Re: ***'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016*** (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

by sallypelt 24.07.17 11:00

Traces of human blood have reportedly been found on a toy car and sandal believed to have belonged to toddler Ben Needham, who disappeared on Kos 26 years ago.
Kerry Needham said the discovery is evidence of a cover-up in the disappearance of her son, who was staying at his grandparents’ farmhouse on the Greek island.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ben-needham-human-blood-found-on-missing-toddlers-toy-and-sandal_uk_5975a494e4b0e79ec19a4f83

Sorry to sound pedantic, but I can't see it stated anywhere in the Media, that it "may have been blood", but I am always ready to learn, and if you can provide the link where it says "may be blood" I would very much appreciate it. But my first post WAS from the BBC and it states "signs of blood". I take that to mean that they are sure that it is blood, but it needs to be tested for DNA

by plebgate 24.07.17 11:22

The newspaper report is very confusing to me. Will wait to see if and when the police confirm who the blood belonged to.

by sallypelt 24.07.17 11:50

BlueBag wrote:Latest:

Ben Needham: Blood found on items in hunt for toddler

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-40684276

"It's my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory."

I'm not buying it.

They have no evidence but they are twisting what they have got, looking it through squinty eyes and saying it confirms the theory.

Read the article and you'll see the BBC headline isn't true.

Bluebag, is this the quote you are referring to?

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe, that unfortunately and tragically Ben died as a result of an incident at that farmhouse. It’s my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory"

From my interpretation, I don't believe that Jon Cousins is saying that what has been found is not evidence, but he's putting more weight on the intelligence. The "signs of blood" will have to be forensically tested, but why it has taken all this time is open to question.

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jul/24/ben-needham-blood-found-on-toy-car-and-sandal

by sallypelt 24.07.17 11:55

"Professor Lorna Dawson, of the James Hutton institute in Aberdeen, has been working with South Yorkshire Police.

She told the Daily Mirror a specialist police dog used in the hunt for bodies had reacted to the sandal and biologists were trying to extract DNA from both items to compare with Ben’s profile"

End quote

I now believe, that this is the beginning of the end for this sad case. I hope it is game, set and match, as I would love to see closure for the Needham family.

by sallypelt 24.07.17 12:01

Admin, please feel free to merge these two Ben Needham threads. It will make for easier reading and comments.

Threads merged

Mod.

by Verdi 24.07.17 12:01

Pull the other one!

by sallypelt 24.07.17 12:02

Verdi wrote:Pull the other one!

Huh!!

by Guest 24.07.17 13:47

sallypelt wrote:
BlueBag wrote:Latest:

Ben Needham: Blood found on items in hunt for toddler

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-40684276

"It's my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory."

I'm not buying it.

They have no evidence but they are twisting what they have got, looking it through squinty eyes and saying it confirms the theory.

Read the article and you'll see the BBC headline isn't true.
Bluebag, is this the quote you are referring to?

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe, that unfortunately and tragically Ben died as a result of an incident at that farmhouse. It’s my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory"

From my interpretation, I don't believe that Jon Cousins is saying that what has been found is not evidence, but he's putting more weight on the intelligence. The "signs of blood" will have to be forensically tested, but why it has taken all this time is open to question.

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jul/24/ben-needham-blood-found-on-toy-car-and-sandal

It's evidence or it isn't.

It plainly isn't.

It's something that can be twisted to support a theory and put this all to bed.

Anyway, I thought the items they found were not identified as Ben's.

by sallypelt 24.07.17 13:52

BlueBag wrote:
sallypelt wrote:
BlueBag wrote:Latest:

Ben Needham: Blood found on items in hunt for toddler

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-40684276

"It's my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory."

I'm not buying it.

They have no evidence but they are twisting what they have got, looking it through squinty eyes and saying it confirms the theory.

Read the article and you'll see the BBC headline isn't true.
Bluebag, is this the quote you are referring to?

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe, that unfortunately and tragically Ben died as a result of an incident at that farmhouse. It’s my belief that [the findings] corroborate and strengthen that theory"

From my interpretation, I don't believe that Jon Cousins is saying that what has been found is not evidence, but he's putting more weight on the intelligence. The "signs of blood" will have to be forensically tested, but why it has taken all this time is open to question.

"DI Jon Cousins added: “It’s not evidence, it’s intelligence which supports what we believe

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jul/24/ben-needham-blood-found-on-toy-car-and-sandal

It's evidence or it isn't.

It plainly isn't.

It's something that can be twisted to support a theory and put this all to bed.

Anyway, I thought the items they found were not identified as Ben's.

He's not saying what they have found is NOT evidence. What JC is saying it is NOT the evidence that they have found that tells them that Ben is dead, but the INTELLIGENCE that they had BEFORE they started to dig and look for the evidence.

by Guest 24.07.17 14:25

"He's not saying what they have found is NOT evidence"

Er... yes he is.

Evidence would support their theory best of all.

What they found is of less value than hearsay.

by sallypelt 24.07.17 14:42

Oh dear! This is the last time I am going to respond to this post.
He is NOT saying that it is NOT evidence, period. He is saying it is NOT [the] evidence] [BUT] it is the intelligence. If he said it is "not evidence" and then ended the sentence there, then it would have a different meaning, BUT, he continued with "it's the intelligence".

by Guest 24.07.17 14:53

If the "evidence" was any good then it would trump all.

It's worthless.

by willowthewisp 24.07.17 15:10

sallypelt wrote:Oh dear! This is the last time I am going to respond to this post.
He is NOT saying that it is NOT evidence, period. He is saying it is NOT [the] evidence] [BUT] it is the intelligence. If he said it is "not evidence" and then ended the sentence there, then it would have a different meaning, BUT, he continued with "it's the intelligence".

Forgive me if I am wrong,but wasn't little Ben Needham "Bare Footed"playing in and around the Farm house on the day of his disappearance enjoying his feet being doused with water?
Yet the Police are stating the items were found in 2012 and have undergone these"Forensic Tests"four or five years later,are the public being led down another"Mysterious Route"where it is of No Evidence found to conclude what has happened but now based on an"Intelligence" of what the South Yorkshire Police are basing their theory as to what has happened to Ben Needham!?
Much like Madeleine McCann's disappearance,but where the Metropolitan Police Service never mention Martin Grimes Police dogs,Eddie,Keela?
Now wonder with all the progress made in the"Forensic World"why haven't Scotland Yard re-investigated the DNA from the Rothley pillow to the Results from the evidence collected from a certain Renault MPV,15;19 markers?
Also note how Kerry Needham has chosen to use the word,conspiracy,that her Son's body(Ben)may have been moved from where any "Accident"may have occurred?
Mark Rowley come in please,wish to air any new evidence on Operation Grange,farce?

by Verdi 24.07.17 15:33

willowthewisp wrote:
Also note how Kerry Needham has chosen to use the word,conspiracy,that her Son's body(Ben)may have been moved from where any "Accident"may have occurred?
Mark Rowley come in please,wish to air any new evidence on Operation Grange,farce?

Only a matter of time before the 'McCann effect' globally kicks-in big time.

Quote..

> > Ben’s body has never been found although other items – thought to be a toy car and sandal belonging to the 21-month-old – are being tested for his DNA after being recovered previously.

Scientists said on Monday they had found human blood samples on the items but that further testing was required to link them directly to Ben.
The sandal was reportedly found in 2012 at the site where Konstantinos “Dino” Barkas was operating a digger, while the car was discovered last year at another spot.

Barkas is believed to have died from stomach cancer in 2015. < <

Still the implication is that 'Dino' Barkas is in some way responsible for Ben Needham's presumed death, without a scrap of evidence or intelligence to support the theory. Just like the dead tractor driver in Portugal - the focus of Operation Grange. If in doubt blame a dead person - they can't speak for themselves any more than the victims can !!!

by Phoebe 24.07.17 17:50

I hope the mystery of Ben's disappearance gets solved but something about these latest developments jars. Snipped from Textusa -

From Kerry's Book "Ben" : PG 84

"It was a blissful afternoon. Those who wanted the sun sat in it and those who didn’t sat in the shade of the trees. And it was so peaceful. Earlier in the day there had been a digger truck transporting rubble from a building renovation at the bottom of the lane to the top. The driver had to pass the farmhouse to dump the hardcore ready to be used to improve the dirt track before driving back down again, kicking up a trail of dust with it’s heavy wheels as it went. But now building work had stopped there for the day, and they were able to eat undisturbed."

If the digger had stopped for the day before Ben disappeared how could it have accidentally struck him? What happened to Ben's blue shorts which disappeared off the tree branch on which they had been hung to dry? It's unlikely that, in the event of his being run over, the driver would come up to the house to collect these off the tree.

by Doug D 24.07.17 19:50

Why has it taken TEN MONTHS to come up with this latest nonsense?

by Doug D 24.07.17 20:09

Sorry my mistake. Not ten months, but 5 years!

‘Mr Cousins revealed that one line of inquiry they are focusing on is the sandals Ben was wearing on the day he disappeared. And he disclosed that part of a sandal was found during their initial excavations back in 2012. Experts are now determining if that segment has any connection to Ben’

They made the replica sandals last year, but had found the sandal remnants back in 2012.

No mention of any sandal bits recovered from last years dig.

by Guest 25.07.17 7:01

But where did they find the sandals in 2012?

None of this is making sense unless they what to put this to bed without people looking too closely.

I say again, they didn't find blood as the media keeps saying. They found what could have been blood "a chemical fingerprint" (and therefore obviously could have been something else).

"It's not evidence...".

by Guest 25.07.17 7:16

2012 news:

Diggers draw a blank in hunt for Ben Needham as police team finish operation on Greek island of Kos

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2223601/Still-sign-Ben-Needham-police-team-finish-digging-operation-Greek-island-Kos.html

No mention of scraps of leather and the car wasn't definitely Ben's back then.

Doesn't say where they found anything.

by Guest 25.07.17 7:22

2016 news:

Ben Needham's toy car discovered at secret fly-tipping dump just hours before cops called off Kos search

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ben-needhams-toy-car-discovered-9066437

Anyone else confused by the car?

Was it 2012 or 2016?

by Guest 25.07.17 7:55

The Mercedes "88 Lucky Star" toy car was manufactured in 1968.

688 MERCEDES-BENZ (200 SERIES) (1968) YELLOW LUCKY STAR #88

http://www.planetdiecast.com/index.php?option=com_myblog&show=the-return-of-summer-sm-summer-metal-list.html&Itemid=2435

I would be very surprised if Ben had been bought a vintage toy.

by Doug D 25.07.17 9:07

Bluebag:

But where did they find the sandals in 2012?

2012 dig was the bank alongside the road in the ‘garden’ of the property being renovated, opposite the old woman’s house, so I think we have to assume it was found there, but who really knows? I thought it was reported as a buckle at the time, so it could have just been lying on the ground anywhere and somebody picked it up.

The car was miraculously reported as being found right at the last knockings of the 2016 dig on the fly-tipping triangle, by the dodgy bend in the road.

by Guest 25.07.17 9:09

More 2012 news:

Hunt for Ben Needham: Police dig up bits of children's toys in mound near where Ben was seen last

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/ben-needham-dig-police-find-1393687

Det Supt Matt Fenwick, who is leading the 20-strong British team, said: “Bits of toys have been found, but we do not yet know if they are his.

Toys?

More than one?

by Guest 25.07.17 9:28

I get the feeling that if we had full access to the details of what we are being told the theory would crumble very quickly.

"Bits of toys"?

That's a quote from the dig team leader.

by MayMuse 25.07.17 11:07

sallypelt wrote:"Professor Lorna Dawson, of the James Hutton institute in Aberdeen, has been working with South Yorkshire Police.

She told the Daily Mirror a specialist police dog used in the hunt for bodies had reacted to the sandal and biologists were trying to extract DNA from both items to compare with Ben’s profile"

End quote

I now believe, that this is the beginning of the end for this sad case. I hope it is game, set and match, as I would love to see closure for the Needham family.

Oh those pesky dogs ... "specialist police dog reacted to the sandal" this sandal was found on the farmhouse dig back in 2012 and now they find "blood" which they are still testing?

Dogs ... intelligence... reacting to signs of decomposition; in other words a corpse?

Signs of blood found on part of sandal AND on soil inside toy car.....

Nice to see focus and priority ( not) on these items which are now being forensically tested a number of years later to see if a DNA match to Ben.

Family now believe Ben dead and a conspiracy of cover up that he was moved after death?

When and where did Ben die and who moved him? because the digger driver was no where near the farmhouse (according to Kerry in her book) when Bens grandparents had lunch and he was playing just outside the farmhouse barefoot and fancy free with his wet shorts hanging on a tree branch to dry in the heat of the sun...before both disappeared in a matter of minutes complete with toy car and sandals?

Sandal ( parts of as remember they were reconstructed) found buried in earth at the farmhouse in dig?
Sandal which was never found in immediate search of area by the family which I'm assuming would be a prominent item if it had been left behind at the time of Bens disappearance ( i.e. Above ground)

No bones at dig site where parts of sandal found other than "specialist dog alert".... so who " buried" the sandal at the farmhouse?

No bones or signs of decayed corpse at dig site where toy car found!

A "conspiracy" of a child's dead body being moved to cover up an "accident"????????

By whom?

The investigation of Bens disappearance has turned into a Mccannesque media mayhem trying to convince the public IMO!

bignono

'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Kos digs,forensic tests?

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

Re: 'Kos dig' starts 26 Sep 2016 (was: Kerry Needham 'prepared for worst' by investigators)

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