The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Welcome to 'The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann' forum 🌹

Please log in, or register to view all the forums, then settle in and help us get to the truth about what really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann.

Please note that when you register your username must be different from your email address!

SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Page 5 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Did the Smiths effectively become McCann supporters after January 2008?

30% 30% 
[ 31 ]
57% 57% 
[ 58 ]
13% 13% 
[ 13 ]
 
Total Votes : 102

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by Verdi on 01.06.17 13:29

The title of the thread would be better named 'The Nine Faces of Smithman'.

That aside..



Oooops - wrong book Gerald.  I think this is what you're looking for..


____________________
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made" - Groucho Marx
avatar
Verdi
Moderator/Researcher

Posts : 6416
Reputation : 3506
Join date : 2015-02-02

Back to top Go down

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by Get'emGonçalo on 01.06.17 13:36

To be fair to Isabelle she hasn't actually said she's changed her mind - only that an expert with years of experience told her "it's very possible Madeleine #mccann died earlier than May 3rd *sees some planning in calls made"

But it's still significant that she thought the info was important enough to tweet it on #mccann
avatar
Get'emGonçalo


Posts : 10206
Reputation : 5121
Join date : 2009-11-25
Location : parallel universe

http://gerrymccan-abuseofpower-humanrights.blogspot.co.uk/

Back to top Go down

Isabelle McFadden's views on what happened to Madeleine and when are moving towards those of CMOMM and Richard D Hall

Post by Tony Bennett on 01.06.17 18:26

Get'emGonçalo wrote:To be fair to Isabelle she hasn't actually said she's changed her mind - only that an expert with years of experience told her "it's very possible Madeleine #mccann died earlier than May 3rd *sees some planning in calls made"

But it's still significant that she thought the info was important enough to tweet it on #mccann
@ GEG   You make a reasonable point on behalf of Isabelle.

However, these things need to be remembered:

1. Isabelle McFadden has constantly championed the Smith sighting as solid evidence that Gerry McCann was carrying his dead daughter to the beach at about 10pm on Thursday 3 May - despite the huge weight of evidence and common sense against that

2. She has on a number of occasions defended Goncalo Amaral's book chapter and verse, including the claims that Madeleine died after 6pm, died from an accident, and that Gerry was seen carrying her dead body down to the beach...even as recently as yesterday. In other words (until today) she had refused to consider carefully all the evidence which we now have that is contrary to those beliefs

3. She has made at least one video with the express intention of openly criticising Richard D Hall's views on the Smithman sighting, and asked you to post it here, which you did - confirmation that she believes that Smithman was Gerry McCann etc.      

4. Only yesterday she published a flawed poll on Twitter which have only two options: Either (1) Smithman was Gerry McCann or (2) Smithman was not Gerry but someone who looked jolly like him. No way is that a fair poll; it simply leaves out the option that the Smiths may, for whatever reason, have fabricated the sighting.

Now, against that background, McFadden has told us that 'an expert of long experience' has found possible evidence of 'planning', meaning (as McFadden says) that Madeleine died before 3 May and there was a planned abduction hoax well in advance of the evening of 3 May.   

Now, McFadden refers to an anonymous 'expert' who has 'evidence' of 'planning'. We have been led up a few garden paths before by McFadden, with claims of 'evidence' from 'top PJ insiders' she has spoken to, claims about Brian Kennedy 'wanting to get to the truth about Madeleine' and so on and so forth. We never seem to get any corroboration of these tales.

So, as before with McFadden's claims, we await the evidence to follow.

But in the meantime,  the very fact that she acknowledges openly that there may be good evidence from 'phone calls made that this hoax abduction may well have been planned before 3 May mean that is wiling to abandon her previous claims that:

1. Madeleine died on 3 May
2. Madeleine died after 6pm on 3 May as the result of an accident
3. Gerry McCann was then carrying Maddie's body down to the beach at 10pm that night, and   
3. Goncalo Amaral's book is 100% right about everything and can't be challenged.

