Re: ROBERT MURAT'S ROLE

by jd 08.07.13 23:31

I think it was April 30th...the day nobody talks about.... the night robert murat made his emergency booking to fly back to PDL for a few hours later for 'business' which he clearly did not attend to...

It wasn't assumptions that they were married.....This was in the statement of russell of brien where he starts off referring to jane tanner as his partner but later his wife

by Guest 09.07.13 20:13

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:
Marconi (or your alter-ego Macaroni!) I did hope to post a link to a good article about Robert Murat and the discrepancies with his statements but the website on which it appears is down at present.

www.madeleinefoundation.org.uk/

The site is now back. Go to the Articles section and there, amongst other reports, is a six parter about Robert Murat.

by **tigger** 10.07.13 7:26

Came across this in McCannfiles:

McCanns after Murat Jornal de Notícias
3/5/08
(Thanks to 'Li' from the3arguidos forum for translation)

The McCanns look for answers in Robert Murat, they are convinced of his involvement in the disappearance of their daughter. The multimillionaire that supports the expenses with lawyers and the private detectives of the Spanish agency "Método 3" went on purpose to Algarve to get to know the British man.

Brian Kennedy offered to help him, although he was unable to explain how. Why? Why does he believe that Robert or his mother Jennifer might have seen someone on the night of 3rd of May in the area of the Ocean Club. He was prepared to pay to the best technicians to draw a photofit of a possible suspect. Saying one thing and then saying another he ended to say that Kate and Gerry believe that he is innocent and they never came publicly to accuse him but he insisted that Murat might remember some important detail to help them find Madeleine.

The JN knows that Murat did not accept the help of the multimillionaire. On the contrary he was upset with the questions that were made and with the insistence of the multimillionaire that wanted him to remember the night of the disappearance, when Murat always said that he spent the night in his mother's house, Jennifer, in Praia da Luz.

The meeting - a dinner that Brian Kennedy asked to be discreet and far away from the eyes of the press - took place in the end of last year at a house of Murat's relatives in Burgau (Vila do Bispo). At the dinner were present Murat and Kennedy, the respective lawyers, Jennifer Murat and the aunt and uncle of Murat.

After dinner was Brian Kennedy that finished the conversation. He could not explain why three friends of the couple, belonging to the group "Tapas 7" came publicly saying that they saw Robert Murat in the area of the Ocean Club in the night of 3 of May and he (Kennedy) ended to enter in contradiction.

Francisco Pagarete does not confirm this meeting but the JN knows that the PJ is aware and that they monitored the steps of Kennedy and the detectives of Método 3 very closely. According to the lawyer one year after the disappearance of Maddie, Murat "still does not understand how his name was involved in the case". "Everything is very strange" says the lawyer regretting that " a person was involved in this story without having nothing to do with it".

unquote

Vila do Bispo, wasn't that Gerry's first stop after he came back from his US trip?

by bobbin 10.07.13 8:31

tigger wrote:Came across this in McCannfiles:

McCanns after Murat Jornal de Notícias
3/5/08
(Thanks to 'Li' from the3arguidos forum for translation)

The McCanns look for answers in Robert Murat, they are convinced of his involvement in the disappearance of their daughter. The multimillionaire that supports the expenses with lawyers and the private detectives of the Spanish agency "Método 3" went on purpose to Algarve to get to know the British man.

Brian Kennedy offered to help him, although he was unable to explain how. Why? Why does he believe that Robert or his mother Jennifer might have seen someone on the night of 3rd of May in the area of the Ocean Club. He was prepared to pay to the best technicians to draw a photofit of a possible suspect. Saying one thing and then saying another he ended to say that Kate and Gerry believe that he is innocent and they never came publicly to accuse him but he insisted that Murat might remember some important detail to help them find Madeleine.

The JN knows that Murat did not accept the help of the multimillionaire. On the contrary he was upset with the questions that were made and with the insistence of the multimillionaire that wanted him to remember the night of the disappearance, when Murat always said that he spent the night in his mother's house, Jennifer, in Praia da Luz.

The meeting - a dinner that Brian Kennedy asked to be discreet and far away from the eyes of the press - took place in the end of last year at a house of Murat's relatives in Burgau (Vila do Bispo). At the dinner were present Murat and Kennedy, the respective lawyers, Jennifer Murat and the aunt and uncle of Murat.

