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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Mm11

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The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Mm11

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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Empty Re: McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007

Post by Daisy 04.12.11 22:52

Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:This message was sent to me via email for inclusion on this thread:

On google earth, road view 360 degrees, number 30, Main street, Dungloe,
Donegal.
Outside the shop 'Books and Charts', where green dustbin stands, is a little
wall where the children could be sitting eating ice creams with Tulleys behind
them, over the road, and with car parked beside the children in bay.
Slight raised curb, enough for kids to sit on.
A photo I saw whilst searching, can't find it now, has human sized ice-cream
cornet outside the book shop.
In the Google Earth pictures (2009) the road is in wet conditions. The photo I
saw was sunny. Perhaps the large ice cream cornet is put out seasonally.
The photo could be correct.
The buildings have been repainted since the Donegal photo. A date for the change
would be interesting. It's just perhaps the timing of the photo might be
different. However, a little wall is possible as the raised curb by parking.

Thanks Get 'em, for forwarding the message and thanks to the person that sent in the info. I hope this doesn't come across as being smug but we had already conceded this photo is from a genuine location. (few posts beyond ^)

Still strange though, that out of all those beautiful surroundings and locations of that 'holiday' they chose the kerbside of a main road, right opposite the betting shop for a photo opportunity?

Why not show photos of this event?

According to Aunt Phil McCann: “She's just learned to swim from taking lessons and in Donegal, she had her water wings off for the first time."

And

"Patricia Cameron (aka McCann) remembers vividly a holiday in Ireland with 46 extended family and friends, and playing rounders on the beach.
Patricia said: "Madeleine was a little daredevil. She was the only
one who would go in the water.
It was the Atlantic and it was freezing.
She was a determined little thing.
"

So where are these photos? the ones that capture the essence of Madeleine? Because the few photos we have been shown do not portray "a determined little thing"

And, question to whoever sent that message in ^, what do you think of the McCanns exagerrated portrayal of Irishness, that in turn mislead the people of Ireland to being the biggest contributers to their fund?

Ps... I also questioned the differing images on google but Lady-Heather answered that one for me.

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Post by TrollAng 05.12.11 19:05

Daisy wrote:
Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:This message was sent to me via email for inclusion on this thread:

On google earth, road view 360 degrees, number 30, Main street, Dungloe,
Donegal.
Outside the shop 'Books and Charts', where green dustbin stands, is a little
wall where the children could be sitting eating ice creams with Tulleys behind
them, over the road, and with car parked beside the children in bay.
Slight raised curb, enough for kids to sit on.
A photo I saw whilst searching, can't find it now, has human sized ice-cream
cornet outside the book shop.
In the Google Earth pictures (2009) the road is in wet conditions. The photo I
saw was sunny. Perhaps the large ice cream cornet is put out seasonally.
The photo could be correct.
The buildings have been repainted since the Donegal photo. A date for the change
would be interesting. It's just perhaps the timing of the photo might be
different. However, a little wall is possible as the raised curb by parking.

Thanks Get 'em, for forwarding the message and thanks to the person that sent in the info. I hope this doesn't come across as being smug but we had already conceded this photo is from a genuine location. (few posts beyond ^)

Still strange though, that out of all those beautiful surroundings and locations of that 'holiday' they chose the kerbside of a main road, right opposite the betting shop for a photo opportunity?

Why not show photos of this event?

According to Aunt Phil McCann: “She's just learned to swim from taking lessons and in Donegal, she had her water wings off for the first time."

And

"Patricia Cameron (aka McCann) remembers vividly a holiday in Ireland with 46 extended family and friends, and playing rounders on the beach.
Patricia said: "Madeleine was a little daredevil. She was the only
one who would go in the water.
It was the Atlantic and it was freezing.
She was a determined little thing.
"

So where are these photos? the ones that capture the essence of Madeleine? Because the few photos we have been shown do not portray "a determined little thing"

And, question to whoever sent that message in ^, what do you think of the McCanns exagerrated portrayal of Irishness, that in turn mislead the people of Ireland to being the biggest contributers to their fund?

Ps... I also questioned the differing images on google but Lady-Heather answered that one for me.

