Re: Three university forensic psychologists say > 'Anti-McCann Trolls Cannot be Cured'

by beejay 22.02.17 14:19

Unfortunately there are some pretty unpleasant people surfing the internet who indulge in vitriolic abuse and can rightly be described as "trolls", but Twitter is by far the worst social medium for this type of behaviour, partly because it is instant and reactive.

The frustrating aspect of this particular research study is that it does not make any attempt to differentiate between the genuine trolls, who we all condemn, and web-based forums such as this where in general the contributors are serious, inquisitive and measured in their postings on such a controversial subject.

Instead the authors of the study have unfairly banded together all those who do not subscribe to their own perceived wisdom of an abduction into one amorphous mass of "anti-McCanns" and then are selective in finding those posts that conform to their trolling subtext.

That is not an impartial academic paper, it is a self-fulfilling parody that completely ignores the fact that 10 years on, there is still a large body of people who are drawn to this case simply because it is one of the biggest unsolved mysteries of our time.

by ChippyM 22.02.17 14:32

What's_up_doc? wrote:
woodbine wrote:This 'research' stinks of desperation. The Mccanns are losing the public relations battle. Every day more and more people become aware of what a farce this case is. Even a master of spin cannot control the internet, and they are left with labeling all people who question the case as incurable trolls. I
I wanted to add that GM is now a professor, mixing in national and international academic circles. According to his own profile statement "Professor McCann directs a very active imaging research programme with funding of £9M from the British Heart Foundation, MRC the NIHR and industry. In 2016 the British Heart Foundation advertised the position of personal chair at Huddersfield, looking for an individual with 'outstanding cardiovascular research achievements and leadership qualities' According to their own blurb, 'The University of Huddersfield has a string of partnerships with industry and practice, 3M Buckley Innovation Centre, Astra Zeneca and the NHS.

I didn't realise he would had such an active, public role. It says he has mentored students in their doctorates too.

http://www2.le.ac.uk/colleges/medbiopsych/events-1/past-events/another

by tinkier 22.02.17 14:47

ChippyM wrote:
What's_up_doc? wrote:
woodbine wrote:This 'research' stinks of desperation. The Mccanns are losing the public relations battle. Every day more and more people become aware of what a farce this case is. Even a master of spin cannot control the internet, and they are left with labeling all people who question the case as incurable trolls. I
I wanted to add that GM is now a professor, mixing in national and international academic circles. According to his own profile statement "Professor McCann directs a very active imaging research programme with funding of £9M from the British Heart Foundation, MRC the NIHR and industry. In 2016 the British Heart Foundation advertised the position of personal chair at Huddersfield, looking for an individual with 'outstanding cardiovascular research achievements and leadership qualities' According to their own blurb, 'The University of Huddersfield has a string of partnerships with industry and practice, 3M Buckley Innovation Centre, Astra Zeneca and the NHS.

I didn't realise he would had such an active, public role. It says he has mentored students in their doctorates too.

http://www2.le.ac.uk/colleges/medbiopsych/events-1/past-events/another

Using your link above,scroll down to the 4th picture….a few well known faces? Must have needed a few more bums on seats.

by sallypelt 22.02.17 15:27

I believe that this research paper was published by Elsevier. I have asked for this to be confirmed, as I don’t have enough time, at the moment, to go into this thread in depth. However, here are a few comments about Elsevier:

Elsevier is one of the most profitable companies in the world,
- profit is the money that remains after all the production and reproduction has been paid,
- Elsevier's profit comes mostly from the funds of Universities, research agencies and research projects (any penny saved there means additional research being paid from it),
- the entire business of finding the appropriate peers to review, of making decisions about publications and of attracting the researchers to submit is done by volunteering scientists, hence does not depend on Elsevier's profit, not even of its return of investment, but rather amounts to another donation from the scientific community to this same profit.

Same old, same old: Elsevier justifying their crazily inflated prices by taking credit for the work done by volunteer academic editors and peer-reviewers.