After dinner was Brian Kennedy that finished the conversation. He could not explain why three friends of the couple, belonging to the group "Tapas 7" came publicly saying that they saw Robert Murat in the area of the Ocean Club in the night of 3 of May and he (Kennedy) ended to enter in contradiction.

Francisco Pagarete does not confirm this meeting but the JN knows that the PJ is aware and that they monitored the steps of Kennedy and the detectives of Método 3 very closely. According to the lawyer one year after the disappearance of Maddie, Murat "still does not understand how his name was involved in the case". "Everything is very strange" says the lawyer regretting that " a person was involved in this story without having nothing to do with it".

unquote

Vila do Bispo, wasn't that Gerry's first stop after he came back from his US trip?

Yes, I recall reading that he made a detour, which appeared a bit strange and without explanation or reason.
How do the dates for the Murat meeting and Gerry's return tally. If they don't tally, who would have been in the house at Vila do Bospo that Gerry would want to 'see' 'report to'?
How did he know anyone in Vila do Bospo that would merit a diversion rather than going straight to see his wife and twins after an exhausting visit and flights to USA, given that K and G weren't supposed to have any acquaintances in Portugal.

by **tigger** 10.07.13 9:09

Here is HideHo's video - from about 6.10 it's about Gerry's returning around 16.40 from the US. Overshooting PdL and driving to Vila do Bispo - it hadn't registered with me that there is a Murat connection.

Complete with phone pings and a drive through the area. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkrLLLX7cY

by Liz Eagles 10.07.13 9:40

tigger wrote:Here is HideHo's video - from about 6.10 it's about Gerry's returning around 16.40 from the US. Overshooting PdL and driving to Vila do Bispo - it hadn't registered with me that there is a Murat connection.

Complete with phone pings and a drive through the area. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkrLLLX7cY

It's also not clear to me whether GM was collected from the airport. He had been away for 3? days. Would he have parked the car up in the airport and left Kate and Trish Cameron without a car for a few days or would he have been taken to the airport and collected - if so who picked him up from the airport?

by bobbin 10.07.13 11:11

aquila wrote:
tigger wrote:Here is HideHo's video - from about 6.10 it's about Gerry's returning around 16.40 from the US. Overshooting PdL and driving to Vila do Bispo - it hadn't registered with me that there is a Murat connection.

Complete with phone pings and a drive through the area. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkrLLLX7cY

It's also not clear to me whether GM was collected from the airport. He had been away for 3? days. Would he have parked the car up in the airport and left Kate and Trish Cameron without a car for a few days or would he have been taken to the airport and collected - if so who picked him up from the airport?

Going to Vila do Bospo would be like going through Cornwall to Lands End. It's almost a straight line, not even a round trip.
Info: Taken off Google Earth:
Faro to Boliqueime = 29 km. driving 27 mins
Boliqueime to Vila do Bospo = 82 km. driving 59 mins
Vila do Bospo to Sagres = 9 km. driving 10 mins
Phone pings show approx. 45 mins for Faro to Boliqueime's driving time of 27 mins (20 mins free/space)
and 1hr 30 mins approx. for Boliqueime to Vila do Bospo's driving time of 59 mins. (50 mins free/space)
ETA Where did all the family/relatives etc. gather on a certain (possibly Catholic religion significant) date for an 'event'? Was it near or at Sagres?

by **tigger** 10.07.13 12:15

bobbin wrote:
aquila wrote:
tigger wrote:Here is HideHo's video - from about 6.10 it's about Gerry's returning around 16.40 from the US. Overshooting PdL and driving to Vila do Bispo - it hadn't registered with me that there is a Murat connection.

Complete with phone pings and a drive through the area. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkrLLLX7cY

It's also not clear to me whether GM was collected from the airport. He had been away for 3? days. Would he have parked the car up in the airport and left Kate and Trish Cameron without a car for a few days or would he have been taken to the airport and collected - if so who picked him up from the airport?
Going to Vila do Bospo would be like going through Cornwall to Lands End. It's almost a straight line, not even a round trip.
Info: Taken off Google Earth:
Faro to Boliqueime = 29 km. driving 27 mins
Boliqueime to Vila do Bospo = 82 km. driving 59 mins
Vila do Bospo to Sagres = 9 km. driving 10 mins
Phone pings show approx. 45 mins for Faro to Boliqueime's driving time of 27 mins (20 mins free/space)
and 1hr 30 mins approx. for Boliqueime to Vila do Bospo's driving time of 59 mins. (50 mins free/space)
ETA Where did all the family/relatives etc. gather on a certain (possibly Catholic religion significant) date for an 'event'? Was it near or at Sagres?

