Re: The emails from Michael Sangerte (off topic/split section)

by vaguely1 04.03.10 21:50

Because focused only on them....if they know they're innocent then the case being shelved makes no difference.

by bunny 04.03.10 21:50

They cant demand that it remains open. they have to have new evidence. that new evidence was sat in a file marked irrelevant and by the looks of it most wasnt thoroughly investigated.

madeleine was marked irrelevant. That tells me that it wasnt about Madeleine to Pavia, it was about him having made his mind up that the parents were involved and not bothering to look into that file. He made Madeleine irrelevant.

by Cath 04.03.10 21:50

jkh wrote:
Inyx wrote:They've got PI's who are probably better equipped for doing that job.

Oh please. Maddie is in a secret lair in a lawless village in PDL. Have they financed a search there yet after 3 years?

How could we know what they are doing unless it's been published in the papers?
How would they know where to go (physically) searching unless someone gives them a lead?
Who will give them a lead if they think Madeleine is dead, so it can't be her they've seen?

by hedge 04.03.10 21:51

jkh wrote:
bunny wrote:It was also the head of Leicestershire police who said that there was no evidence, not one shred against the Mccanns.

He said this AFTER the dogs were bought in.

Then why can't Gunnill spend his valuable time investigating stuff like this? Why don't people in authority want to know what happened to this three year old girl?

What the heck is Mike Gunnill doing lurking in forums, snooping on people, when he could be out on the streets doing what he's paid to do?

He's paid to presumeably proivide visual aids for human interest stories probably, that's how most jobbing journos and photographers make their rent. He stumbled across a pretty interesting human interest story here didn't he, the world of Amaral defenders, Amaral the man currently most infamous for writing a book based, not on evidence but, on his own fantasy that the most famous child in the uk at the moment is dead.

Personally I don't see how you could expect him to resist. It's tabloid gold I suppose.

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 21:51

What were the police supposed to do when Maddie's own parents flatly refused to cooperate with every part of the investigation?

They wouldn't answer questions, they wouldn't take part in the official reconstruction although they preferred to do their own televised version. Not even Maddie's grandparents requested the investigation remain open.

by jmbd 04.03.10 21:53

The Portuguese authorities can re-open the case of a missing child at any time - why don't they?

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 21:54

hedge wrote:
jkh wrote:
bunny wrote:It was also the head of Leicestershire police who said that there was no evidence, not one shred against the Mccanns.

He said this AFTER the dogs were bought in.

Then why can't Gunnill spend his valuable time investigating stuff like this? Why don't people in authority want to know what happened to this three year old girl?

What the heck is Mike Gunnill doing lurking in forums, snooping on people, when he could be out on the streets doing what he's paid to do?

He's paid to presumeably proivide visual aids for human interest stories probably, that's how most jobbing journos and photographers make their rent. He stumbled across a pretty interesting human interest story here didn't he, the world of Amaral defenders, Amaral the man currently most infamous for writing a book based, not on evidence but, on his own fantasy that the most famous child in the uk at the moment is dead.

Personally I don't see how you could expect him to resist. It's tabloid gold I suppose.

He would make a much better name for himself investigating, and finding, Maddie. That would be tabloid gold for sure.

by jmbd 04.03.10 21:55

This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 21:56

jmbd wrote:This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

You don't say. So why aren't people looking for her instead of looking to silence and sue people?

by hedge 04.03.10 21:56

jkh wrote:

But the McCanns allowed the case to be shelved. They didn't demand that it remained open. Wonder why that was?

They were guests in the country at the mercy of cops like Amaral and a completely counter intuitive justice system, what did you think they could do, click their fingers and demand the countries police forces be sent out onto the streets day and night, no one has that power and no police force can search forever, particularly in a case so error strewn and mistake riddled at this one was.

You seem to think they have some magical powers, they are almost completely powerless in much of this, all they can do it try and calm troubled waters and try and remind people as often as they can that this is all about a tiny defenceless child, not them, not their hair cuts or clothes or faces or shoes or accents.