Next time we see a pro-Elsevier puff-piece like this, I'd like to see them explain why being "sustainable" for them costs an order of magnitude more than it does for newer born-digital publishers like Ubiquity Press, Hindawi and PeerJ. And yes, I do mean literally an order of magnitude: income of about $5000 US per published paper for Elsevier and its contemporaries, income around $500 per paper for the new open-access publishers.

http://www.nature.com/news/scientists-in-germany-peru-and-taiwan-to-lose-access-to-elsevier-journals-1.21223

by MayMuse 22.02.17 15:30

tinkier wrote:
ChippyM wrote:
What's_up_doc? wrote:
woodbine wrote:This 'research' stinks of desperation. The Mccanns are losing the public relations battle. Every day more and more people become aware of what a farce this case is. Even a master of spin cannot control the internet, and they are left with labeling all people who question the case as incurable trolls. I
I wanted to add that GM is now a professor, mixing in national and international academic circles. According to his own profile statement "Professor McCann directs a very active imaging research programme with funding of £9M from the British Heart Foundation, MRC the NIHR and industry. In 2016 the British Heart Foundation advertised the position of personal chair at Huddersfield, looking for an individual with 'outstanding cardiovascular research achievements and leadership qualities' According to their own blurb, 'The University of Huddersfield has a string of partnerships with industry and practice, 3M Buckley Innovation Centre, Astra Zeneca and the NHS.

I didn't realise he would had such an active, public role. It says he has mentored students in their doctorates too.

http://www2.le.ac.uk/colleges/medbiopsych/events-1/past-events/another
Using your link above,scroll down to the 4th picture….a few well known faces? Must have needed a few more bums on seats.

How many other parents of a missing child have had their own career ( or life) propelled in such a way?
Progress has not been thwarted in Gerry's profession has it?
Remind me, how much time has he spent on searching for his daughter, Madeleine ?

by ChippyM 22.02.17 15:45

tinkier wrote:Snipped...........Using your link above,scroll down to the 4th picture….a few well known faces? Must have needed a few more bums on seats.

The McCanns out in force. They respect him and are proud of his achievements obviously. It's no wonder they wouldn't want to believe he could have lied about what happened. It would be hard for them. I don't have much sympathy when it comes to the hounding to death of people with the 'dossier' though.

by IAmNotMerylStreep 22.02.17 16:36

I'm surprised the Professor of Cardiovascular Sciences doesn't seem to have given Philomena a lecture about the damage she's doing to her heart.

But then the Dossier proved she doesn't have one.

by sandancer 22.02.17 16:56

Has all that work he's been doing not " hindered the search for Madeleine " ?

Can't see Kate sitting there proudly , can anyone else ?

by MayMuse 22.02.17 19:40

Perhaps these forensic psychologists could look at sick perverts who harm children! The latest is a volunteer from the MET!

A volunteer Met Police officer has admitted sexually assaulting a child.
Serving special sergeant Craig Keane, 28, pleaded guilty to nine counts of sexual assault of a child aged under 13.
Keane, who worked at a school in Chelmsford, Essex, admitted the offences at Snaresbrook Crown Court on Monday.
He was caught after Met officers in the Sexual Offences Exploitation and Child Abuse Command launched an investigation.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/met-police-special-sergeant-admits-sexually-abusing-a-child-a3472981.html

Sorry, slightly off-topic but a better use of time and "expertise" for these so called psychologists, me thinks.

by **Tony Bennett** 02.03.17 19:49

I have not yet finished compiling a letter of complaint to the University of Huddersfield about this seriously flawed research project.

Meanwhile , @MayMuse (thank you) has posted on the Twitter thread this scarcely believable news.

This utterly flawed research report that we've discussed on four pages of this thread has now made the Washington Post:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-intersect/wp/2017/03/02/how-researchers-tried-to-understand-one-of-twitters-oldest-trolling-groups/?postshare=6431488478372073&tid=ss_tw-bottom&utm_term=.b5e2db15429b

So it has not only been published in one of the world's leading scientific journals, Nature (see upthread), but has now been published in one of the world's leading broadsheet newspapers.

