Re: How Maddie's creche attendance was "arranged"

by littlepixie 17.01.11 22:06

Quote// I cannot think of any medical problem that they would have to kill her for unless it was euthanasia for unbearable suffering.

I was thinking that maybe they had done something illegal during the IVF process and had created a problem that they could no longer contain.
Maddie was due to start school soon.

by theolivebranch 17.01.11 22:15

littlepixie wrote:Quote// I cannot think of any medical problem that they would have to kill her for unless it was euthanasia for unbearable suffering.

I was thinking that maybe they had done something illegal during the IVF process and had created a problem that they could no longer contain.
Maddie was due to start school soon.

Yes Littlepixie there could have been some problem as a result of the IVF but sufficient to kill her. That is murder we are speaking of here. Not manslaughter but murder, premeditated.
Yes she was due to start school and her medical records would have needed to be given over.
I think I am just going around in confused circles and starting to gibber so I will give it a rest.
Thankyou Littlepixie for your posts/discussion.

by **Tony Bennett** 17.01.11 22:18

The suggestion that this was fully premeditated is I agree almost intolerable to even think about.

All I was trying to do is to draw attention to the fact that this is the only logical conclusion to be drawn from kikoraton's theory. I emphasise again that despite the excellent research I am yet to be convinced by that theory.

In response to the query about 'the wider agenda', this thought has occurred to me.

I think (I stand to be corrected) that the photo of Dr Gerald McCann lecturing over a white board with the words 'The Wider Agenda' contained within what looked suspiciously like a set square and compass appeared before Eddie and Keela were called in and before the McCanns were taken in for questioning.

Is it possible that a secretive elite group had proposed to use Madeleine's disappearance for a wider agenda (Amber alerts, microchipping etc.) - but were blown off course by the realisation that it would take a superhuman effort to overcome the powerful combination of Martin Grime, Eddie and Goncalo Amaral?

But for those three, we might well have see a great deal more of this 'wider agenda'.

by Judge Mental 17.01.11 23:41

Which is where the man from Belgium comes in with his microchipping palavre, and the McCanns start acting like would-be ambassadors for children.

by **Jill Havern** 18.01.11 6:50

Tony Bennett wrote:The suggestion that this was fully premeditated is I agree almost intolerable to even think about.

All I was trying to do is to draw attention to the fact that this is the only logical conclusion to be drawn from kikoraton's theory. I emphasise again that despite the excellent research I am yet to be convinced by that theory.

In response to the query about 'the wider agenda', this thought has occurred to me.

I think (I stand to be corrected) that the photo of Dr Gerald McCann lecturing over a white board with the words 'The Wider Agenda' contained within what looked suspiciously like a set square and compass appeared before Eddie and Keela were called in and before the McCanns were taken in for questioning.

Is it possible that a secretive elite group had proposed to use Madeleine's disappearance for a wider agenda (Amber alerts, microchipping etc.) - but were blown off course by the realisation that it would take a superhuman effort to overcome the powerful combination of Martin Grime, Eddie and Goncalo Amaral?

But for those three, we might well have see a great deal more of this 'wider agenda'.

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Surely that means that Maddie is still alive then if this was done for Amber alerts etc? I mean who in their right mind would approach the parents of a truly abducted child/or a child who'd died accidentally and say "Hey, can we take advantage of your grief to promote Amber alerts/microchipping? For a very good fee which would clear your mortgage of course."

I've always thought Maddie's demise/disappearance was preplanned but would rather it had been a calculated hoax which is slightly less abhorrent than the first option.

A calculated hoax involving a hidden/alive Maddie would explain the McCann's behaviour and sickening smirks.

But it doesn't explain Eddie and Keela.

So, like Gerry's flipchart, it's back to the drawing board.

thinking

by Guest 18.01.11 9:09

All credit to this find goes to Ironside, who looked into this some time ago. Bless her [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] I hope she's doing OK.

It might explain why Gerry had to go to Washington. It might also explain why there were so many financial high flyers out there.

by Guest 18.01.11 9:13

Autumn wrote:

So just a month after Madeleine's disappearance Gerry was already talking of of a campaign which could last years.

It would take years, many years to sell this idea to each and every country. They would need a high profile case like that of Madeleine to sell it to everyone. Perhaps Portugal was chosen all along, knowing the next big thing to happen in Europe was the Lisbon Treaty? Who knows.

