Re: Whose car was available?

by crusader 26.02.22 14:12

Murat had Balu's phone number it doesn't imply either of them were involved in Madeleine's disappearance, it's just a tenuous link between the two of them.

by crusader 28.02.22 19:40

Linda McQueen said in her statement, she arrived on her first visit to Portugal on 12th to 19th May.

Alexander ( Sandy ) Cameron was there and he had a car, it was not the Renault Scenic that Kate and Gerry hired later.

Pat Cameron said in her rogatory statement, when they arrived in Portugal on 15th May, a friend lent them a car to use.

by Vera Krista 28.02.22 20:40

but it would hard to dispose a body when the cameras are focused on you, your family and your friends, so how did the cadaver scent & bodily fluids end up in the rental car? (I am not McCann fan) I am just trying to figure out.

by **ShiningInLuz** 28.02.22 21:45

Verdi wrote:
Bird131 wrote:Can anyone please provide any further details pertaining to the vehicles mentioned? Where for instance, was Robert’s car when he arrived from the UK? As a matter of interest, did Robert keep his vehicle for years thereafter, or did he sell it shortly after arriving back in Praia da Luz. Any clarity in relation to the afore-mentioned would be appreciated.

I think perhaps forum member and blogger ShinningInLuz might be able to offer some assistance here.

Sorry, in 2007 I was living in England.

I had no interest in this case whatsoever until Operation Grange decided to dig up the centre of Luz in June 2014. When I lived at the extreme north of Luz.

I do know (of) Mr Malinka. He is trying to flog our current home. But to date I have never met him.

by Verdi 01.03.22 0:16

Fair enough - it was worth a try.

I look on you as our Luz correspondent titter

in chief.

Apart from the case in question I'm always interested in a personal perspective of life across the globe. How else can we know how others live?

Certainly not by what we read across the medias.

by Verdi 07.03.22 16:03

crusader wrote:Linda McQueen said in her statement, she arrived on her first visit to Portugal on 12th to 19th May.

Alexander ( Sandy ) Cameron was there and he had a car, it was not the Renault Scenic that Kate and Gerry hired later.

Pat Cameron said in her rogatory statement, when they arrived in Portugal on 15th May, a friend lent them a car to use.

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by Verdi 03.08.22 13:40

Something niggling .... I'm sure somewhere along the line - an official source. I read group member Russell O'Brien had use of a car.

I've been looking at his rogatory statement, alas I was bogged-down by the gibberish -it's very difficult to understand what he's talking about, I did however come across this little gem..

1578 “Did you see Kate and Gerry inside a car during the holidays'

Reply “Err no not during the holiday err you know obviously the hire car err business is well known, I, I mean, I don’t think there was any of us had a car err or saw, or there was any access to a car until sort of Gerry’s family all came, Gerry’s family had come over and hired a car when they came. So there was a car around after that but I don’t actually particularly remember err much about Kate and Gerry using it, I think on a couple of occasions, if I think closely, I think they may have driven down to the church just to try and keep the, the, the crowds and things off them. Err but certainly in terms of, the quote “holiday”, that was, you know they didn’t not have a car.”

by **Jill Havern** 03.08.22 14:10

Who said that ^^^? Rachel Oldfield?

by Verdi 03.08.22 16:52

Rachel Oldfield's version of the truth..

Rogatory statement

1578 'Did you see Kate or Gerry inside any car during the holiday period''

Reply 'During the whole time that we were there, or just, or up to the third of May or, I mean I never saw them in a car the whole time, I mean there was no car'.

1578 'Answers the question then'.

by Verdi 03.08.22 17:12

Patricia Cameron Statement 15 April 2008
Leicestershire Police Force
Witness Statement

Statement from Patricia Cameron
Occupation : Nurse

Date 15th April 2008

I am Gerry McCanns oldest sister, he is the youngest of five children. I'm married to Sandy Cameron and we have an adult son.

Snipped..

We went to Manchester and stayed at a friends house before catching the first flight of the morning, on Saturday 5th May 2007.