Wow, Daisy, this gets better. I'm pretty sure swimming in the Atlantic would cause the onset of hypothermia in early April, are these people for real?
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Post by Nina 05.12.11 20:27

TrollAng wrote:
Daisy wrote:
Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:This message was sent to me via email for inclusion on this thread:

On google earth, road view 360 degrees, number 30, Main street, Dungloe,
Donegal.
Outside the shop 'Books and Charts', where green dustbin stands, is a little
wall where the children could be sitting eating ice creams with Tulleys behind
them, over the road, and with car parked beside the children in bay.
Slight raised curb, enough for kids to sit on.
A photo I saw whilst searching, can't find it now, has human sized ice-cream
cornet outside the book shop.
In the Google Earth pictures (2009) the road is in wet conditions. The photo I
saw was sunny. Perhaps the large ice cream cornet is put out seasonally.
The photo could be correct.
The buildings have been repainted since the Donegal photo. A date for the change
would be interesting. It's just perhaps the timing of the photo might be
different. However, a little wall is possible as the raised curb by parking.

Thanks Get 'em, for forwarding the message and thanks to the person that sent in the info. I hope this doesn't come across as being smug but we had already conceded this photo is from a genuine location. (few posts beyond ^)

Still strange though, that out of all those beautiful surroundings and locations of that 'holiday' they chose the kerbside of a main road, right opposite the betting shop for a photo opportunity?

Why not show photos of this event?

According to Aunt Phil McCann: “She's just learned to swim from taking lessons and in Donegal, she had her water wings off for the first time."

And

"Patricia Cameron (aka McCann) remembers vividly a holiday in Ireland with 46 extended family and friends, and playing rounders on the beach.
Patricia said: "Madeleine was a little daredevil. She was the only
one who would go in the water.
It was the Atlantic and it was freezing.
She was a determined little thing.
"

So where are these photos? the ones that capture the essence of Madeleine? Because the few photos we have been shown do not portray "a determined little thing"

And, question to whoever sent that message in ^, what do you think of the McCanns exagerrated portrayal of Irishness, that in turn mislead the people of Ireland to being the biggest contributers to their fund?

Ps... I also questioned the differing images on google but Lady-Heather answered that one for me.

Wow, Daisy, this gets better. I'm pretty sure swimming in the Atlantic would cause the onset of hypothermia in early April, are these people for real?



And packing for a family of five for Easter in Donegal would you have packed swimming gear, I certainly would never even have given such outfits a thought.

All just to give us a picture of rosey cheeks and hours of fun on the sands. No, the McCanns don't do family fun.

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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Empty Water Temperatures in Donegal in April

Post by uppatoffee 05.12.11 21:05

According to [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] the water temperature in Muckros, one of the nearest beaches to Donegal averages 10 degrees centigrade in April.

"Muckros water temperatures peak in the range 13 to 17°C (55 to 63°F) on around the 7th of August and are at their minimum on about the 2nd of March, in the range 8 to 10°C (46 to 50°F). The maximum water temperatures at Muckros in the first part of August are ideally suited to a 4/3mm wetsuit + 3mm boots, although a 5/3mm wetsuit may be preferable for longer sessions and cold windy days. The minimum water temperatures at Muckros mean that you will need a flexible 6/5/4mm wetsuit or a well fitting 5/4mm wetsuit with gloves and 5mm neoprene booties and a hood to surf here in early March."

This is suggesting that to go in the water in August, at the peak of the summer, you would still need a wetsuit. Yet here is Maddie, splashing around in temperatures of 10 degrees? I don't think so. nah
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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Empty Breaking the ice before going swimming

Post by Guest 05.12.11 23:40

Didn't Kate mention how cold the water was in the pool at PDL but nothing could stop Madeleine going in anyway? Clearly the McCanns are made of stronger stuff than ordinary mortals!
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Post by pauline 05.12.11 23:44

Marian wrote:Didn't Kate mention how cold the water was in the pool at PDL but nothing could stop Madeleine going in anyway? Clearly the McCanns are made of stronger stuff than ordinary mortals!

Marian, yes she did. Obviously a water baby.
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Post by Lance De Boils 10.12.11 19:44

This is an interesting thread. However, I'm totally confused...! [It doesn't take much!]

