Where Is Everybody???

[rainbow-fairy]

I'm surprised to note that we don't seem to have had any 'visitors' crowing over the new developments. Which I have to say is really surprising considering the current developments in the Maddie case. In particular, the fact that Pinky Porkies is insisting that Kate and Gerry are 'delighted' and that they 'hope the case will be re-opened in due course'.
Considering such a victory for Team McCann, I've half been expecting the likes of Garth and friends to call in and tell us how well the Met are doing, and that the collaboration between Met and Oporto is 'just what the Doctors ordered' (eh hem, bad pun, sorry!)
Have the McCanns updated their 'Find Maddie' site page with their good news yet???

[russiandoll]

Could not resist a little peep at JATYK2, surprise surprise..their reaction is that we are spinning the latest news. They really are sinking lower than ever in their vilification of GA. He is now being abused for leaking the secret work of the PJ so that the new force had no choice but to go public with it, hence the press reports....GA is now jeopardising the case .Why do they think a professional police officer would want to fit up the McCanns and/or their friends? Why would he want to hinder the outcome? What would be his motive?

I would like to ask a simple question, based on logic but not possible to post there [probably because they could not argue their case intelligently and with reason and logic]

Why are they so surprised at the ongoing suspicion of the couple when one of them refused to answer questions, both the parents and their friends refused to participate in a reconstruction [ as it would not help the search!!].... all would have been done as part of police procedures, trace interview and eliminate..then move on to other lines of enquiry.

They hindered their elimination by their actions and as adults must face the consequences. People will always ask questions.

Logically, in a reconstruction, if all 9 people give an honest account of their actions and time of them, there will be a coherent account that adds up. There will not be any problems with inconsistencies, inaccuracies, contradictions, revised versions of events. It will simply ADD UP, BECAUSE ALL ARE TELLING THE TRUTH.

[rainbow-fairy]

Spin? Us? Really truly??? Oh. My. God.
Why would we need to spin anything??? Surely, 'spin' is the art of PR, turning a negative situation into a positive one? What ever, we would be but pale imitators of those 'Masters of McSpin'...

In answer to your question (logically, if I can!)
You would think that the T9, with the Met 'on the case' would be straining at the leash to perform the reconstruction. How could it NOT help find Maddie? The archiving despatch that they insist 'cleared' them was very clear: the investigation COULD NOT move forward without the reconstruction being performed. So, as you say, seeing as they are all telling the truth, the whole truth and NOTHING but the truth, then the T9 will be TIE'd (traced, interviewed, eliminated) and the investigation can crack on with what they 'claim' they want - finding Maddie.
This is logical. Failure to co-operate is not. If Portugal truly thought that there was a dangerous paedophile individual/gang who had snatched Maddie, would they REALLY risk more of their children's lives by pinning it on 'innocent' parents? Of course not. Now that IS illogical.
So, what we have is a stalled investigation that only the parents co-operation could have prevented from stalling at that early stage (and appealed the archiving), and fresh eyes (Oporto and the Met) looking again. If they are STILL looking at the T9 inconsistencies, logic dictates that the re-opening the McCanns 'desire', cannot happen whilst the inconsistencies remain an obstacle.
We should also remember, logically, that of 100 children under 7 'reported abducted from home'(which includes holiday accommodation) 99 are killed by a close family member. Logic dictates all forces be it Portuguese or English would be remiss to eliminate them first. This still hasn't happened. So to look at 'swarthy gypsies' and 'Bundleman' before hand IS TOTALLY ILLOGICAL.
So you are 100% correct russiandoll, that people will continue to ask questions such as 'What have allegedly innocent people to fear from proving their claims?' The answer should be, 'Absolutely nothing'...
Says it all, IMHO

[Ribisl]

Rainbow- fairy - I am cautiously optimistic.

[rainbow-fairy]

Rainbow- fairy - I am cautiously optimistic. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Yep, Ribisl, certainly seems to be moving in the right direction (the almost silence from Team Mccann is very telling, imo). I'd give you a high-five back but I can't insert smilies with my phone. Only a or a
So, in this instance it'd best be a for now!

