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The Priests

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Re: The Priests

Post by HiDeHo on 16.12.17 2:53

A few random pics relating to 'priests'












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Re: The Priests

Post by BlueBag on 16.12.17 8:39



Because asking for a Priest 3 hours after your daughter went missing makes complete sense.

"My-my someone fetch a priest
you can't say no to the Beauty and the Beast".
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Re: The Priests

Post by Jill Havern on 16.12.17 8:43

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Re: The Priests

Post by HiDeHo on 16.12.17 10:26

Get'emGonçalo wrote:

When was this photo taken?

eta:



http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PRIESTS.htm


I don't know when the pic was taken but was used by Mail in August 2007

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-477801/Madeleine-Now-Portuguese-press-claims-scent-corpse-McCanns-keys.html
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Re: The Priests

Post by NickE on 09.01.18 20:50

This is snipped from Peter Pattersons witness statement in the files.

Kate asked him to pray at the marina.
Does it mean something special if a Catholic pray on a specific site?

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Re: The Priests

Post by Phoebe on 09.01.18 22:58

"Kate asked him to pray at the marina.
Does it mean something special if a Catholic pray on a specific site?"


In answer to your question, yes it is traditional to pray at the site of a death. A bizarre tradition seems to have flourished here in rural Ireland of erecting roadside shrines at the sites of fatal R.T.A s and the countryside is dotted with them. I think Kate was deliberately trying to push the "abducted and whisked abroad" story and her praying at the marina lark was calculated with this in mind.

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Re: The Priests

Post by Basil with a brush on 09.01.18 23:37

Just a thought, but wonder where the lady (who was alleged by some to share her coffin) ashes were spread.

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Re: The Priests

Post by jazega on 10.01.18 0:12

Does anyone have the actual date the ex-pat lady was cremated.
Was it before or after the McCanns hired the car ?

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Re: The Priests

Post by Verdi on 10.01.18 2:04

Oh come on - beam me up Scotty roll

Peter Patterson was/is an Attorney/Solicitor (now there's a coincidence) not a priest. The oceanic supplication was but a fraction of the witness statement - let's have it in all it's glory to get a feel for the burlesque..

Witness statement of Peter Neal Patterson (family friend) 2008.05.08

Leicestershire Police Squad
Witness Testimony

Testimony of: Peter Neal Patterson

Occupation: Attorney/Solicitor

This testimony (comprised of three pages and signed by me) is the truth and in accordance with my understanding. I give this testimony with the knowledge that, knowingly making false statements may subject me to legal action.

Date: 08 May 2008
Signature:

I am the above referenced person and live at the address previously provided to the police.

I was questioned by DC Ferguson and by DC Messiah of the Leicestershire Police at the request of the Portuguese police whose charge is to investigate the disappearance of Madeleine.

As regards the questions, I can offer the following information:

I became known Kate and Gerry since 2002. My wife (Bridget) and Kate both trained in general medicine and have become good friends. We have also learnt that Kate attended the same university we did in Dundee even though she was not there when we attended. My wife faced some clinical problems (a miscarriage and an ectopic/tubal pregnancy). We discovered after that Kate and Gerry were also having problems conceiving. This brought Bridget and Kate even closer. This occurred in mid-2002. I believe that we tried to get pregnant five years ago. Suddenly Kate became pregnant with Madeleine and my wife and I had our first child, a boy, who was born after Madeleine's birth. Later Kate again became pregnant with Sean and Amelie. Our youngest son was born nine months ago today.

My wife maintains regular contact with Kate and as a result we visited them once in Queniborough. We have yet to visit their home in Rothley. I saw Madeleine for the last time on my sons birthday, the 1st of September of 2006. The friendship between Kate and Bridget is focused on themselves and the children. I have met Gerry and know him well enough to maintain a casual conversation.

