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Post by suzyjohnson on 12.03.13 16:57

I was just looking at ROB's interview statements, did he have time to fit in everything he said he did between 9.30 and 10pm on May 3rd?

At 9.30 pm he says he walked round to the front door of his apartment with MO. Approx. one and a half mins. Then he goes to the loo. Then at -

9.32pm He finds that his daughter has been sick. He runs her a bath, changes her clothes, answers the door to MO, puts his daughter in the bath, changes all the bedding, finds her some clean clothes, gets her dry and redressed, puts all the washing into the washing machine, and is sitting in the lounge reading his daughter a book by the time JT arrives back by 9.40pm. It has to have been 9.40pm at the latest because he says they were together for 5 mins and then he was back at the Tapas by -

9.45pm (the waiter's statement is in agreement with this) where he reordered his main meal, which took 10 mins to arrive (the waiter found this meal half finished after the group had left the Tapas).

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by PeterMac on 12.03.13 17:01

You may be making the mistake of thinking he is telling the truth !
c.f. Kate's statement about searching the apartment in15 seconds - her version of the truth - against Gerry's getting concerned because she had been gone for more than ten minutes.

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Post by suzyjohnson on 12.03.13 17:10

And Jane's comment (that she 'almost' said to Gerry when she saw him talking to Jez .... that Kate was wondering why he was taking so long) when Jane apparently left the Tapas just a few mins after Gerry.

And DP's visit to the McCann apartment that took 30 mins ...... or 30 seconds.

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Guest on 12.03.13 18:31

All I can say after reading of Russell O'Brien's achievements on that evening is
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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by rainbow-fairy on 12.03.13 23:07

Jean wrote:All I can say after reading of Russell O'Brien's achievements on that evening is
Indeed impressive Jean! And there was me thinking I could do with a man Friday to get my house sorted. ROB would be perfect! Er, then again..... laughat

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by aiyoyo on 13.03.13 2:15

suzyjohnson wrote:I was just looking at ROB's interview statements, did he have time to fit in everything he said he did between 9.30 and 10pm on May 3rd?

At 9.30 pm he says he walked round to the front door of his apartment with MO. Approx. one and a half mins. Then he goes to the loo. Then at -

9.32pm He finds that his daughter has been sick. He runs her a bath, changes her clothes, answers the door to MO, puts his daughter in the bath, changes all the bedding, finds her some clean clothes, gets her dry and redressed, puts all the washing into the washing machine, and is sitting in the lounge reading his daughter a book by the time JT arrives back by 9.40pm. It has to have been 9.40pm at the latest because he says they were together for 5 mins and then he was back at the Tapas by -

9.45pm (the waiter's statement is in agreement with this) where he reordered his main meal, which took 10 mins to arrive (the waiter found this meal half finished after the group had left the Tapas).

The Police listening to him can't have failed to suss ROB was inventing a cock & bull story.
Of all people, doctor would know not to leave a sick-child who had just thrown up alone and unsupervised, in case the child is sick again and chokes on vomit.
By a quick calculation, within 10-11 mins between 9.32 to 9.43 (9.45 he was already back at Restaurant), he'd washed and changed his sick vomiting daughter, read to her, and settled her down to sleep. That is speed of lightning, a record time indeed, to have settled a sick child back to sleep, not right after the wash and change, but after having read to her as well, where the child must have been alert to enable this reading activity.

Would imagine the Police have taken out the timeline from each and every of T9, place them side by side, see whether one reconciles with the other and nothing tellies.........what fun!


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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Lance De Boils on 09.04.13 17:25

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:All I can say after reading of Russell O'Brien's achievements on that evening is


"The Life of O'Brien"
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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by PeterMac on 09.04.13 18:25

aiyoyo wrote:[Would imagine the Police have taken out the timeline from each and every of T9, place them side by side, see whether one reconciles with the other and nothing tallies.........what fun!
Perhaps this is what they were all laughing at over their long sardine lunches with wine !

