Mobile Phones - Info Needed

by jd 02.08.11 2:00

Someone put a post in a thread this morning (or yesterday now) with info of GM's and Murats mobile phone being off and on at the very same time. Think it was an ex military giving his opinion about this. I can't find it but remember reading it. Please could you put it up again in here. Thanks

by Guest 02.08.11 9:01

The poster who has examined the phone traffic is Kiko. Some time ago he posted up this very detailed analysis on here, this is a copy of that post. It starts from the alarm being raised and working backwards.

Kikoratton:

"Robert Murat turned his mobile back on after a long silent interval at 2320 on 3 May. One of his first calls was from Sergi Malinka, his computer guru. But at least one hour before KM raised the alarm, Sergi and his friends were chatting profusely by phone, leading me to wonder whether word of “something” had got out before the official announcement by Kate.
The vital piece of evidence, however, is this: RM’s mobile phone silence had begun at 1545 on 2 May, and ended at 2320 on 3 May just after KM’s shout. That’s 31h 35m of silence. Gerry had been taking numerous calls made to his voicemail box on 2 May, and effectively the last of these was at 1549. He postponed listening to this until around 2015, at which point he turned off his mobile. He took just one incoming call at 1224 on 3 May, then his mobile fell silent again until 2314. Since he didn’t make a single outgoing call during that period, and used voicemail to eliminate any possibility of identification of his callers, we can say that his period of silence (compare the figure with Murat’s) was of 31h 25m.
This is inexplicable unless you come to the conclusion that GM and RM were in cahoots, and the silence was akin to the military golden rule, of communications silence to avoid any possibility of compromise before the action kicks off.
I then consider in more detail those 12 voicemail messages which GM received on 2 May. The PJ never found out who they came from, but by any standards it was a busy eight hours for Gerry, no doubt with pen and paper in hand to take down detailed instructions and timings. As I’ve said, he postponed listening to the last two for some reason. KM’s claim that Gerry was so busy at work that he had to keep in touch with his department, is given the lie by the fact that he didn’t actually speak to anybody, and never responded with a single outgoing call.
Putting all of this together, I’m satisfied that the tragic event had not only taken place by 0800 on 2 May, but that sufficient time had passed between the event and 0800 on 2 May for Gerry to start to receive detailed plans beginning at that time.
So theoretically, death around 2345 on 1 May is still possible, although we have no indication of frantic phone communications during that night as we would expect. Which leads us neatly to those six contacts (texts or calls?) on KM’s mobile from 2216 – 2228 on that evening. (According to Mrs Fenn’s account, the crying of Madeleine started at 2230).
Might that really be the time of the tragedy? I doubt it. Look at it this way: wouldn’t we have expected some normal, “chatty” contact between the two McCanns and their Tapas chums, or with family, on 1 May and 30 April? We have absolutely none. 48 hours without mobile contact. I believe that represents 48 hours during which something very concealed was going on. And then suddenly Kate has to make six contacts in 12 minutes just before the long period when, according to Mrs Fenn , Maddie was crying. I don’t believe there is any logic which points to the tragic event happening at that time.

So I return to investigate the calls made by RM’s mobile, and in a 14 minute period between 2200 and 2214 I find six texts apparently being transmitted between his mobile and Michaela Walczuch’s. Now, as an inveterate ex-communications-intelligence jobsworth, I look at those bursts of six messages beginning at 2200 and ending at 2228 and I say “something fishy’s going on here.”
Putting this together with RM’s and Gerry’s coinciding 31-hour silences of the following day, I believe that Murat’s and Walczuch’s mobiles were being used to transmit stuff which was vital to the cover-up of a tragedy which had happened before 2200 on 1 May.
Going back still further, it can be noted that RM booked his flight on 30 April, that the same day was highlighted by phone communications between Jenny Murat and Exeter, and that he flew to Faro and arrived at PdL around 1130 on 1 May. And we should add to the mix an unexplained call to Jane Tanner at the ungodly hour of 0415 on 29 April.

That’s about 600 pages of the phone thread condensed into little more than one page"

by Guest 02.08.11 9:43

Follow this man on twitter for updates

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dewi lennard
@kikoratton
catalunya
ex-GCHQ traffic analyst. I.e.who's contacting whom? why? what's the motive? where? how do they fit in with others?

by jd 02.08.11 10:37

Thanks very much Stella, this is most interesting and fits in perfectly in a theory I am forming. except for one thing, that the cleaner cleaned the apartment on the morning on weds 2nd May but this could be a red herring, unless they took the body and hid it in one of Murats empty properties for a night or two. Note also that Sergio Malinka (Murats web designer) called Murat at 11.30pm on May 3rd even though they both denied it at first saying they hadn't spoken for a year, until it was discovered by police this call had been made. And Matthew Fazakerley who works (at that time) with Sergey Malinka as a Project Organiser for Island expeditions on the boat company [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and runs a chain of computer offices with Malinka. Its very possible to get the body from one of Murats empty properties to a boat and out to sea is my thinking....there is a route there

by Guest 02.08.11 10:44

jd wrote:Thanks very much Stella, this is most interesting and fits in perfectly in a theory I am forming. except for one thing, that the cleaner cleaned the apartment on the morning on weds 2nd May but this could be a red herring, unless they took the body and hid it in one of Murats empty properties for a night or two. Note also that Sergio Malinka (Murats web designer) called Murat at 11.30pm on May 3rd even though they both denied it at first saying they hadn't spoken for a year, until it was discovered by police this call had been made. And Matthew Fazakerley who works (at that time) with Sergey Malinka as a Project Organiser for Island expeditions on the boat company [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and runs a chain of computer offices with Malinka. Its very possible to get the body from one of Murats empty properties to a boat and out to sea is my thinking....there is a route there

