Re: Mark Saunokonoko's Madeleine McCann Podcasts

by Guest 29.03.19 10:43

This conjures up an interesting question (link posted in Textusa)

21-Jul-2004
Forensic Science Service Expands License for Cybergenetics Automated DNA Data Review Technology
Cybergenetics, Corp. today announced that the Forensic Science Service (FSS), an executive agency of the British Home Office, expanded its license for Cybergenetics TrueAllele

technology to crime scene evidence. Three years ago, the FSS became the first group to validate and operate the TrueAllele software for automated forensic DNA data review. The FSS uses the TrueAllele process for the UK National DNA Database, which stores over two and a half million profiles and is the largest of its kind in the world. Cybergenetics pioneering technology uses proprietary computational methods that fully automate routine DNA analysis, replacing the slow and costly manual scoring that represents a substantial portion of the cost of analyzing DNA data.

"It is natural that the FSS, the long-time world leader in DNA forensics, is the first to apply our TrueAllele forensics technology to crime scene evidence," said Dr. Mark Perlin, chief executive officer of Cybergenetics. "The intelligent computerized TrueAllele system greatly reduces the time, cost, error and tedium of manually reviewing forensic data. We expect the FSS to realize further efficiency gains in applying TrueAllele interpretation to DNA evidence."

"The FSS has long been the world leader in automating forensic DNA," said Dr. Dave Werrett, chief executive of the FSS. "We created the first large-scale national DNA databank, along with the laboratory production and information delivery services that provide effective DNA intelligence to our police. The TrueAllele process helps analyze roughly 350,000 DNA database profiles for the FSS each year, with high accuracy and rapid turnaround time. We are pleased to extend our TrueAllele license to crime scene DNA evidence, applying Cybergenetics automated interpretation technology to an estimated 100,000 crime stains each year."

The UK National DNA Database assists police in catching criminals by matching DNA from crime scene evidence to a database of known offenders. This DNA database averages 100 hits a day, and has been instrumental in securing the convictions of thousands of offenders. In conjunction with Cybergenetics TrueAllele technology, 95% of UK DNA Database profiles are analyzed and entered within 5 days. Moreover, 95% of crime scene DNA evidence samples are processed within 10 days. There is no DNA backlog in the UK.

Conventional DNA data editing is a labor-intensive task that requires human review of every genotype and involves significant time and expense. Cybergenetics TrueAllele software is an automated intelligent system that performs approximately 90 percent of this routine data review rapidly, cost effectively and with a high degree of accuracy, enabling technical staff to focus on the small number of problematic samples. The TrueAllele technology is protected by US patents 5,541,067, 5,580,728, 5,876,933, 6,054,268 and 6,750,011; international patents are pending.

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by **Philo Beddoe** 29.03.19 16:59

I recalled this article from August 2016 (yes I know it's from the sun...)
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With a pinch of salt, August 2016 sees OG end forensic tests, April 2017 Mark Rowley admits that the McCann's have not been questioned as potential suspects, forensic tests conducted got nowhere?? 2018/19 see FOI's confirm that there are still 4 (yes four) detective's working on OG full time (their words), Isabelle McFadden spends half an hour talking to one of them on the phone about everything yet no one else can get past the switchboard or answerphone just like Mark S & co regarding the new DNA testing offer, there's the new annual request for funding which has seemingly changed from 6 monthly... Couple that with the laughable OG approved Crimewatch special of 2013 in which they seemingly fabricated Tannerman out of thin air despite all the glaring inconsistencies, the we are now focused on Smithman and are desperate for information on him so please contact us despite knowing full well that there are statements DCI Redwood knows about testifying that the man sitting just to his left is the man they identified but yet does absolutely nothing or goes anywhere with it... Are they just hoping now that it will all just fizzle out into nothing, just keep funding it annually to prevent the real truth coming out??

