Would this account for the unprecedented high level of political support?

Stella wrote:Important people working for important companies, with reputations, potential big financial projects and private properties to protect. It's no wonder the Government got involved.

The big question is, at what point did they first get involved?

1. before May 3rd

2. on May 3rd

3. or after May 3rd

I am sure that the government is involved. When did it become involved? Good question.



I would also like to know: Did they know from the begining that wheatever happened to Maddie was no abduction? Did they know from the outset that there were blood splatters on the walls in 3A and cadaver scent would be found on the clothes of Kate McCann?

No flight details and an untidy entry !!

Where do people like the Gaspars fit into all this?



Given that most of us believe they were a *normal* family going on holiday with some doctor pals. The previous year, that is.

Stella wrote:

I wonder if the Newman's at the bottom of the page are also relations of Margaret Hodge?

Margaret's sister Ines married a Mike Newman.

Stella wrote:

Stella wrote:

I wonder if the Newman's at the bottom of the page are also relations of Margaret Hodge?

Margaret's sister Ines married a Mike Newman.

Goodness, you have been doing your homework Stella

ShrinkingViolet wrote:
Why go on to create the humungous publicity band wagon though, if they were trying to keep it all hush-hush?



With THIS scenario, they already had the willing help of some powerful business men and government. They didn't need to make themselves into VIPs in order to get the money and generate the celebrity in order to get support from govt?
Not so sure they would get a lot of money off these business men, besides, both business and government were skint. There was simply no precedent to give money to the McCanns and no need!
Most of Portugal were on their hands an knees looking for the child, the portrait was sent around the world and all the newspapers carried the story. They did not need any money, they just wanted it!



Please don't get me wrong, I am very interested in what's been uncovered in this thread. Well done everyone involved, keep digging away for the truth. And, it is clear from the Ambassadorial help that Amaral talks of in his books that from the very, very start, the McCanns were being protected. But I'm scratching my head here, trying to understand why Oppenheimer or Margaret Hodge or anyone else would think that the blanket coverage of Maddie on the news or the setting up of the Fund was a GOOD idea.



Unless of course it was part of the idea and related to Masonichip or some such.



http://www.masonichip.org/index.php/for-parents.html

I agree with violet, it simply doesn't make sense. What does makes sense is that a hush hush meeting was taking place and thats why a few of them got out to avoid publicity. As I said 2007, makes sense for business and golfing enthusiasts to come together. There was a golf tournament? Someone said.

I still don't think it's got anything to do with the T9. OK lot of doctors, but they'd all been on holiday before, the one with the Gaspars in Majorca who were also doctors. Greece? How many were doctors there?

I'm thinking the protection came straight from the top. Namely, GB who has worked tirelessly and interfered with all sorts of authorities.
And the top can lean on anyone, these businessmen, however high powered they might be, have connections but no personal power, certainly not to act so immediately. They cannot activate the F.O. in a matter of hours, or appoint spin doctors.

We have in the first 24 -48 hours, the Consul, the Ambassador, the FO, a spokesman and GB, the great man himself. Gerry worked for Andrew Brown. I would look there. I thinks its' simple. GB had a very good reason to help them and on top of that it was a vote winner. What's not to like?
But still, he never got himself photographed with them or visited the illustrious couple himself, although he did take time out from his busy schedule to visit both Leicester Police and the FSS. He said right at the start that it was a matter of 'national security'. So... I like him, as US cops tend to say.

IMO we're looking at two separate sets of circumstances here. One where there is a salvage operation/cum golf holiday going on, the financiers and big business were looking at ways to 'firewall' their investments and e.g. possible new schemes to get patents on. Masonichip doesn't involve actual microchips although they might want to progress to that. But as there is already a very good system in place for pets, it wouldn't be groundbreaking technology to set up such a scheme .
What with Landsbanki which was on the slippery slope to bankruptcy (it's winding up this November), Lehman brother scandal coming up, (I'm sure the City would have had some idea), it's quite feasible that they were there for business. Nothing else.

As a last thought, since the creche records are a little doubtful, to say the least, surely it wouldn't have been a great deal more difficult to change the booking sheets? In this case, a little money could have changed hands and no one who didn't want to be, would be on the books.

ShrinkingViolet wrote:

Stella wrote:

Stella wrote:

I wonder if the Newman's at the bottom of the page are also relations of Margaret Hodge?

Margaret's sister Ines married a Mike Newman.