We arrived in Portugal on Saturday morning, where a friend lent us a car to use and we went to Praia da Luz.

by Bird131 05.08.22 0:42

The "available car" was mainly in reference to 30th April (2007), when the Sagres trip was mentioned ... and the same time Madeleine's body probably had to be moved from the Ocean Club and taken to a "place of safety". By then, RM had almost certainly been contacted to organize much-needed assistance (because the 9 couldn't dare risk hiring a car for a day or two shortly before an "abduction"). RM's dear friend SM in Praia da Luz had an "available car" for just such an emergency (it could be argued that CB was also "in the area" and had an available camper!). Months later and in the same holiday town, SM's vehicle was suspiciously destroyed in a mystery fire/blast. The event occurred months after the "game-changing" cadaver was discovered in 5A and the hired Renault Scenic. Was SM's car destroyed in an act of pure vandalism, or was it a precaution in case someone suggested it be tested for the presence of cadaver?

by Verdi 05.08.22 1:01

You're confusing me, I thought all this had been covered up-thread..

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As for Christian Brueckner, if that's who you mean by CB .... a red herring beyond shadow of doubt, at least until some tangible evidence comes forth.!

by Bird131 05.08.22 14:07

Thanks Verdi for your reply ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]) and yes, the matter has been thoroughly discussed. In the latest previous comments made, I noted the cars being discussed all played a role after 3rd May 2007. My interest in the thread relates to any car/s used by any of the 9 persons before the "abduction".

by Verdi 05.08.22 15:56

Yes, I know where your interests lie, sorry again for taking your thread slightly off topic.

I have a tendency to whizz about all over the place when searching for something specific. I use the forum to jot down things I find interesting or potentially relevant, otherwise I lose track - as I have clearly done regards Russell O'Brien and my recollection he had access to a vehicle during the holiday.

Also, there is a remote possibility the availability of a vehicle after the event could lead to the same vehicle being available before Thursday 3rd May 2007 - if you get my drift.

by crusader 05.08.22 17:23

James Sperry and his wife Clare, Friends of Jane Tanner had a hire car.

by Verdi 29.11.22 11:49

Bird131 wrote:Thanks Verdi for your reply ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]) and yes, the matter has been thoroughly discussed. In the latest previous comments made, I noted the cars being discussed all played a role after 3rd May 2007. My interest in the thread relates to any car/s used by any of the 9 persons before the "abduction".

RUSSELL O'BRIEN

To the coordinator of the criminal investigation.

In the context of the investigation, we have collected information concerning a vehicle used by RUSSELL O'BRIEN, friend and member of the group who spent their holiday with the McCann family in the Algarve . At the time of the request for vehicles considered important to the procedures that follow, we were not aware of the identification details of this vehicle. Meantime, our investigation has led us to establish that it may be a vehicle of the "Opel" range, a "Corsa" model, registration....AG - 62. At the present time, we do not have a mandate to search for and seize the vehicle to allow us to add the vehicle to the planned inspections. As a consequence, we request such a legal mandate in order to be able to realize the planned inspections.

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by Bird131 29.11.22 12:30

Thanks Verdi. Am I correct in assuming no other information (date and time of hire and return, distance travelled etc.), regarding this vehicle exists?

by Verdi 29.11.22 12:39

I mentioned this ages ago but couldn't find the source - until today!

Give me time, something is still niggling about this, I've a feeling I've seen mention elsewhere. Not internet gossip but something more tangible.

As time passes it's becoming more and more difficult directly locating information - another good reason why we need to keep CMOMM on track.

by Verdi 29.11.22 15:20

The Truth of the Lie by Gonçalo Amaral

EXAMINATION OF THE VEHICLES

Not having been able to find an available garage in Lagos, we appeal to the mayor of Portimão, Manuel da Luz. In this case as in others before, the police have been able to count on the practical support of the mayor’s office.

Finally, on August 6th, in the unoccupied floors of an underground car park, opposite the PJ’s offices, the inspection of the vehicles takes place. To be examined are those of Robert Murat, Michaela, Sergey Malinka, Luiz Antonio, the McCann couple, and one that Russell O’Brien may have used. Driven by the investigators, the cars are parked in the reserved areas, doors closed and windows raised, with a space of 10 metres from one to another to avoid contamination. According to planned procedure, Eddie goes in first; Keela will be brought in if necessary.

In the immense underground car park, Martin commands Eddie to begin the examination. The dog then intensively sniffs each of the first three cars, at tyre level, the side doors and the boot, then all round. When he gets close to the fourth, the McCanns’ Renault, he becomes agitated, raises his nose while running around, as if he is trying to locate the source of the odour he has detected. Martin tells him to stop running around and concentrate on the search. Finally, he starts to growl, bark and wanting to bite the bottom of the driver’s door and the boot. The odour is coming from inside. The PJ’s experts examine the vehicle for hours with the help of Keela. At dawn, traces of human blood are found in places indicated by the female dog: the key and the boot. The harvested samples are packed, then sent to a forensic laboratory in Birmingham, Great Britain.