Madeleine disappeared on Thursday night of the 03rd of May 2007. Normally I have a habit of listening to the news every morning but on Friday, the 04th of May 2007, I have an early morning meeting and for this reason did not see the news. After the meeting I received a text message from my wife informing me of Madeleine's disappearance. The rest of the week was spent listening to the news, and trying to prevent my son from recognising Madeleine as he has asked what was going on.
My wife and I decided to travel to Portugal. We caught a flight to faro on Tuesday, the 08th of may 2007. We did this in the hopes of offering our help and support and to do something other than just sit at home watching from afar. My wife sent a text message to Kate telling her of our flight. We reached Praia da Luz around 11 or 11:30 that morning.

I caught a ride from the airport to Praia da Luz with someone I knew. There were two receptions in the resort. I asked the functionaries about helping out with the volunteer searches and they told me to head to the hotels principal reception where people would come together every morning. The group that day had already departed and for this reason I caught a taxi to Lagos to try and find a place to stay.

I was at a slight advantage relative to other Brits because I have a slight understanding of the different laws in Portugal. Most people do not understand the difference between the adversarial system of justice in the U.K. and the inquisitorial systems of Europe.

I met Kate and Gerry on Friday after having made contact with them via written messages during the week. They knew I was participating in the searches that week. I felt dispirited because there appeared to be no coordination or leadership to the searches. Many people went searching without adequate local equipment, like for example people were cutting their feet on the rough terrain or on the shrubs in those locales. Many people wore sandal and walked over tough land. I never saw any police involvement in the operations carried out by civilians.

On Friday the 11th of May 2007 we heard rumours that the Portuguese were going to stop the searches. After having passed this information to Kate we met up in the Tapas bar in the resort between 9:30 and 9:45 in the morning. We met for only a half hour to 40 minutes as Kate had to attend a police interview.

During this meeting, I offered Kate a bible. This happened in the sequence of emotions that Kate was obviously feeling and after our having sat down to speak. We did not know each other well as she is predominantly my wifes friend. I am the leader of a South Wigston team run out of the Corporation for Exercise and Salvation, Leicestershire. I have a particular interest in the bible and the form in which it was written. I frequented the course ?Alpha Course? (an introduction to Christianity) a recommended to Kate some of the passages in the bible that she could rand to help comfort. There was a dedication from me to my wife on the first page, as it had previously been a gift from me to her. I have a tendency to mark pages and passages in the bible and even though this was my spouses bible, there were many marked/tagged passages relevant to the both of us. This happened before Madeleines disappearance.

I encouraged Kate to read Psalms X and XX of the Old Testament as I felt these were relevant to her. They are both believers. The Psalms reveal a confidence in God, in his justice and in the question which can be asked ?Why do bad things happen?. Psalms XX is a small oration asking Him to guide and illuminate our path in times of anguish.

The passage which is marked in my wifes bible I believe is Samuel 2:12. This passage is very significant for me and my wife but likely has so significance for Kate. I interpret this passage as saying that even though we cannot be with the two children that we have no lost, we will find them one day.

After meeting with Kate, I returned to Lagos and caught a taxi to Portimao where I had previously (May 2003) visited a Christian bookstore. I went with the purpose to acquire a new bible to help me through the rest of the week. Unfortunately, I did not find the bookstore.

Kate asked me to pray at the Marina, which I did, a number of times during the week. I returned home on Sunday, 13th of May, 2007, leaving from Faro at 9:30.

This testimony was made by me and is the truth in accordance with my understanding.

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Re: The Priests

Post by Basil with a brush on 10.01.18 4:21

@jazega wrote:Does anyone have the actual date the ex-pat lady was cremated.
Was it before or after the McCanns hired the car ?

 The answer to that is most probably within in this forum somewhere. If it isn't, I'm sure someone will help you out Jazega.

I keep telling myself I'm going to give up trying to be an armchair (or 'At work in my lunch hour') detective. I keep ending up back in the same place. If I was doing it physically, my feet would be in an appalling state facepalm

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Re: The Priests

Post by NickE on 10.01.18 9:06

@jazega wrote:Does anyone have the actual date the ex-pat lady was cremated.
Was it before or after the McCanns hired the car ?

