The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
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The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
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Whose car was available?

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Post by Cammerigal 29.11.22 21:57

Silentscope wrote:Did anyone notice that there are several instances where the Renault Scenic Kms are incorrectly accounted for?

Who drove the 73 and 35 Kms between the Dissappearence and the Start of the McCann's hire? 




Kilometres Not OkDateTimeTotal KmDays HireDriverLocations
1110.03.200709:421797Simon Halder
19017.03.200717:20Simon Halder
0
19018.03.200709:546337John Patterson
82325.03.200708:35John Patterson
0
823409925.03.200710:181227Kenneth Walkden
945494501.04.200708:32Kenneth Walkden
0
94502.04.200711:27110610Adrian Lowes
205112.04.200709:00Adrian Lowes
0
205108.05.200716:285417John Brown
259215.05.200714:21John Brown
73Unknown user
266517.05.200712:452045Fernando Vilela
286922.05.200711:23Fernando Vilela
0
286923.05.200709:002103Enawgaw Mengistae
307926.05.200709:00Enawgaw Mengistae
Start Hire35Unknown user
311427.05.200712:3005Gerald McCannAS Lagos
386403.06.200712:307503Gerald McCannAS Lagos
386403.06.200712:300Gerald McCannAS Lagos
586403.07.200712:30200027Gerald McCannAS Lagos
586503.07.200712:3013Gerald McCannAS Lagos
03.08.200729
Dogs Inspection93296-7.08.200715:1762156PJ and Martin GrimePJ HQ Portimao
586601.09.200712:30126Gerald McCannAS Lagos
1444323.09.200715:30857723Gerald McCannAS Lagos
It really doesn't make logical sense, but the forum drew a blank at the time.
We  did request a separate thread from Verdi, as this analysis was buried in the 'leave no stone unturned' thread
anyway, to refresh minds;[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
And as they say in the UK 'MIND THE GAP'
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Post by Verdi 30.11.22 0:17

Yes indeed, when embarking disembarking a railway carriage.

The originator of this thread, bird131, is interested in who associated with the McCann travel group had access to or hired a vehicle prior to the alarm raised by Kate McCann on the night of Thursday 3rd May 2007.

But thanks for the reminder of past bizarre theorizing about the unknown.

Could we please try to keep on topic!

Thank you.

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Post by Cammerigal 30.11.22 23:50

absence of evidence is not evidence of absence - Carl Sagan
Once again [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] , you dismiss the query and supportive information as raised by [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].
I will try and provide an explanation as to why it is of use, is not bizarre theorizing and is on topic; 

Q; What cars were in use that fateful week, who had access and who drove them? 
The on topic exam question posed by [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

The above analysis, based on the PJ file's car hire dockets advises us that the McCann Renault Scenic, which was subsequently found to contain Mccann Family DNA vestiges by the CSI dogs was AWOL 12th April to 8 May. No explanation, for a popular family car being unavailable for over a month

Moreover, the recorded mileage (kms) magically dropped ! [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] then found that via a simple piece of software and a connected PC to the Car's ODI bus, that mileage could be easily adjusted, aka 'clocked' like a used car sold form under and East London 'railway arch'
NOK2 – Ref PJ P.2929- On the 2nd April, the car had 4000km erased from its clock, for when RA Lowes of the UK hired it at 1130hrs with 945km on the clock. He had it for 10 days, running 221km

These were of course paper records, handed to the PJ, which when scrutinized here also clearly showed manipulation via scanning, reprinting & duplication. Clever then, but like a modified EXIF file time/date stamp on 'the last photo', it doesn't actually stand up to computer systems auditors.
  
A: So we now have a vehicle potentially 'available' and worthy of further consideration by [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - the McCanns DNA contaminated Renault Scenic 

So we still have to Mind the Gap 
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Post by Verdi 01.12.22 2:02

When loòking to provoke a reaction, I strongly recommend that you ....

a)  Talk to me and not @ me.

b)  Talk some resemblance of sense.

c)  Defend your own position rather than trying to justify that of a another's.

hat

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Post by Bird131 01.12.22 9:18

Thanks Cammerigal ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]) and Verdi ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]). Truly appreciate!
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Post by Verdi 01.12.22 12:27

British family cleared of any link to Madeleine McCann's disappearance.