Hi jd, just a few comments,

The cleaner did not clean on the 2nd, she only went in to collect the rubbish bag in the kitchen and left again, as I believe.

If they had friends in private residences out there, then they had an infinite number of places to choose from.

by Willo 02.08.11 11:27

I wonder if the cleaner checked what was in the bag?

by jd 02.08.11 11:37

From her statement, the cleaner said she last cleaned the apartment on the morning of May 2nd and she didn't have time that morning to clean the rubbish bags as she was so busy. Maybe yet another contradiction of statements! (I put an extract of her statement in the 'cleaners' topic)

But this could very well be true anyway, as if Maddie died the night before which is very possible, this would make sense of the amount of frantic phone texts from KM on May 1st etc. then they planned to turn their mobiles off in an effect to deflect the police at a later stage and not have them linked to one another, though they did just that! After the accident they could have initially put the body in their apartment cupboard to keep it away from the twins while they made other arrangements. The cleaner in the morning was perfectly timed. The McCanns had probably 12 hours window to get the body out and Murat could have helped them by initially storing the body in one of his empty property apartments, while he organised with his connections to take it out to sea during the next day. The McCanns say that Maddie went sailing on the 2nd May, maybe in truth it was actually them that went out to sea. In their desperate situation having decided they had to fake an abduction (fear of losing theirs jobs, twins etc) there is only one place on the planet where she could never be found...the ocean. Burying on land is too much of a risk of being discovered one day, especially in a country they don't really know. In a panic they had to make a quick decision with their friends

This is one of scenarios which does make sense to me, though the other one makes sense also as the McCanns were very desperate for money. The deeper we delve the more clearer it will be!

by Miraflores 02.08.11 11:41

This is one of scenarios which does
make sense to me, though the other one makes sense also as the McCanns
were very desperate for money. The deeper we delve the more clearer it
will be!

Now if the McCanns and friends were just to tell the truth - we might find out that it's all a whole lot simpler.

I don't think that we will ever find out though!

by jd 02.08.11 11:52

Miraflores wrote:
This is one of scenarios which does
make sense to me, though the other one makes sense also as the McCanns
were very desperate for money. The deeper we delve the more clearer it
will be!

Now if the McCanns and friends were just to tell the truth - we might find out that it's all a whole lot simpler.

I don't think that we will ever find out though!

I think a few of them want to but are too scared and live in fear of the consequences

by Guest 02.08.11 12:25

jd, I don't think anything was taken out to sea. Remember what was found in the car and the state of it? GA said it had been frozen and was defrosting. Which means a fridge/freezer, somewhere near by.

by Guest 02.08.11 12:29

jd wrote:From her statement, the cleaner said she last cleaned the apartment on the morning of May 2nd and she didn't have time that morning to clean the rubbish bags as she was so busy. Maybe yet another contradiction of statements! (I put an extract of her statement in the 'cleaners' topic)

Sorry jd, you are right. It was on Wed 2nd she did the clean and on Thur 3rd, she did not have time to go in and collect the rubbish.

by jd 02.08.11 12:35

Stella wrote:jd, I don't think anything was taken out to sea. Remember what was found in the car and the state of it? GA said it had been frozen and was defrosting. Which means a fridge/freezer, somewhere near by.

You could be absolutely right Stella, the car is a mystery also and another thing which doesn't make sense. I think by expressing opinions (based on the facts) between us all we can eventually get to an account of what really happened which makes sense of it al. Its very possible that the body was hidden and they decided to bury her instead of the ocean, there seems to be a church link after all who could easily help them. At the moment, I see them as being so sure a body won't be found and the only way one can't be is in the sea...but I could be well off the beaten track thinking this

by jd 02.08.11 12:46

There is also the "triangle' car route that GM kept taking

by Guest 02.08.11 12:57

My gut feelings are, death on the 28th, moved to a secret location on the 29th and put into refridgeration. Moved by car in July to the marina in Luz, then boarded a boat back to the UK.

by Guest 02.08.11 21:00

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So the urn on the mantlepicee might not be far from the truth?

Does anyone know how long Katie's call to Fiona lasted on the morning of 29th? I tried looking on the PJ files but definitely need bigger glasses

by jd 03.08.11 0:29

Molly wrote:So the urn on the mantlepicee might not be far from the truth?

That is a brilliant observation Molly bravo

by jd 03.08.11 1:18

1) is it a coincidence that all the mobile phone activity started when Murat arrived in PDL?