Tully's sign in gold & green + red house
vs.
Tully's sign in red & green, bigger frontage + cream house

Which came first and when were they decorated?

My guess would be that the house was cream first, then painted red - due to the fact that the cream painting is clearly not new in that photo (looking at damage on corner of house). So the streetview photos are from before Apr 2007? Or am I getting this all the wrong way round?
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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Empty McCann family history

Post by uppatoffee 12.12.11 14:16

I have now seen the marriage certificate for (Grandad) John McCann and Ellen (Eileen) Ferry from 1958. John is shown as being a resident of St. Johnston, Donegal. His father, Joseph and mother, Agnes are both listed as deceased. Ellen was listed as living in Glasgow, daughter of Patrick and Brigid Ferry.

Interestingly, both John and his father were listed as Spirit Merchants. In my own family research I have found that people who run pubs are, rather unsurprisingly, called publicans on official documentation. The use of the term spirit merchant suggest more that they are dealers in wines, spirits, beers etc. So the suggestion that they ran Joe's bar seems slightly at odds with the official documentation.
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Post by Guest 12.12.11 18:14

That is an interesting find Uppatoffee. Until now nothing has been found to confirm that John McCann ever had anything at all to do with running a pub but the certificate does indicate that at one time he did. The term spirit merchant sounds to me more like someone who runs an off licence but perhaps one of our Irish members will advise if it can mean a pub or bar manager.
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Post by Lance De Boils 14.12.11 7:05

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Uppatoffee and Jean, If you look at that link p31, you will see some relevant names.
If you then look back through the previous pages you'll see many Peoples. Tolands too.
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Post by uppatoffee 14.12.11 7:29

Thanks for the link Lance, the McCann entries certainly seem to fit with what it says in the bewk about grandpa John losing both parents and his oldest brother Patrick before he was 16. Not sure about Hugh though, as brother Hugh was supposed to have accompanied them to Donegal for this infamous Easter break in 2007.
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Post by Guest 14.12.11 12:51

Yes, if Uncle Hugh is the one who died in 1999, it was quite an achievement for him to go on holiday in 2007! I've never heard any mention of him as still being alive though. It would be interesting to have a list of the 29 or 46 (depending on which report you read) people who supposedly went to Donegal - wonder if any of the other tapas 7 were there!
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Post by Daisy 14.12.11 14:56

Great finds by Uppatoffee & Lance, things are starting to fall into place nicely.

The McCann graves are interesting. From what I can gather from that link they are buried together in a family type plot? Agnes McCann (died 1943) was probably Gerry's grandmother, wife of Joe/Joesph McCann. Then we have Patrick, died 1953 (same year as his father - Joeseph). Then there's Hugh, died 1999. This is puzzling because like people have already said - Hugh is supposed to be still alive. Unless it's another Hugh McCann, but how does he fit into the above family plot? Lastly there's John McCann, died 2005 - this must be Gerry's father?

Edit: @ Uppatoffee, I'm guessing you have a subscription to genealogy records? If so could you check see if you can find any BMD records on Hugh McCann please? [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

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Post by Guest 14.12.11 23:32

Hugh McCann doesn't feature on Pamalam's page of Madeleine's relatives.

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Post by Guest 15.12.11 13:01

Probably not the right Hugh Mccann but still it was interresting and coincidal to find this site !

Hugh McCann is a libertarian philosopher who has formulated a "non-causal" theory of action that focuses on intentions and other mental states prior to action. He argues that our motivations and desires may be reasons for our actions, but they should not be called causes.

McCann makes the relation of intentions to actions a teleological relation, rather than a causal relation. Unfortunately, describing his theory as "non-causal" suggests something outside normal physical explanation.


Read more

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Post by Daisy 15.12.11 13:40

Marian wrote:Hugh McCann doesn't feature on Pamalam's page of Madeleine's relatives.

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Yes, I did notice there are no photos or indeed mention of Hugh Mccann on other sites. However, I'm really baffled now. I know I definitely read (from more than one mainstream source) that he attended the 'mass family gathering' in Donegal. I'm sure I'm not the only one that recalls this? Trouble is, I've searched & searched but can't find any of the articles that gave this information. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

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“And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music.” 