Original Source: DAILY TELEGRAPH: SUNDAY 12 AUGUST 2007
By Andrew Barrow August 14, 2007 12:00am

A BRITISH family caught up in the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann say detectives have cleared them of any link to the case.

A hire car rented by solicitor James Gorrod just days before Madeleine was abducted in Portugal was one of ten seized by police last week as part of the hunt for the British four-year-old.

Gorrod, whose wife Charlotte gave birth to a son just three weeks ago, said rumours of their involvement in Madeleine's abduction had been very distressing for his "vulnerable" wife.

He said: "Having given birth to a baby boy three weeks ago, for this to happen at this time when she is so vulnerable, is distressing."

Property solicitor Gorrod, a then-heavily pregnant Charlotte and their two-year-old son took a last minute holiday in the same resort as the McCanns at the end of April, around the same time as Madeleine was taken.

They never met the couple and the first they knew of Madeleine's disappearance was when a note was pushed under the door of their holiday villa the following day.

Gorrod, a former Great Britain youth and junior level sailor, was drawn into the inquiry after Portuguese police discovered he had hired a car at Faro airport and asked for a child's seat.

In a statement released through Gorrod's Exeter-based legal firm, he said: "A British police officer directly liaising with the Portuguese investigation team recently contacted me to eliminate the vehicle I hired for a holiday with my wife and two-year son in Praia da Luz at the time Madeleine McCann disappeared.

"The vehicle has been identified and I have been told by the British police officer that he has no plans to interview me or my family, and he does not expect me or my family to have any further involvement in the Madeleine McCann investigation."

The statement added: "We are, of course, deeply saddened by Madeleine's disappearance and hope for her safe return."

Earlier today Charlotte Gorrod said she was baffled Portuguese police had not spoken to them while they were on holiday even though they offered to help.

Speaking from the couple's home in Exeter, she told the Evening Standard newspaper: "My husband was on holiday with myself and our son who is aged two. And that is why we needed a baby seat.

"It was our last chance to have a holiday before I got too pregnant to fly.

[Acknowledgement: gerrymccannsblog and mccannfiles]


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Post by Verdi 01.12.22 15:29

Judging by the documented PJ investigation, it was the Opel Corsa registration 75-AG-62 that was hired by the Gorrod family during their holiday..

RUSSELL O'BRIEN

To the coordinator of the criminal investigation.

In the context of the investigation, we have collected information concerning a vehicle used by RUSSELL O'BRIEN, friend and member of the group who spent their holiday with the McCann family in the Algarve . At the time of the request for vehicles considered important to the procedures that follow, we were not aware of the identification details of this vehicle. Meantime, our investigation has led us to establish that it may be a vehicle of the "Opel" range, a "Corsa" model, registration....AG - 62. At the present time, we do not have a mandate to search for and seize the vehicle to allow us to add the vehicle to the planned inspections. As a consequence, we request such a legal mandate in order to be able to realize the planned inspections.

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Sniffer Dog Report

Date: 06 and 07 August 2007

Place: Underground Car Park, Praca 1 de Maio, Portimao.

Participants:

1. PJ ? Tavares de Almeida, Chief Inspector
2. PJ ? Joao Carlos Pereira, Inspector
3. PJ ? Ricardo Paiva, Inspector
4. UK ? Mark Harrison
5. UK Martin Grime UK Forensic Canine P SM Expert
6. EDDY ? English Springer
7. KEELA ? English Springer

AN IMAGE AND SOUND RECORDING OF THE WHOLE INQUIRY WAS MADE.

On 6th August 2007 at about 15.17 a sniffer dog inspection was carried out of the following cars that had been placed for this purpose in the underground car park mentioned previously:

Vehicle n? 1 ? Opel Corsa ? number plate 75-AG-62
Vehicle n? 2 ? Fiat Punto ? number plate 45-49-ER
Vehicle n? 3 ? Peugeot 205 ? number plate RI-96-03
Vehicle n? 4 ? Renault Scenic ? number plate ? 59-DA-27
Vehicle n? 5 ? Skoda Fabia ? number plate 96-26-VE
Vehicle n? 6 ? Volkswagon Transporter ? number plate 44-77-KD
Vehicle n? 7 ? Nissan Patrol ? number plate VH-24-22
Vehicle n? 8 ? Volkswagon Passat ? number plate 57-12-HP
Vehicle n? 9 ? Audi A4 ? number plate 10-91-FP
Vehicle n? 10 ?Renault Kangoo ? number plate 07-50-UI