by **Philo Beddoe** 29.03.19 17:07

Jim Gamble has hinted that there is no work going on in Portugal. The impression given by SY is that there is no work going on over here. I'm convinced that there hasn't been any work or investigative leads followed for a while and it still hinges on whether the political powers that be will give the go, no go. Twelve years later we're no closer or rather Madeleine is no closer to having justice served for her, certain people are still seemingly untouchable and the gov't assets and agencies who covered it up are still unaccountable meanwhile a new assault on our senses is underway with the plethora of lies and propaganda that the Netflix/Pulse Films documentary came out, coupled with the usual media nonsense articles that are coming now and increasing by the day with as many as 3 maybe 4.
Interesting looking at the tweets of Mark Watts (I think) on Twitter who has been following the IICSA. Recently information came out in hearings which stated that SY ended all investigations into child abuse that involved establishment figures or words to that effect, I'm sure if you trace back through his timeline the tweets will still be there

by Guest 29.03.19 17:46

All work on forensics may well be finished but that's not to say that FSS didn't use TrueAllele at the time. During Mark S's interview Dr Perlin gave the impression that FSS didn't have the software. The press release from Cybergenetics states in 2004 that FSS had a license and the software.

What might well be the case is that since FSS checked the samples in 2007 and subsequently closed in 2012, TrueAllele has been improved (you'd certainly think so). Today's TrueAllele may very well be that much better than in 2007 however the impression given on the podcast was FSS was in the dark ages, which was not true.

The other side of the coin could be that the full analysis of the digital numerical data has been done and the answers were hidden / not proven or some other outcome.

by willowthewisp 29.03.19 17:54

Philo Beddoe wrote:Jim Gamble has hinted that there is no work going on in Portugal. The impression given by SY is that there is no work going on over here. I'm convinced that there hasn't been any work or investigative leads followed for a while and it still hinges on whether the political powers that be will give the go, no go. Twelve years later we're no closer or rather Madeleine is no closer to having justice served for her, certain people are still seemingly untouchable and the gov't assets and agencies who covered it up are still unaccountable meanwhile a new assault on our senses is underway with the plethora of lies and propaganda that the Netflix/Pulse Films documentary came out, coupled with the usual media nonsense articles that are coming now and increasing by the day with as many as 3 maybe 4.
Interesting looking at the tweets of Mark Watts (I think) on Twitter who has been following the IICSA. Recently information came out in hearings which stated that SY ended all investigations into child abuse that involved establishment figures or words to that effect, I'm sure if you trace back through his timeline the tweets will still be there

Hi Philo Beddoe, thanks for your post above.

Dame Alexis Jay was given the "poisoned chalice" to investigate child abuse after uncovering "Grooming Gangs" in Yorkshire, Raping and abusing 1400 young girls, that South Yorkshire Police had No knowledge of!
Prime Minister Theresa May gave Remit to Alexis Jay, Not to investigate Elm Guest House or Dolphin Square and Kincora Boys home in Ireland on child abuse,why would these Three places be given "Elephant in the Room" process on child abuse, Operation Yewtree,Midland?

The same South Yorkshire Police who investigated a "Pop Idol" who sued BBC for libel after finding No evidence of child abuse at a church convention Billy Graham and pop idol attended in 1985, Seven Months earlier the Metropolitan Police Service had concluded as part of Operation Yewtree, No Evidence?
Marry Moss Elm Guest House list,MP's, pop idols Eight named Police Officers, early untimely Death of Carole Kaiser,"Insulin overdose" aged Forty Six?

Mark Watts is showing how deceptive a QC Mr B Altman is in questioning different "Witness's" to child abuse, Police establishment figures plenty of leeway, Whistle blowers or accusers, short sharp replies only?

Dame Alexis Jay is making a "mockery" of IICSA inquiry on behalf of the Establishment, as per the past Forty fifty Years, as Mr Don Hale has shown, by E-mails, UK Police and files in their possession.

Can you Trust Police Evidence, with all of the shenanigans they have become involved with, Creche Dad appears Six years later,"Walking wrong way", but the Police have all clothes worn by Father and Daughter, Six years later, with Millions of calls to, "Was this you", then Boom, it was me Doctor J Totman and I know the Tapas Friends and Parents!

by **Jill Havern** 29.03.19 20:05

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by plebgate 29.03.19 23:14

Is it possible PJ are investigating and told SY to butt out? Doubt it but it does all sound very strange.

We have had all these stories in MSM and the Netflix business. Why?