[Kololi]

Russiandoll said,

"Why are they so surprised at the ongoing suspicion of the couple when one of them refused to answer questions, both the parents and their friends refused to participate in a reconstruction [ as it would not help the search!!].... all would have been done as part of police procedures, trace interview and eliminate..then move on to other lines of enquiry."

Add a few more of the odd things to that and it would, believe it or not, echo my opinion. Of course we were not there and so cannot be sure as to why they did do what they did or even didn't do what some people think they should have done.

I have a niggle however, that says if I was in their position and really believed that an attempt was being made to stitch me up for something so horrendous and I had honestly not done it how scared would I be? Scared enough to run home maybe, despite what I had said previously, to safer soil with friends and family for support. I take on board the point of "if you have nothing to hide" but not all countries have laws that protect accused people and follow the "innocent until proven guilty" theory as England does.

It sometimes does appear that their own survival and desire to maintain their lifestyle became of greater importance than finding Madeleine but, and maybe I have mellowed as time has passed, I cannot with hand on heart, say that I wouldn't have done the same thing believing that I would be more use in finding her if I was safe rather than languishing in some creepy foreign prison.

[Liz Eagles]

Russiandoll said,

"Why are they so surprised at the ongoing suspicion of the couple when one of them refused to answer questions, both the parents and their friends refused to participate in a reconstruction [ as it would not help the search!!].... all would have been done as part of police procedures, trace interview and eliminate..then move on to other lines of enquiry."

Add a few more of the odd things to that and it would, believe it or not, echo my opinion. Of course we were not there and so cannot be sure as to why they did do what they did or even didn't do what some people think they should have done.

I have a niggle however, that says if I was in their position and really believed that an attempt was being made to stitch me up for something so horrendous and I had honestly not done it how scared would I be? Scared enough to run home maybe, despite what I had said previously, to safer soil with friends and family for support. I take on board the point of "if you have nothing to hide" but not all countries have laws that protect accused people and follow the "innocent until proven guilty" theory as England does.

It sometimes does appear that their own survival and desire to maintain their lifestyle became of greater importance than finding Madeleine but, and maybe I have mellowed as time has passed, I cannot with hand on heart, say that I wouldn't have done the same thing believing that I would be more use in finding her if I was safe rather than languishing in some creepy foreign prison.

but would you have alerted the world media within hours of your child's disappearance before you had been accused of anything?

[russiandoll]

KOLOLI:

I take your point about self-preservation, but;

how could the police charge me with a crime if I had been truthful, there would be no evidence.
you truly believe a police force in a developped country would stitch up a mother for a crime they knew she had not committed against her child? what would be the motive for such an action?

if an abduction took place, it was not in the described circumstances, evidence points to that. so questions needed answers.
surely to ask them is not a stitch up?

[Kololi]

Russiandoll said,

"Why are they so surprised at the ongoing suspicion of the couple when one of them refused to answer questions, both the parents and their friends refused to participate in a reconstruction [ as it would not help the search!!].... all would have been done as part of police procedures, trace interview and eliminate..then move on to other lines of enquiry."

Add a few more of the odd things to that and it would, believe it or not, echo my opinion. Of course we were not there and so cannot be sure as to why they did do what they did or even didn't do what some people think they should have done.

I have a niggle however, that says if I was in their position and really believed that an attempt was being made to stitch me up for something so horrendous and I had honestly not done it how scared would I be? Scared enough to run home maybe, despite what I had said previously, to safer soil with friends and family for support. I take on board the point of "if you have nothing to hide" but not all countries have laws that protect accused people and follow the "innocent until proven guilty" theory as England does.

It sometimes does appear that their own survival and desire to maintain their lifestyle became of greater importance than finding Madeleine but, and maybe I have mellowed as time has passed, I cannot with hand on heart, say that I wouldn't have done the same thing believing that I would be more use in finding her if I was safe rather than languishing in some creepy foreign prison.

but would you have alerted the world media within hours of your child's disappearance before you had been accused of anything?

I don't think I would have done a lot of things that they did aquila tbh, certainly I would not have left the children alone and thought it ok to do so. Once the "abduction" happened who knows how we might react under the same circumstances. To answer your particular question however, no, I don't think that would have been one of the first things I would have thought to do but wasn't it one of the others in the group that did that or am I mistaken?