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As regards the Renault Grand Scenic, number plate 59-DA-27, it was hired by Gerry from Rent a car AA. Castanheira, with offices in Lagos, on 27-05-2007 and was delivered to the McCann couple at the apartment they were occupying in P da L, from which time it was noted in the contract that a friend of the McCanns, Alexander Cameron, was noted as an additional driver.

- At a later date, at the end of August, another additional driver was added to the contract, Michael Terrence Wright.

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Post by Verdi 01.12.22 15:33

2134 Search warrant on OPEL Corsa with plate no. 75-AG-62

08-Processos Vol VIII Page 2134

Search and Apprehension Report

Date: 2007/08/06

Presiding Officer: Tavares de Almeida

Executing Officer: Joao Carlos and Ricardo Paiva, Inspectors

Search Identity: vehicle belonging to SIXT rent a car.

Time: 14.00

The following result was obtained (detailed description of the number and quantity papers and objects detected and their exact location, search warrant and indication of examinations made).

Search carried out on Opel Corsa vehicle, number plate 75-AG-62, with forensic support, nothing having been found or indicated.

Signed

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Post by Silentscope 11.12.22 11:53

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icture from the Dogs Inspection Video of Malinka's Audi A4

Post#1 Bird 131 wrote:

Two weeks later, on 15th May 2007, the Portuguese police declared Robert a suspect in Madeleine’s ‘disappearance’. The following day, his friend Sergey who lived in Praia da Luz, was interrogated by the police. For some unknown reason, weeks later his vehicle escaped the ‘Eddie and Keela sniffer dogs’ police line-up held in August 2007. Strangely, Sergey’s Audi A4 only months later was torched outside his home and partially destroyed.

From the Portugal Resident: Dated 27 Mar 2008
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It appears the Vehicle was burnt AFTER the Dogs Inspection, or?
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Post by crusader 11.12.22 12:30

Snipped from above
For some unknown reason, weeks later his vehicle escaped the ‘Eddie and Keela sniffer dogs’ police line-up held in August 2007.






Malinkas car was subject to examination by Eddie and Keela on 6th August 2007.


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Post by Verdi 11.12.22 13:29

Add to that ^^^..

Verbal Report of Martin Grime Referring to the Search Made of Vehicles Using the Dogs

Vehicle No 1 - number plate 75-AG-62
Vehicle No2 - number plate 45-49-ER
Vehicle No3 - number plate RI-96-03
Vehicle No4 - number plate 59-DA-27
Vehicle No5 - number plate 96-26-VE
Vehicle No6 - number plate 44-77-KD
Vehicle No7 - number plate VH-24-22
Vehicle No8 - number plate 57-12-HP
Vehicle No9 - number plate 10-91-FP
Vehicle No10 - number plate 07-50-UI

We examined the cars with the dog and the only reaction we got was in relation to the car in the extreme corner. I will indicate that it was the Renault. What we have is a reaction to this door here, where (the dog) lifts its head in the air and sniffs for the objects which it has been trained to detect. And when we limit our movements, the dog chooses this car, this door. It is important to know that the dog chooses the odour that comes from the lower part of the door. Based on this information, I will try to place the dog inside the car.
CANINE VEHICLE SEARCHES.

Ten vehicles were screened in an underground multi storey car park at
Portimao. The vehicles, of which I did not know the owner details, were
parked on an empty floor with 20-30 feet between each. The vehicle
placement video recording and management of the process was conducted
by the PJ. The EVRD was then tasked to search the area. When passing a
vehicle I now know to be hired and in the possession of the McCann family,
the dog's behaviour changed substantially. This then produced an alert
indication at the lower part of the drivers door where the dog was biting and
barking. I recognise this behaviour as the dog indicating scent emitting from
the inside of the vehicle through the seal around the door.

