magalhaes e Menezes slated the probe, noting detectives had "achieved very little in terms of conclusive results".

The report also damned the Portuguese police for failing even to establish if the five-year-old is alive or dead.
unquote

It's a shame that a dog's nose apparently doesn't work as well in some environments. Notice how the GNR dogs are picked out for this, not Eddie and Keela whose performance is a bit harder to denigrate.
The tracker dogs which came from Lisbon on the 4th can only be as good as the material they were given to sniff. It seems the GNR report cannot state with confidence that the towel they were given actually had Maddie's scent on it. There was no chain of evidential material.

I can't recall seeing a reprimand of the PJ for failing to establish whether the girl was dead or alive. Eddie and Keela did that with very convincing statistics on their side - such as 100% success rate and evidence accepted in murder trials where no body was found. But strangely enough the best trained dogs aren't mentioned much.
Hard at work in August 2008 when the PJ files were released. spin

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