[Kololi]

Russiandoll said,

"if an abduction took place, it was not in the described circumstances, evidence points to that. so questions needed answers.
surely to ask them is not a stitch up?"

I agree with this wholeheartedly and did find it rather odd that they were harping on about leaving no stoned unturned but then hot footed it back to England when their own personal stones were flipped over by the Portuguese Police. I have never understood their rationale for that as they surely knew they would be part of the investigation. If they had not been questioned vigourously I would not have felt the Police were doing their job properly.

That is why I wonder if it was such a scary experience that they felt they were likely to be wrongly stitched up and fled and I think would I do the same under the circumstances if I was scared.

As to your other point, ask the Brit who has just been sent to America. Whether he committed the crime or not at this stage, having to ask for solitary confinement says a lot of that developed country's justice system. And Guantanamo Bay doesn't paint a pretty picture of life in capitivity either.

[T4two]

Russiandoll said,

"if an abduction took place, it was not in the described circumstances, evidence points to that. so questions needed answers.
surely to ask them is not a stitch up?"

I agree with this wholeheartedly and did find it rather odd that they were harping on about leaving no stoned unturned but then hot footed it back to England when their own personal stones were flipped over by the Portuguese Police. I have never understood their rationale for that as they surely knew they would be part of the investigation. If they had not been questioned vigourously I would not have felt the Police were doing their job properly.

That is why I wonder if it was such a scary experience that they felt they were likely to be wrongly stitched up and fled and I think would I do the same under the circumstances if I was scared.

As to your other point, ask the Brit who has just been sent to America. Whether he committed the crime or not at this stage, having to ask for solitary confinement says a lot of that developed country's justice system. And Guantanamo Bay doesn't paint a pretty picture of life in capitivity either.

We aren't talking about USA extradition here, we're talking about two people in a European country with unprecedented support from our ambassador to that country as well as our Prime Minister and his predecessor. No reason whatsoever for them to be scared.

[rainbow-fairy]

Well, I'm more clear on everything now!
I must be crackers because I went on to JATYK2 after russiandoll's earlier post.
Oh dear. Seems we are all deluded to think any review will be looking at the McCanns. Its all 'Gonc's' fault you see - he's 'leaking like a sieve' again, which is why the PJ were FORCED to publicly respond...
And yet, and yet - I'm now more confused than ever - as in the same sentence 'Nobody in the PJ would tell that idiot anything' then 'he's leaked to the PT press!' W. T. F?!?

Oh and I'm also totally clear what they do over there now - nothing useful, just adding ten 'rofl' emoticons to point and take the mick!
Morons.

[Kololi]

Russiandoll said,

"if an abduction took place, it was not in the described circumstances, evidence points to that. so questions needed answers.
surely to ask them is not a stitch up?"

I agree with this wholeheartedly and did find it rather odd that they were harping on about leaving no stoned unturned but then hot footed it back to England when their own personal stones were flipped over by the Portuguese Police. I have never understood their rationale for that as they surely knew they would be part of the investigation. If they had not been questioned vigourously I would not have felt the Police were doing their job properly.

That is why I wonder if it was such a scary experience that they felt they were likely to be wrongly stitched up and fled and I think would I do the same under the circumstances if I was scared.

As to your other point, ask the Brit who has just been sent to America. Whether he committed the crime or not at this stage, having to ask for solitary confinement says a lot of that developed country's justice system. And Guantanamo Bay doesn't paint a pretty picture of life in capitivity either.

We aren't talking about USA extradition here, we're talking about two people in a European country with unprecedented support from our ambassador to that country as well as our Prime Minister and his predecessor. No reason whatsoever for them to be scared.

Actually T4Two this was the question to me.

"you truly believe a police force in a developped country would stitch up a mother for a crime they knew she had not committed against her child? what would be the motive for such an action?"

I understand America to be a developed country thought may not always necessarily agree.