This vehicle was then subjected to a full physical examination by the PJ and
no human remains were found. The CSI dog was then tasked to screen the
vehicle. An alert indication was forthcoming from the rear driver's side of the
boot area. Forensic samples were taken by the PJ and forwarded to a
forensic laboratory in the U.K.

It is my view that it is possible that the EVRD is alerting to 'cadaver scent'
contaminant or human blood scent. No evidential or intelligence reliability can
be made from this alert unless it can be confirmed with corroborating
evidence. The remainder of the vehicles were screened by the EVRD without
any interest being shown. Therefore the CSI dog was not further deployed.

MINISTERIO PUBLICO DE PORTIMAO

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Post by Verdi 12.12.22 12:32

I guess it wasn't deemed relevant to the investigation as the Renault Scenic hired by the Mccanns was the only vehicle the specialist dogs reacted to.

Unfortunately there is a lot of unclarified information (evidence?) documented in the PJ files left open to dispute - the dog inspections being one such example.  Like just about everything attached to this case, it's an indicative to be included in the overall picture.

The overall picture doesn't look to good for Gerry and Kate McCann.

They were whisked away overnight from Portugal, where they declared the intention of never leaving without Madeleine, after having been interviewed as arguidos in September 2007.

That in itself speaks volumes!

ETA: This was meant in reply to Bird131 - the post disappeared as I replied.

i don\'t know

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Post by Bird131 12.12.22 12:55

On 6th August 2007, the following vehicles were subjected to an 'inspection' in an underground car park (Martin Grime and his dogs Eddie and Keela).
Vehicle 1         Number plate:  75-AG-62        Opel Corsa.
Vehicle 2         Number plate:  45-49-ER        Fiat Punto
Vehicle 3         Number plate:  RI-96-03         Peugeot 205
Vehicle 4         Number plate:  59-DA-27        Renault Scenic
Vehicle 5         Number plate:  96-26-VE        Skoda Fabia
Vehicle 6         Number plate:  44-77-KD        Volkswagon Transporter
Vehicle 7         Number plate:  VH-24-22        Nissan Patrol
Vehicle 8         Number plate:  57-12-HP        Volkswagon Passat
Vehicle 9         Number plate:  10-91-FP         Audi A4
Vehicle 10       Number plate:  07-50-UI         Renault Kangoo
Was the (Praia da Luz) car owned by Robert Murat amongst these 10 vehicles?
Remember, Murat claimed that on his arrival in Praia da Luz from the UK on 1st May 2007, his car was 'not available' and he had to rent a car for a few days. Is it known which car he rented and also, the make/colour/number plate of his own car?
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Post by Verdi 12.12.22 13:01

Off the top of my head yes, Robert Murat's vehicle debacle was covered by the PJ investigation.

I haven't time at the moment but in the meantime, this might throw some light on Murat's movements..

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Post by crusader 12.12.22 13:37

Reg 96-26-VE Skoda Fabia is Murats car.
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Post by crusader 12.12.22 14:09

Vehicle 1         Number plate:  75-AG-62        Opel Corsa.  James Gorrad
Vehicle 2         Number plate:  45-49-ER        Fiat Punto   Ralph Everleigh
Vehicle 3         Number plate:  RI-96-03         Peugeot 205   Michaela, Murats girlfriend
Vehicle 4         Number plate:  59-DA-27        Renault Scenic   McCann
Vehicle 5         Number plate:  96-26-VE        Skoda Fabia    Murat
Vehicle 6         Number plate:  44-77-KD        Volkswagon Transporter   Murat
Vehicle 7         Number plate:  VH-24-22        Nissan Patrol   Michaelas ex husband
Vehicle 8         Number plate:  57-12-HP        Volkswagon Passat   Michaelas ex husband
Vehicle 9         Number plate:  10-91-FP         Audi A4    Sergio Malinka
Vehicle 10       Number plate:  07-50-UI         Renault Kangoo   Michaelas ex husband


Murats rented car Hyudai Getz  60-AX-86
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Post by Verdi 13.12.22 13:09

I've had another rummage about but I think the link to mccannpjfiles posted up-page the most comprehensive source of Murat's vehicles @#64.

Snipped:

Confronted with this incoherent comportment, Robert Murat, showed much nervousness and offered to stop providing services, if that was our desire.