That was Sagres. Gerry gives the wrong date for this in his blog. Also gives the wrong date for 40 days since Maddie disappeared. Imo he shifts dates in his blogs on purpose.

Day 37 9/06/2007
DATE GERRY USED
Day 37 - 11/06/2007
Kate and I had a slightly busier day on the media front than expected. We did a short press interview for the Irish Sunday papers, mainly to thank the Irish for their fantastic level of support. We followed that with one for the British Sundays which is likely to be the last one we do for a while. We talked about our pain of not having having Madeleine for such a long time and for our need to grieve, which occurs mainly in private. We also talked about how after Morocco we will have to spend some time reflecting both emotionally, and also how best the campaign can be taken forward. What we want to ensure is that the campaign has a psoitive effect on finding Madeleine.

After this we headed down to Sagres which is the very most southwestern tip of Portugal. There is a very nice beach and we had lunch with the family.

http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/DAYS_1_to_50.htm

Iirc the 10th of June - a Sunday -was the date they left for Morocco, in the morning of that day there was a phone call between Gerry and ROB which Gerry explained as being some 4 km from PdL but the PJ found to be some 25 km away. This is linked to the barn and the fibres and towel found there.
40 days after a death a memorial service with friends and family. I have seen accounts of soberly clad relatives including John McCann. A number of family flew in just before that weekend. It would fit a demise around the 1st very well. I wonder when Father Seddon came over?
(3 days afterwards - vigil, prayer in church, 12 days afterwards mass said for the deceased, three months say farewell at the graveside.)

by sallypelt 10.07.13 15:03

957 to 958 External diligence carried out in the OC 2007.05.11

TRANSLATION BY INES

04-Processos Vol IV Pages 957 - 958

02-Processos Volume II PJ Record 8th May 2007-
At about 20.00 the police received a phone call from a number that could not be identified, from a person with a female voice speaking in correct Portuguese, who did not want to be identified for reasons of safety. She refers to an individual who abducted Madeleine, who knows how to keep quiet and is quite close to the police. When asked who she was referring to she said it was an individual who resides in Praia da Luz, who has an English mother, who speaks this language very well, who was near the area since the disappearance of the little girl, supposedly with the intention of helping the investigation. She said this man was called Robert and that he used to consult Internet chats of a pretty heavy sexual nature. He would also use Internet for contacts with different acquaintances he had in other countries, especially in the UK. She said most of the mails he sent were encrypted due to the monitoring of the kind of content they possessed. This is why she wanted to alert the authorities about the characteristics of this man, who, in her opinion, could have sexual motives and opportunity, knowing the area perfectly for committing or collaborating in this type of crime.

Who was this woman? Could it be RM now wife? If so, it gives weight to the theory, that RM was a patsy.

by bobbin 10.07.13 20:44

sallypelt wrote:957 to 958 External diligence carried out in the OC 2007.05.11

TRANSLATION BY INES

04-Processos Vol IV Pages 957 - 958

02-Processos Volume II PJ Record 8th May 2007-
At about 20.00 the police received a phone call from a number that could not be identified, from a person with a female voice speaking in correct Portuguese, who did not want to be identified for reasons of safety. She refers to an individual who abducted Madeleine, who knows how to keep quiet and is quite close to the police. When asked who she was referring to she said it was an individual who resides in Praia da Luz, who has an English mother, who speaks this language very well, who was near the area since the disappearance of the little girl, supposedly with the intention of helping the investigation. She said this man was called Robert and that he used to consult Internet chats of a pretty heavy sexual nature. He would also use Internet for contacts with different acquaintances he had in other countries, especially in the UK. She said most of the mails he sent were encrypted due to the monitoring of the kind of content they possessed. This is why she wanted to alert the authorities about the characteristics of this man, who, in her opinion, could have sexual motives and opportunity, knowing the area perfectly for committing or collaborating in this type of crime.