Perhaps Madeleine already had one inserted and something went wrong?

by Autumn 18.01.11 9:27

Stella wrote:All credit to this find goes to Ironside, who looked into this some time ago. Bless her [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] I hope she's doing OK.

It might explain why Gerry had to go to Washington. It might also explain why there were so many financial high flyers out there.

Yes I was just thinking about the Washington trip. This is worth researching in depth and wonder if we should start a new thread here about The Wider Agenda. Just out of interest, where and when was the clipboard photo taken?

I hope Ironside is doing fine and responding well to treatment roses

by Autumn 18.01.11 9:49

Stella wrote:I'm not sure when the clip-board photo was taken, but was quite surprised to see some writing on the top of it by the manufacturer in English and not Portuguese. Did someone from England fly this flip-chart over to Portugal to have this meeting? The same people who may be protecting them?

Perhaps a seperate thread would be the better way to go.

I think there is a lot worth looking into re the wider agenda, would you mind starting the new thread Stella as I don't know how to post up photos daft

and was thinking that the Clipboard photo would be a good start to the OP smilie

by Guest 18.01.11 9:57

Test run on inserting a picture, this is my maiden voyage too !!!!!!!!!!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Yeah, well that was a simple enter Get'em's original post, click on this photo and copy and paste into here. Quite where you get the original photo from and what you have to do to insert is another matter. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] I've learnt something new today. To insert a picture, go to the picture source (pamalams), click on the link in your tool bar. Post on here using the image icon above. It works [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by littlepixie 18.01.11 10:13

"What are the "letters four"? It is believed that they are the name of
the Great Architect of the Universe YHWH (pronounced "Yahway".
(sometimes pronounced Jehovah) in the ancient Hebrew language, from
which the Bible was translated"

That was one of the first things you are taught at the Kingdom Hall. That Gods name is YHWH and that it is some sort of conspiracy that his name has been removed from most Bibles.
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I am in the process of reading books in the Left Behind series where all those taking the mark of the beast have a microchip inserted into them. I have never understood Masons and its the first time I have realised that there are bits of religion mixed up in it all.

by Autumn 18.01.11 10:27

Stella has started a new thread entitled The Wider Agenda where discussion on this topic can be continued.

Thanks Stella maybe we should start an IT section ( come to think of it there already is) confused

by kikoraton 09.02.11 17:17

Don't fret that you haven't heard from me. I'm giving my IT expert plenty of time to understand my chart (of the mobile messages). And I've already started revealing what the writing in the creche records indicates. Secrets shared between Gerry, Naylor, and one other!!
Some posters have said "Give the results to Gonçalo!!" But his published theory is so far from mine, that there wouldn't be any point at this stage.

by YNG 09.02.11 20:34

kikoraton wrote:Don't fret that you haven't heard from me. I'm giving my IT expert plenty of time to understand my chart (of the mobile messages). And I've already started revealing what the writing in the creche records indicates. Secrets shared between Gerry, Naylor, and one other!!
Some posters have said "Give the results to Gonçalo!!" But his published theory is so far from mine, that there wouldn't be any point at this stage.

Great work kikoraton , we wait in anticipation clapping

by Guest 10.02.11 11:21

That's the thing, the calls alone did not paint much of a picture. But, the calls in conjunction with the creche activity, might just paint a whole different picture.

I have been told that the guest who left one day early, hours after the alarm was raised, has never been spoken to by any Police authority !!!

Why did they not speak to all of the guests who came into direct contact with the McCann's?

This is where the key lies. With the creche records, plus the other guests, plus the phone records.

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by Guest 10.02.11 12:04

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I would have thought that all the parents of other children in the creche with Madeleine might have been interviewed. There is no record of the Naylors having been interviewed, for example. Do you think that they might have been and their statements withheld? Or perhaps the creche was not seen to be a pivotal part of the investigation at the time.

I agree with you Stella that the solution lies in linking together the various factors:the creche records, the phone records, the photographs of Madeleine ( or rather the lack of them), the difficulty of obtaining a Madeleine-specific DNA sample from 5A.