For the investigative strategy, in order to better control and collect relevant elements, we opted to continue to use his services. Also via communication with the Leicester police authorities, the locale where the McCann family lives in the U.K., we were informed that an English reporter had suspicions regarding Robert, for the reason of his evasive comportment when she tried to take his picture and from a telephone call, which he said was to his daughter, making it in a loud voice, as if he wanted to demonstrate something.

The target resides in Vila da Luz, and while this is not binding, that the route of the observed suspect by the testimony of Jane, went in the direction of his home. He has knowledge of the area where the facts occurred, enabling him to circulate among, to sway [influence] and to educate (figuratively speaking) the natives and people that are there on their holidays.

It is also stressed that some of the routes taken by foot by Madeleine and her family, went through the locale where he lives. It is further added that reported in the present investigation is anonymous information, alerting us to the eventuality of the abductor being found in a residence of the locale in proximity to block 5, and the same accesses various sites of a sexual nature, trading, inclusively, encrypted communications.

Thus, suspicions fall on the target and for this reason sir, I am requesting that you suggest to the Magistrate to issue search warrants for his below referenced homes, given that only with such legal instruments is it possible to progress the investigation:

1. RUA AMALHETE, CASA LILIANA, LUZ, LAGOS, residence of the observed person and his mother, JA Murat, given that they live together.
2. Rua D. João Moniz Nogueira, *******, Lagos
3. Rua Adelina ******, residence of Michaela Walczuch
4. Rua Garret, ******, Lagos
5. Rua Lima Leitão, ********, Lagos

Equally we ask for search warrants for the vehicles:
1. VW Transporter *****
2. Peugeot 205 - *****
3. Hyundai Getz ******


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Post by Verdi 13.12.22 15:24

10 Processo 10 Pages 2603 to 2604

2604 to 2608 - Additional analysis by Chief Inspector Tavares de Almeida

Dated 3 September 2007.

We refer now that the location of the cadaver odours signifies that physically the body (cadaver) is not on the place, marked by the dog, but certainly it has been there, as long as the dog signals it.

As it can be verified from the 'Autos', in the inquiry, the dogs inspected the locales and objects with the results described below.

All the inspections were recorded in sound and image and were directed by our British colleagues that accompanied the dogs.

Among the great number of objects and locales inspected, the dogs marked the following places:
1. Apartment 5 A, Ocean Club resort, the place from where the child disappeared
1.1. Cadaver odour
* Master bedroom, in a corner, by the wardrobe
* Living room, behind the sofa, by the side window
1.2. Blood dog:
* Living room behind the sofa, close to the lateral window (on the same spot signalled by the cadaver dog);
2. Front garden to the apartment 5A
2.1. Cadaver dog
* Flower bed (the dog handler commented on the 'lightness' of the odor)
3. Apartments where the rest of the group were staying
* NOTHING was detected by the dogs
4. Actual residence of the McCann
* NOTHING was detected on the house by any of the dogs
5. At Aldeia da Luz
* NOTHING was detected by any of the dogs
6. Clothes and belongings of McCann family
6.1. Cadaver dog:
* 2 pieces of clothing of Kate McCann
* One piece of Madeleine McCann
* Madeleine's soft toy
* The odour was detected when the toy was still in the interior of the actual residence of the McCann
* It was confirmed in out of the house conditions
7. Vehicle used by the McCann family
7.1. Cadaver dog:
* Marked the key of the car
* Marked the interior of the booth
7.2. Blood dog
* Marked the car key
* Marked the interior of the booth
8. Car used by a family friend that was staying in the same resort, in some of the same days
* Nothing was detected by any of the dogs
9. All the cars used by the arguido Robert Murat and the people that are close to him
* Nothing was detected by any of the dogs.

The use of those dogs, for official record purposes, was recorded on video - image and sound. The work in which the dogs were used included:
- in the apartment 5A that was used by the family at the date of the events;
- in the apartments that were used by of the rest of the group of friends at the date of the events;
- in the residence presently being used by the family;
- in the vehicle used by the family;
- the clothing of the family;
- in the vehicles used by arguido Robert Murat and those used by persons familiar with him [family, friends and associates];

- in the residence and garden of arguido Robert Murat;
- in diverse areas in and around Praia da Luz.

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