My hope is that the PJ are acting on the letter sent from MMRG.

by skyrocket 30.03.19 8:10

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - odd though. In the podcast it came across as though Dr Perlin had no idea that the FSS were already utilising TrueAllele. I can find no reference to use of the TrueAllele or similar, either directly or indirectly, in the FSS reports pertaining to the MBM investigation but that is not to say it wasn't used. You may be correct in that a more advanced programme has been developed since 2004. What concerns me most is that all Mark S's requests for copy of the analysis results were blocked - why?

by Guest 30.03.19 9:01

skyrocket wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - odd though. In the podcast it came across as though Dr Perlin had no idea that the FSS were already utilising TrueAllele. I can find no reference to use of the TrueAllele or similar, either directly or indirectly, in the FSS reports pertaining to the MBM investigation but that is not to say it wasn't used. You may be correct in that a more advanced programme has been developed since 2004. What concerns me most is that all Mark S's requests for copy of the analysis results were blocked - why?

Whilst the forensic reports are in the case files they wouldn't normally be released in the UK (I don't think). I'm not sure any journalist phoning UK police would be given them for any other case either, considering the case is supposed to be a live investigation. I'm surprised they even entertained the notion of him wanting a copy and he did get the runaround as to who the current holders of that information was.

On Mark's interview with Dr Perlin he (Perlin) specifically says FSS methods were old fashioned and states that the forensic interpretations were conducted manually for these reports (thus old fashioned). There should of course be another 12 years worth of TrueAllele software development which would see 2007 results as possibly less accurate. Something doesn't sit quite right and it may be interview editing by Mark or Dr Perlin wasn't quite 100% truthful (FSS did have the software). He may of course looked at the resulting report and knew that this wasn't results generated by TrueAllele and stated that TrueAllele could be used. It is odd as you say.

by Liz Eagles 30.03.19 9:28

Saunokonoko calls Operaton Grange and records an ansaphone response.

Saunokonoko then makes no mention of any other phone calls made.

Saunokonoko makes a point of no response from Operation Grange.

Saunokonoko then reveals a year or so later that a potentially explosive DNA advancement is in the offing but waits until episode 5 to reveal what has been allegedly sat upon for a year.

by Guest 30.03.19 11:38

aquila wrote:Saunokonoko calls Operaton Grange and records an ansaphone response.

Saunokonoko then makes no mention of any other phone calls made.

Saunokonoko makes a point of no response from Operation Grange.

Saunokonoko then reveals a year or so later that a potentially explosive DNA advancement is in the offing but waits until episode 5 to reveal what has been allegedly sat upon for a year.

Whilst I agree that it seems like he's sat on potentially explosive information, has he really?

He spoke to Dr Perlin Feb 18, he is told that if the numerical digital data can be provided that TrueAllele may possibly answer some DNA questions (I don't think Dr Perlin was saying anything for definite).

He then proceeds with FOI request (now he knows what he's looking for) and we are all aware these things aren't quickly answered. He's given the runaround by various government departments but does find out the report was removed for review in 2012

He doesn't state when he phones OG but received no reply. So what is he left with? A theory that getting the digital numerical data may solve the DNA conundrum.He also does not know if the PJ or OG already have the analysis it could have been done using another Lab who has TrueAllele or STRmix.

In reality he's not left with much other than a good story, if he really believed he had the explosive evidence then I'm sure his Australian TV channel would have had an exclusive before now.

It's out in the open now, perhaps something will now come of it

For those interested a bit more in TrueAllele

Using MATLAB to Analyze Complex DNA Samples
TrueAllele technology uses MATLAB, Signal Processing Toolbox

, and Statistics and Machine Learning Toolbox

to mathematically separate mixed DNA data into individual contributors and their respective genotypes. Since the solution may be uncertain, the inferred genotype values are assigned probabilities.

A DNA sequencer generates laser-detected fluorescent data as a one-dimensional signal, a multicolored multiplex of many loci. A TrueAllele analysis module developed with Signal Processing Toolbox processes the signal data to remove artifacts, classify the peaks, determine peak sizes and heights, and perform other quality checks.

After the initial analysis, TrueAllele interprets the data using a probability model. This model incorporates several hundred variables, including the unknown genotypes of individuals contributing to the sample, DNA quantities, amplification artifacts that distort the signal, and the uncertainties of these variables. Many of the variables are hierarchical, which means they include submodels, each with their own parameters and uncertainties. Starting from the DNA data, TrueAllele solves the model through Markov chain Monte Carlo (MCMC) statistical sampling, using a Metropolis-Hastings algorithm developed with Statistics and Machine Learning Toolbox.