Eddie did not hesitate for a moment. He was only interested in the McCanns’ automobile. No other attracted his attention or provoked any reaction whatsoever on his part. So, why would certain people want to minimise the evidence produced by this method?

Later, I am brought the witness statement of a neighbour, according to whom, the McCanns left their car boot open all the time. For Gerry’s brother-in-law, the bad smell was explained by the fact that the McCanns transported their bins in it. As for the blood, it had been left by a piece of meat fallen out of a shopping bag. Kate’s cousin explained that the unpleasant smells were due to the little ones’ dirty nappies.

None of that stands up to scrutiny faced with the reactions of these dogs, who are thoroughly trained to detect only blood and cadaver odours.

by Verdi 29.11.22 16:00

NOTE: Holidaymakers James and Charlotte Gorrod were said to be friends/neighbours of Russel O'Brien and Jane Tanner.

They were allegedly staying in or around Luz at the same time as they McCann group were there.

If I remember rightly, they had access to a car but don't quote me - yet!

by crusader 29.11.22 16:05

Are these of any interest?

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by Verdi 29.11.22 16:07

Russell O'Brien's Rogatory Interview - 10th April 2018

1578 “Did you see Kate and Gerry inside a car during the holidays'

Reply “Err no not during the holiday err you know obviously the hire car err business is well known, I, I mean, I don’t think there was any of us had a car err or saw, or there was any access to a car until sort of Gerry’s family all came, Gerry’s family had come over and hired a car when they came.

So there was a car around after that but I don’t actually particularly remember err much about Kate and Gerry using it, I think on a couple of occasions, if I think closely, I think they may have driven down to the church just to try and keep the, the, the crowds and things off them. Err but certainly in terms of, the quote “holiday”, that was, you know they didn’t not have a car.”

I visited the Algarve in 101 years B.C. - I know full well I hired a car - it's not the sort of thing you forget. The memory of places you visited - on wheels!

by Silentscope 29.11.22 18:45

Did anyone notice that there are several instances where the Renault Scenic Kms are incorrectly accounted for?

Who drove the 73 and 35 Kms between the Dissappearence and the Start of the McCann's hire?

Kilometres	Not Ok	Date	Time	Total Km	Days Hire	Driver	Locations
11		10.03.2007	09:42	179	7	Simon Halder
190		17.03.2007	17:20			Simon Halder
	0
190		18.03.2007	09:54	633	7	John Patterson
823		25.03.2007	08:35			John Patterson
	0
823	4099	25.03.2007	10:18	122	7	Kenneth Walkden
945	4945	01.04.2007	08:32			Kenneth Walkden
	0
945		02.04.2007	11:27	1106	10	Adrian Lowes
2051		12.04.2007	09:00			Adrian Lowes
	0
2051		08.05.2007	16:28	541	7	John Brown
2592		15.05.2007	14:21			John Brown
	73					Unknown user
2665		17.05.2007	12:45	204	5	Fernando Vilela
2869		22.05.2007	11:23			Fernando Vilela
	0
2869		23.05.2007	09:00	210	3	Enawgaw Mengistae
3079		26.05.2007	09:00			Enawgaw Mengistae
Start Hire	35					Unknown user
3114		27.05.2007	12:30	0	5	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
3864		03.06.2007	12:30	750	3	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
3864		03.06.2007	12:30	0		Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
5864		03.07.2007	12:30	2000	27	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
5865		03.07.2007	12:30	1	3	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
		03.08.2007			29
Dogs Inspection	9329	6-7.08.2007	15:17	6215	6	PJ and Martin Grime	PJ HQ Portimao
5866		01.09.2007	12:30	1	26	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos
14443		23.09.2007	15:30	8577	23	Gerald McCann	AS Lagos

by **sharonl** 29.11.22 19:14

What happened to the hire of the vehicle by Michael Wright before the McCanns hired the car? Not, Cousin Michael Wright but the other Michael Wright (coincidence?) who had the car just before the reported disappearance?

by crusader 29.11.22 20:36

Michael George Wright was on holiday in Portugal with John Brown who hired the car.

Michael George Wright was named as additional driver.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MICHAEL_WRIGHT_1_MAY_08.htm

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