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Post by Guest 15.12.11 14:58

I can't personally recall hearing Hugh McCann's name anywhere other than on this site. Do we know if the whole Donegal story appeared anywhere other than the Belfast Telegraph in the early days after Madeleine's "disappearance"? It does seem to me to have been specially cooked up for the Irish market.

I'm sure that this link has been posted before (probably by me!) but it's interesting for a few reasons.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

The story gets off to a good start with the caption under the photo describing Madeleine as being with "a couple of friends". Good old Philomena is accredited with the statement about there being a group of 46 on the holiday so I think can be taken with a very large pinch of salt.

The report says that the McCanns visted every year but for once I think Kate might actually be telling the truth when she said it was the first time they had been there.

Having read through a number of Belfast Telegraph articles about the McCanns I'm now feeling extremely nauseous!

Thanks to whoever it was who explained how to put a signature after a posting. It was so easy that even I could do it!
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Post by Lance De Boils 15.12.11 15:13

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By Anita Guidera



Tuesday May 08 2007





THE missing English toddler who disappeared from a holiday apartment in the Algarve visited Donegal with her parents at Easter.
The
east Donegal village of St Johnston which she visited with her parents
Gerry and Kate and younger brother and sister has united in prayer for
the safe return of three-year-old Madeleine McCann who police say was
abducted last Thursday night.
The family and the missing child's
great uncle Hughie and grandmother Ellen McCann spent more than a week
in The Rosses area of Donegal, staying mostly in a Bed and Breakfast in
the Dungloe area.
Ellen, nee Ferry, was born in the Crolly area
of the county but left for Scotland in the 1960's after she married
Johnny McCann from the Donegal village of St Johnston, where he used to
run a pub with his brother Hughie.
According to the current owner
of McCann's bar on the main street in the middle of the village of St
Johnston, the family were regular visitors to the area although they no
longer had relatives in Donegal.
Drinks
But a larger group than usual had travelled to Donegal at Easter, Joe Peoples said.
"They
came frequently to St Johnston and always stopped in the bar for a few
drinks and a chat although at Easter they actually stayed in the west of
the county.
"I believe Ellen came from the Crolly area of the county.
"But they called in here on their way to back to Belfast Airport and I met them all," said Mr Peoples.
The pub which had been run by the brothers had hardly changed at all in the last 25 years.
He vividly recalled the two-year-old twins Sean and Amelie and three-year-old Madeleine whom he described as "a wee dote".
Prayer
"She was just running around all over the bar having a great time, up to all sorts.
"She was a wee dote, a lovely wee girl.
"I can't believe what has happened to her," he said.
He added that as soon as he heard the name of the father of the missing girl he feared the worst.
"It is an awful thing. They must be in a terrible state.
"All we can do is pray for them and pray that she will be found safe," he said.
Joe even had his photograph taken with the entire family before they left.
"I had intended asking them to send me a copy of the photograph but I didn't and look at what's happened now," he said.
Joe said Maddie's dad Gerry was proud of his Donegal roots.
"They keep very much in touch.
"They came to St Johnston almost every year - the years they missed were few and far between," he said.
Anita Guidera
- Anita Guidera






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Joe Peoples is currently Treasurer of St Johnston Cricket
Club. He has the distinction of being the first ever person to qualify as
an umpire in the North West Cricket League not to mention being known to have
been rather young to have been an umpire! Furthermore, he became an umpire
without ever have played a Cricket match.




He officiated when the Indian Legend, Kapil Dev was bowling.
In the seventies, he officiated as umpire in two International matches.
The teams were M.C.C. and Sri Lanka.




Joe is a Peace Commissioner and manages Joe's Bar, Main
Street, St Johnston.

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Post by Daisy 15.12.11 15:33

Thanks Lance, I knew it wasn't just a forum myth, I also remember reading it from more than the one article. Now why on earth would they do that - why make out a family member that died in 1999! was on that holiday?

Quoted from lance's post: "The family and the missing child's great uncle Hughie and grandmother Ellen McCann spent more than a week in The Rosses area of Donegal, staying mostly in a Bed and Breakfast in the Dungloe area.
Ellen, nee Ferry, was born in the Crolly area"

Edit: @ Marian, the other sister Trish? also claimed there were 46 of them on holiday.

