Re: Missing Tia Sharp

by **PeterMac** 10.08.12 18:18

russiandoll wrote: The German Shepherds would have found her, regardless of not being trained specialist cadaver dogs imo. They have dogs' noses. They must not have gone in the vicinity of where the body was located imo, for whatever reason. Body in an area of the house not accessed. Or not in the house at that time. All I can think of given my knowledge of dogs. [my underline]

Spot on. Ditto the officers.
They did search.
They did not search where she was.
Ask the right question ...

by One 10.08.12 18:19

Such a sad day, RIP Tia x

by Guest 10.08.12 18:20

As Russian Doll has suggested, perhaps the body has not been in the house all week.

According to the BBC website, police have yet to determine how long the body has been there.

And we don`t know where the body was found.

by Julchen 10.08.12 18:20

russiandoll wrote: The German Shepherds would have found her, regardless of not being trained specialist cadaver dogs imo. They have dogs' noses. They must not have gone in the vicinity of where the body was located imo, for whatever reason. Body in an area of the house not accessed. Or not in the house at that time. All I can think of given my knowledge of dogs.

I used to work as a (VDH licensed) dog trainer in Germany. My very first thought when I saw the German shepherd with the red ring toy was "gosh, that's a young dog, not concentrated, suitable for the job?, I even had my husband watch the video since I wanted a second opinion on the dog. He came up with "not focusing".

The houses over here are soooo incredibly small. No cellars etc.
Unless they ignored the fact that lofts are sort of accessible they should have done an intensive search of the place within 30Min at the most.
But they probably did ignore the fact that houses have lofts.

Jule

by Spaniel 10.08.12 18:22

PeterMac wrote:They have found her body at the house.
As we thought they might !

Poor little girl.

by Newintown 10.08.12 18:27

candyfloss wrote:When the Sky interviewer mention the dogs going in to search the house, Former Met Police Detective Peter Kirkham said............

Wouldn't surprise me if they were dogs to indicate body remains.

They probably were in the past day or two, but at the beginning of the week the police had Alsatians who are trained sniffer dogs to scent out people who are on the run etc. They are given an item of the person's clothing to smell and they can track them for miles through thick vegetation, through water (rivers, streams), over fences etc.

One person speaking on Sky News said that the police didn't feel obliged to go into the house to tear in apart within the first couple of days just incase Tia had just run away or was hiding out somewhere. He also said that the police come under such criticism now that they are frightened to do anything that would put them in a bad light.

Unfortunately, we can blame the liberal do-gooders PC brigade for changing the role of the police to something unrecognisable from 10/20 years ago.

by Guest 10.08.12 18:28

poor little girl to have such a collection of relatives..

If we all thought it was all a bit fishy then pretty sure the police would have thought so too.. not sure why he hasn't been watched though as he's an obvious suspect..

I think the questions that need to be answered include:
- when did she die - might not have been last Friday
- where has the body been since then - might not have been at the house all that time. Can't imagine a body being kept in the house all that time without the odour being all-pervasive.
- who knew about what had happened
- who knows where the step-grandfather is .

Lessons to be learned from this for me is trust your instincts. This smelt fishy to me right from the start...and if things don't ring true they generally aren't..

by TheTruthWillOut 10.08.12 18:28

PeterMac wrote:
russiandoll wrote: The German Shepherds would have found her, regardless of not being trained specialist cadaver dogs imo. They have dogs' noses. They must not have gone in the vicinity of where the body was located imo, for whatever reason. Body in an area of the house not accessed. Or not in the house at that time. All I can think of given my knowledge of dogs. [my underline]

Spot on. Ditto the officers.
They did search.
They did not search where she was.
Ask the right question ...

First of all I have followed this case from the beginning and am shocked at this outcome (being found in the house)

Peter, are you saying the family said the police could search but not her bedroom or the loft or whatever room she was in?

Sorry if this is a dumb question! I'd love hear your theory.

by **tigger** 10.08.12 18:33

russiandoll wrote: The net is going to be cast a bit wider than Mr Hazell imo. Someone else is complicit in this imo.

Very likely, but I think he is the main perpetrator. In the interview he had the same expression on his face that Ian Huntley had, sorry for himself.
Going on about all the cleaning in such detail rang alarm bells for me plus the unlikely storyline anyway.
They must have rigged something up otherwise the dogs would have alerted?

by **Tony Bennett** 10.08.12 18:36

pennylane wrote:Watching that interview, Stuart Hazell seems sincere to me. Call me gullible, but I don't hear alarm bells ringing when he relates the events of that morning. It's quite possible Tia was snatched, or accepted a ride with someone she knew...

Hallo 'pennylane', hope all is well, and once again thank you for your much appreciated support at various times in the past.

I for one will not call you 'gullible'. However, shortly before you posted last night, I wrote of Stuart Hazell:

"My goodness, if he is hiding something really dreadful, I must say he carried ot off very well - polished, almost".