So she is (at last) moving towards the views of CMOMM and Richard D Hall on what really happened to Madeleine - and when it happened.

And that is very good news

____________________

"This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners" - Paul's first letter to his disciple Timothy,  1 Timothy 1 v 15

avatar
Tony Bennett
Researcher

Posts : 14701
Reputation : 2834
Join date : 2009-11-25
Age : 70
Location : Shropshire

Back to top Go down

An answer to Carla Spade about evidence that Martin Smith collaborated with the McCann Team since January 2008

Post by Tony Bennett on 13.06.17 23:32

See also new SMITHMAN 11 thread

"An answer to Carla Spade about evidence that Martin Smith collaborated with the McCann Team since January 2008"



I have decided to open one further ‘Smithman’ thread and I promise that this will be my very last.

The reason for doing so is that I have been repeatedly attacked by @CarlaSpade on Twitter for allegedly having ‘no evidence’ in support of my contention that Martin Smith has actively collaborated with the McCann Team since January 2008. I also say that Martin Smith has actively collaborated with Operation Grange since 2012 i.e. for the past 5 years.

These are the two tweets I am specifically responding to:

Carla Spade @CarlaSpade  07 Jun 2017
You've made several claims @zampos but you haven't been able to provide evidence for any of them. Provide it or you're a fraud #McCann 

Carla Spade @CarlaSpade 08 Jun 2017
I'm still waiting @zampos for you to provide evidence to back up these nonsense claims. You can't though can you? #McCann 

There was also this today from Ben Thompson:

Bugsy‏ @TheBunnyReturns 
The only reason I can think of that Bennett is allowed to continue [to discuss Madeleine’s disappearance], is that he discredits firm evidence that implicates Kate and Gerry #McCann

This, again, is a reference to the ‘Smithman’ sighting. Thompson has long taken the view that the Smithman sighting is the firmest evidence we have that Gerry McCann hid Madeleine’s body, so much so that he has maintained for two years that I am acting in cahoots with the McCanns to dismiss the ‘truth’ of this claimed sighting. He also calls me a government ‘shill’

@CarlaSpade is one of a number of followers of the Madeleine McCann case who insists that when Martin Smith - on 20 September 2007, 140 days after 3 May 2007 - told police he was ‘60% to 80% sure’ that it was Gerry McCann he had seen carrying a child that night, this is somehow absolute proof that he did in fact see Gerry McCann that night carrying his dead daughter through the streets of Praia da Luz.

All the reasons why I reject that claim are on the Smithman threads and are well known on the forum and I won’t repeat them again here.

My analysis of the claimed ‘Smithman’ sighting has, it is true, been rejected by many.

I have been accused of not believing a ‘respectable, honest, decent’ man and family, and of effectively accusing them of lying. Those who make that accusation generally think there are insufficient grounds for questioning the evidence and statements of people like Martin, Peter and Aoife Smith, Pamela Fenn and Robert Murat, despite obvious problems with all of their statements.

Along with that have been miscellaneous claims that I have been 'obsessed with Smithman', have 'banned people who disagree with me on Smithman', and 'bent on proving he is right'.    

But ever since, two weeks after the BBC Crimewatch McCann Show on 14 October 2013, I began to question the truth of the ‘Smithman’ sighting, another more serious accusation has been leveled at me by people who post elsewhere and on Twitter. They say I am ‘a pro-McCann in disguise’. They accuse me of ‘destroying the best evidence there is that Gerry McCann hid his daughter’s body’. They insinuate that I have done a ‘dirty deal’ with the McCanns.