I don't think Amaral did mention any exactly date for this.
But wasn't RoB lurking around on "erm...I think it's...erm Cemetery road...erm"?
I'am little confused about this because Amaral said that body could have been in a freezer and the fluids in the car came when the freezed body was melting in the trunk of the car and this was in late May.
Where were this freezer located?
If the freezer were located in pdl the body shouldn't start to melt so soon if they took the body in the car and drove it straight to church in pdl?
I don't believe that they drove around with a body in the car for a longer time.
From an interview with Amaral in CMTV:

A late-night sighting of three figures entering Luz church with a large bag coincided with the existence of a coffin inside the church, he said, into which Madeleine’s body could have been placed.

The coffin - holding the remains of an elderly British resident - was taken the following day for cremation in the Alentejo.

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Re: The Priests

Post by Verdi on 10.01.18 12:28

Witness statement - Peter Patterson.  Attorney/Solicitor
8th May 2008    [snipped]..

During this meeting, I offered Kate a bible. This happened in the sequence of emotions that Kate was obviously feeling and after our having sat down to speak. We did not know each other well as she is predominantly my wifes friend. I am the leader of a South Wigston team run out of the Corporation for Exercise and Salvation, Leicestershire. I have a particular interest in the bible and the form in which it was written. I frequented the course ?Alpha Course? (an introduction to Christianity) a recommended to Kate some of the passages in the bible that she could rand to help comfort. There was a dedication from me to my wife on the first page, as it had previously been a gift from me to her. I have a tendency to mark pages and passages in the bible and even though this was my spouses bible, there were many marked/tagged passages relevant to the both of us. This happened before Madeleines disappearance.

I encouraged Kate to read Psalms X and XX of the Old Testament as I felt these were relevant to her. They are both believers. The Psalms reveal a confidence in God, in his justice and in the question which can be asked ?Why do bad things happen?. Psalms XX is a small oration asking Him to guide and illuminate our path in times of anguish.

The passage which is marked in my wifes bible I believe is Samuel 2:12. This passage is very significant for me and my wife but likely has so significance for Kate. I interpret this passage as saying that even though we cannot be with the two children that we have no lost, we will find them one day.
-----

The open page of Kate McCann's bible - 2 Samuel 12:15 page 320.   Found by the PJ in the bedroom of the McCanns temporary residence at rua das Flores, 27, Luz, Lagos..


The marina..

331 to 344 Witness statement re Kate's relative and psychic vision of Shearwater boat
08-02-outros apenso_VIII volume_II_ Pages _331-342

02volume_II_apenso_VIII_Page_331

LEICESTERSHIRE CONSTABULARY Continuation WITNESS STATEMENT
INFORMATION FROM THE FAMILY
I spoke to Kate McCann on Tuesday 8th of May 07. She told me that a friend of her Aunt & Uncle from Leicester had a friend that had a strong vision that Madeleine was on a boat with a man in the Marina in Logos.
 
This person arrived in Portugal and has spoke to Kate. They have visited the Marina and identified the boat as "SHEARWATER" They saw a man on the boat. but it was not the same man that she had in her vision.
 
This is very important to Kate. I spoke to Glen Pounder if he could make some enqs with regards to the boat.
He has done this and the boat is registered to a Canadian National called Bruce Cook. Glen has told me that George Reyes at the police Stn  is now dealing with the matter with record to doing dvc checks etc.
 
I spoke to Kate today and she has given me photographs of the boat. She has also given me photographs of a man who has been on the boat. This is not the man the woman had in her vision.
This matter is very important to her and she is very pleased that we are making enq's into the matter. Once the enq's have been completed can we please let her know the results.
Thanks 

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Re: The Priests

Post by polyenne on 10.01.18 12:37

Hmmm, interesting article about cremations at Ferreira do Alentejo :

Note the date of the article (2 June 2007) and the date for re-opening (5 June 2007)...... 

