More than friendships?

For those with a phobia for long winded posts, and veterans who have read and discussed this all before who don't want to be involved, please ignore.
 
I keep thinking about my own pet theory that MBM died at the hands of her parents, probably as a result of a tragic accident, or on her own while they spent the evening quaffing wine at the nearby Tapas.  But there is something about it that just doesn't make sense insofar as, if this scenario were true, it would be impossible for the group as a whole to maintain a united front.  There is just not enough time for the alliance to coalesce and become rigid enough to hold the PJ at bay.  It would have had to fracture under the immediacy and trauma of the event; or if not just what kind of relationship did they enjoy that would overcome such a thing.
 
Maybe it was just friendship after all, a strong permanent lifelong friendship. An old pal of mine, sadly no longer here, once told me that we are lucky, in life, if we ever make more than a couple of real friends.  It’s true that we may amass a wide social circle at various times in our lives, but it is an ever changing one as we move jobs, move home, or, much earlier in life, when we progress from the infants school to junior school then college.  Real friends transcend all that and, well, they just stay with us through thick and thin, and it’s the ‘thin’ part of it that I’ve been thinking about in the McCann case.  How good a friend would you have to be to support your mate through an event like their child’s death, knowing they were complicit in it?  Would you do such a thing for your lifelong pal or would you encourage them to come clean and say you will stand by them but you can only go so far and will have nothing to do with a cover up?  What would your friends do or say do you think, if it were your dilemma?
 
So what were the McCann friendships with the Tapas crew?  The first two to pop up were Fiona and David Payne. Kate tells us on P33 of her book she first became friends with Fiona in December 2000 at Leicester General ICU, so I guess David came as part of the package in that friendship.  If I read her book correctly Russell O’Brien, Jane Tanner, and Matthew and Rachael Oldfield were closer friends of the Paynes, but known acquaintances of her and Gerry (P59).  It was the first time the McCanns would holiday with the ‘acquaintances’. To my way of thinking there is no way on earth this lot could stick together under the circumstances of 3^rd May, at least superficially.
 
So if not friendship, what else might there be?  A site recommended by these forums is Textusa, who tells on her blog, in a message to newcomers, that she believes the group were swingers.  This suggestion may have its roots in the fact that Mark Warner holidays cater for ‘adults only’ holidays; there is a link from steel magnolia here:
 
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Also from the Jane Tanner rogatory appears this bolt from the blue:
 
“078    “Okay.  Is there anything else that you need to speak about”?
 Reply    “Erm no I don’t think so, don’t think anything else is”.
 
4078    “What about your personal opinions Jane”?
 Reply    “Yeah erm, well obviously I, I mean I was almost gonna say this at the very, very end of anything but I just, I’d just really like to say to the Portuguese Police you know, I think there’s been a lot said but from a, you know we’re not a bunch of swingers that went out there for a swinging holiday, I can’t think of anything to be worse to be honest but yeah, we didn’t go out there on a swingers holiday to dump our kids in the kids club while we got pissed and shagged each other you know, that’s not what we did.”
 
Kate says in her book P59, they had been away with Dave and Fiona several times and always enjoyed themselves; Dave was an avid organiser of holidays it seems.  It was he who instigated the infamous timeline lists handed to the PJ, and he was at the Rothley meeting that Clarence Mitchell tells us was for ‘operational reasons’ on 17^th November 2007, that caused such indignation within the PJ, just 10 days after the Telegraph reported that two of the Tapas wanted to change their story and had consulted their solicitors..
 
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Maybe it’s something altogether darker than swinging. David’s flaky, almost casual conversations with Gerry in front of the Gaspars can only add to the consternation.  It’s here I have to say that I have little but my own instincts about what is available for me to read that I can point to.  I just have a feeling that there is more to him than meets the eye.  He is at the centre of the holiday soirées, surrounding himself with friends, and someone, with his prepared timelines, who needs to try and control what the PJ think when in reality he should just be a bystander letting them get on with their job. The other’s compliance with his actions on 3^rd May is complete, not one dissenting voice, so what does he have over them that they feel powerless to confront? 
 