Linda & Mark McQueen & family were also reported to have joined the Mccann clan in Donegal. More about the McQueen's here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]




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Post by tigger 15.12.11 16:33

All these conflicting 'witness' statements and stories which do not match any visual evidence are rather reminiscent of the Tapas 7 at PdL. It seems to be part and parcel of the opening moves of the abduction.
What particularly annoys me that some of the statements re Maddie are taken verbatim from Auntie Phil re the wee little mite.
I still feel that the Donegal holiday being used so soon in the proceedings had a purpose, particularly in view of the fact that very little seems to work and that Kate herself said that it was their first visit. This time, I believe her.
I'm still fixed on Burgau and an Easter sighting in Zaival, for me, PdL was the last act of a two or three part play.

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Post by uppatoffee 15.12.11 21:57

I also found one article that said that Maddie spent her Easter Break with her family (of 5) in a B&B in Dungloe, before joining more relations in the St Johnston area. Although this is the only place I have seen this
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I also have another which shows that Great Uncle Hughie was supposedly there too.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Daisy I have found possible birth entries for Grandpa Johnny and Hugh.

John J McCann
Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes, 1845-1958
birth: Jan - Mar 1937 Stranorlar
parents: O'Rourke

Hugh F McCann
Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes, 1845-1958
birth: Jan - Mar 1943 Letterkenny
parents: O'Rourke

The two areas, Letterkenny and Stranorlar are fairly close together, joined by the N13. They are both pretty close to St Johnston. I have not been able to find anything for older brother Patrick, in terms of birth or death. Also no marriage certificate for Joseph and Agnes. 😢
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Post by Daisy 15.12.11 22:42

Very interesting Uppatoffee, cheers.

Perhaps Joe & Agnes never married, hence parents name 'O'Rourke' on birth records of John & Hugh? If it's true they weren't wed, Patrick could be registered under O'Rourke.

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Post by uppatoffee 15.12.11 23:01

Daisy, the name O'Rourke just refers to the Mothers maiden name. I had just cut and paste that bit from my search results, which did not make this very clear. From about 1911 onwards, the mothers maiden name helpfully appeared on birth records. I would think it most likely they were married, I am looking to see whether Joseph had another name as this would help with the searching! I will also look for Patrick under o'Rourke, just in case!

Didn't someone say that Johnny had been born in Joe's Bar or McCanns? Or whatever it is called. I don't think Stranorlar is the nearest registration district to St Johnston, so guess that story is not true.
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Post by Daisy 16.12.11 13:56

Ah, I see now, thanks toff.

Yeah, your guess is right, that was just another lie attributed to Joe Peoples. I did leave a message for Mr Peoples (posted a few pages back ^) asking about these untruths on the webite he contributes to (which contains more McCann lies) - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Alas, my comments were whooshed and Mr Peoples didn't e-mail me a response. He didn't want to explain why he had told these lies, that in turn lead to the Irish population being the biggest contributers to 'the fund'. Sad

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Daisy
Daisy

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McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007 - Page 9 Empty Re: McCanns Easter break Donegal 2007

Post by Guest 16.12.11 14:23

uppatoffee wrote:I have now seen the marriage certificate for (Grandad) John McCann and Ellen (Eileen) Ferry from 1958. John is shown as being a resident of St. Johnston, Donegal. His father, Joseph and mother, Agnes are both listed as deceased. Ellen was listed as living in Glasgow, daughter of Patrick and Brigid Ferry.

Interestingly, both John and his father were listed as Spirit Merchants. In my own family research I have found that people who run pubs are, rather unsurprisingly, called publicans on official documentation. The use of the term spirit merchant suggest more that they are dealers in wines, spirits, beers etc. So the suggestion that they ran Joe's bar seems slightly at odds with the official documentation.

Daisy, it does seem as if John McCann Senior had a connection with pubs or bars when he was living in Ireland. Perhaps he only became a joiner when he moved to Scotland in 1967.

I wonder how Ellen (Eileen) met John in the first place if she was living in Scotland before her marriage; nothing seems to be straightforward does it?
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