Not only that, but the Washington Post has given the whole story a still more sinister twist by referring to 'anti-McCann internet trolls' as "One of Twiter's Oldest Trolling Groups".

I don't know what other members and guests think about this, but it seems clear to me at least that the average Washington Post reader (and there are millions of them), will make these simple links:

Maddie was abducted >> very nasty people doubt the story >> and for 10 years have been abusing the McCanns on Twitter >> these people who doubt the McCanns are so psychologically disturbed that they are beyond cure.

This tiny, flawed research project at the University of Huddersfield is now being used worldwide to promote the abduction narrative and at the same time brand all doubters as 'nasty, disturbed trolls'. It's possible that some British newspapers may now pick up and run with this story.

I hope that others here will share my outrage at this development, and can also see the sinister significance of it, and, if so, please express your thoughts here about the implications of this new article

Thank you

by Phoebe 02.03.17 20:50

What's most surprising to me is that these eminent scientists of psychology, given their obvious interest false stories and fake news, have never bothered to examine the labyrinth of the McCanns and Tapas friends statements in the P.J. files. Now that is a psychological study worth carrying out! Perhaps they could give me an insight into the mind of an allegedly sane and intelligent person who can't remember what door he used to enter his apartment a mere 24 hours later, cant remember who had high tea for the last time ever with their child, who read her a story, who bathed her. Nor can he remember if or why he sent his friend to visit the apartment ( remember, these events are fresh when he gives his statement). His equally learned friend can't remember that Kate was wearing a towel and dripping water when she shooed him away, can't recall the colour of the kids pyjamas or what they talked about. Gerry and Jez cant remember seeing Jane Tanner passing them, and according to their reconstruction, they agree that she cant remember which side of the road she was on. I could go on with more but Id say that's enough for our erudite psychologists to start with. "Is selective amnesia contagious around the McCanns?" Perhaps that could be their working title. spin

by petunia 02.03.17 21:41

I have read this report and re read this report and IMO It could apply to Anti and Pro McCanns.

-------

Maybe, petunia, but there's no doubt, is there, about the media spin, slant and hype about this flawed piece of research, witness the first headline we saw: 'Anti-McCann trolls can't be cured'.

And that's the way this research is now being promoted - far and wide - Mod

.

by sandancer 02.03.17 21:44

Maybe they could also consider why a group of well educated individuals when giving their statements became inarticulate , gibbering fools ?

One couldn't even remember how old she was !

by **Tony Bennett** 02.03.17 21:49

ALERT! ALERT!

Bits in red bold below:

----

Exploring the world of the Madeleine McCann trolls

Phys.Org

A decade has passed since the disappearance of toddler Madeleine McCann on holiday in Portugal, but activity online regarding the case is constant, ...

A decade has passed since the disappearance of toddler Madeleine McCann on holiday in Portugal, but activity online regarding the case is constant, with some of this commentary being directed in the form of abuse, a behaviour commonly referred to as 'trolling'. It is estimated that every hour there are more than 100 tweets posted using the McCann hashtag.
Now, University of Huddersfield psychology researchers have entered the world of internet trolls and their abusive, aggressive language, directed towards those who disagree with them.

Described in a new journal article, the project has led to a call for measures - including an end to pseudonyms on Twitter - that would curb the anonymity that enables cyber-trolling.

The work is featured in an online editorial headed: ‘The dark side of social media’ for the prestigious journal, Nature, and the research reinforces newly-revealed UK Government plans to curb cyber abuse.

The University of Huddersfield's Dr John Synnott - who co-authored the new article in Computers in Human Behaviour - commented that: "It is encouraging to see that ministers have called the major social media platforms to Whitehall to demand that they do more to protect people online from cyber bullying and trolling or face sanctions. This is a step in the right direction by making these platforms responsible for negative behaviour that they unfortunately enable."

Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2017-03-exploring-world-madeleine-mccann-trolls.html#jCp

by plebgate 02.03.17 21:50

Thanks Tony - I am outraged by this and yet again am impressed by the way you seek to make sure there is fair play on all sides.

I agree that there is way too much negativity being used to describe so-called anti-McCann questioners and I think it should be pointed out that many thousands of people prefer to be seen as "pro Maddie" who are simply responding to her parents plea to the general public for help in finding their daughter. Without these questions being asked and answered many people will continue to think that something isn't right about the whole case I believe.

As for the ridiculous phrase one of Twitters oldest trolling groups it can to me only be seen as inflammatory and unfair language.

In 2004 or thereabouts questions were starting to be asked about Lance Armstrong.

In 2006 Twitter was launched so did anyone actually investigate to see whether any so-called trolls were asking questions on twitter about him before writing this article and if they were why didn't these psychologists research that?

I certainly do believe that this is bias of the highest order against pro Maddie posters and we are seeing far too much of it for my liking.

The internet allows us all to see a lot of what would have in the past been able to be printed in journals without a "target" group even being aware of it.

I am glad to see that these people can be challenged thanks to the internet and people like Tony and others who exchange information in the interests of fair play.

If they don't like it tough. ARRRGGGHHHH.

by plebgate 02.03.17 22:04

Also as someone posted earlier up thread how does anyone know whether some of the "troll" posts weren't actually paid shills?

Some of us were suspicious when Tony started getting supportive posts just before his criminal court appearance along the lines of good post Tony you have really made me change my mind about this case blah blah blah and as we pointed out at the time how could this possibly be used as evidence against him in a court of law as nobody knew whether the posts were genuine or not?

Fairness and a right to reply must apply imo.

by Guest 02.03.17 23:13

Thanks Tony - This research is clearly facile and I believe the assertion 'There is no cure for anti-McCann trolls' is incredibly crass and reductive. Firstly, a distinction needs to be made between a disruptive minority who choose to undermine and often discredit with often duplicitous motives, who get personal and can be rightly labelled 'trolls' and a growing number of people who, in the pursuit of justice take to the Internet in the hope of justice and desire to use their collective might for the common good. These people are more appropriately referred to as Internet Sleuths or ordinary, decent people.

If we take the case of Steven Avery in America there has been a huge outpouring of public indignation and a real desire on the part of ordinary people to see justice served. Kathleen Zellner harnesses this - she uses Twitter to communicate with these people and she often re-tweets posts from now quite famous Internet Sleuths such as Foghaze. There has been a real appreciation of the positive contribution these people make and I find their efforts admirable and the work they do truly inspirational. I would add your group and your efforts to this category.

I would also add that most forums are now moderated successfully and I certainly have not found trolling to be an issue. I believe this 'research' is very low grade and and does not address the underlying causes of why people are turning away from mainstream media. It also seems to suggest by asserting there is 'no cure' for this group who are labelled trolls that it is a sickness rather than a symptom of an ailing mainstream media that appears incapable of investigative journalism. The researcher fails to acknowledge that there is such a thing as righteous anger and if inarticulate people get personal we shouldn't forget that their sentiments may be well founded even if their expression is ugly. However, I would challenge the spurious assertion that there is 'no cure' and say actually, in the case of Madeleine McCann, there is a 'cure' and that cure is the truth. If confidence was restored there would be less anger, mistrust and cynicism and probably a lot less trolling.

by jeanmonroe 03.03.17 1:23

'Anti-McCann Trolls Cannot be Cured'

Conversely, can,

'PRO-McCann Trolls BE Cured'?

'Rainne @ dirndlass'?

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/169572/Mccann-troll-Brenda-Leyland-driven-to-suicide-after-twitter-death-threats

Today we can disclose some of the appalling comments sent to her. The first states: “Hoping you get beaten so bad you beg for mercy, only to have gasoline thrown on you and set ablaze.”