After I was found guilty of contempt of the High Court in February 2013, I did do a deal with the McCanns. I agreed to cancel my appeal to the Court of Appeal against the High Court ruling, and at the same time agreed to cancel my application to be freed from the various undertakings I was forced to give to the McCanns back in November 2009. In return, they agreed to substantially reduce what was an enormous costs bill against me, which they estimated at over £300,000. They had employed two barristers against me to make sure I was defeated. That is what the deal was about. The McCanns gained the benefit of my withdrawing an appeal and an application. I gained a substantial reduction in my costs bill. It is as simple as that.

But some insist loudly on Twitter and elsewhere that it was a ‘grubby deal’ to attack the Smith sighting on the McCanns’ behalf (!). Some go further and allege that I am a paid government ‘shill’. These accusations are made repeatedly on the #McCann hashtag on Twitter and on forums which purport to campaign for the truth about what really happened to Madeleine McCann.

I would not normally reply to someone like @CarlaSpade, whose attacks have been relentless, aggressive, and laced with bad language.

Nevertheless it gives me one final opportunity to explain how Martin Smith clearly worked for and collaborated with the McCanns from January 2008 onwards.

I will answer @CarlaSpade by reproducing the OP of ‘SMITHMAN8’ (The Nine Phases of Smithman) and in bold are my questions, which she and anyone else who still believes that Martin Smith hasn’t been working for the McCann Team must answer:

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
 
https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t11521-smithman-8-the-nine-phases-of-smithman-how-the-smiths-became-part-of-the-mccann-team-in-january-2008
THE NINE PHASES OF SMITHMAN

Phase 1
from 3 to 15 May 2007:

AN UNREPORTED SIGHTING

The Smiths claim to have seen a man carrying a child at about 10.00pm on 3 May, but do not report it – a baffling delay. They give several contradictory reasons for not reporting what they say they saw 

Phase 2
from 16 May to 20 September 2007:

A REPORTED SIGHTING

On 16 May The Smiths get round to reporting what they say they saw – the day after someone they know, Robert Murat, is made an unofficial suspect in the case. The Portuguese Police interview three members of the Smith family on 26 May. Martin Smith is adamant that the man he saw was not Robert Murat. All the three Smiths admit they saw the man in the dark and for a few seconds at the most, and agree that none of them would be ablse to recognise him again if they saw him

Phase 3
from 20 September to December 2007:

COULD IT BE GERRY MCCANN? 

Martin Smith triggers new interest in the sighting by claiming that he was 60% to 80% sure that he really saw Gerry McCann that night in early May. He bases this on the way Gerry McCann carried his son Sean down the steps of an aeroplane on 9 September. He delays reporting his new belief for 11 days

Phase 4
from January 2008 to December 2008:

THE MCCANNS TAKE OVER THE SMITH SIGHTING

Newspaper articles on 3 and 4 January 2008 reveal that Metodo 3 have ‘already’ been in touch with the Smiths - and that Cheshire businessman Brian Kennedy, one of the McCann Team, is also involved. The Sun reported that “Investigators from the Metodo 3 agency hired by Maddie's parents Gerry and Kate are preparing to travel to Ireland to interview them”. Kennedy contacts the Smiths. Henri Exton, and possibly Irishman Kevin Halligen, visits the Smiths and produces two e-fits of what, to many people, looks like two different men: different face shape and size, differences in chin and nose length, hair style and so on. From this moment on, Martin Smith drops his identification of the man he says he saw as Gerry McCann, supports the McCanns’ search for the abductor, and in effect becomes a McCann supporter, working with the McCann Team 

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith know that Metodo 3 and Brian Kennedy were working for the McCanns?  [CLUE: QUOTE > The Sun reported that “Investigators from the Metodo 3 agency hired by Maddie's parents Gerry and Kate are preparing to travel to Ireland to interview them”.]

QUESTION: If Martin Smith was sure he’d seen Gerry McCann on 3 May 2007, why would he even agree to speak to people from Metodo 3 and to Brian Kennedy?

QUESTION: Why did Martin Smith (and/or other members of the Smith family) agree to draw up e-fits with Henri Exton, who was working for the McCann Team and Kevin Halligen?

