The truth about Tony Bennett and the two Harlow Credit Unions

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

I am sceptical about Dr Kate McCann's account that she left the table to do a check, in the dark, at about 10.00pm, that she found the shutters open and the window open and a wind blowing the curtains etc. etc., that she 'instantly' knew (though she's never said why) that Madeleine had been abducted, that she then spent several minutes looking in and around the apartment for Madeleine, and that only then did she run down to the 'Tapas bar' shouting 'They've taken her' or 'Madeleine's gone' or whatever she says she said, leaving the twins with no-one with them and the window left open.

Well, that's what she does say, isn't it?

Have I got any part of that wrong? - please let me know if I have.

I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

I have to say I have my doubts as well. Did she really tell the police she's left Tanner minding the twins?

badmanners wrote:

candyfloss wrote:

badmanners wrote:The PJ shut it down some time after their arrival, which was of course quite a while after the GNR.
But I would direct you to the thread where we were discussing Tanner and her Rogatory account of when PJ were told about her sighting.

At that point, everyone except Kate and another female were in the McCanns apartment, because that's where she told the police officer about what she had seen.
They had also all sat there writing out their 'timeline' of checks, with a PJ officer present.

Not so damn quick off the mark at clearing everyone out, were they hun? In fact they sat in there themselves.

Bit like locking the stable door after the horse had bolted eh? hun? Bit late after they had traipsed everywhere, and touched everything. And the reason they probably kept them all together was to take dna swabs to eliminate their dna.

That's a rather poor reply if I may say so.

If you arrive at a scene you fear may have been contaminated, what do you do?
Clear them all out, seal the place off, and call in forensics?

Or sit down with them all, call up another few people so you can take their statements, and generally faff about until a senior officer tells you to pull your bloody socks up?

What is so hard about admitting that these cops didn't have a clear idea what to do with the scene?
Especially when it is the ONE thing that Amaral admits the PJ did wrong!!

I agree if a Child goes missiing in the UK and the police arrive. Is the 1st thing they do treat the home as a crime sceen or question those that reported them missing. Someone with a bit of knowledge may know because I don't.

Nits

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

I am sceptical about Dr Kate McCann's account that she left the table to do a check, in the dark, at about 10.00pm, that she found the shutters open and the window open and a wind blowing the curtains etc. etc., that she 'instantly' knew (though she's never said why) that Madeleine had been abducted, that she then spent several minutes looking in and around the apartment for Madeleine, and that only then did she run down to the 'Tapas bar' shouting 'They've taken her' or 'Madeleine's gone' or whatever she says she said, leaving the twins with no-one with them and the window left open.

Well, that's what she does say, isn't it?

Have I got any part of that wrong? - please let me know if I have.

I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

Well I cant find anything in the files that says she closed that window when she went to the tapas.
Why do you find that account hard to believe?
I always thought that quite plausible due to the sheer panic one would feel upon discovering that your child was missing.

And no she did not leave the twins with Jane Tanner. Why would she do that?

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

I am sceptical about Dr Kate McCann's account that she left the table to do a check, in the dark, at about 10.00pm, that she found the shutters open and the window open and a wind blowing the curtains etc. etc., that she 'instantly' knew (though she's never said why) that Madeleine had been abducted, that she then spent several minutes looking in and around the apartment for Madeleine, and that only then did she run down to the 'Tapas bar' shouting 'They've taken her' or 'Madeleine's gone' or whatever she says she said, leaving the twins with no-one with them and the window left open.

Well, that's what she does say, isn't it?

Have I got any part of that wrong? - please let me know if I have.

I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

Well I cant find anything in the files that says she closed that window when she went to the tapas.
Why do you find that account hard to believe?
I always thought that quite plausible due to the sheer panic one would feel upon discovering that your child was missing.

And no she did not leave the twins with Jane Tanner. Why would she do that?

It sounds like you have a great deal of knowledge about the case.

Where exactly was Jane Tanner when Kate says she found Madeleine missing?

Tony Bennett wrote:I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

I don't suppose many people are really interested in what you find hard to accept and what you don't.

Speak for yourself.

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

I am sceptical about Dr Kate McCann's account that she left the table to do a check, in the dark, at about 10.00pm, that she found the shutters open and the window open and a wind blowing the curtains etc. etc., that she 'instantly' knew (though she's never said why) that Madeleine had been abducted, that she then spent several minutes looking in and around the apartment for Madeleine, and that only then did she run down to the 'Tapas bar' shouting 'They've taken her' or 'Madeleine's gone' or whatever she says she said, leaving the twins with no-one with them and the window left open.

Well, that's what she does say, isn't it?

Have I got any part of that wrong? - please let me know if I have.

I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

Well I cant find anything in the files that says she closed that window when she went to the tapas.
Why do you find that account hard to believe?
I always thought that quite plausible due to the sheer panic one would feel upon discovering that your child was missing.

And no she did not leave the twins with Jane Tanner. Why would she do that?

It sounds like you have a great deal of knowledge about the case.

Where exactly was Jane Tanner when Kate says she found Madeleine missing?

In her apartment.
Oh and by the way, I think you should maybe re read the files but this time read them all the way through. Look what I found
As for my knowledge of the case. Well, I read the files and have done since they were released. I dont think it is good practice to just cherry pick parts to fit theories. You need to read them in context of times.

JERONIMO RODRIGUES SALCEDAS
I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant.

I ran out of the Tapas and noticed that some of the childcare works of the Mark Warner had begun to arrive. At the point I left the Tapas I heard a scream from a woman I did not know. I do not know who screamed, but I had never heard a similar cry. I cannot even describe it but thought it had come from the child’s mother. I went to the reception with one of the child care workers whose name I do not remember. One of the employees looked to be organizing the searches and told us the name of the child. We were sent to the beach zone and looked in all the alleys and called out the name of the child but did not find her. Later, we returned to the Tapas where we found John, the Manager of Mark Warner. There were many people now, perhaps 40 including the Mark Warner personnel. We were divided into groups and Ewan and Rob (both employed by Mark Warner), my cousin, Miguel, and I went in a Mark Warner vehicle to search a beach zone which included a construction site. Again, we did not see any signs of the child and after a telephone we returned to the Tapas.

Ricardo Alexandre da Luz Oliveira

Date: 2007.09.07



The witness went to them, he does not remember which one, and asked what was happening. One of them responded to the witness in English stating “GIRL IS MISSING”—that a child had gone missing. After a few moments, around 5 or 10 minutes, he heard screaming from the apartment zone and saw a woman on the balcony of 5 A. He did not understand what she was saying. As it was night, and given the distance from the Tapas bar to the apartment, he was not able to determine if there was someone else next to the woman on the balcony. At that moment his colleague, Joe, met up with him and asked the witness to call the police, and that a child has gone missing and could not be found. Immediately afterwards, Joe left toward the street. He does not know who gave this information to Joe but the witness (or his colleague who believes the witness did so) called the reception asking them to inform the police

-----------------------------------------------------------
So both statements are confirming this scream was after everyone had started searching and the woman on the balcony with Kate would have been one of the friends AFTER the alarm was raised.

Looks like he got it wrong yet again....he should learn how to read

Actually, the witness says he couldn't determine if there was anythone else on the balcony anyway. So it seems that another person on the balcony is unlikely but a possibility. Doesn't make any difference though as it was after the alarm was raised and as Tony himself has pointed out, there were many people in and out of 5a that night

littlepixie wrote:Speak for yourself.

That's okay. It's just a good thing to question someones theories when there is nothing to back them up in the files...no?

I'm sure you would do that.....wouldn't you?

Blindly accepting something someone posts without anything to back it up is not the best way to go IMO.

The fact that the files are out there for everyone to read and people are still throwing about incorrect info like this, well its just plain shoddiness

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

I am sceptical about Dr Kate McCann's account that she left the table to do a check, in the dark, at about 10.00pm, that she found the shutters open and the window open and a wind blowing the curtains etc. etc., that she 'instantly' knew (though she's never said why) that Madeleine had been abducted, that she then spent several minutes looking in and around the apartment for Madeleine, and that only then did she run down to the 'Tapas bar' shouting 'They've taken her' or 'Madeleine's gone' or whatever she says she said, leaving the twins with no-one with them and the window left open.

Well, that's what she does say, isn't it?

Have I got any part of that wrong? - please let me know if I have.

I hope it's not libellous to say it, but I find that account very hard to accept.

Well I cant find anything in the files that says she closed that window when she went to the tapas.
Why do you find that account hard to believe?
I always thought that quite plausible due to the sheer panic one would feel upon discovering that your child was missing.

And no she did not leave the twins with Jane Tanner. Why would she do that?

It sounds like you have a great deal of knowledge about the case.

Where exactly was Jane Tanner when Kate says she found Madeleine missing?

In her room, wasn't she?

Look Tony, you posted up here that a woman, almost certainly Tanner, was with kate on the balcony before the alarm was raised, and that Tanner then stayed with the twins while kate went back to the restaurant. What's more you cited a witness.

But it turns out that the witness saw no such thing and I'm perplexed as to how you made the reading of it that you did.

This is serious stuff, it isn't a game and people's police statememnts are not there to be mucked about with and misinterpreted willy nilly.

I seem to remember, a long time ago, a thread on the 3 arguidos, about Jane Tanner being in the next apartment, when Madeleine was found missing. There was a heated discussion re why hadn't Kate popped next door to see if Madeleine had been crying etc., and Jane had taken her next door. I don't know where this came from, must have been in a newspaper article, I have googled, but can't find it, perhpas it's been pulled, like so many others. Does anyone else remember this?

Yes I recall that. I think it was mostly forum conjecture. I don't remember it being in the papers.

That was a huge help wasn't it.

vaguely wrote:Yes I recall that. I think it was mostly forum conjecture. I don't remember it being in the papers.

That was a huge help wasn't it.

I've found it :yahoo: Jane Tanner was next door!!

BILTON: According to the McCann timeline, at about 9.30 Matt Oldfield is the next to check on the children. Remember Gerry McCann says he had closed the bedroom door, but Matt Oldfield says he finds it open. He doesn't go in the room, he sees the twins but can't see Madeleine's bed. Because there's no noise he assumes everything is okay. At about 10 it's Kate McCann's turn to check on the children. The bedroom door is still open. As she closes it she feels a draft and knows something is wrong. A shutter on the side of the apartment they couldn't see from the tapas bar is open. Madeleine is missing. Kate McCann says she searches the flat three times before raising the alarm. Jane Tanner says that by this time she is already back in her apartment.

JANE: I went out to the front door of our apartment and then I saw Rachael came and said: "Oh Madeleine's gone!" So that was the first that I heard about it. And then I saw Kate and Fiona running around shouting 'Madeleine' and Kate said to me: "Jane, Madeleine's gone! Madeleine's gone!" and that was the first that I heard.

BILTON: What time was it about?

JANE: I'm not sure, it'd be ten'ish, around ten'ish.

Quoted from the PANORAMA programme, Transcript The Mystery of Madeleine McCann

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/panorama/7106086.stm


This is from Jane's own mouth, was this in the files or interviews, if not why not?

What she's telling is in the files in Tanner's statement.
But it wasn't her who was next door, it was Oldfield.

DAVID ANTHONY PAYNE – apartment 5H (first floor)
FIONA ELAINE PAYNE
DIANNE WEBSTER
RUSSEL JAMES O’BRIEN – apartment 5D
JANE MICHELLE TANNER
MATTHEW DAVID OLDFIELD – apartment 5B
RACHAEL MARIAMMA (sic) JEAN MANPILLY
GERALD PATRICK McCANN – apartment 5A
KATE MARIE HEALY

http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/PJ_Report_English_Translation.pdf



Another link http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/AG/Extras_do_livro_Page_3.jpg

this is what I thought. That the issue about her being in the next door apartment was forum myth.

She wasnt next door she was further up to the left as you look at that picture.

What difference does it make anyway? The witness said he wasnt sure there was someone else on the balcony and it was also after the alarm was raised and the front door is at the back, the balcony at the front (again looking at that picture)...its all irrelevant as what Tony posted is totally wrong.

Interesting. I see Tony posting on the snowed in thread yet he is not posting on this one anymore. Wonder why?

I am Very Confused. This is The First I've Heard of A Scream Coming, Gerry Searching before Kate Raised the Alarm, Tanner Being Next Door, Tanner Being on the Balcony. And yet Everyone Thinks the Files Say One Thing and Others Say the Other. It Seems Clear from Tanner's Statement That She wasn't Next Door. And the Witness in the Files if that was the Proper File Posted and it Wasn't Edit, Came After the Alarm Had Been Raised

I Would Recommend Not Getting too Hung Up on Exact Timing -- it's Clear it is All Estimated.

What Goal does This Go to? Can Any of the Antis (Maybe Not Tony Because of His Legal Gag) Explain? Showing that Madeleine Died before May 3rd? Or That Murat Was Involved? Or that it Was Planned?

[quote="flytrap"]
JERONIMO RODRIGUES SALCEDAS
I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant.

I ran out of the Tapas and noticed that some of the childcare works of the Mark Warner had begun to arrive. At the point I left the Tapas I heard a scream from a woman I did not know. I do not know who screamed, but I had never heard a similar cry. I cannot even describe it but thought it had come from the child’s mother. I went to the reception with one of the child care workers whose name I do not remember. One of the employees looked to be organizing the searches and told us the name of the child. We were sent to the beach zone and looked in all the alleys and called out the name of the child but did not find her. Later, we returned to the Tapas where we found John, the Manager of Mark Warner. There were many people now, perhaps 40 including the Mark Warner personnel. We were divided into groups and Ewan and Rob (both employed by Mark Warner), my cousin, Miguel, and I went in a Mark Warner vehicle to search a beach zone which included a construction site. Again, we did not see any signs of the child and after a telephone we returned to the Tapas.

Ricardo Alexandre da Luz Oliveira

Date: 2007.09.07



The witness went to them, he does not remember which one, and asked what was happening. One of them responded to the witness in English stating “GIRL IS MISSING”—that a child had gone missing. After a few moments, around 5 or 10 minutes, he heard screaming from the apartment zone and saw a woman on the balcony of 5 A. He did not understand what she was saying. As it was night, and given the distance from the Tapas bar to the apartment, he was not able to determine if there was someone else next to the woman on the balcony. At that moment his colleague, Joe, met up with him and asked the witness to call the police, and that a child has gone missing and could not be found. Immediately afterwards, Joe left toward the street. He does not know who gave this information to Joe but the witness (or his colleague who believes the witness did so) called the reception asking them to inform the police

-----------------------------------------------------------

I Noticed From this Statement That the Witness, A Portuguese Employee, Felt Compelled To State that He'd Never Heard Such a Similar Cry -- Clearly the Cry Greatly Upset Him.

This Seems to Suggest that A Theory About Accidental Death Or an Accident is More Likely -- Makes the Grieving Real.

flytrap wrote:

Tony Bennett wrote:

sunshine wrote:So if Jane Tanner was left minding the twins why has so much been made of Kate leaving the twins alone with an abductor on the loose?

Er, simply because that's what she's told the police and all and sundry that that's exactly what she did do.

I have to say I have my doubts

Are you saying that you think the McCanns were not guilty of neglect regarding leaving the twins alone when she went back to the Tapas?

It Seems a Bit Silly to Think that They Were Capable of Hiding Madeleine's Death or Killing Her to Cover Up Something More Sinister As Has Been Suggested by Posters About Murat, but Were So Concerned About the Twins' Welfare While Putting the Fake Plan into Place that Tanner Had to Watch Them.