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Post by aniandr on 09.04.13 22:58

Unless the child was drugged. By Rob. He set the dose for alle the children with Gerry saying "theyll be fine kate". Robs child wakes up. Half awake, throwing up. You maybe gave them all a bit to much. They got sick. Your half drunk thinking "ill make up for it later". Later on a child is dead.everything happends realy fast. KM checks - maddie stopped breathing. What to do? Gerry promised they would be fine. She leaves maddie in murrats garden running down to get gerry.he calls murrat for help. Murrat is local and get someone to pick maddie up. . The parents are devestated. Surreal. A nightmare. The night is spend spinning the story. When PJ arrives, gm and jm throw thenselves to the ground, removing focus instantly.JT panics and invent "the egg man". They make a pact of silence - they are all in on this - and PJ arrives. And GA. He uses his guts...thinking...this isnt right...but the circle is full. That day the parents confess in the church. They give the blanket to the priest and any other dna traces. He promise silence.

Kate never eanted her daughter dead. Gerry never wanted her daughter dead. Madeleine was a bright, lovely young daughter. The mislected her. She was drugged. All the kids were. They all knew.

Sometimes things happends different than planned.

Bottomline: 11 min..well..maybe. A drugged, halfasleep kid.

Why didnt the PJ make a drugtest? Why didnt the keep maddies blanket?

PJ: they were deveatated. A nightmare. They knew this was bad.realy bad.

Im not sure there will be justice for maddie. But there will be justice for the parents some day. One day the circle will be broken

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Post by aniandr on 09.04.13 22:59

Unless the child was drugged. By Rob. He set the dose for alle the children with Gerry saying "theyll be fine kate". Robs child wakes up. Half awake, throwing up. You maybe gave them all a bit to much. They got sick. Your half drunk thinking "ill make up for it later". Later on a child is dead.everything happends realy fast. KM checks - maddie stopped breathing. What to do? Gerry promised they would be fine. She leaves maddie in murrats garden running down to get gerry.he calls murrat for help. Murrat is local and get someone to pick maddie up. . The parents are devestated. Surreal. A nightmare. The night is spend spinning the story. When PJ arrives, gm and jm throw thenselves to the ground, removing focus instantly.JT panics and invent "the egg man". They make a pact of silence - they are all in on this - and PJ arrives. And GA. He uses his guts...thinking...this isnt right...but the circle is full. That day the parents confess in the church. They give the blanket to the priest and any other dna traces. He promise silence.

Kate never eanted her daughter dead. Gerry never wanted her daughter dead. Madeleine was a bright, lovely young daughter. The mislected her. She was drugged. All the kids were. They all knew.

Sometimes things happends different than planned.

Bottomline: 11 min..well..maybe. A drugged, halfasleep kid.

Why didnt the PJ make a drugtest? Why didnt the keep maddies blanket?

PJ: they were deveatated. A nightmare. They knew this was bad.realy bad.

Im not sure there will be justice for maddie. But there will be justice for the parents some day. One day the circle will be broken

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by plebgate on 10.04.13 8:42

Re the statement - as I have said (more and more often of late) I really errrrr, um, errrr, um cannot believe what I am reading.

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by tigger on 19.04.13 7:41

I thought I'd add the uncanny feats performed by Matthew Oldfield here as well as told by Dr. Roberts in 'The loneliness of the long distance runner'.


Well we know doctors are accustomed to schedules, but Matthew Oldfield's readiness to keep pace with Kate McCann in this instance is seriously impressive. Three to four miles each way, squeezed into a lunchtime outing on account of a sick wife and a child needing care and supervision back home. ("Grace had loose nappies nearly every day, but until after Madeleine went, erm, disappeared, she was never sick." Is that 'went on her abduction,' Matthew?).

A total of some seven miles, say, plus the time it will have taken for Oldfield to change into, and afterwards out of, his athletic strip. Roger Bannister was himself a medic but I don't think that can be taken to imply that non-runner Dr Matthew Oldfield could get remotely close to the four minute mile, then or now.
unquote


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Post by tigger on 01.04.14 16:02

This is from the Sol reports on Mccannfiles.com :

Also the table waiters that were working in the resort's restaurant -the Tapas, where the group of friends had dinner that night - didn't notice much movement of checking on the children. One of them guaranteed to Sol that, since the beginning of dinner (which started between 8.30 and 9 p.m.), only two men got up, almost simultaneously.