[rainbow-fairy]

This 'stitch up' baloney does make me laugh! As T4two says, the McCanns enjoyed unprecedented embassy support etc.
Now, if the intention was there to 'stitch them up' surely they'd be in jail now anyway? Remember the lawyers words - 'If you were Portuguese you'd be behind bars by now'?
And the 'we're being framed' comment re the dog alerts - er, how? Were they truly insinuating the PJ had Maddie's body stashed somewhere? For cadaver scent and DNA?
Sorry but I just find it impossible to believe that the PT would risk children's lives by pinning the crime on an 'innocent' parent? Why would they?
Mind, one poster over on jatyk2 hinted that Amaral did what he did for reasons 'worse than incompetence'. Maybe I interpreted that wrongly, but if not I hope Snr Amaral sues their ass off...

[T4two]

So if I have understood the argumentation correctly, Gerry McCann was scared of being stitched up by the Portuguese police because of conditions purported to prevail in prisons in the United States of America and specifically at Guantanamo Bay. Yes, I can understand that many people in Britain might think that way. This puts a completely new complexion on things. If we follow the reasoning to its logical conclusion, then we must accept that no Brit can feel safe outside the UK and consequently that every Brit involved in an investigation by the police in a foreign country and who is made a suspect, is quite justified in refusing to cooperate with that investigation on the grounds that he is scared and return to Britain posthaste. This actually explains a lot of things which have been a cause of some concern to me over the past few years. For example why McCann was received by the British authorities and media on arrival back to Blighty as something akin to a returning hero and why, with the backing of the UK media and a smattering of Z-list celebs, he has since been allowed to repeatedly defame the villains in the foreign police force with complete impunity over the past 4 years, whilst threatening to sue anyone else who seriously questions his version of events. But, wait a minute! Isn't it on record that it was the British police officers assisting the Portuguese police on the ground, who pointed them in the direction of McCann and his wife in the first place? Didn't they even go as far as to bring in an expert who in turn recommended bringing in those pesky dogs which seem to be the cause of all the trouble? This definitely calls for a rethink, in fact, contrary to the impression given by McCann and his spokesman since then, it can't only have been the Portuguese police who were scaring McCann, but the British police as well. This rather explains why a lot of people like myself are querying the assertion that the McCanns were justified in not cooperating with the investigation and leaving the country because they were scared that they were being stitched up by the Portuguese police does it not? Mind you, I can quite understand why McCann has not come out and stated that he was scared of being stitched up by the British police. Bashing foreigners may go down well with a large section of British society, but accusing the British police of being involved in a stitch up definitely wouldn't and might have some serious consequences.

[aiyoyo]

Kololi what you said is a whole lot bull manure logic, sorry I dont buy that, pull something else out.

The PJ fitting them up? What would be their motive? Police Bravery Honour Award?
When they fled back to UK what's stopping them dropping into their local police post and volunteer info then?
What's stopping them handing their pte investigators finds to UK police then?

We are talking about a pair who have an influential chain of connections as well as support from the UK government. And we are talking about a pair having been first assigned, then they later took on the most "effective" media PR man whose role is to control what comes out of the media and as we did witness he did a brilliant job for them. Don't forget people's money afforded them the heavy duty lawyers in the land. So with all the powerful elements and connections the best they can muster is spin?

Don't you think manipulatively clever people like the mccanns would have the nuance to use these elements to their advantage, to persuade the UK police to search for Maddie? If they use media to spin their tale equally they can use the media to expose keystone coppers so that the coppers would continue to search for Maddie. Notice that the only authority with remit for searching missing people, ie the Police, is the only authority they didnt lobby in their campaign to engage them to search for Maddie.

Not only did they not ask for the case to remain open which was within their remit to do so, they didn't even step into the local police station to hand in all the leads that their pte investigators allegedly collected?
In fact they were delighted the case was shelved? Now why do you think that is so?
Because the PJ can no longer stitch them up? IF PJ want to stitch them up they would be in jail now. They wouldn't have been allowed to return home IMO. Even a charge of neglect is sufficient to put them in goal.