Who was this woman? Could it be RM now wife? If so, it gives weight to the theory, that RM was a patsy.

I don't understand who is RM's wife. Why would she 'tell' on RM? and then marry him? spin

I am sure I have misunderstood.

by Guest 10.07.13 20:47

No I don't understand that either! Michaela is now married to Robert Murat but in 2007 she was still married to her first husband.

by sheila.edwards 10.07.13 21:26

In a theory once had, thought if maddy was sold,as money seems to be big interest, RM and his friend could have been involved in some way with a dodgy adoption set up, who did not pay up, then Mcs cried abduction !! still think not within the reals of possibility as a theory imo only: spin

by sallypelt 10.07.13 22:32

Let's not forget this from May this year:

Madeleine world exclusive: 'Bring them all back to Portugal’

Robert Murat said “They need to speak to everybody, including myself, and they need to get the Portuguese involved in a much more constructive way.

“To get somewhere now they need to have a joint team working here together in Praia da Luz. This is where it happened. It didn’t happen in England.

“The reconstruction should cover the critical period just before and after the abduction.”

So, even Murat is going along with the abduction. I have my suspicions about Murat.

by sallypelt 10.07.13 22:32

sallypelt wrote:Let's not forget this from May this year:

Madeleine world exclusive: 'Bring them all back to Portugal’

Robert Murat said “They need to speak to everybody, including myself, and they need to get the Portuguese involved in a much more constructive way.

“To get somewhere now they need to have a joint team working here together in Praia da Luz. This is where it happened. It didn’t happen in England.

“The reconstruction should cover the critical period just before and after the abduction.”

So, even Murat is going along with the abduction. I have my suspicions about Murat.

Opps, I forgot the link: http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/397244/Madeleine-world-exclusive-Bring-them-all-back-to-Portugal

by sallypelt 10.07.13 23:11

I don't know if anyone has read this statement, given to the Leicester Police, by Steve Carpenter, but Carpenter mentions the cleaner and their van in this statement.

SC: Yes.
I am certain that I read about this at the beginning, which (inaudible)' I think that afterwards, and afterwards coincides with the fact that he was the man from the laundry and of the van parked there, because as i have already explained, we were here in a small street here above which linked to the main road and to everything beside here on top, the rest was all pathways and I remember that on two or three occasions I thought...this is a dead end road, the van was parked there, I never saw anyone and more than once assumed that it would be cleaning staff and only this thought coincided with the presence of the man from the laundry, and if there were any reply to be made in relation to the link between the van parked there and the laundry man.
DCF: Yes.

SC: Murat here, I think and the laundry thing here.

DCF: Yes

SC: And I would once again give the reason why I mentioned the subject..

DCF: Of what age did the laundry man appear to be'

SC: Humm, I do not remember clearly what I said, but obviously at times Europeans appear older than they are, because of

DCF...(inaudible) the sun.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm

Who is the "50 year old, grey-haired English man" that Carpenter is referring to? Does anyone know?

by twisted 06.12.13 18:11

......woman speaking correct Portugese rings Police to talk about a man called Robert whose mother is English etc. Malinka had a Portugese girlfriend. Just a thought. Fazackerley´s wife/ girlfriend subsequently denounced Malinka as well. Just amazing how many people in Luz wanted to point fingers at people

by **Tony Bennett** 06.12.13 18:19

twisted wrote:....woman speaking correct Portuguese rings Police to talk about a man called Robert whose mother is English etc. Malinka had a Portuguese girlfriend. Just a thought. Fazackerley´s wife/ girlfriend subsequently denounced Malinka as well. Just amazing how many people in Luz wanted to point fingers at people

Here is the Portuguese woman's account.

There are two possibilities:

1. She was lying, OR

2. She was telling the truth.

This from my long article on Robert Murat:

This second, anonymous, witness who came forward to the Portuguese Police explicitly says that she wanted to remain anonymous ‘for reasons of safety’. Her ’phone call came at 8.00pm on 8 May, just five days into the investigation. It was from a ‘withheld’ number, and from a female, obviously speaking in her native Portuguese.