One of them was Russell O'Brien, one of the doctors of the group, who was absent for most of the dinner and who returned to the table 5 minutes before Kate went to her apartment and noticed Maddie was missing. Russell then explained that his daughter was sick, and even "vomited so it was necessary to change her bed sheets". One of the employees of the Ocean Club, who was heard by Sol this week, contradicts his version: "If that had happened, he would have to ask the housekeeping service for some clean sheets, which did not happen".

During the short hour that dinner lasted, the group asked for, and consumed at their table, eight bottles of red wine and six of white wine, according to the restaurant's records.

Unquote

So the bit in ROB's rog, where he gets rather shirty about knowing how to use a washing machine is of some interest.
Apparently there is no way he could have either washed and dried the sheets in the short time he was there and did not ask for clean sheets as I expect the waiter would know.


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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Hicks on 01.04.14 19:12

tigger wrote:This is from the Sol reports on Mccannfiles.com :

Also the table waiters that were working in the resort's restaurant -the Tapas, where the group of friends had dinner that night - didn't notice much movement of checking on the children. One of them guaranteed to Sol that, since the beginning of dinner (which started between 8.30 and 9 p.m.), only two men got up, almost simultaneously.

One of them was Russell O'Brien, one of the doctors of the group, who was absent for most of the dinner and who returned to the table 5 minutes before Kate went to her apartment and noticed Maddie was missing. Russell then explained that his daughter was sick, and even "vomited so it was necessary to change her bed sheets". One of the employees of the Ocean Club, who was heard by Sol this week, contradicts his version: "If that had happened, he would have to ask the housekeeping service for some clean sheets, which did not happen".

During the short hour that dinner lasted, the group asked for, and consumed at their table, eight bottles of red wine and six of white wine, according to the restaurant's records.

Unquote

So the bit in ROB's rog, where he gets rather shirty about knowing how to use a washing machine is of some interest.
Apparently there is no way he could have either washed and dried the sheets in the short time he was there and did not ask for clean sheets as I expect the waiter would know.

I refuse to believe that ROB, or any parent in that group, would leave a vomiting child and go back to the Tapas and have their dinner. The time absent from the table could have been the time of removal. The scene then set and ready for KM.
Perhaps Madeleine's body was wrapped in bed sheets while ROB waited in 5a for the man ( stairwell man who was wearing glasses ?) to take the body away. There was definitely outside help. Was it ROB who had surfing friends in Luz?

I am convinced Madeleine's body was then taken out to sea. IMO the McCann's would not be so arrogant regarding finding her body if that poor child had been buried anywhere on land.
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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Upsy Daisy on 01.04.14 19:28

Matthew's child was perhaps sick every day with loose nappies due to ingesting a certain nightly medication, which, upon Madeleine's disappearance, was swiftly discontinued.....hence the ' no more sickness' (in my opinion).

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by canada12 on 01.04.14 20:04

Agreed: I don't think any parent, and least of all a parent who is a medical doctor, would leave a child alone who has been vomiting. Especially because of the possibility of a repeat, and choking on the vomit. Which is why I don't believe a word of the vomiting story.

I do believe, however, that Madeleine might have vomited and aspirated and choked to death. And that blood spray droplets which were found might have indicated a last minute and desperate emergency tracheotomy to open her airway. That's one possibility, anyway. On top of all the other theories about how she might have died. I'm open to a lot of possibilities. A drugged child awakens and drowsily falls and hits her head. A very much awake child meets some sort of accident, whether by falling, or by hitting her head, or something hits her head.

I don't believe anyone taking Madeleine away would have wrapped her in sheets from any of the apartments. Why? Because then the missing sheet would be noticed by housekeeping staff.

It's possible she might have been wrapped in a sheet from somewhere else however.