Indeed, looking now at Stuart Hazell's interview with the terrible news we now have, we can surely see that Stuart Hazell, to coin a phrase, 'put on another great performance'.

I would venture to suggest that Hazell is a well practised, adept, indeed consummate liar, though as we were beginning to explore on this thread last night, there were some definite indications that he was not telling the truth. His long rambling interview can now be picked over - with the valuable benefit of hindsight - to see exactly how and where in this interview he was lying, and what signals he gave.

There are a great many liars out there who can be very very convincing - and yet telling a pack of outright lies.

++++++++++++

P.S. The British police have obviously not learnt one very obvious lesson from the Madeleine McCann case - seal off and search the home from where the child has apparently disappeared - immediately

by Newintown 10.08.12 18:49

Tony Bennett said:

There are a great many liars out there who can be very very convincing - and yet telling a pack of outright lies.

_____________________________________________

I used to work for one some years ago. He would tell barefaced lies to people's faces and didn't flinch. He lied so much he obviously believed everything he said to be true and people took in every word he said. He didn't touch his nose, pull at his earlobe or blink very fast when he was lying, he hid it very well.

There was no point in me telling people he was lying as he had them wrapped around his little finger, they would have accused me of being catty or vindictive so I just let him get on with it. I was due to retire anyway so I was able to leave it behind me.

by **PeterMac** 10.08.12 18:51

TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Peter, are you saying the family said the police could search but not her bedroom or the loft or whatever room she was in?
Sorry if this is a dumb question! I'd love hear your theory.

It is not a dumb question. There are no dumb questions. All require answers
The short answer is that police do not only search places the householder allows them to.
They search where they reasonable can.

You are all getting very close to my theory, and I have just seen another clip on Sky which tends to confirm what I think the answer might be.

by **tigger** 10.08.12 19:03

It looks as if both the grandmother and mother knew. So if that is the case, won't that be interesting and make some people think five years back?
Because one of the main arguments I hear is that a family could not have been complicit.

Families are very complicit by nature in my experience, about all sorts of things.

by Guest 10.08.12 19:07

Keith‏@FixitpcKeith
BBC news just reported search stepped up after indication from dog. #TiaSharp #McCann

by pennylane 10.08.12 19:08

Tony Bennett wrote:
pennylane wrote:Watching that interview, Stuart Hazell seems sincere to me. Call me gullible, but I don't hear alarm bells ringing when he relates the events of that morning. It's quite possible Tia was snatched, or accepted a ride with someone she knew...
Hallo 'pennylane', hope all is well, and once again thank you for your much appreciated support at various times in the past.

I for one will not call you 'gullible'. However, shortly before you posted last night, I wrote of Stuart Hazell:

"My goodness, if he is hiding something really dreadful, I must say he carried ot off very well - polished, almost".

Indeed, looking now at Stuart Hazell's interview with the terrible news we now have, we can surely see that Stuart Hazell, to coin a phrase, 'put on another great performance'.

I would venture to suggest that Hazell is a well practised, adept, indeed consummate liar, though as we were beginning to explore on this thread last night, there were some definite indications that he was not telling the truth. His long rambling interview can now be picked over - with the valuable benefit of hindsight - to see exactly how and where in this interview he was lying, and what signals he gave.

There are a great many liars out there who can be very very convincing - and yet telling a pack of outright lies.

++++++++++++

P.S. The British police have obviously not learnt one very obvious lesson from the Madeleine McCann case - seal off and search the home from where the child has apparently disappeared - immediately

Hi Tony, thank you for your reply. Missing Tia Sharp - Page 11 1387363171

I wasn't fully up to date with what was happening in this case, and only caught the interview today of SH for the first time. I totally agree with you he is an accomplished liar, and as I said before, I am constantly shocked and amazed how people can tell outrageously brazen lies with such a cool exterior, and even more astonishing now that we know where poor Tia's body lay.

When I watched SH's interview again I saw the red flags people were discussing, and I asked who the man sitting next to him was (Tia's uncle it turns out), as he seemed to be looking at Stuart Hazell with doubt in his eyes.

Erm, err yes, it seems the British police did NOT seal off the crime scene immediately. Tut tut, I thought it was only dumb foreign cops that were so lax. Missing Tia Sharp - Page 11 181154

I'm praying that you have a favourable outcome in your upcoming court case instigated by the greedy duo. Here's hoping they fall flat on their deceitful faces very soon.

by TheTruthWillOut 10.08.12 19:09

Could it be a hoax gone wrong I wonder? Hidden somewhere with limited air or too hot............and..........damn this is a horrible thought.

Just watching the Sky coverage the presenters/reporters are being weirdly careful what they say.