Goodness, you have been doing your homework Stella

the booking says staff hol for Helen. There is a Helen Newman, head of resource recruitment at mark warner http://www.spoke.com/info/pYP64uf/HelenNewman

Tigger, when you talk about the first 24-48 hours, you are assuming that Madeleine died on the 3rd?

But what if she died on the 29th and between then and the 3rd, certain guests used possible connections to help get them out of what would be one hell of a scandal? If you could, would you?

By virtue of what we can see on the creche records, it would suggest that the T9 group was much bigger than we have been led to believe and quite possibly other people were used or possibly involved in the cover up.

Stewie wrote:

the booking says staff hol for Helen. There is a Helen Newman, head of resource recruitment at mark warner http://www.spoke.com/info/pYP64uf/HelenNewman

But is she married to a Mike Newman once married to an Oppenheimer, or a relation of his ?

Are you ready for another one of those coincidences?

On the report from the 1st May we have a

Matthew Philip Newman

room W21B - that's on the waterfront and would be a big luxurious property with private pool.

from 28/4/07 to 5/5/07

the report on the 2nd is missing and low and behold the reservation disappears from the reports run on the 3rd and onwards.

But it doesn't end there....

On the 6th May report we now see another Newman entry. Are they related?, who knows.

Anthony James Newman

room FP08

5/5/07 to 12/5/07


This means that Matt Newman and Helen (recruitment) Newman, checked out on or just after the 1st May after staying

just 3 or 4 days out of a 7 day holiday.

Now that is a tad suspicious if you ask me.

I wonder if this Mike Newman http://www.geni.com/people/Mike-Newman/6000000007014359005

has a brother or son called Matthew Newman ?

Stella wrote:Tigger, when you talk about the first 24-48 hours, you are assuming that Madeleine died on the 3rd?

But what if she died on the 29th and between then and the 3rd, certain guests used possible connections to help get them out of what would be one hell of a scandal? If you could, would you?

By virtue of what we can see on the creche records, it would suggest that the T9 group was much bigger than we have been led to believe and quite possibly other people were used or possibly involved in the cover up.

I wasn't aware that the T9 group was larger than the we were led to believe. There was a suggestion there was a 10th who disappeared on the 4th of May. This could have been the Oppenheimer/Edwards. But the sudden departure might mean he was surprised and didn't want to be associated with the abduction.
But I'm still of the opinion, that if she died very early (which is what I believe anyway) that the death could have been covered up instead of creating this badly produced 'abduction'. That plan was so bad, that anyone with two brain cells would have vetoed it. So IMO it was all the McCanns idea.

So if she died early, then the FO and all the other help could have covered up the reason for her death. Bit of publicity, sad for the parents, not their fault. But no Fund, no money and no celebrity status. No new lifestyle. All these things are the last thing the 'helpers' would want.

Again if she died early, and there were discussions with the business men on how to help the McCanns, the last thing they wanted was a faked abduction and all the publicity.
These were people who could probably lay their hands on a private jet and get the body transported to the UK in no time for a controlled PM report.
Gerry and Kate could have gone home early, pleading that Maddie was sick. The whole thing would be swept under the carpet in no time. They could even have borrowed a child to stand in for Maddie.

I can think of lots of ways to help the McCanns cover up. An abduction is sort of shouting it from the roof tops.
And for me it's the money. It was always about the money and the glamour and the lifestyle.

tigger wrote:I wasn't aware that the T9 group was larger than the we were led to believe. There was a suggestion there was a 10th who disappeared on the 4th of May. This could have been the Oppenheimer/Edwards. But the sudden departure might mean he was surprised and didn't want to be associated with the abduction.

Have you been following the gist of the Creche Enquiry thread on handwriting?

Look also at the Moita Flores quote below !! he is suggesting possibly 12 people.

Stella wrote:26/04-03/05 C1C Neema Balva Patel a Thomas Cook guest

According to the report run on the 1/5, Patel was due to leave on the 3^rd

The report for the 2^nd is missing

When the report was run on the 3^rd, it now says Patel’s last day was the 2^nd So she must have left 1 day early also.

Why are so many people keen to leave Ocean Club early?

When the police were looking into an abduction on the 3rd, surely they would have checked out all of the guests present on the 3rd. Hmmm I do see where you're going with this Stella... But this would make this a conspiracy between so many people, it would be nigh on impossible to keep the lid on.



Will we ever get to the bottom of this murky tale? Please say yes.

This may seem rather frivolous, but wasn't it raining on the 2nd?

Stella wrote:Are you ready for another one of those coincidences?