To interpret DNA evidence, TrueAllele proposes 100,000 different combinations of possible values for solution space variables and evaluates how well each proposed solution explains the DNA data. The MATLAB based software then calculates probability densities to produce a probability distribution over the feasible solutions. Solutions that more accurately describe the observed data have higher probability, while poorer explanations have lower probability.

For some samples, the computer can mathematically separate the mixture into virtually single-source components, with a high probability assigned to each genotype. For other samples, the results are less certain and yield genotypes with more diffuse probabilities. Regardless, the genotype answer is a probability distribution, objectively inferred solely from the evidence.

When the data supports a match between the evidence and a suspect’s genotype, the TrueAllele model enables the analyst to calculate a DNA match statistic. To form such a match statistic, or "likelihood ratio," the MATLAB program compares a genotype inferred from the evidence with a reference genotype from the suspect. To eliminate the possibility of examination bias, this comparison is done only after computer genotype inference has completed.

The match calculation includes a third genotype representing the random population, which provides the denominator needed to compare a probability of match with coincidence. Stating the mathematical result in plain language, a forensic scientist can report, for example, that “a match between the evidence item and the suspect is a quadrillion times more probable than coincidence.”diffuse probabilities. Regardless, the genotype answer is a probability distribution, objectively inferred solely from the evidence.

When the data supports a match between the evidence and a suspect’s genotype, the TrueAllele model enables the analyst to calculate a DNA match statistic. To form such a match statistic, or "likelihood ratio," the MATLAB program compares a genotype inferred from the evidence with a reference genotype from the suspect. To eliminate the possibility of examination bias, this comparison is done only after computer genotype inference has completed.

The match calculation includes a third genotype representing the random population, which provides the denominator needed to compare a probability of match with coincidence. Stating the mathematical result in plain language, a forensic scientist can report, for example, that “a match between the evidence item and the suspect is a quadrillion times more probable than coincidence.”

by **Jill Havern** 01.04.19 8:20

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Latest podcast from Mark: The Courtroom
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Description

Never heard before court audio reveals the battle and consequences of the McCanns’ feud with lead Portuguese detective Goncalo Amaral.
----------------

He has got access to the recording of Kate's police interview, on tape/CD,
Must go back but I think she says she is not practicing as a "medical doctor" since Maddie's abduction.

So the 6 corpses nonsense is even worse.

Kennedy talking about Mainly Legal expenditure !

Enid O'Dowd features aswell.

by Guest 01.04.19 8:56

Jill Havern wrote:Latest podcast from Mark: The Courtroom
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Description

Never heard before court audio reveals the battle and consequences of the McCanns’ feud with lead Portuguese detective Goncalo Amaral.
----------------

He has got access to the recording of Kate's police interview, on tape/CD,
Must go back but I think she says she is not practicing as a "medical doctor" since Maddie's abduction.

So the 6 corpses nonsense is even worse.

Kennedy talking about Mainly Legal expenditure !

Enid O'Dowd features aswell.

He starts off with an update to podcast 5 about the DNA. Dr Perlin is now going to contact OG directly, explaining what his offer is and answering any of their questions. So not only will he analyse the data etc. for free but also take the time to answer any questions they may have, although he doubts that they will give him the data as this would prove FSS analysis was flawed.

It may be the knock on effect to other cases if he proves them (FSS) wrong that could be the issue.

Mark S also talks to a former Metodo 3 employee / Director (who believes Maddie was abducted) about what was actually investigated (not that interesting).

Another decent podcast, well worth the time to listen

by Guest 01.04.19 19:05

Dr Perlin interview
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by Guest 02.04.19 16:00

The question about FSS having the TrueAllele software in 2007 is answered here:-
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Basically FSS had a license to check single source DNA only, many samples in Maddie case contained multiples.