The next adds: “You have reached the end of your torturing campaign against the McCann family, understand.”

The third message is a direct threat against her life with the sadistic author stating: “Death is waiting and watching for u @sweepyface..Do you feel it????”

The next attack was so disgusting it is unsuitable for publication.

The last message states: “Sweepyface, we’re coming for you. Do you feel us?? The decent kind folk who pray for this family and their sad loss.You go to hell *****.”

All the 'above'.... sent by PRO-McCann 'supporters'!

McCann family spokesman Clarence Mitchell, responding to the alleged online death threats against Brenda Leyland, said yesterday: “We will not be commenting. It is a matter for the coroner.”

Oh come on, Clarrie, you're not usually so erm, y'know........'QUIET'! (about Anti-Mc 'trolls!)

by Guest 03.03.17 9:21

Another issue with regards 'trolling' is that it is in some people's interest to perpetuate a sense of victimhood and it is very common for certain individuals or organized groups to exploit this so they can gain sympathy or support. There was a recent case involving Scottish Nationalists were an online petition was started that appeared to show a huge number of people in England were becoming anti-Scottish. It was nearly raised in parliament by the nationalists until it was revealed that most of the supporters came from Scotland. We see the same thing now with the frequent spurious reporting of hate crimes. Any sophisticated research into the subject of trolling needs to recognize this. Something similar happened after the tragic death of Jo Cox, there was a deliberate attempt to use this tragedy for political gain by attempting to portray those who were on the side of remain as enlightened and pure and those on the side of leave asz a bunch of swivel-eyed loons who keep bad company. A sort of contamination if you like - but it back fired. A similar thing here with the Mccanns - you are damned by association and it smacks of desperation. As my son said to me when I first became interested in this case, no one believes the mainstream narrative anymore and he's right. I believe it's a death rattle and it's going to get pretty shrill before the truth outs.

by sallypelt 03.03.17 20:07

Hang in there, folks. The "anti-Mccanns" and the McCann "trolls" have been assessed. It's now the turn of the "pro-McCann group"

Snipped

"Dr Synott is now planning to extend the research by analysing the pro McCann camp"

This should be a corker!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-subjected-150-9960117

by **Tony Bennett** 03.03.17 20:38

sallypelt wrote:Hang in there, folks. The "anti-Mccanns" and the McCann "trolls" have been assessed. It's now the turn of the "pro-McCann group"

Snipped

"Dr Synott is now planning to extend the research by analysing the pro McCann camp"

This should be a corker!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-subjected-150-9960117

I am afraid to say @ sallypelt that there is absolutely no cause for optimism here. I very much doubt whether they have any intention at all to research the 'pro-McCann camp' - and even if they did, would it produce headlines like this headline in the Mirror article tonight?:

Madeleine McCann's parents subjected to 150 abusive tweets a DAY from online trolls

Let us just pause for a good few moments to collect our thoughts on this article.

The headline will have been read by some 2-3 million Mirror readers. It is just as bad a headline as the combined efforts of Sonia Poulton and Rosalind Hutton managed to achieve with their article in the Sun two years ago, headlined: "I can be quite a bitch. I gave as good as I got. I enjoyed the wars and the spats".

The Mirror headline or similar may well appear in other British newspapers over the weekend.

Let us remember with some solemnity that it was headlines not unlike this which immediately preceded Brenda Leyland being driven to her suicide.

This wretched, seriously flawed, hugely biased University of Huddersfield research is being shamelessly used to once again represent the McCanns as innocent, heroic sufferers, persecuted by a band of obsessed, perhaps disturbed or psychotic, 'haters'. Feature-writers may write follow-up articles in the coming days reinforcing the message.

I have no doubt that forums like CMOMM will, in the minds of many members of the public, be tarred with the same brush.

After Amaral's great court victory and the Portuguese Supreme Court stating the obvious - that the McCanns were never cleared - the Mccanns were suddenly on the defensive.

Articles like this in the Mirror wil be a significant setback to our cause, make no mistake about that

by sallypelt 03.03.17 20:44

Tony Bennett wrote:
sallypelt wrote:Hang in there, folks. The "anti-Mccanns" and the McCann "trolls" have been assessed. It's now the turn of the "pro-McCann group"

Snipped

"Dr Synott is now planning to extend the research by analysing the pro McCann camp"

This should be a corker!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-subjected-150-9960117
I am afraid to say @ sallypelt that there is absolutely no cause for optimism here. I very much doubt whether they have any intention at all to research the 'pro-McCann camp' - and even if they did, would it produce headlines like this headline in the Mirror article tonight?:

Madeleine McCann's parents subjected to 150 abusive tweets a DAY from online trolls

Let us just pause for a good few moments to collect our thoughts on this article.

The headline will have been read by some 2-3 million Mirror readers. It is just as bad a headline as the combined efforts of Sonia Poulton and Rosalind Hutton managed to achieve with their article in the Sun two years ago, headlined: "I can be quite a bitch. I gave as good as I got. I enjoyed the wars and the spats".

The Mirror headline or similar may well appear in other British newspapers over the weekend.

Let us remember with some solemnity that it was headlines not unlike this which immediately preceded Brenda Leyland being driven to her suicide.

This wretched, seriously flawed, hugely biased University of Huddersfield research is being shamelessly used to once again represent the McCanns as innocent, heroic sufferers, persecuted by a band of obsessed, perhaps disturbed or psychotic, 'haters'. Feature-writers may write follow-up articles in the coming days reinforcing the message.

I have no doubt that forums like CMOMM will, in the minds of many members of the public, be tarred with the same brush.

After Amaral's great court victory and the Portuguese Supreme Court stating the obvious - that the McCanns were never cleared - the Mccanns were suddenly on the defensive.

Articles like this in the Mirror wil be a significant setback to our cause, make no mistake about that

I am on the same page as you, Tony. I just couldn't resist being facetious. If it wasn't so pathetic it would be funny.

by 23 Librae 03.03.17 21:33

I have just downloaded the journal article and had a quick skim (will read it properly over the weekend) and I can't believe what I am reading. Flawed, unscientific, biased and I have just found out that because I dare to ask questions that I might meet the criteria for anti-social personality disorder.
I actually feel rather embarrassed for the authors, how it got published I don't know.
Is there any conflicts of interest that were not disclosed I wonder?

by Roxyroo 03.03.17 22:46

As some of you were aware i was having problems getting an electric wheelchair fr my daughter as a direct result of the cutbacks. I had been given a second hand chair from the only service left operating in my area, but the repairs to it were going to cost me at least £1000. I had to set up a go fundme page, which i now regret, but i was so panicked that my daughter was going to yet again be housebound. Anyway after a few weeks of not acheiving anywhere near enough money i admit to loosing self control and joining twitter specifically to "troll" my local MP , the snp, nicola sturgeon and the disabilities minister, as well as writing long well thought out letters. I kept it up relentlessly fr three weeks. Low and behold a phonecall from said service asking which colour we wanted a brand new chair in and that until that chair arrived a temporary one wld be arriving in the morning. So "trolling" does have its place in the world, (even if it was just to shut me up about the cutbacks), no matter how much these folk try to say we're all mad. We can't ALL be surely?

by JRP 03.03.17 23:11

The McCanns have the press to get their message across to a very wide audience. They have the BBC who are complicit in helping them get their innocent message into the houses of the ill informed. They have celebrities who fall over themselves to back their abduction theory. They have access to lawyers paid for by donations from the public.
Those who doubt the story only have social media and Youtube.

I don't hate the McCanns, I simply believe they know what happened to their daughter and they have covered it up, with help for those named above, and others, to conceal a crime or crimes.

There is no evidence of an abduction, so why is it being pushed at us from every angle?

Three university forensic psychologists say > 'Anti-McCann Trolls Cannot be Cured'