On the report from the 1st May we have a

Matthew Philip Newman

room W21B - that's on the waterfront and would be a big luxurious property with private pool.

from 28/4/07 to 5/5/07

the report on the 2nd is missing and low and behold the reservation disappears from the reports run on the 3rd and onwards.

But it doesn't end there....

On the 6th May report we now see another Newman entry. Are they related?, who knows.

Anthony James Newman

room FP08

5/5/07 to 12/5/07


This means that Matt Newman and Helen (recruitment) Newman, checked out on or just after the 1st May after staying

just 3 or 4 days out of a 7 day holiday.

Now that is a tad suspicious if you ask me.

Helen/Matt Newman in W21B appear on the master arrivals list . This list was printed 27/4 18.35 and looks like it is the master copy printed in ancitipation of the new round of arrivals on 28/4 and was used by ocean club reception as a reference list of new arrivals.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P2/02_VOLUME_IIa_Page_351.jpg
Then looking at this list in the pj files called Ocean Club check in lists, this was printed 8/5 17.26 and shows arrivals 28/4 to 5/5 - guessing this was requested by pj in order to show who was booked in to ocean club for that week but the Newmans don't appear on this list.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TAPAS_BOOKING.htm

Thought maybe if Helen was on a freebie because she worked for Mark Warner and if they were full they moved her out of the apartment but looking at the subsequent reports available after 1/5 noone appears to be occupying the apartment. So it does seem that she appears on the original master list used during check in, but on subsequent print outs they have been whooshed...

Then looking at the Newmans FP08, they have a tapas reservatioin for 7/5 but it is recorded as Newan not Newman...

That's right Stewie, that's the beauty of the OC daily run reports, they give us a timeline day by day, of what happened over the previous 24 hours. There is much to be learnt from those lists, something I bet they never anticipated we would ever find out about. I just wish we had been allowed to see the ones run on the 29th and 30th also. As I have a funny feeling there would be another guest who quite possibly suddenly left on the 30th, just after Madeleine really left this world.

As for the Newman connection to the Oppenheimer family, we can find no connection with the ones booked into Ocean Club.

If the McCann's had allowed the investigation to remain open, none of the guest lists would have ever been released.

This is one big own goal, by those who seek to stem this infomation from coming out.

We are currently having a count up and to date have identified 11 Doctors staying at the OC that week.

11

Was Professor Tony Gershlick there too?

Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:Was Professor Tony Gershlick there too?

He's not on the lists under Gershlick, will see if he travelled with someone with a different name.

Stella wrote:We are currently having a count up and to date have identified 11 Doctors staying at the OC that week.

11

Hmm, interesting

Would be good to see what they might have in common. Eg. Were they all Mark Warner bookings? I count there are 65 adults in total, 28 family groups for Mark warner that week so 11 doctors would be a high percentage I would think. Where room upgrades were given, or guests got different rooms to those they had booked , how many were doctors?

I bet there's more than 11 by the time we are finished.

G607 Dr L Hurne (?)
G5A Dr Kate McCann (GP)
G5A Dr Gerry McCann (Cardiologist)
G5B Dr Matthew Oldfield (Endocrinologist)
G5D Dr Russell O’Brien (University of Plymouth, Medical School)
G5H Dr Fiona Payne (Anaesthetist)
G5H Dr David Payne (Leicester University in Cardiovascular Sciences)
G4M Dr Julian Edward Bartran Totman (GP in Salisbury, has 2 surgeries)
G4M Dr Rachel Clapton Totman (GP in Salisbury)
G20 Dr Pawer (Leicester Royal Infirmary)
S704 Dr Christopher John McNamara (Consultant Haematologist, Royal Free Hospital, London)

Stella wrote:I bet there's more than 11 by the time we are finished.

G607 Dr L Hurne (?)
G5A Dr Kate McCann (GP)
G5A Dr Gerry McCann (Cardiologist)
G5B Dr Matthew Oldfield (Endocrinologist)
G5D Dr Russell O’Brien (University of Plymouth, Medical School)
G5H Dr Fiona Payne (Anaesthetist)
G5H Dr David Payne (Leicester University in Cardiovascular Sciences)
G4M Dr Julian Edward Bartran Totman (GP in Salisbury, has 2 surgeries)
G4M Dr Rachel Clapton Totman (GP in Salisbury)
G20 Dr Pawer (Leicester Royal Infirmary)
S704 Dr Christopher John McNamara (Consultant Haematologist, Royal Free Hospital, London)

Ones in red booked through Thomas Cook
Ones in blue are 'donos' bookings
all the rest are Mark Warner.

This list does no include other people who work for the NHS, or research.