How I would love to know who was in the " other" Naylor apartment.....!

by Guest 10.02.11 12:20

Hi Alison

This person who I am led to believe has never been spoken to by the PJ, had children in a different creche group to Madeleine, but he was there in the Tapas bar the night the alarm was raised and he claims that his children played with Madeleine that day !!!

In my opinion, he is a very important witness as to Madeleine's identification.

I would think that the Naylor's were never interviewed. This other guest who left early, should have raised alarm bells, but they never bothered to get in touch with him!!! Why not?

by Judge Mental 10.02.11 14:37

The guest who left early needs to be interrogated by the PJ. No matter who he is!

by kikoraton 13.02.11 18:54

"Why did they not speak to all of the guests who came into direct contact with the McCann's?

This is where the key lies. With the creche records, plus the other guests, plus the phone records."

I have come to the view that we were all blinded by the relationship between the McCanns and the other Tapas members. We spent hours analysing what Oldfield or O'Brien had to say, and setting great store on their comical interviews with the Leicestershire Constabulary. I now lean towards the idea that the Tapas Seven were marginal. They were the wallpaper to keep us "occupied", and to keep our eye (and the Police's) off the main collaborators.
I think I know who was in the "other" Naylor apartment. I.e., in G4N which was booked by its anonymous owner in the name of Naylor. Those occupants may well not have needed transfers or flights, since they were not part of a Tourist Agency package. But then, the Naylors were part of an agency package - and yet somehow they didn't need transfers or flights either. Hmmmm. Onwards and upwards.

by kikoraton 13.02.11 19:00

Oh, and by the way: if any "strangers'" eyes are reading here where they shouldn't be, another forum member also knows what I think I know.
If you see what I mean.

by kikoraton 16.02.11 18:54

Stella pointed out in a nice colourful chart, on Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:22 am (sorry, I'm not clever enough to reproduce it), that on 3 May it was unusually KMcC who picked up the presumed substitute Madeleine from Lobsters, and nobody signed out the twins.
This doesn't surprise me at all. The picking up of "Madeleine" occurred at 1225. At 1224, GMcC was busy taking his only and possibly most important call of the day (before abduction-hour, that is). A 12-second call from Prof Iain Squire of Leicester University. Hence, KMcC had to do the more mundane duties. At 1224, GMcC was just beginning possibly the most important 8 hours of his life. It was as though his life depended on getting through them successfully.

by **Jill Havern** 16.02.11 18:58

What has Prof Iain Squire of Leicester University got to do with this other than he is an expert in heart failure?

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thinking

have you noticed that this emoticon looks like Mr Amaral....-----------------------------------------------> laughat

by kikoraton 16.02.11 19:17

We don't know the answer to that, Get 'em. Maybe something, maybe nothing. But the point is, that since no other pings were detected from GMcC's mobile that day (before 2314), the call must have been important for him to have switched on his mobile to receive it, and to have switched it off again immediately afterwards.
Another thing to which I am indebted to Stella: her chart shows that nobody signed out the Naylor child on the morning of 3 May. That's unique, because on every other occasion her mother was the one who signed her out. She never missed.
Did you know that, every time the Naylor child attended, GMcC was in close attendance. (In fact, I believe it was he who signed her in - remember this is all about handwriting?). And of course he also signed in "Madeleine". When E Naylor didn't attend, "Madeleine" did (of course, she and the twins were forced to attend creche every damn morning and afternoon) but it was KMcC who signed her in. No sign of GMcC. Believe me, this is significant.

by Judge Mental 17.02.11 0:22

It can come in very handy having a friend or colleague who is an expert in heart failure, especially if a failing of the heart has been detected.

It rather looks as if McCann is never off the job, even when he is on holiday. Work calls ay?
Pull the other one.

by Guest 17.02.11 8:47

	sun	mon	tue	wed	thur
Lobsters	29	30	1	2	3

AM in	9.45	9.30	9.30	9.20	9.10
AM out	12.15	12.10	12.20	12.30	12.25
PM in	2.45	3.15	2.30	2.45	2.50
PM out	5.30	3.30		5.30	5.30


Jellyfish	29	30	1	2	3

AM in	missing	9.20	9.20	9.10	missing
AM out	missing	12.15	12.20	12.25	missing
PM in	2.35	3.25	2.30	2.40	2.45
PM out	5.30	5.20	5.20	5.20	5.25


		KM	signed

		GM	signed