2) is it a coincidence that RM and GM mobile phone activity was the same between May 2nd and May 3rd?

3) is it a coincidence that RM switches his mobile phone back on at 23.20 on May 3rd, after 31 hours of the phone being switched off? (he knew nothing of the abduction until the next morning remember) And you can still speak on the phone while it is on charge

4) is it a coincidence that after a year with no contact and with obviously a lot to catch up on, Murat speaks with Sergei Malinka on his mobile phone at 23.40, for just 30 seconds only

5) is it a coincidence that on May 1st, the day Murat arrives in PDL, six contacts (texts or calls?) on KM’s mobile (22:16 – 22:28) and at the same time (22:00 - 22:14) there are six texts being transmitted between Murats mobile and Michaela Walczuch’s

6) is it a coincidence that GM received 12 voicemail messages on his mobile on 2nd May from his work which he never responded to with a single outgoing call? No activity to this level at any other time

7) is it a coincidence that unlike most normal people, GM doesn't receive voicemail messages on his mobile and instead has his voicemail messages sent to a number that eliminates any possibility of identification of his callers?

8) is it a coincidence that RM and GM mobiles are switched off for the exact same time of 31 hours 25mins? (give or take 10 mins)

9) is it a coincidence that Murat was just half a mile away from Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien house in the UK for 7 days prior to them going to PDL for a holiday?

10) Am I being paranoid?

by jd 03.08.11 4:04

It also seems that 2 of the 3 Tapas friends, namely Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien, were the ones who told the police they saw Murat on the night and believe it was him that abducted Maddie

11) is it a coincidence that the 2 people whom Murat was just half a mile away from their house a week before in the UK, are a week later trying to stitch him up in a child abduction case in PDL?

12) is it a coincidence that if the 'Campbell' that was booked in at the Mark Warner resort on May 2nd is Lori Campbell (Sunday Mirror Reporter), apart from why is she there a day before the abduction...that she too framed Murat?

I beginning to think that every Brit in PDL that week in May 2007 was involved somehow!!!!!

by Guest 03.08.11 8:32

Two very thought provoking posts there jd and as you say, far to many coincidences in my eyes too.

Kiko will be very proud of you I'm sure !! [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by jd 03.08.11 13:39

Thank you Stella. There are just too many coincidences going on here and the phones are just another one in a long line of them. I think we are on to something and from my initial thoughts of this being a cover up for an accidental death, the deeper I dig the wider this whole story is opening up. What are the chances of meeting someone on holiday who just happens to specialse in crime reconstructions at the same time you are creating a crime reconstruction (Jez Wilkins). And also the very same person becomes a witness at 9.15pm....mmmmm. This is just one of many coincidence questions I have. I think the answer to this cover up is there right in front of our eyes, but nobody can see it yet

13) is it a coincidence that Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien neighbours, James and Charlotte Gorrod, were also having a holiday at the PDL resort at exactly the same time?

14) is it a coincidence that there are hardly any photos of Maddie from the holiday? No beach photos? This from a child they loved to photo and who loved to be photoed

15) is it a coincidence that there are death smells only connected to the McCanns

16) is it a coincidence that the UK news media knew about the abduction before the police arrived?

17) is it a coincidence that despite being in great financial debt and getting their family & friends to pay their £2000 a month mortgage, they can afford to go away on holiday and to a rather expensive resort

I could go and on and on with this.........

by jd 03.08.11 13:45

Molly wrote:[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

So the urn on the mantlepicee might not be far from the truth?

The urn has got me thinking.....could this have been the way to get Maddie back home to the UK? Could that be Maddie in the urn?

Being deeply religious people, it is safe to say that in a foreign country the only people they would have trust in would be the church

by Guest 03.08.11 13:53

jd wrote:Being deeply religious people, it is safe to say that in a foreign country the only people they would have trust in would be the church

To quote Kate's mum:

Susan Healy: 'Kate phoned me, errm… about an hour after Gerry and asked me to get in touch with, errm… Paul Seddon, who is the priest, Father Seddon, who married her, who baptised Madeleine, errm… and I didn't have his mobile phone so I rang a friend of Kate's and got… got him and he rang Kate right away and I think as soon as this happened, as soon as Kate realised what had happened, it was as if, errm.. she started to ask God right away to give her Madeleine. Errm… because Kate and Gerry were not the most devout family.

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by lj 03.08.11 14:44

Yep, nobody suspects a "devout", "grieving" mom of something nefarious.

It seemed to have worked for quite a few.

by Guest 03.08.11 15:53

Kate's mother appears to be as incapable of speaking coherently as the McCanns' friends in their police statements. Such waffling doesn't convey the impression that the truth is being told.

by jd 03.08.11 16:01

Whats also interesting is the priest at the PDL church at the time was Father John Wilson, who comes from a church in the same area in Norfolk England where Murat lived for many years. In yet another coincidence, he was replaced 3 days later on May 6th 2007! And his replacement Father Hubbard also comes from Norfolk, not sure where in Norfolk but one can guess!