Over a million downloads for Maddie podcasts now.

by Doug D 02.04.19 16:30

The clarification tweets posted by CF over the road:

Mark Saunokonoko‏2Verified account@saunokonoko · 1h1 hour ago

1/ Since Episode 5 of Maddie, 'The DNA', a few people have been in touch to ask about this press release, which talks about a relationship between Dr Mark Perlin's Cybergenetics and the FSS in 2004

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] https://www.cybgen.com/information/press-release/2004/Forensic-Science-Service-Expands-License-for-Cybergenetics-Automated-DNA-Data-Review-Technology/page.shtml …

2/ That press release left some people confused, as it may have appeared that in 2004 the FSS already had access to the TrueAllele technology that Dr Perlin was speaking about in episode 5, the tech that could solve those 'inconclusive' DNA samples [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

3/ So I got in touch with Dr Perlin to explain the background to that 2004 deal between Cybergenetics and the FSS. This will clear up any confusion. The following are direct quotes from Dr Perlin [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

4/ "Cybergenetics contracts with the FSS [in 2004] were for analysing single source DNA items," said Dr Perlin. (Remember, many of the McCann DNA samples were mixed with multiple people + too complex for FSS) [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].

5/ "This second contract cited [in the press release] expanded our TrueAllele Databank (single source) work with the FSS from buccal swabs (National DNA Database) to property crime. The work did NOT include analysing DNA mixtures, as in [the Madeleine McCann] case." [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

6/ I hope that clears that up. As an aside, the Maddie podcast ticked over 1 million downloads last night. A massive thank you to all of you for your support! [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

by willowthewisp 02.04.19 18:13

Hi Verdi, DougD, Madeleine McCann, DNA/LCI evidence.

Didn't Clarence Mitchell state they had the Renault Scenic boot swabbed for DNA,whilst the car was in possession of Mr Geraherty Garage Portugal September 2007?

Why haven't the Family handed any DNA taken by their Private sources tested to "Rule in/out" Madeleine DNA/LCI found in Renault Scenic!

by **Hobs** 03.04.19 0:09

willowthewisp wrote:Hi Verdi, DougD, Madeleine McCann, DNA/LCI evidence.

Didn't Clarence Mitchell state they had the Renault Scenic boot swabbed for DNA,whilst the car was in possession of Mr Geraherty Garage Portugal September 2007?

Why haven't the Family handed any DNA taken by their Private sources tested to "Rule in/out" Madeleine DNA/LCI found in Renault Scenic!

Hi Willowthewisp

Perhaps because they already knew what swabs might reveal or rather they feared what the swabs might reveal.
Despite their denials and excuses as to why Maddie's DNA was found in the hire car, hired 3 weeks after Maddie was allegedly abducted, the swabs came up with a 15/19 markers with 4 alleles too degraded to provide a conclusive result.

Even if there was a complete match showing Maddie's DNA was in the hire car weeks after she was allegedly abducted, they came up with excuses, numerous people drove the vehicle, sweaty sandals, dirty diapers, Maddie's clothing, rotting meat and fish and so on.

Even if there is a full 19/19 match to Maddie, they have already sown the seeds of doubt with contamination from the twins, Maddie's belonging being in the car and close family in the car.

It would be interesting though to see if the 19/19 match reveals kate and gerry to be her parents as claimed even though she was IVF.
What would be more telling was if the results show that gerry is not the father as was claimed early on with police apparently having spoken to the sperm donor.
If results showed kate and gerry to be the bio parents of the twins (IVF in Holland) and one or both not being the bio parent of Maddie then we have a huge motive right there to explain Maddie's alleged abduction (actually death) and the lack of emotion and parental bonding between the mccanns and Maddie.
It would explain why kate positively bloomed after Maddie's disappearance as if a huge weight had been lifted from her shoulders.
The mccanns are more than happy to ignore anything which could provide a match to their missing daughter.
I wonder where the hire car currently is or if, as is more likely, it was taken to the scrap yard and destroyed, thus making sure no more samples could be obtained from the vehicle.

There may well be swabs kept on the mccanns behalf probably because it incriminates them as, if it cleared them of involvement, they would have handed them over and shouted from the roof tops that the samples did not come from a dead Maddie, rather it is indeed a result of cross contamination.