Southern Portugal’s only crematorium closed

in News · 02-06-2007 00:00:00 · 0 Comments

The only crematorium in Southern Portugal, in Ferreira do Alentejo, has been closed after six years of non-stop cremations so the incinerator could undergo a thorough inspection and maintenance. Meanwhile, families opting for a cremation, now face exorbitant prices, as funeral homes are now charging one euro a kilometre to take a body from the Algarve to Lisbon and beyond.



Corpses waiting for cremation have had to be put on hold with growing backlogs a common problem, especially in the Algarve.
One funeral agency in Loulé had a body in its fridge for more than 15 days, waiting for the maintenance service to be completed, though the family later decided to send the body to be cremated in Lisbon.
Excluding the cremation, the family had to pay around €250 to have the body of a loved one delivered at a crematorium in the Portuguese capital.
Suspicions have been raised due to the duration of the maintenance service, which commenced over a month ago, despite spokesperson of Portugal’s other four crematoriums (two in Lisbon, two in Oporto) claiming standard maintenance services take little more than three days.
Local authorities have guaranteed the crematorium will be up and running by June 5th.
The Ferreira do Alentejo crematorium was privately founded after a significant donation form local benefactor Mariano Faria who’s dying wish was to be cremated in his place of birth.

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Re: The Priests

Post by polyenne on 10.01.18 12:40

Samuel 12:15 has its fair share of the striking down of children.............

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Re: The Priests

Post by NickE on 10.01.18 13:50

"They have visited the Marina and identified the boat as "SHEARWATER"

"Identified the boat as "Shearwater"?
"Shearwater" is a sort of boats.
I do wonder if they made a mistake with the boats name or...confusion/misleading maybe?

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Re: The Priests

Post by Verdi on 10.01.18 23:45

Peter Patterson was interviewed by the rogatory process in the UK, at the request of the PJ. As can be seen from the interview he took great pains to detail his involvement in 'searching' for Madeleine, texting Kate McCann and the bible belonging to his wife. The wife was Kate McCann's particular friend, by his own admission, Peter Patterson didn't really know her yet he is the spokesman for the duo? This is the other version according to McCanns law

Kate McCann's version of the truth, excerpt from her autobiographical chic-lit..

The Bible

So many people were supporting us in so many different ways, from the high-profile donations of the reward consortium to the quiet prayers and unsung practical acts of friends and strangers alike. On the day of our first meeting with IFLG, I had gone over to the Tapas area to meet up with Paddy, the husband of Bridget, a good friend of mine in Leicester. Paddy is, as Bridget puts it, ‘a man of God’. He’s also six foot three, a big fella generally, with very dark hair and eyes – not someone you’d miss in a crowd. I was so touched that, even though we didn’t know each other all that well then, he had decided, completely off his own bat, to come out to Praia da Luz and join the search parties that were being organized locally. He’d texted me to say, ‘If you want me to call and see you while I’m there, I’ll come. Otherwise I’ll just get on with the search.’ I had asked Paddy if he had a Bible with him I could borrow. He brought me one that had been a Christmas present from him to Bridget several years earlier. That Bible is still sitting next to my bed. I must get round to returning it one day!
-----------

Call me cynical but this smacks to me of the 'innocent explanation for anything the police may find', as postulated by spindoctor in chief - Clarence Mitchell Esquire.

All roads lead to Rome.

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Ferreira do Alentejo

Post by PLL on 28.08.18 23:24

This discussing stopped by 2014, but maybe it could be reopened.

This hypothesis is quite scaring and I hope it can be refuted.