Now you said in their shoes you would fled home too contradicting your own promise - self preservation priority over Maddie - but would you visit the Papal, promote merchandise, bewk and what not, waste time setting off lanterns and attending charity dinner and what not, and beg for money for the "fighting fund"? Would you and your friends refuse reconstruction in UK - well they could set that as a condition, that the reconstruction be done in UK from props set up. In their shoes if I was innocence I would have no fear of the Police, never mind their nationality, I would pressure them to search, I would park myself in their office until they give me answers, of course I would volunteer info until they eliminated me. With them being so high profile and the level of help they garnered do you think the PJ would take them into custody and refuse them bail?

For debate sake, let's grant you the premise that if you are innocent and have no trust of foreign police, wouldn't you then on arriving in your own home country approach your country's police and volunteer to cooperate with them, get them to no matter how search for your missing child missing, provided of course you are willing to answer questions until they are satisfied you were not involved in the disappearance and the perpetrator is at large and needs to be hunted down?

If you had all these helps at your disposal, is using them to spin the best you can do for your missing child, now that you are back and safe in your own home ground. Wouldn't that be waste of opportunity and human resources at your disposal?

[tigger]

Portugal was chosen as a suitable location imo. It had to be a foreign country as they would never have gotten away with it in the UK, too overpopulated for a start. Lacking in lawless villages full of paedophiles.

Xenophobia was used from the start - as from 10.00 am. on the 4th when the consul reported that the PJ did absolutely nothing. Kate reported that the police left after a few hours and omitted to mention that masses of people searched all night - including the GNR. The family too, were instructed around 11.00 p.m. on the 3rd to report that 'nothing was being done by the Portugese police', who'd only had the report in for less than an hour!
None of these lies would have worked in the UK.

Xenophobia was an integral part of the 'presentation' of loving - hard working parents who had allowed themselves a rare break. Who had been led to believe (naive is Gerry's favourite word) by the OC that it was safe to leave children alone in this foreign country.

The British public is always ready to stand up for the underdog, but Portugal has to comply with the laws on human rights, just like the rest of the EU.
They were never in any danger of being arrested and jailed for a crime they had not committed.

[Kololi]

So if I have understood the argumentation correctly, Gerry McCann was scared of being stitched up by the Portuguese police because of conditions purported to prevail in prisons in the United States of America and specifically at Guantanamo Bay. Yes, I can understand that many people in Britain might think that way. This puts a completely new complexion on things. If we follow the reasoning to its logical conclusion, then we must accept that no Brit can feel safe outside the UK and consequently that every Brit involved in an investigation by the police in a foreign country and who is made a suspect, is quite justified in refusing to cooperate with that investigation on the grounds that he is scared and return to Britain posthaste. This actually explains a lot of things which have been a cause of some concern to me over the past few years. For example why McCann was received by the British authorities and media on arrival back to Blighty as something akin to a returning hero and why, with the backing of the UK media and a smattering of Z-list celebs, he has since been allowed to repeatedly defame the villains in the foreign police force with complete impunity over the past 4 years, whilst threatening to sue anyone else who seriously questions his version of events. But, wait a minute! Isn't it on record that it was the British police officers assisting the Portuguese police on the ground, who pointed them in the direction of McCann and his wife in the first place? Didn't they even go as far as to bring in an expert who in turn recommended bringing in those pesky dogs which seem to be the cause of all the trouble? This definitely calls for a rethink, in fact, contrary to the impression given by McCann and his spokesman since then, it can't only have been the Portuguese police who were scaring McCann, but the British police as well. This rather explains why a lot of people like myself are querying the assertion that the McCanns were justified in not cooperating with the investigation and leaving the country because they were scared that they were being stitched up by the Portuguese police does it not? Mind you, I can quite understand why McCann has not come out and stated that he was scared of being stitched up by the British police. Bashing foreigners may go down well with a large section of British society, but accusing the British police of being involved in a stitch up definitely wouldn't and might have some serious consequences.

Wow!!!! 10/10 for sarcasm.

The question put to me was about a developed country. I have answered Russiandoll's question. Not all developed countries allow their prisoners ensuite bedrooms, ooops I mean cells with little luxuries that often their victims cannot afford. Does Portugal? I ask because I don't know and don't speak the language so there's two reasons why the thought of being dealt with via their legal system would scare the poop out of me.

Maybe we come at this from different stand points. You appear to be convinced that "they did it" and feel that the evidence to prove so is there in the public domain for all to see. I, on the other hand, have my suspicions that all doesn't seem right but believe in "innocent until proven guilty" and up to now, they have not been tried by 12 good men or women or one Portuguese Judge come to that. Hence, my thoughts remain just that - thoughts, meaning I am open to alternative thoughts to mine.

If, and note the word "if", they are innocent and the duplicate child theory turns out to be a pile of tosh, imagine how they might feel. They wish to find their child but feel that they may end up in a Portuguese jail. They would lose all control totally over ensuring efforts were made to find their daughter and she could be lost forever. Add to that any fears of prison life and all the rest of the stuff that you might lose and it becomes a very scary prospect.

If you are right and the McCanns did wrong by their daughter then it becomes clear why they would run off home. I wouldn't agree with it and would think that the justice system failed their daughter in allowing them to save their own bottoms in that way. In the meantime we can only air our thoughts and suspicions and our hands must stay firmly away from our hearts as we do not absoloutely know for a fact what happened. :flower:

[Kololi]

Aiyoyo said,

"Kololi what you said is a whole lot bull manure logic, sorry I dont buy that, pull something else out."

Read that sentence and saw it was par for the course so didn't bother to read the rest. Why do you even bother to read what I type? It only appears to cause you grief.

Hope the sun is shining where you are and it makes you feel a little better tempered Aiyoyo.

[russiandoll]

Kololi, I take your point and I do read all of your posts. We will have to agree to disagree, because while I understand totally your point about ignorance and /or fear of the criminal justice system in a foreign country, what I have read about this case leads me to believe that it was not fear of being framed for something they did not do which resulted in their hastily leaving Portugal. It was not to ensure they would be free to further the search for Madeleine [ please tell me which of their subsequent actions has helped with that] but was self-preservation.

Speaking of which, I think you are being rather disingenuous though, to refer to my calling what you knew from the context of this debate was Portugal "a [i.e. any] developped country ".

Could you please answer the other part of my question. What do you reason would be the MOTIVE of the Portuguese authorities for framing either or both of the parents if they honestly believed in the plausibility of an abduction?

[Kololi]

Kololi, I take your point and I do read all of your posts. We will have to agree to disagree, because while I understand totally your point about ignorance and /or fear of the criminal justice system in a foreign country, what I have read about this case leads me to believe that it was not fear of being framed for something they did not do which resulted in their hastily leaving Portugal. It was not to ensure they would be free to further the search for Madeleine [ please tell me which of their subsequent actions has helped with that] but was self-preservation.

Speaking of which, I think you are being rather disingenuous though, to refer to my calling what you knew from the context of this debate was Portugal "a [i.e. any] developped country ".

Could you please answer the other part of my question. What do you reason would be the MOTIVE of the Portuguese authorities for framing either or both of the parents if they honestly believed in the plausibility of an abduction?

Russiandoll it isn't often I sit here and read what you have said and think, "I disagree", but you are right - we have a difference of opinion here. Generally, your comments tend to be somewhere close to my own thoughts. The bottom line is I do think it was more about self preservation that got them hot footing back to England and I think a lot of what they have done since is about the same. Protecting their reputations and lifestyle appears sometimes to be more of a priority than finding Madeleine but I may be wrong and until they have been reliably shown to have done something dreadful a part of me feels it right to try and understand their odd behaviour rather than condemn it always.

Apologies for being a tadge naughty. Yes I knew it was Portugal and America, even as a developed country, may have been extreme to highlight. Even so, guilty or not, I can understand why they might run home rather than face the weight of a foreign legal system because I think that I might do the same due to even just the language barrier and the unknown of something so serious but so foreign to me.

Your final question - I cannot see the Portuguese Police having any motive to do the McCanns wrong no more than I have suspicions about the British Police in general being all corrupt and the spawn of Satan but it may be that I am a minority for thinking that way, about the British Police I mean. I didn't base my original statement on any distrust I would have of the Portuguese Police but rather on what I assumed may be a perceived picture that the McCanns may have had bearing in mind all that had happened. Would they have been thinking rationaly at the time so that actions of others such as the Police may have been distorted in their minds?