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Post by Monty Heck on 01.04.14 20:07

Upsy Daisy wrote:Matthew's child was perhaps sick every day with loose nappies due to ingesting a certain nightly medication, which, upon Madeleine's disappearance, was swiftly discontinued.....hence the ' no more sickness' (in my opinion).
And the McC twins became rather a handful at bedtimes after the disappearance, strange considering all had apparently slept to order during their holiday week.

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Hicks on 01.04.14 20:36

canada12 wrote:Agreed: I don't think any parent, and least of all a parent who is a medical doctor, would leave a child alone who has been vomiting. Especially because of the possibility of a repeat, and choking on the vomit. Which is why I don't believe a word of the vomiting story.

I do believe, however, that Madeleine might have vomited and aspirated and choked to death. And that blood spray droplets which were found might have indicated a last minute and desperate emergency tracheotomy to open her airway. That's one possibility, anyway. On top of all the other theories about how she might have died. I'm open to a lot of possibilities. A drugged child awakens and drowsily falls and hits her head. A very much awake child meets some sort of accident, whether by falling, or by hitting her head, or something hits her head.

I don't believe anyone taking Madeleine away would have wrapped her in sheets from any of the apartments. Why? Because then the missing sheet would be noticed by housekeeping staff.

It's possible she might have been wrapped in a sheet from somewhere else however.
Madeleine may have been wrapped in a shower curtain. I still find it credible that the bag found near Faro airport (the one with a blue fleece, jeans --JT? elastic hair band--what colour was Madeleine's hair band in the last photo? a 'SHOWER CURTAIN', child's green t-shirt and a pencil case) a mystery that as yet has not been explained fully.
IIRC the contents were sent to Birmingham? Also I find it odd that all samples recovered and sent back to the UK for analysis have always returned with the result.....inconclusive. Strange!
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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by suzyjohnson on 03.04.14 20:46

1) Hicks and canada12 - ROB did not leave his sick daughter alone to return to the Tapas, MO had gone back to the tapas to tell JT that their daughter was ill and she had returned to their apartment at 9.45 pm so that ROB could go and eat his meal.

It's odd though that ROB decided to go to his flat at 9.30 pm. (JT, who had seen Tannerman at 9.15 pm on her way TO her apartment, while GM was talking to JW) could not have been back at the Tapas herself, after her check, much before 9.25 pm, so why would ROB need to check 5 minutes later? 

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2) Hicks - I also think the bag found near Faro airport could be important. I don't think MM would have been wrapped in a shower curtain (because I think the Smith family saw MM) but I think MM could have had an accident in the bathroom.

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3)

Upsy Daisy wrote:Matthew's child was perhaps sick every day with loose nappies due to ingesting a certain nightly medication, which, upon Madeleine's disappearance, was swiftly discontinued.....hence the ' no more sickness' (in my opinion).

Monty Heck wrote ''And the McC twins became rather a handful at bedtimes after the disappearance, strange considering all had apparently slept to order during their holiday week''.


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Yes, possibly. So was it the bedding from 5A that was in the washing machine in ROB's apartment?

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Post by kimHager on 04.04.14 4:49

I believe the twins would become a handful IF they were sedated on the holiday. Take away meds especially if it was a benzo or opiate and you would see withdrawals IE. Loose stools, vomiting, irritability, sweating, chills, etc. So yes if Madeleine died from an OD of one of those she could have aspirated her vomit and internal bleeding would probably be present. Definitely no autopsy would miss that!
Hence you would keep a close eye on the other children's breathing and hopefully give no more meds!
Also didn't AG say in his book that the children so cots were stripped down with no sheets... Just a thought but maybe that was used to wrap up Maddy. Wouldn't necessarily have to ask housekeeping for more sheets as I'd read the twins didn't need cots and could sleep in beds..... Very interested to see. Where this goes.

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Post by joyce1938 on 04.04.14 10:22

There seemed to be very little notice taken of Bag found near to airport,i just realized we heard about bag ,but it was short lived ,does anyomn recall tis ?
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Post by canada12 on 04.04.14 10:29

joyce1938 wrote:There seemed to be very little notice taken of Bag found near to airport,i just realized we heard about bag ,but it was short lived ,does anyomn recall tis ?