Amaral clarified the Ferreira do Alentejo allegation. He says an old British woman died at Luz, where she lived, and her coffin remained inside PDL Church before burial. Gerry had Church's key lent by the Priest. Some people say 3 people with a box entered the Church in the night. The woman was cremated the next day at Ferreira do Alentejo. So Amaral thinks they might have hidden the body inside the coffin. No dates are offered. No one knows who was the British woman.

Ferreira do Alentejo crematorium was closed for maintenance until June 5th. So this couldn't be before June 4th. That's very strange that Police would let the coffin escape. They searched Maddie everywhere and even inspected a pet crematorium in Algarve (sealed before by authorities).

Coffins for burial are welded before burial, so one can't open them. But coffins for cremation are made of light combustible material and I don't know about closing (and opening).

The coffins enters the crematorium closed. But they say bones must be smashed during cremation to be reduced to ashes. So they had 2 skulls there, how could it be? They would call the Police at once.

There's a single location of McCanns near Ferreira do Alentejo on August 20th from Gerry's phone ping. But they were travelling from PDL to Lisbon and 6 minutes later it pings another zone, so they didn't even stop. If they knew Maddie had been incinerated there, I think they would make a stop. Anyway, in his trip from Lisbon to PDL there's not a single ping, so his mobile was disconnected (dead battery?).

So, it that all anyhow possible?

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Re: The Priests

Post by Verdi on 29.08.18 1:47

This hypothesis was mentioned in passing by Dr Amaral, during an interview, long after he was removed from the case and grossly sensationalized by the media as a direct attack against Dr Amaral. 

It has been repeatedly stated by the Portuguese authorities, as with any police force in the civilized world,  that all hypothesis are considered feasible until ruled out by investigative procedures, no matter how unlikely.  The cremation hypothesis was an example of just one of the many possible lines of inquiry prompted by intelligence and/or witness testimony.

The identity of the person waiting for cremation must have been known, firstly by whoever arranged and paid for the cask and the cremation, even it there wasn't a next of kin.  Then there is the death certificate, if the person was from the UK then the Foreign and Commonwealth Office would be involved as a matter of course.  Maybe the body was to be repatriated.

If there was even the remotest possibility that a corpse was disposed of in this way, the PJ would have investigated until all lines of inquiry were exhausted. 

I truly believe this is a non-starter, a comment made by Dr Amaral that has been blown out of all proportion - just like the comment he made about the British authorities only following the McCanns agenda, the comment that led to his removal from the case.

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Re: The Priests

Post by jazega on 30.08.18 8:40

Which comment led to his removal from the case.Evidence please.

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Re: The Priests

Post by Verdi on 30.08.18 12:36

@jazega wrote:Which comment led to his removal from the case.Evidence please.
BAD RESPONSE TO A JOURNALIST:  Chapter 21

In the evening, while driving, I receive an unidentified phone call, the last straw...A journalist asks me if I want to comment on the subject of the email. Whether due to the difficult day, the raging storm or the fact of driving through rain...I lose my cool. I reply, irritably, without thinking, that the message is of no interest and that it would be better for the English police to occupy themselves with the Portuguese investigation. Even as I am hanging up, I realise that I have not only made a blunder, but I have been unfair towards the majority of the British police who have helped us throughout these difficult months. I drive on, certain that I have triggered a diplomatic incident with predictable consequences: as soon as these simple words are made public, I risk not being able to continue to direct the Portimão Department of Criminal Investigation.

It is shortly after 2pm, in the middle of lunch, that I receive the news. The National Director has sent a fax to the Portimão DIC: in it, he stipulates the end of my assignment and requests my return to Faro.

According to a British correspondent, the Prime Minister personally called Stuart Prior to ask for confirmation of my dismissal. Why would the head of the British government be interested in a lowly Portuguese official? We refuse to believe the rumours going around, according to which the signing of the Treaty of Lisbon was dependent on my dismissal.