If they believed their daughter was abducted and there was even the slightest indication that they were not being believed by the Police, would it not be fair to assume that they may go into panic mode and think they could find themselves facing consequences that they shouldn't face?

They didn't always behave as Joe Public expected and not as I think I might have done in similar circumstances, but we all behave differently faced with problems. I think they continue to make some mistakes even now in an effort to gain public support. I cannot however, visualise them as having acted in such a cold blooded fashion that they would deliberately harm their daughter. My guess until we know for sure, if we ever know of course, is maybe an accident of some sort or maybe she got out and was taken by somebody she bumped into as she wandered the streets. We have some information but we don't have it all, and really the only two people who do have the greatest insight into this mystery of course is the McCanns - they know for sure whether they did anything awful or not.

[Guest]

[quote Kololi]

If they believed their daughter was abducted and there was even the slightest indication that they were not being believed by the Police, would it not be fair to assume that they may go into panic mode and think they could find themselves facing consequences that they shouldn't face?

But wasn't it GM that kept saying "there is no evidence..........." If this was the case then what is there to fear. Don't forget Kololi you keep mentioning foreign police and language barriers. There were British police involved, and it was the British police that brought in the dogs, and Martin Grimes, and it was a British lab that performed the forensic tests. So how could they have been set up by the PJ?

[PrissyCrissy]

I don't have children, but I imagine I would be going insane if I truly believed my daughter had been abducted. I admittedly would want consular assistance to help me through an investigation in a foreign country, but I also would:

Be willing to answer the same questions one hundred times.

Be willing to participate in one hundred reconstructions.

Be willing to take one hundred lie detector tests, even if not admissable in court.

Follow police advice to not do anything that has even a 1% chance of harming my daughter, such as publishing pictures of an eye defect.

Allow the police to do their jobs instead of immediately inviting a media storm that could hinder my child's safe return.

Constantly beg (on my knees, if necessary) the Portuguese to reopen the investigation.

And I would not:

Leave my sleeping children in a room with an open window through which I believed my daughter had just been abducted.

Place my children in a creche in the same resort from which my daughter was abducted.

Shrug off the dogs' devastating findings.



Parents should be willing to go through anything it takes to find their child.

[Guest]

I don't have children, but I imagine I would be going insane if I truly believed my daughter had been abducted. I admittedly would want consular assistance to help me through an investigation in a foreign country, but I also would:

Be willing to answer the same questions one hundred times.

Be willing to participate in one hundred reconstructions.

Be willing to take one hundred lie detector tests, even if not admissable in court.

Follow police advice to not do anything that has even a 1% chance of harming my daughter, such as publishing pictures of an eye defect.

Allow the police to do their jobs instead of immediately inviting a media storm that could hinder my child's safe return.

Constantly beg (on my knees, if necessary) the Portuguese to reopen the investigation.

And I would not:

Leave my sleeping children in a room with an open window through which I believed my daughter had just been abducted.

Place my children in a creche in the same resort from which my daughter was abducted.

Shrug off the dogs' devastating findings.



Parents should be willing to go through anything it takes to find their child.

[Liz Eagles]

I don't have children, but I imagine I would be going insane if I truly believed my daughter had been abducted. I admittedly would want consular assistance to help me through an investigation in a foreign country, but I also would:

Be willing to answer the same questions one hundred times.

Be willing to participate in one hundred reconstructions.

Be willing to take one hundred lie detector tests, even if not admissable in court.

Follow police advice to not do anything that has even a 1% chance of harming my daughter, such as publishing pictures of an eye defect.

Allow the police to do their jobs instead of immediately inviting a media storm that could hinder my child's safe return.

Constantly beg (on my knees, if necessary) the Portuguese to reopen the investigation.

And I would not:

Leave my sleeping children in a room with an open window through which I believed my daughter had just been abducted.

Place my children in a creche in the same resort from which my daughter was abducted.

Shrug off the dogs' devastating findings.



Parents should be willing to go through anything it takes to find their child.

Fantastic post. You've explained it all in a nutshell which is the essence of the questioning on this forum.

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