I remember it quite well, and I remember it being discussed... and then it all got buried and forgotten about... I think one of the important things about the items in this bag is that the predominant colour seemed to be green. However everything we've heard about Madeleine is pink, pink, pink. One wonders now whether the whole "pink" thing was also a diversion away from the possibility that the bag did have something to do with the case, but because the colours of the items weren't pink, they were dissociated from peoples' minds (and also perhaps the detectives).

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by Hicks on 04.04.14 12:16

canada12 wrote:
joyce1938 wrote:There seemed to be very little notice taken of Bag found near to airport,i just realized we heard about bag ,but it was short lived ,does anyomn recall tis ?

I remember it quite well, and I remember it being discussed... and then it all got buried and forgotten about... I think one of the important things about the items in this bag is that the predominant colour seemed to be green. However everything we've heard about Madeleine is pink, pink, pink. One wonders now whether the whole "pink" thing was also a diversion away from the possibility that the bag did have something to do with the case, but because the colours of the items weren't pink, they were dissociated from peoples' minds (and also perhaps the detectives).
That's a good point canada12.

The green t-shirt had a flower motive so most likely a girls item of clothing.
I will look for info regarding this bag.

Jane Tanner WAS wearing a fleece on the night in question, and she went to great pains to let it be known that she didn't bring jeans on the holiday. Now why would you even need to mention that?

Lets assume for a moment that the contents of this bag are very significant. A green t-shirt and NOT pink pyjama's could have been the last thing Madeleine wore. We have no proof that she was wearing pink pyjama's the night she went missing. If this t-shirt was the last item of clothing to be worn then it would be fair to assume that she didn't have an accident close to bedtime or indeed on the night of the 3rd, it would suggest that the time of death was during the day and not necessarily on the 3rd.
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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by HelenMeg on 04.04.14 12:30

suzyjohnson wrote:1) Hicks and canada12 - ROB did not leave his sick daughter alone to return to the Tapas, MO had gone back to the tapas to tell JT that their daughter was ill and she had returned to their apartment at 9.45 pm so that ROB could go and eat his meal.

It's odd though that ROB decided to go to his flat at 9.30 pm. (JT, who had seen Tannerman at 9.15 pm on her way TO her apartment, while GM was talking to JW) could not have been back at the Tapas herself, after her check, much before 9.25 pm, so why would ROB need to check 5 minutes later? 

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2) Hicks - I also think the bag found near Faro airport could be important. I don't think MM would have been wrapped in a shower curtain (because I think the Smith family saw MM) but I think MM could have had an accident in the bathroom.

---------------------

3)

Upsy Daisy wrote:Matthew's child was perhaps sick every day with loose nappies due to ingesting a certain nightly medication, which, upon Madeleine's disappearance, was swiftly discontinued.....hence the ' no more sickness' (in my opinion).

Monty Heck wrote ''And the McC twins became rather a handful at bedtimes after the disappearance, strange considering all had apparently slept to order during their holiday week''.


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Yes, possibly. So was it the bedding from 5A that was in the washing machine in ROB's apartment?
The bag found near Faro airport was thought to be a red herring as it was handed in by Nancy Burridge, wife of Andy Burridge who was linked to the VIP guests at OC  - it was thought that it was a distraction deliberately placed there to be a red herring.

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Re: Your time starts now ........

Post by suzyjohnson on 04.04.14 13:08

I would expect that the last item worn by MM would have stayed with her (assuming that she had died) wherever she was laid to rest.

So an item of clothing found in a bag would be unlikely to be what she was last wearing. However, she might have been wearing the green tee shirt earlier in the day or at the time of an accident, or maybe the tee shirt was used as a cloth as the first item that came to hand and possibly stained with blood?

The last clothes worn by MM could have been anything, except that I personally think that the Smith family did see MM and so am inclined to accept their description of clothing.

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