I hope a police press conference is done soon to clarify things.

by Cristobell 10.08.12 19:11

Newintown wrote:Tony Bennett said:

There are a great many liars out there who can be very very convincing - and yet telling a pack of outright lies.

_____________________________________________

I used to work for one some years ago. He would tell barefaced lies to people's faces and didn't flinch. He lied so much he obviously believed everything he said to be true and people took in every word he said. He didn't touch his nose, pull at his earlobe or blink very fast when he was lying, he hid it very well.

There was no point in me telling people he was lying as he had them wrapped around his little finger, they would have accused me of being medacious or two-faced so I just let him get on with it. I was due to retire anyway so I was able to leave it behind me.

I have met people of that ilk too Newintown, and as I watched that interview with Hazell last night, I had an uncontrollable urge to smash his face in! Among other things he said they had gone to search at a funfair, yet didn't know where the funfair was.

Lots of similar gormless expressions that we have seen in Huntley and GM. Over expressive, playing to the camera, fake emotions, overly keen to show what a good guy he was. I doubted the whole cleaning story, but in retrospect, I wondered what he might have been cleaning up? He mentioned dog mess - had he scrubbed part of the carpet?

The grandmother entered the house yesterday with a box of washing powder and cigarettes. They seem to do a lot of washing and cleaning in that house - and how do you carry on doing laundry etc, given the circumstances? Some of the clothes washed may have held crucial forensic evidence.

You mentioned another murder earlier Newintown. I saw a documentary about it on Youtube, but can't remember the victim's name. She was found behind the panel of the bath. Astonishingly, the house had been 'forensically' searched, but they had failed to find the body. The mother found her, several weeks later when the smell in the bathroom had become so intense that the police were called in again.

by russiandoll 10.08.12 19:12

If Hazell is doing his own thing as stated by the grandmother today I would think that she knows what and where. If he has gone off without telling her where, would that not have rung her alarm bells given the circumstances? Unless she believes he is anxious about the finger- pointing he claimed yesterday and is running scared.
I read that the mother is not around, reliable report?

by Cristobell 10.08.12 19:16

tigger wrote:It looks as if both the grandmother and mother knew. So if that is the case, won't that be interesting and make some people think five years back?
Because one of the main arguments I hear is that a family could not have been complicit.

Families are very complicit by nature in my experience, about all sorts of things.

The grandmother said he had gone out 'to do his own thing'. I wonder if she knew he was making a run for it?

Where is the mother? She has kept a very low profile throughout. All very strange.

by russiandoll 10.08.12 19:17

TheTruthWillOut wrote:Could it be a hoax gone wrong I wonder? Hidden somewhere with limited air or too hot............and..........damn this is a horrible thought.

Just watching the Sky coverage the presenters/reporters are being weirdly careful what they say.

I hope a police press conference is done soon to clarify things.

This crossed my mind until I heard a murder enquiry had been launched.

by pauline 10.08.12 19:23

I can understand why people feel the body may not have been in the house all week or the police would have found it sooner.

However, it was moved there after the alarm was raised, how could that be done with all the publicity, media outside, neighbours, liaison officers and police coming and going. While there might be times when the road was deserted very hard to be sure that that situation wouldn't change in a moment. The granny has a car which Hazell drove.The police will presumably be forensically examining that.

by pennylane 10.08.12 19:24

PeterMac wrote:
pennylane wrote:What an horrific, deeply depressing outcome. Poor Tia, RIP.
I feel Eddie and Keela would have found her immediately!
Not necessarily !
We are back to asking the right question.

I'm flummoxed re the right question. It's such a small house. Surely floorboards, attic, garden, bath panel, secret place for drugs, etc, wouldn't be that difficult to find, particularly if a body had lain there for a week?

by Guest 10.08.12 19:26

Cristobell wrote:
tigger wrote:It looks as if both the grandmother and mother knew. So if that is the case, won't that be interesting and make some people think five years back?
Because one of the main arguments I hear is that a family could not have been complicit.

Families are very complicit by nature in my experience, about all sorts of things.

The grandmother said he had gone out 'to do his own thing'. I wonder if she knew he was making a run for it?

Where is the mother? She has kept a very low profile throughout. All very strange.

I've not heard Brunt or the ex-cops even mention her, they must have been told not to for some reason. Strange indeed.

This could have been an accidental death. I don't think we should assume murder.

by **PeterMac** 10.08.12 19:28

pennylane wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
pennylane wrote:What an horrific, deeply depressing outcome. Poor Tia, RIP.
I feel Eddie and Keela would have found her immediately!
Not necessarily !
We are back to asking the right question.
I'm flummoxed re the right question. It's such a small house. Surely floorboards, attic, garden, bath panel, secret place for drugs, etc, wouldn't be that difficult to find, particularly if a body had lain there for a week?

Absolutely right. Keep going !
(I hasten to add that I do not know, but I have a theory which fits.)