If the mccanns were truly not involved in the disappearance of Maddie as in it did not take place in the children's bedroom as claimed which would explain the non physical evidence of an abductor entering the apartment but elsewhere, i am sure they would be willing to be interviewed by a trained statement analyst such as Peter Hyatt, Kaaryn Gough or Avinoam Sapir or anyone else trained in statement analysis.
It is more reliable that a polygraph and only the language used by the subject is used to frame the questions so there is no chance of being misquoted or misspoke or not understanding the question or any number of other excuses.

Their own words and language will reveal the truth.

by Verdi 03.04.19 0:45

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by Doug D 03.04.19 20:07

Rather than just the isolated letter from Espinheira, the run of letters & results is here:

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The comparison sample is taken from the saliva stain on the pillowcase, which was collected (unscientifically as far as we can see, not that it seems to matter) by GM on his quick trip home around 21^stMay 2007, rather than from something from 5A, which never made sense in itself.

Another oddity though, according to the ‘bewk’ MM’s pillowcase must still have been in Rothley in June:

‘So, in the second week of June, we had confided in Auntie Janet and our friend Amanda back in Leicestershire and got them to go round to our house looking for hairs that could only be Madeleine’s. They came up with five head hairs from the inside of a coat hood and a couple of eyelashes from her pillow’

so quite whether Krugel got just ‘five head hairs and a couple of eyelashes’ or MM’s hairbrush, to ‘use’ in his cowboy machine in July 2007 is again a bit of a mystery.

In 2017 the hairbrush was supposedly returned to the Mc’s by Krugel, so if he had it all that time, how can it have been sent to the FSS for Lowe to report that nothing could be found on it? How is it possible that someone with hair as long as MM’s would leave no trace on a hairbrush. More McNonsense.

Ok, the ‘one toothbrush between all three’ rubbish might make it more difficult to isolate samples, but even if the hairbrush was shared, which personally I would have thought was very likely with the three youngsters, (although it was stated to be MM’s), isolating whose hair was whose should not exactly be ‘rocket science’ and certainly in the laboratory would simply not have been a problem.

In his book, GA talks of checking DNA profiles from alleged sightings as early as May 11^thso the PJ must have had some reference samples from something even at that stage and the hairbrush would seem to be the obvious choice in the absence of her toothbrush, so why the need to ask GM to bring back the pillowcase, if indeed they did ask him.

Lowe’s report clearly states that the saliva matches the blood sample (presumably heel prick card) for MM.

We then get Lesley Denton’s (FSS) two reports, dated 28 June 2007  and 18^thJuly 2007 (McCannfiles translation dates the second one incorrectly as 28 June also, just to further confuse things), the first of which says the saliva swab comes from a natural child of GM & KM, but could be from another female (AM),  but the second of which, presumably following receipt of further reference samples, then states that it is not AM or SM on the pillow.

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John Lowe’s e-mail  to Stuart Prior was dated 3 September 2007, but it then takes him until 18^thJune 2008, to submit his full report.

So again it begs the question, why so long?

by **HiDeHo** 04.04.19 15:17

Doug D wrote:Rather than just the isolated letter from Espinheira, the run of letters & results is here:

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The comparison sample is taken from the saliva stain on the pillowcase, which was collected (unscientifically as far as we can see, not that it seems to matter) by GM on his quick trip home around 21^stMay 2007, rather than from something from 5A, which never made sense in itself.

Another oddity though, according to the ‘bewk’ MM’s pillowcase must still have been in Rothley in June:

‘So, in the second week of June, we had confided in Auntie Janet and our friend Amanda back in Leicestershire and got them to go round to our house looking for hairs that could only be Madeleine’s. They came up with five head hairs from the inside of a coat hood and a couple of eyelashes from her pillow’

so quite whether Krugel got just ‘five head hairs and a couple of eyelashes’ or MM’s hairbrush, to ‘use’ in his cowboy machine in July 2007 is again a bit of a mystery.

In 2017 the hairbrush was supposedly returned to the Mc’s by Krugel, so if he had it all that time, how can it have been sent to the FSS for Lowe to report that nothing could be found on it? How is it possible that someone with hair as long as MM’s would leave no trace on a hairbrush. More McNonsense.

Ok, the ‘one toothbrush between all three’ rubbish might make it more difficult to isolate samples, but even if the hairbrush was shared, which personally I would have thought was very likely with the three youngsters, (although it was stated to be MM’s), isolating whose hair was whose should not exactly be ‘rocket science’ and certainly in the laboratory would simply not have been a problem.