Gonçalo Amaral - the Truth of the Lie

http://goncaloamaraltruthofthelie.blogspot.co.uk/2009/06/chapter-21-dismissal-of-head-of.html



https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t13561p400-media-mayhem-mccann-media-nonsense-of-the-day#390223

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Media,McCann's

Post by willowthewisp on 30.08.18 13:53

@Verdi wrote:
@jazega wrote:Which comment led to his removal from the case.Evidence please.
BAD RESPONSE TO A JOURNALIST:  Chapter 21

In the evening, while driving, I receive an unidentified phone call, the last straw...A journalist asks me if I want to comment on the subject of the email. Whether due to the difficult day, the raging storm or the fact of driving through rain...I lose my cool. I reply, irritably, without thinking, that the message is of no interest and that it would be better for the English police to occupy themselves with the Portuguese investigation. Even as I am hanging up, I realise that I have not only made a blunder, but I have been unfair towards the majority of the British police who have helped us throughout these difficult months. I drive on, certain that I have triggered a diplomatic incident with predictable consequences: as soon as these simple words are made public, I risk not being able to continue to direct the Portimão Department of Criminal Investigation.

It is shortly after 2pm, in the middle of lunch, that I receive the news. The National Director has sent a fax to the Portimão DIC: in it, he stipulates the end of my assignment and requests my return to Faro.

According to a British correspondent, the Prime Minister personally called Stuart Prior to ask for confirmation of my dismissal. Why would the head of the British government be interested in a lowly Portuguese official? We refuse to believe the rumours going around, according to which the signing of the Treaty of Lisbon was dependent on my dismissal.


Gonçalo Amaral - the Truth of the Lie

http://goncaloamaraltruthofthelie.blogspot.co.uk/2009/06/chapter-21-dismissal-of-head-of.html
Hi Verdi, I would love someone to question Gordon Brown of his machinations to Madeleine McCann's case,you can bet he'd be a shifty as ever,like when caught by the microphone,"Terrible bigoted Woman",then had to apologise for being such a smarmy *astard?
He's(Gordon) has that look of"Nixon"another twisted mind,just look at his role with Kissinger,Vietnam,sinister minds and didn't give a shit who got killed,sums them all up doesn't it?
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Re: The Priests

Post by Hobs on 01.09.18 20:56

@NickE wrote:
@jazega wrote:Does anyone have the actual date the ex-pat lady was cremated.
Was it before or after the McCanns hired the car ?

I don't think Amaral did mention any exactly date for this.
But wasn't RoB lurking around on "erm...I think it's...erm Cemetery road...erm"?
I'am little confused about this because Amaral said that body could have been in a freezer and the fluids in the car came when the freezed body was melting in the trunk of the car and this was in late May.
Where were this freezer located?
If the freezer were located in pdl the body shouldn't start to melt so soon if they took the body in the car and drove it straight to church in pdl?
I don't believe that they drove around with a body in the car for a longer time.
From an interview with Amaral in CMTV:

A late-night sighting of three figures entering Luz church with a large bag coincided with the existence of a coffin inside the church, he said, into which Madeleine’s body could have been placed.

The coffin - holding the remains of an elderly British resident - was taken the following day for cremation in the Alentejo.

There is a small problem with the scenario.

When a body is cremated, it doesn't all get turned to ash, more like a fine sand than say wood fire or paper ash.

The flesh is consumed, the bones to a degree would also be burned but not fully consumed.
The crematorium will pass the cremains though a  cremulator which grinds the remainingh bones down to a fine ash

The cremation remains are usually pasty white in color.
These remains are transferred in a cremation urn and given to the relative or representative of the deceased. If you do not have an urn, the crematorium may return the ashes in a plastic box or default container.

This means that had Maddie been in the bsame casket as the old woman. after cremation when the  cremains are removed prior to the final 'ash' there would likely have been skeletal remains of a child in the ash, larger bones such as skull or pelvis.

The person dealing with said cremains would have noticed 2 skulls or remnants of or other large bones of which there should be one or two of.

Finding 2 skulls in the cremains would have provoked some questions along the lines of WTH?

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