A child.

by bunny 04.03.10 21:58

jkh wrote:What were the police supposed to do when Maddie's own parents flatly refused to cooperate with every part of the investigation?

They wouldn't answer questions, they wouldn't take part in the official reconstruction although they preferred to do their own televised version. Not even Maddie's grandparents requested the investigation remain open.

They cant unless there is new evidence. Did you not realise that?

Why wouldnt the PJ do a reconstruction in the early days? thats when its important,,,,as soon as possible so memories are still fresh. Why did the PJ refuse to let the press film the reconstruction they wanted? it would have been great to to get that out to the general public so it would jog memories.

To me that proves that the PJ were only interested in the McCanns and their friends as suspects. they didnt want anyone coming forward with information about people around the tapas at that time. It shows the PJ had already made their minds up that the Mccanns were involved. If its not publicised then its not going to get more information about an abductor into the PJ is it?

by Kololi 04.03.10 21:58

bunny wrote:They have been searching for her. you know they have gone through the files day in and day out. you know that they have regular meetings with the PIs. they lead the search.

A search is not just a physical one with your hands. that would never achieve what they have achieved by using the media. no one can deny that madeleines face is known worldwide. the more people who know what she looks like the more chance of her being found.

That is much more productive than two people searching themselves.

that is also why in missing people cases its important to get a description out there as soon as possible and to sustain that as long as possible. Its proven to be the best way to proceed.

Hi Bunny
The McCanns have certainly shown a massive amount of stamina and commitment to keep Madeleine at the front of peoples thoughts. Surely though, there can be very few people left who don't know her face now in the world.

All the campaigning, the posters, the vists and still she hasn't been found. How is that possible? And I am asking genuinely as it amazes me. If there was an abductor then how are they keeping her so well hidden and if it was one or both of her parents, how on earth are they managing to keep such a dreadful secret all this time and face the public without their conscience getting the better of them?

Take care

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 21:58

hedge wrote:
jkh wrote:

But the McCanns allowed the case to be shelved. They didn't demand that it remained open. Wonder why that was?

They were guests in the country at the mercy of cops like Amaral and a completely counter intuitive justice system, what did you think they could do, click their fingers and demand the countries police forces be sent out onto the streets day and night, no one has that power and no police force can search forever, particularly in a case so error strewn and mistake riddled at this one was.

You seem to think they have some magical powers, they are almost completely powerless in much of this, all they can do it try and calm troubled waters and try and remind people as often as they can that this is all about a tiny defenceless child, not them, not their hair cuts or clothes or faces or shoes or accents.

A child.

They had the chance to keep the investigation open and they let the deadline pass. You're right - a tiny defenceless child - THEIR OWN child.

by Cath 04.03.10 21:59

jkh wrote:
jmbd wrote:This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

You don't say. So why aren't people looking for her instead of looking to silence and sue people?

Silence and sue people who've declared her dead.
If they know they're not involved into her disappearance, silencing those people makes perfectly sence.
They harm the search for a missing child.

by jmbd 04.03.10 21:59

jkh wrote:
jmbd wrote:This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

You don't say. So why aren't people looking for her instead of looking to silence and sue people?

Did the Mccanns's ask Tony and Amaral to publish their books?

Did the Mccann's encourage the press to print the foul things they printed?

Did the mccann's ask internet forums to say the foul things they said about them?

by jmbd 04.03.10 21:59

They asked for people to help look for their missing child.

by bunny 04.03.10 22:00

jkh wrote:
jmbd wrote:This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

You don't say. So why aren't people looking for her instead of looking to silence and sue people?

Because Amarals book and |Tonys are damaging that search as people are believing that Madeleine is dead. They couldnt be ignored any longer as there was an impact on the search.

by hedge 04.03.10 22:00

jkh wrote:What were the police supposed to do when Maddie's own parents flatly refused to cooperate with every part of the investigation?