QUESTION: If Martin Smith was so sure he’d seen Gerry McCann, why did he not simply approve of one sketch that looked similar to Gerry McCann?

QUESTION: Why, if he thought he had seen Gerry McCann, did Martin Smith approve two quite different e-fits, one of which bore very little resemblance at all to Gerry McCann?

QUESTION: Why, if he believed Gerry McCann was the person he had seen, did Martin Smith go on record and (a) express sympathy for the McCann family and (b) urge  people to look for ‘the abductor’?     

Phase 5
from January to May 2009:

SMITHMAN FEATURES IN A PRO-MCCANN DOCUMENTARY

Former Detective Inspector Dave Edgar appointed to lead the McCann private investigation, around November 2008. Former Detective Sergeant Arthur Cowley appointed later. They help to prepare a documentary, widely called the ‘Mockumentary’, prepared by Mentorn Media and shown by Channel 4 on May 2009. The documentary, in two lengthy passages, suggests that ‘Tannerman’ and ‘Smithman’ are one and the same    

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith know that his sighting was going to be used in a pro-McCann documentary?  

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith approve of the McCanns and the documentary-makers suggesting that Tannerman and Smithman were one and the same?

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith express any objection to the use of his sighting to put over to viewers that the man he said he had seen was NOT Gerry McCann? 

Phase 6
from May 2009 to April 2011:

SMITHMAN PROMOTED AS A KEY SUSPECT ON THE MCCANNS’ FIND MADELEINE WEBSITE

This is the period during which the McCanns actively promoted the Smith sighting on their ‘Find Madeleine’ website, with a 30-second audio clip of a man with an Irish accent repeating a summary of the Smiths’ evidence. During this audio clip, the voice is heard to say that the man looked ’34-35’. But in his original police statement, he had said the man looked ’35-40’. This was the second time Martin Smith changed his mind, because when he was interviewed a second time by the Irish police, he gave the man’s age as ‘40’. The most likely explanation for Smith changing the age of the man from ‘40’ to ’34-35’ is because he was asked to by the McCann Team 

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith object to his sighting being placed on the McCanns’ website in 2009?

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith agree to the McCanns changing the age of the man he said he’d seen to ’34 to 35’?

QUESTION: Martin Smith had previously, in his first statement said that the man looked ’35-40’. In his second statement, he changed that to ‘40’. Why, when he had said the man was ‘40’, did he now allow the McCanns to change the age to ’34-35’?

QUESTION: If he didn’t agree with the change of the age, did he ever object to this change?  [NOTE: The age ‘34-35’ has remained on the McCanns’ website to this very day – over eight years in all].  

 Phase 7
 May 2011:

SMITHMAN PROMOTED IN KATE MCCANN’S BOOK, ‘madeleine’:    

When Dr Kate McCann published her book, ‘madeleine’, on 11 May 2011, seven pages of her book mentioned Smithman. Three of these seven pages consisted of an itemised list of the ‘striking similarities’ between ‘Tannerman’ and ‘Smithman’.

QUESTION: Again, given that in September 2007 Martin Smith was sure that he had seen Gerry McCann on 3 May 2007, did Martin Smith approve of his sighting being quoted on 7 pages of Kate McCann’s book? – which was all about another, ‘stranger’ abductor?

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith object in any way to his sighting being used in a book which effectively denied that he had seen Gerry McCann - and was pointing the finger at the ‘Tannerman’ sighting?        

Phase 8
from May 2011 to September 2013:

DCI REDWOOD PREPARES TO REVEAL SMITHMAN AS HIS MAIN SUSPECT

DCI Andy Redwood, Head of the Met Police’s Operation Grange, talks to Martin Smith at least twice. There is on-the-record confirmation that he met Det Chief Insp Andy Redwood of Operation at least twice, once in 2012 and once in 2013. Undoubtedly this was to discuss the BBC Crimewatch McCann Special which had long been planned together with the BBC Crimewatch Team, at a cost of around £2 million

QUESTION:  Why did Martin Smith meet DCI Andy Redwood in 2012?

