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The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by polyenne on 06.08.17 21:11

There is a very active force within and without trying to destroy CMoMM, please don't give them ammunition


Please elaborate "very active force within"
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 06.08.17 23:10

@polyenne

Goodness me - please don't be perturbed, I didn't mean to alarm anyone.  Rest assured the forum owner, with the help of the support team, do everything possible to ensure the safety of CMoMM members when online - genuine members have nothing to worry about in this respect.

Members can however help to lighten the load by keeping CMoMM's integrity and reputation on track by restricting commentary to fact, intelligence and informed debate.  A modicum of self-restraint isn't too much to ask, I'm sure all will agree.

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by roz on 07.08.17 6:13

The possibility of the make-up photo of Madeleine being taken at C5C was mentioned further up this thread re the video clip of an apartment (clip by Ben Salmon I think). That was my little bone of contention as the Gorrods were booked to stay at C5C from Monday 30th (and the make-up photo is suggested here on CMoMM as being taken on Sunday 29th).
https://www.facebook.com/groups/253706621672502/permalink/456367711406391/
Also from James and Charlotte Gorrod thread here:
British family caught up in the investigation say detectives have cleared them of any link to the case. Solicitor JamesGorrod, from Exeter, and his family happened to be in the resort at the same time, but never met the McCann’s.
http://www.mccannfiles.com/

James Gorrod, 34, a solicitor from Exeter, said that detectives had cleared him and his wife of any link to her disappearance. They had raised suspicion because they were a couple who were on holiday with the McCann’s and had hired a car with a child seat. However, it transpired that they were travelling with their two-year-old son.
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id11.html

I personally do not believe that the Gorrods were present when the make-up photo of Madeleine was taken (wherever it was taken), or were involved in any way with what happened to Madeleine.

I do believe that they met up with their friend Jane on Monday 30th around the Tapas area.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 07.08.17 12:02

@roz #503

A fair and well reasoned response if I might say - it's so easy to sometimes go wandering off into the twilight zone by other comments and association of thoughts,  I do it myself.  At the risk of being repetitive, it does however tend to take a topic off track and ends in the propagation of unsubstantiated myth.  Some such nonsense, born in this way in the very early days, is still being repeated and seemingly believed, to this day.

On the flip side, there are those who will only believe what they want to believe.  No matter how many times you present facts, figures etc. makes no difference, they will still believe their fantasy.  CMoMM is no place for this mindset, not only does it damage the forums true purpose but it compromises all the years of hard graft volunteered by a number of diligent diehards, named and anonymous, whose only goal is to see justice for little Madeleine McCann - so often forgotten in the war of words.  Twitter is an ideal breeding ground for unmitigated nonsense, slander and unacceptable public behaviour and of course, there are a number of blogs and fora out there who happily promote nonsensical theorizing and 'cesspit' [sic] bashing - no shortage of platforms for those with idle hands!  I like to think CMoMM is a more sophisticated venue that actively discourages the kind of behaviour seen elsewhere.

The press of course are always on the look out for anything connected to the mystery of Madeleine McCann that they can turn into juicy sensationalism - they are not to be trusted!  Less so when there information emanates from an unspecified 'source'.

See - there you go, I'm digressing!  Back on topic ....

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by roz on 07.08.17 14:15

I must say that I do have my doubts as to where and when that make-up photograph of Madeleine was taken, that is whether it was taken in Portugal at all.
But the one thing about this forum is that we are invited to discuss, debate, put forward our thoughts and theories - even we agree to disagree.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by dartinghero on 09.08.17 1:40

Having just read the thread, my two penn'orth for what it's worth;

I think hair length is the same in the 3 photos.
I don't necessarily think an adult had to put a necklace on - it looks like a child's play necklace rather than a proper accessory.
I don't think her pupils look dilated with the photo at normal size - they start to appear so (indistinct pupil edges) when the picture is enlarged.
It looks to me like she is wearing eyeliner (which would definitely require an adult to apply) but I don't see lipstick.
The black thing on the wall looks like it may be a bracket for a light to me.
The blue thing in the bottom corner of the pic - I initially thought was a plastic chair but the more I look at it, could be a top of a shoulder.
Preparing for a telling off for this last bit, but here goes: the photo looks to me like it wasn't taken in England/Ireland in April. The quality of the light looks much warmer than the harsher light of the UK. I realise that the last bit isn't scientific :-\

Upthread there is a quote from the bewk saying that KM sat down with notepad and pen making notes about the dated holiday photos - what, all 5 of them?!
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 09.08.17 12:00

@dartinghero wrote:Upthread there is a quote from the bewk saying that KM sat down with notepad and pen making notes about the dated holiday photos - what, all 5 of them?!
laugh  That merits quote of the day!

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by sandancer on 09.08.17 13:47

@Verdi wrote:
@dartinghero wrote:Upthread there is a quote from the bewk saying that KM sat down with notepad and pen making notes about the dated holiday photos - what, all 5 of them?!
laugh  That merits quote of the day!


Surely it should only be 4 photos , cos no one can remember who took the Tennis Balls photo ? :baffled:

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by JRP on 09.08.17 15:43

@sandancer wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@dartinghero wrote:Upthread there is a quote from the bewk saying that KM sat down with notepad and pen making notes about the dated holiday photos - what, all 5 of them?!
laugh  That merits quote of the day!


Surely it should only be 4 photos , cos no one can remember who took the Tennis Balls photo ? :baffled:

Must have taken ages.
Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, Sunday

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by polyenne on 09.08.17 15:47

Don't forget the "off-site" image notations, most probably from their Scottish office
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 09.08.17 15:57

@JR wrote:
Must have taken ages.
Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, Sunday
Maybe she was altering times and dates - we wouldn't want to mislead the PJ now would we?

According to Steve Gibson's feerie, when Gerry McCann told the PJ he didn't have any further photographs, he actually meant he didn't have any further photographs that he wanted to hand over to the PJ.  Conclusion therefore..


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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by JRP on 09.08.17 16:09

@Verdi wrote:
@JR wrote:
Must have taken ages.
Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, Sunday
Maybe she was altering times and dates - we wouldn't want to mislead the PJ now would we?

According to Steve Gibson's feerie, when Gerry McCann told the PJ he didn't have any further photographs, he actually meant he didn't have any further photographs that he wanted to hand over to the PJ.  Conclusion therefore..


I'm sorry, I only managed the first episode of the Steve Gibson show, but without subtitles it's hard work.

Was this in the episode where he plays a statement analyst or the one where he plays a body language expert?

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 12.08.17 21:27

@JRP wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@JR wrote:
Must have taken ages.
Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, Sunday
Maybe she was altering times and dates - we wouldn't want to mislead the PJ now would we?

According to Steve Gibson's feerie, when Gerry McCann told the PJ he didn't have any further photographs, he actually meant he didn't have any further photographs that he wanted to hand over to the PJ.  Conclusion therefore..


I'm sorry, I only managed the first episode of the Steve Gibson show, but without subtitles it's hard work.

Was this in the episode where he plays a statement analyst or the one where he plays a body language expert?
On this particular occasion I think he was playing super sleuth - or should that be souper sloof smilie ?

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Get'emGonçalo on 23.09.17 12:07

A lurker on the forum has asked me to remind members and guests of a series of tweets made by self-proclaimed ‘criminologist’ and ‘child protection expert’ Mark Williams-Thomas about that ‘Make-Up Photo’.

When this video was released, there was a storm of protest on social media and in a couple of mainstream newspapers.

Among those to express great concern over the Make-Up image was Mark Williams-Thomas, who then made these five tweets in fairly quick succession:

1) “On the eve of Madeleine's disappearance I agree with the release of a new photo but question the appropriateness of the photo chosen”

2) “Have not yet seen the new Madeleine video but the photograph is so inappropriate & damaging on so many levels - ill advised again”

3) “Am trying to find out now who gave advise [sic] to use the make up photo - so damaging - as I know what it will become”

4) Jon Corner may b able 2 answer ur question on who advised the McCanns to release THAT picture. He's friends with Esther McVey”

5) “No response yet re who advised of the use of recent photo of Madeleine - as soon as I get a response will let u know”.


The lurker wrote to me:

“There is quite a lot of information that we can extract from these five tweets, and a number of questions arise:

A Even Mark Williams-Thomas, a noted McCann-supporter, went so far as to describe
the Make-Up Photo as: (i) damaging, on so many levels (ii) so inappropriate and (iii)
ill-advised. So much for those who keep on insisting that this is just a child enjoying
playing with Mummy’s make-up box (a story we know anyway is simply not true

B Job Corner is declared once again as responsible for the production of this
controversial video, and therefore by implication at least in part responsible for the
inclusion in that video of both the Make-Up Photo and the Skirting Board Photo

C Mark Williams-Thomas tweets that “Jon Corner may b able 2 answer ur question on
who advised the McCanns to release THAT picture”. He therefore ASSUMES that
the McCanns authorised its release. But did they? That has not been admitted or
proven. Moreover, when the video was released, the McCanns seemed to be caught
entirely unawares, and seemed at a loss as to how to explain it, coming up with
‘Playing with Mummy’s make-up box’. We can say that the video was made public by
Jon Corner, maybe with others. But we cannot say that the McCanns authorized its
Release.

D We are told as a fact that ‘Jon Corner is friends with Esther McVey. This then
suggests that there is a long-standing friendship between these three: Corner,
McVey and Kate McCann, since it is admitted that Esther McVey and Kate McCann
were friends from schooldays

E I do not think that Mark-Williams-Thomas ever found out whether the McCanns
authorised the release of this photo, nor exactly who did authorise its release

F We know that Jon Corner must have had the Make-Up Photo, the Skirting Board
Photo and the Ice Cream Photo in his possession in order to make the video. The
question remains as to how he got each one of them. Did he take any of them? Who
did take each one of them?

G IF, as has been suggested, the Make-Up Photo was taken in Praia da Luz, was it
taken by the McCanns or by somebody else. If so, who?

H In looking at the McCanns’ and Jon Corner’s friendship circle, we need to remember
that a year or more before Madeleine was reported missing, Corner’s daughter
Chloe was a Facebook friend of Catriona Baker, Madeleine’s nanny

I In one newspaper, Jon Corrner was reported to have said that he had ‘been to Praia
da Luz on several previous occasions.


I hope these observations are helpful”.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by NickE on 26.10.17 15:08

They have claimed from the start that she was abducted by paedophiles.
Could the reason to release the make up photo be to show the public how attractive she was for them?
It's sounds bizarre, I know, but I can't find another explanation to do what they did.

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 26.10.17 21:24

@NickE wrote:They have claimed from the start that she was abducted by paedophiles.
Could the reason to release the make up photo be to show the public how attractive she was for them?
It's sounds bizarre, I know, but I can't find another explanation to do what they did.
I've said the same thing in the past - I don't think it's a bizarre suggestion, I think it's perfectly feasible. 

Friend and confidante Jon Corner produced the video that included those inappropriate photographs of Madeleine McCann.  In his words referring to Madeleine..

"So beautiful, astonishingly bright, and I’d have to say very charismatic. She would shine out of a crowd. So—God forgive me—maybe that’s part of the problem. That special quality. Some ******* picked up on that."