They wouldn't answer questions, they wouldn't take part in the official reconstruction although they preferred to do their own televised version. Not even Maddie's grandparents requested the investigation remain open.

That's a complete nonsense and you know it. They complied and made themselves available for months, this is all well documented stuff. However on being informed that the police thought their daughter dead (without evidence) and them involved (again without evidence), Kate refused to answer questions under arguido status as was her right that she had answered before and that were frankly mental questions designed to do nothing to help her child.

That's it, one two hour refusal in extremely trying circumstances compared to months of being there available for anything.

Right.

by jmbd 04.03.10 22:00

And look how Tony and others have responded!

by vaguely1 04.03.10 22:00

jkh wrote:
jmbd wrote:This arGuido status and procedural thing in Portugal has really screwed up peoples perception.

THERE IS A MISSING CHILD.

You don't say. So why aren't people looking for her instead of looking to silence and sue people?

I suppose silencing the man who claims she is dead, and suing the newspapers that claim she is dead is part of finding her. Might not be a way we understand it, but it has to be a part of that process.

Why does Tony write to the PCC so often?.....he feels he is in the right and that it is damaging to his cause to read people saying things he doesn't recognise as the truth I suppose.

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 22:01

From joanamorais

translated by Astro

Gonçalo Amaral: “The most important thing is to reopen the process”

24Horas
4 March 2010

Image

What is happening “is propaganda”, given that “nobody is looking for the little girl, neither here nor there (in England)”.

These words are from former PJ inspector Gonçalo Amaral, who sees the criticism from the McCann couple and from the English press against the Portuguese investigation as pure “folklore”.

“These sightings, that are being talked about, almost always came from the English police, if they are so important, as some people are saying now, why weren’t they investigated by the Scotland Yard? After all, the little girl is a British citizen”, the author of the book “The Truth of the Lie”, based on the case of the disappearance of Madeleine McCann in the Algarve, in 2007, recalls.

“The important things is not going around talking about sightings, saying that the little girl was seen here and there, the important thing is to reopen the process. The truth is that after I left Portimão, nothing more was done, the process was archived by the Public Ministry half way through, many diligences remained to be carried out, and that is what not allows for all sort of speculation”, the former inspector told 24horas.

“The process was possibly archived half way through because the State was afraid of (the McCanns’) demands for compensation. That fear was also transmitted to us by our colleagues, the English policemen, who used to say that it was a very common thing in England”, Gonçalo Amaral recalled.

The McCanns’ lawyer, Isabel Duarte, has a very different opinion about the evolution of the Maddie case. For her, “it is shocking and sad” that the leads that are now being publicly revealed “were not handed over to the parents”. The revelation of that information is also criticised by Isabel Duarte, because “it puts the little girl’s safety at risk”.
Annabel
Golden Poster

Number of posts: 868
Location: Europe
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eta link http://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/main-maddie-thread-latest-news-f1/goncalo-amaral-the-most-important-thing-is-to-reopen-the-process-t8737.htm

by jmbd 04.03.10 22:03

Don't forget Ofcom vags when an interview wasn't what he liked.

by **Jill Havern** 04.03.10 22:04

hedge wrote:
jkh wrote:What were the police supposed to do when Maddie's own parents flatly refused to cooperate with every part of the investigation?

They wouldn't answer questions, they wouldn't take part in the official reconstruction although they preferred to do their own televised version. Not even Maddie's grandparents requested the investigation remain open.

That's a complete nonsense and you know it. They complied and made themselves available for months, this is all well documented stuff. However on being informed that the police thought their daughter dead (without evidence) and them involved (again without evidence), Kate refused to answer questions under arguido status as was her right that she had answered before and that were frankly mental questions designed to do nothing to help her child.

That's it, one two hour refusal in extremely trying circumstances compared to months of being there available for anything.

Right.

Well, if Maddie were my child I would do everything to help the investigation. Everything.