Maybe it’s a secret that can’t be revealed; a bond they have above friendship born out of mutual embarrassment in the event of exposure. While swinging, or some other nefarious activity, might suggest a stronger kind of cement than just friendship to hold the group together it all seems a bit flimsy as a theory and “salacious for its own sake” to me. 
 
Nope, I don’t believe this either.  So maybe I’m wrong, and there was some planning that went on over and above buying tickets and packing suitcases for the holidays.  Think I’ll take a look at that.

I always thought that any theory of Maddie's demise that did not account for Murat's sudden return to PdL would not hold water ie she had to have come to grief sooner than was thought but someone suggested a few weeks ago that Murat came back to PdL as there was some 'action' to be had.

roy rovers wrote:I always thought that any theory of Maddie's demise that did not account for Murat's sudden return to PdL would not hold water ie she had to have come to grief sooner than was thought but someone suggested a few weeks ago that Murat came back to PdL as there was some 'action' to be had.

 Hi Roy,

Yeah, forgot to mention the possible Murat stuff, will take a look.

In the meantime, forgot too to mention this little gem from David Payne...

When contacted by Portuguese newspaper, Sol, David Payne said: "We have a pact. This is our matter only. It is nobody else's business."

And how about this one?

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply [DP]   ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”

Châtelaine wrote:And how about this one?

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply [DP]   ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”

1485: OH, ok. cup of tea?

jeanmonroe wrote:

Châtelaine wrote:And how about this one?

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply [DP]   ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”

1485: OH, ok. cup of tea?

 Its as if he thinks he is above the law and he is the one to make these decisions, not the copper - after all its no one else`s business is it !

Woofer wrote:

jeanmonroe wrote:

Châtelaine wrote:And how about this one?

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply [DP]   ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”

1485: OH, ok. cup of tea?

 Its as if he thinks he is above the law and he is the one to make these decisions, not the copper.

Don't under-estimate the interviewing coppers. They are perfectly skilled in letting the 'respondent' speak, moving the interviews forwards with little 'neutral' nudges but without putting any words into their mouths.
The drivel given out by the tapas crew will be up for all types of analysis by people well trained to 'interpret' the drivel. 

bobbin wrote:
The drivel given out by the tapas crew will be up for all types of analysis by people well trained to 'interpret' the drivel. 

They must have been devastated when they realised that all their statements and their incoherent babblings in the rogatory interviews were public knowledge;
when they realised that what they had said individually did not fit with what others in the group had said.

Woofer wrote:

jeanmonroe wrote:

Châtelaine wrote:And how about this one?

1485    ”Is there anything that you consider pertinent or relevant to establish the material truth?”
Reply [DP]   ”Err the, there are a few things but I don’t think this is the right forum for bringing those up.”

1485: OH, ok. cup of tea?

 Its as if he thinks he is above the law and he is the one to make these decisions, not the copper - after all its no one else`s business is it !

As the copper didn't pick him up on it I thought it was stuff that needed to stay off the record but they were all basically aware of.

roy rovers wrote:I always thought that any theory of Maddie's demise that did not account for Murat's sudden return to PdL would not hold water ie she had to have come to grief sooner than was thought but someone suggested a few weeks ago that Murat came back to PdL as there was some 'action' to be had.

That's my opinion, either some excitement going on and/or some money to be made

Jane Tanner made it very clear in her rog interviews that she wasn't close to the McCanns, she tried very hard to distance herself from them

IMO the only ones the McCanns were actually friends with we're the Paynes and something about the Paynes makes me think they could be pretty ruthless if needed to be.

IMO there was an attraction between KM and MO

GA is so adamant about 17:30 on the 03/05 being the last independent sighting of MM, IMO he has something more concrete than the Nannies statements

Therefore I do find it odd that all the rest had gone to the beach and not thought to text the McCanns to say we are all here if you want to collect the kids and join us. Don't know if the McCanns had just generally been painful or there had been some deeper problem but they were excluded

The hints we've had from people have consistently been what happened was simple but the weeks holiday was not

Could that have any connection with what Justin Guiness said short ago?

Can any of you show us " adult only"?

Is that true?

the Mark Worner provides cheche, nannies, etc  I have difficulties to believe something else.