In his book, GA talks of checking DNA profiles from alleged sightings as early as May 11^thso the PJ must have had some reference samples from something even at that stage and the hairbrush would seem to be the obvious choice in the absence of her toothbrush, so why the need to ask GM to bring back the pillowcase, if indeed they did ask him.

Lowe’s report clearly states that the saliva matches the blood sample (presumably heel prick card) for MM.

We then get Lesley Denton’s (FSS) two reports, dated 28 June 2007  and 18^thJuly 2007 (McCannfiles translation dates the second one incorrectly as 28 June also, just to further confuse things), the first of which says the saliva swab comes from a natural child of GM & KM, but could be from another female (AM),  but the second of which, presumably following receipt of further reference samples, then states that it is not AM or SM on the pillow.

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John Lowe’s e-mail  to Stuart Prior was dated 3 September 2007, but it then takes him until 18^thJune 2008, to submit his full report.

So again it begs the question, why so long?

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by Verdi 05.04.19 12:22

Doug D wrote:Rather than just the isolated letter from Espinheira, the run of letters & results is here:

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Because it's not relevant to my point. This thread is about Mark Saunokonoko's podcast, not forensics in general.

The question remains, why all the hullabaloo about Operation Grange/Metropolitan Police not answering phones, when by rights any assistance offered should be sent to Portugal, they are the leading investigative force.

by Liz Eagles 05.04.19 12:27

Verdi wrote:
Doug D wrote:Rather than just the isolated letter from Espinheira, the run of letters & results is here:

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Because it's not relevant to my point. This thread is about Mark Saunokonoko's podcast, not forensics in general.

The question remains, why all the hullabaloo about Operation Grange/Metropolitan Police not answering phones, when by rights any assistance offered should be sent to Portugal, they are the leading investigative force.

I agree wholeheartedly Verdi.

by Guest 06.04.19 9:13

More from Mark Saunokonoko

EXCLUSIVE: Maddie McCann podcast triggers dramatic offer from US lab to solve 18 vital DNA samples
By Mark Saunokonoko
3:28pm Apr 6, 2019

Following an investigation by nine.com.au, a formal request from one of the world's leading DNA scientists has been lodged with London Metropolitan Police for access to 18 complex DNA samples which are potentially loaded with vital clues about Madeleine McCann's disappearance.

There is hope that Dr Mark Perlin's powerful computational DNA testing methods could blow open the cold case by successfully cracking the 18 samples which frustratingly stumped a UK lab in 2007.

The offer comes after revelations about the case in nine.com.au's podcast series Maddie

Dr Perlin, chief scientist at Cybergenetics, a renowned laboratory in Pittsburgh, US, sent a formal pro bono offer to detectives at Operation Grange to analyse that particular set of DNA samples, which had all been ruled "inconclusive", "too meagre" and "weak" by UK scientists during the original 14-month Portuguese police investigation.

Two of the 18 DNA samples Dr Perlin wants to look at were lifted from the boot of a rental car hired by Kate and Gerry McCann 25 days after Madeleine mysteriously vanished while on holiday in Portugal, almost 12 years ago.

Having reviewed a 2007 Forensic Science Service (FSS) report supplied by nine.com.au, Dr Perlin said it was "possible" Madeleine's DNA was present in the McCann hire car, potentially opening up or ruling out a line of the police inquiry, which had stalled with the "inconclusive" results.

The other 16 samples of interest to Dr Perlin were taken from areas inside the McCann holiday apartment in 2007 by a Portuguese forensic team. Dr Perlin will discuss the 18 DNA samples in greater detail in Monday's upcoming episode of Maddie.

In Dr Perlin's email to Detective Chief Inspector Nicola Wall, who heads up Operation Grange, the UK strike force investigating Madeleine's disappearance, he confirmed he would conduct analysis of the 18 samples for no cost. Scotland Yard's Operation Grange, launched in 2011, has cost British taxpayers more than $20 million and it has recently requested further funding from the UK Home Office.

Following an investigation by nine.com.au, a formal request from one of the world's leading DNA scientists has been lodged with London Metropolitan Police for access to 18 complex DNA samples which are potentially loaded with vital clues about Madeleine McCann's disappearance.

There is hope that Dr Mark Perlin's powerful computational DNA testing methods could blow open the cold case by successfully cracking the 18 samples which frustratingly stumped a UK lab in 2007.

Dr Perlin, chief scientist at Cybergenetics, a renowned laboratory in Pittsburgh, US, sent a formal pro bono offer to detectives at Operation Grange to analyse that particular set of DNA samples, which had all been ruled "inconclusive", "too meagre" and "weak" by UK scientists during the original 14-month Portuguese police investigation.

Two of the 18 DNA samples Dr Perlin wants to look at were lifted from the boot of a rental car hired by Kate and Gerry McCann 25 days after Madeleine mysteriously vanished while on holiday in Portugal, almost 12 years ago.

Having reviewed a 2007 Forensic Science Service (FSS) report supplied by nine.com.au, Dr Perlin said it was "possible" Madeleine's DNA was present in the McCann hire car, potentially opening up or ruling out a line of the police inquiry, which had stalled with the "inconclusive" results.

The other 16 samples of interest to Dr Perlin were taken from areas inside the McCann holiday apartment in 2007 by a Portuguese forensic team. Dr Perlin will discuss the 18 DNA samples in greater detail in Monday's upcoming episode of Maddie.

In Dr Perlin's email to Detective Chief Inspector Nicola Wall, who heads up Operation Grange, the UK strike force investigating Madeleine's disappearance, he confirmed he would conduct analysis of the 18 samples for no cost. Scotland Yard's Operation Grange, launched in 2011, has cost British taxpayers more than $20 million and it has recently requested further funding from the UK Home Office.

Cybergenetics chief scientist Dr Mark Perlin has pioneered tremendously powerful software to solve extremely complex DNA evidence
Cybergenetics chief scientist Dr Mark Perlin has pioneered tremendously powerful software to solve extremely complex DNA evidence. (Supplied / Credit: Andrew Rush)
Cybergenetics and Dr Perlin's analysis could either confirm or conclusively rule out some of the questions around the DNA samples.

Mr and Mrs McCann, both doctors from Rothley, Leicestershire, have strenuously denied they were involved in the disappearance of their daughter. Nine.com.au does not suggest any involvement on their part.

As revealed in earlier episodes of Maddie, Nine.com.au's multi-episode podcast investigation into Madeleine's disappearance, Dr Perlin has pioneered world-renowned DNA testing technology able to solve crime scene evidence once thought to be indecipherable.

Dr Perlin's testing methods have helped identify victims of the 9/11 terror attack on New York's World Trade Centre and overturned wrongful convictions based on dodgy DNA evidence.

The now closed FSS in Birmingham had "failed" with the limited DNA testing methods it used to analyse a raft of "inconclusive" McCann samples, Dr Perlin said.

"[If] a lab can produce informative data, even if it is complex and mixed, but they can't interpret it then you can have tremendous injustice; of guilty people not being convicted, of innocent people staying in prison," Dr Perlin said. "What is needed is an objective and accurate interpretation that can scientifically resolve the DNA."

Dr Perlin said forensic and law enforcement agencies around the world, such as the FSS and other official UK bodies, routinely hold and archive the DNA data his lab Cybergenetics needs to make an accurate analysis and possibly help unlock the Maddie mystery.

"It would be a great way to resolve the case using modern technology and get a definitive answer to at least this one question that had perplexed the FSS ten years ago," he said.
Portuguese police had focused on the McCann hire car and certain areas inside the family's Algarve holiday apartment after intensive search work by two specialist British cadaver dogs, three months after Madeleine went missing. The two dogs had alerted inside the apartment, car and on several personal family possessions. Any alerts by cadaver dogs need to be corroborated by additional evidence, such as DNA.

One month after the dogs had searched those areas, Madeleine's parents were declared arguidos, formal suspects.

Arguidos status was lifted from Mr and Mrs McCann when the Portuguese police investigation was shelved in August 2008.

Aged three when she vanished in May 2007, Madeleine would turn 16 in 2019.

Episode seven of Maddie will be released on Monday, April 8.

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by Verdi 06.04.19 12:16

This will not assist any investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

This is a commercial enterprise.

This is quackery.

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