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by worriedmum on 26.10.17 22:31

Can some-one please put a copy of the 'make-up photo' on the forum which shows Madeleine's dress? Some members claim it resembles the dress in the 'Last Photo'-but I can't see a dress at all...
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by NickE on 26.10.17 22:51

@worriedmum wrote:Can some-one please put a copy of the 'make-up photo' on the forum which shows Madeleine's dress? Some members claim it resembles the dress in the 'Last Photo'-but I can't see a dress at all...
I have not seen any dress either but if you take a close look below her necklace can you see the same pink colour as the dress in t.l.p.
[size=31]Same colour,Yes.[/size]
[size=31]Same dress, I don't know.
[/size]

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by worriedmum on 27.10.17 21:01

Do you mean just in sight below the necklace? The straps on the pool photo wouldn't come that close to the neck IMO. It has a higher neckline, like the tennis t shirt or even the pyjama top
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Phoebe on 27.10.17 21:16

@worriedmum. Agreed, my first reaction on seeing the shape and angle of the pink material beneath the beads was that it was part of a pink, round-necked style top or T shirt. I don't think the strap of the smock-dress would sit naturally at that angle. In the pool picture the straps sit on her shoulders quite far away from the base of her neck.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by sharonl on 27.10.17 21:44

Didn't Kate make a point of telling us that she didn't have a cardigan for Madeleine on the day that she wore he pink strappy top\dress?   Why would she need to volunteer that information?  Could it be that Madeleine did, in fact, have a cardigan or jacket that day?  Obviously, she wouldn't be wearing it by the pool when it was warm, but the make up photograph seems a bit more shady.

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Mjc on 26.11.17 20:37

This thread is primarily trying to pin down when and where key MM photos were taken. But the question also keeps surfacing on why the makeup photo was released; with it's clearly unsavoury undertone given the circumstances. For me, this is the key question to ask. At face value, it is highly illogical, but there are some situations where it makes complete sense. I'll offer an example, which I will preface by saying this is a purely hypothetical scenario.

If the photograph was taken by someone with abhorrent intentions, as marketing if you will, then the picture may have conceivably been shared with other individuals prior to MMs disappearance. One of these individuals, or someone else uncovering the photo and context, may later have threatened to release the picture and context, unless some of the MM fund was used to buy their silence. I.e. Blackmail, of the McCanns, who would have had to have been at least complicit in such a scenario.

In this situation the choices are very limited: Pay up potentially huge sums, which would in itself arouse suspicion, allow the picture to be released and denounce it as a sick hoax (or claim it must have been taken by the abductor), or release the image themselves in the least conspicuous way possible (maybe not even as a photo but as a brief image in a poor quality video released by a third party). The last option seems the only choice now does it not? Any subsequent blackmail attempt would then just look like a sick hoax by someone making implications about an 'innocent' picture in the public domain.

Again, I am NOT saying this is what happened, just that there are other scenarios where releasing the picture would be an obvious thing to do.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 26.11.17 21:15

Good evening Mjc and welcome to CMoMM thumbsup .

The controversial image of Madeleine McCann, now commonly known as the 'make-up photograph' or the 'Lolita photograph', was included in the infamous video released by the McCanns close friend Jon Corner..



The short video released by Jon Corner for the  Madeleine McCann 2010 anniversary appeal, also included other seeming inappropriate images of Madeleine, as can be seen above.

Before surmising possible scenarios for the release of the 'make-up photograph', it needs to be taken in context with the other inappropriate images included in the video.  This is not the release of one questionable photograph under scrutiny, it's the whole compilation produced by the man who appears to be custodian of all Madeleine McCann photographs.

"So beautiful, astonishingly bright, and I’d have to say very charismatic. She would shine out of a crowd. So—God forgive me—maybe that’s part of the problem. That special quality. Some ******* picked up on that."

Jon Corner

Makes you wonder doesn't it?

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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by loopzdaloop on 26.11.17 21:32

Where's the thread on here that talked about the 'make up' photo being the 'last' photo as it was taken after she was dead.
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Re: The Mystery of the Make-Up Photo - was it taken on the same day as the Last Photo?

Post by Verdi on 27.11.17 0:06

@loopzdaloop wrote:Where's the thread on here that talked about the 'make up' photo being the 'last' photo as it was taken after she was dead.
This is the thread loopzdaloop! 

Although I don't think it can be, or has been, said with any conviction that the photograph was taken after Madeleine died.  In my view a totally unacceptable macabre presumption without evidence.  I don't disagree that there is something very strange about the photograph but I wouldn't like to hazard a guess as to what without some evidence.

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