She said she thought she knew who had abducted Madeleine, and then referred to a male whom she said ‘knows how to keep quiet and is quite close to the police’. We should say at this point that we don’t know if this witness meant that the man was close to the local police force, the GNR, or to the national police force, the Polícia Judiciária (PJ).

She went on to give the following information about him, which clearly identifies him as Robert Murat:

· his name is Robert

· he lives in Praia da Luz

· he has an English mother, who also speaks Portuguese very well

· the man has been in and around the area since Madeleine’s disappearance, supposedly with the intention of helping the investigation.

We have left out the rest of what she told the Portuguese Police for the reasons we gave above [avoiding graphic language], but you can read her full statement here:

http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/ROBERT-MURAT.htm [ see NOTE below ]

Her statement can be found in the Portuguese Police files at: 02-Processos Volume II PJ Record 8th May 2007.

ETA:

Sorry, the above link doesn't work, here is the evidence from the anonymous lady, which I found on Pamalam's new site - great credit to her for preserving all this material:

02-Processos Volume II pages 461 to 462 : 02_VOLUME_IIa_Page_461
02_VOLUME_IIa_Page_462

02-Processos Volume II PJ Record 8th May 2007-
At about 20.00 the police received a phone call from a number that could not be identified, from a person with a female voice speaking in correct Portuguese, who did not want to be identified for reasons of safety. She refers to an individual who abducted Madeleine, who knows how to keep quiet and is quite close to the police. When asked who she was referring to she said it was an individual who resides in Praia da Luz, who has an English mother, who speaks this language very well, who was near the area since the disappearance of the little girl, supposedly with the intention of helping the investigation. She said this man was called Robert and that he used to consult Internet chats of a pretty heavy sexual nature. He would also use Internet for contacts with different acquaintances he had in other countries, especially in the UK. She said most of the mails he sent were encrypted due to the monitoring of the kind of content they possessed. This is why she wanted to alert the authorities about the characteristics of this man, who, in her opinion, could have sexual motives and opportunity, knowing the area perfectly for committing or collaborating in this type of crime.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ROBERT-MURAT.htm

by Guest 06.12.13 18:26

Tony Bennett wrote: [...]
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/ROBERT-MURAT.htm

***
Doesn't work for me ...

by **Tony Bennett** 06.12.13 18:33

Châtelaine wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote: [...] http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/ROBERT-MURAT.htm
***
Doesn't work for me ...

You're right, that link's broken.

Try this one:

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ROBERT-MURAT.htm

I think you once described Robert Murat as 'The Dauphin of Praia da Luz'.

Could you please elaborate what you meant by that?

by Guest 06.12.13 19:14

Tony Bennett wrote:[ [...]

I think you once described Robert Murat as 'The Dauphin of Praia da Luz'.

Could you please elaborate what you meant by that?

***
It was a friend, who was looking for a house there, had RM as real estate agent. They got to know him well, as well as the region. They described RM to me like that. A well-known, well-bred, well-respected, gentle, knowing everything and anyone, and always available to help, assist ... That's it.

by **Tony Bennett** 06.12.13 21:21

Châtelaine wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:[ [...]

I think you once described Robert Murat as 'The Dauphin of Praia da Luz'.

Could you please elaborate what you meant by that?
***
It was a friend, who was looking for a house there, had RM as real estate agent. They got to know him well, as well as the region. They described RM to me like that. A well-known, well-bred, well-respected, gentle, knowing everything and anyone, and always available to help, assist ... That's it.

OK, thanks. What a wonderful sort of bloke! How he got mixed up in this Madeleine McCann thing beats me

by Guest 06.12.13 21:28

Tony, there a lot of things here that "beat" me.
I think I'll take a time-out.
I've seen too much bitching, diverting and deceiving comments of late and many straight-out uncalled for comments.
Some directed at - IMO - completely dedicated and faithful members.
The atmosphere of this place has changed.
Pity!!!!!

by Guest 06.12.13 21:34

Châtelaine wrote:Tony, there a lot of things here that "beat" me.
I think I'll take a time-out.
I've seen too much bitching, diverting and deceiving comments of late and many straight-out uncalled for comments.
Some directed at - IMO - completely dedicated and faithful members.
The atmosphere of this place has changed.
Pity!!!!!

Don't do that Chatelaine, sad