QUESTION:  Why did Martin Smith meet DCI Andy Redwood again in 2013? 

QUESTION: On either, or each, of those occasions, did Martin Smith say: “Look Mr Redwood, I saw Gerry McCann carrying that child at 10pm on 3 May. I’m not having you using my sighting to suggest it was someone else”.

QUESTION: If not, why not?

QUESTION: Did Martin Smith agree for his sighting and his/his family’s two e-fits to be used in the BBC Crimewatch McCann Show?

QUESTION: If he did agree, why did he agree, if he was sure that he had seen Gerry McCann on 3 May 2007?

Phase 9
from October 2013 to now:

SMITHMAN REVEALED BY SCOTLAND YARD AS THE CHIEF SUSPECT

There was a blaze of pre-programme hype and then innumerable BBC trailers promoting the BBC Crimewatch McCann show, transmitted to an audience of 6.7 million viewers. In this broadcast, DCI Andy Redwood showed us two efits of different-looking people, implying that the Smiths drew them up. He claimed that the man represented by these two e-fits ‘is now the centre of our focus’. Despite that, the e-fits of Snithman are no longer viewable either on the Met Police website or the McCanns’ ‘Find Madeleine’ website. The audio of an Irish voice describing a man aged ‘perhaps 34-35’ is still on the McCanns’ website  

FINAL TWO QUESTIONS:  Do you @CarlaSpade, or does anyone else, still seriously think that Martin Smith really did see Gerry McCann carrying Madeleine on 3 May 2007?

AND: How credible do you honestly think Martin Smith’s testimony of being ‘sure’ he had seen Gerry McCann would be in a court of law? How well would that evidence stand up under cross-examination?

 
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I hope we will get some answers…
  

____________________

"This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners" - Paul's first letter to his disciple Timothy,  1 Timothy 1 v 15

avatar
Tony Bennett
Researcher

Posts : 14701
Reputation : 2834
Join date : 2009-11-25
Age : 70
Location : Shropshire

Back to top Go down

Re: Bogart on Smithman

Post by Searcher on 17.06.17 23:28

The Bogart videos on Youtube, including a very interesting one on Smithman, are deleted.  Would anyone know why?

Searcher

Posts : 373
Reputation : 21
Join date : 2013-07-25

Back to top Go down

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by Cammerigal on 27.06.17 14:08

He has been taken off line and all easily recognisable YouTube history has been deleted. You Brits need to understand that one cannot freely discuss this conspiracy within a cover up in the UK. 
The case is covered by a UK government D 5 notice (National security??? Wtf?). 
This will be policed by both the spooks at MI5, aided and abetted by GCHQ and The legal eagles at Carter *uck.
avatar
Cammerigal

Posts : 4
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2017-06-18

Back to top Go down

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by Keitei on 27.06.17 14:46

@ Cammerigal  Us Brits well understand thank you very much.

____________________
Those who play games do not see as clearly as those who watch. 
avatar
Keitei
Moderator/Investigator

Posts : 873
Reputation : 250
Join date : 2015-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by polyenne on 27.06.17 15:09

Oh yeah ? They can all go and do one. You won't stifle free-speech. Poke me with a Polonium umbrella....................
avatar
polyenne

Posts : 349
Reputation : 229
Join date : 2017-03-31

Back to top Go down

Re: SMITHMAN 8 - The Nine Phases of Smithman - How the Smiths became part of the McCann Team in January 2008

Post by Searcher on 27.06.17 23:28

It sounds a reasonable suggestion, except that Richard D Hall thankfully has not been taken off line.

Searcher

Posts : 373
Reputation : 21
Join date : 2013-07-25

Back to top Go down

Page 5 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum