Re: If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week?

by Verdi 09.06.22 17:09

Sorry this is a mess - gremlin attack.

I'll try to make more sense in due course ....

by crusader 09.06.22 17:51

Graham McKenzie said in his statement, he heard Gerry speaking to someone on his mobile, he was saying Madeleine had been taken by paedophiles.

This he said was an hour into the search,11pm.

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GRAHAM-MCKENZIE.htm

by sandancer 09.06.22 23:23

" They gave no indication that they thought she'd been snatched , let alone by a paedophile "

Really Mr Woolfall ?

how about - " they've taken her "
Phoning all and sundry spreading the lie of " jemmied broken shutters " , open window someone has broken in and gone past the twins and taken her "

To Yvonne Martin - " a couple have taken her "

" their assumption was she'd wandered off "

But Kate said she knew KNEW , Madeleine had been taken ! Though she never did tell us how she KNEW !

" I know what happened wasn't due to us leaving them sleeping , I know it happened under other circumstances "

did she ever tell you what those " other circumstances " were ?

by Verdi 10.06.22 1:17

This is the crux, somehow it disappeared when trying to fathom the complete mystery of no holiday photographs. Alex Woolfall was looking for photographs of Madeleine for release to the media, can't imagine why considering family friend Jon Corner had already taken the initiative - allegedly.

Anyway, on with the motley

08-Outros Processos Vol VIII Page 549
NUIPC 201/07.0 GALGS

Visualisation and Analysis of Photographs

On this date, I state that the photographs contained on a CD delivered to this police force by Gerald McCann have been visualised and analysed, some of them are from the holiday period that the McCann family spent at the Ocean Club in PdL, beginning on the 28th April 2007.

The visualisation and analysis of these images that was carried out reveals that there are several photographs of interest to the investigation, in which it is possible to visualise Madeleine McCann.

Portimao, 09 May 2007

Signed by

Inspector Ricardo Paiva

Outros Processos Vol VIII

Page 550

NUIPC 201/07.0 GALGS

Visualisation and Analysis of Photographs

On this date, I state that the photographs contained on a CD delivered to this police force by Michael Wright, a relation of the McCann couple, relating to the holiday period that the McCann family spent at the Ocean Club in PdL, beginning on the 28th April 2007.

The visualisation and analysis of these images that was carried out reveals that there are several photographs of interest to the investigation, in which it is possible to visualise Madeleine McCann, as well as different adults and children that made up the group of friends who were on holiday together with the McCann couple in PdL, which is why these photographs, joined to the report, were printed.

Portimao, 09 May 2007

Signed by

Inspector Ricardo Paiva

Outros Apensos Vol VIII

Page 553

Service Information

08 ? 05 ? 2007

To: The Coordinator of the Criminal Investigation

From: Hugo Ferreira, Inspector

Subject: Annexing of photographic stills to the process files

I am pleased to inform you that today we were given photographic stills taken during the holiday period in Portugal from 28th April by the English families that compose the group that Madeleine Beth was with, so that they can be annexed to the process files.

Inspector Hugo Ferreira
http://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/HOLIDAY-PHOTOS-LIST.htm

by Verdi 16.07.22 2:03

So essentially why are we here, do I remember rightly .... The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann?

Prime Ministers come and go; cabinet ministers come and go; police officers come and go; witnesses come and go; prime suspects come and go - well almost; forum members come and go.

The only thing that doesn't come and go is the memory of Madeleine McCann, that will never fade even if interest in the case dissipates.

So essentially why are we here if not to continue that legacy to a voice that will never be heard, the voice of a three year old little girl who was so badly let down by her family and the British establishment. The establishment whose only concern appears to be concealing all their wrong doings, the rot that festers behind the scenes, the scandals that can never be allowed to see daylight.

Let's get back down to business .... where is the evidence that a living Madeleine McCann was seen after the photographic evidence taken at the Ocean Club playground on Saturday 28th/Sunday 29th April 2007?

Why the vacuous period of time documented between Saturday 28th April and Tuesday 1st May 2007.

That is where the answers lie, not in the window dressing propagated by team McCann since 3rd May 2007 right up to present day.

https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t17250-if-madeleine-mccann-died-on-sunday-29-april-what-was-really-going-on-behind-the-scenes-that-week#448992

by crusader 16.07.22 8:37

Let's get back down to business .... where is the evidence that a living Madeleine McCann was seen after the photographic evidence taken at the Ocean Club playground on Sunday 29th April 2007?

Snipped from above ^^^^

There is no photographic evidence that Madeleine was alive after 29th APRIL [admin].

There are people who say they saw her on 3rd May but they could be mistaken.

We can never move forward from this point unless it can be proved beyond a shadow of doubt Madeleine was alive after 29th April.

Whether she was alive or not on 3rd May, I believe she was removed from 5a on this night.

by CaKeLoveR 16.07.22 8:49

According to one witness, the little girls were 'all blond and pretty'; they probably favoured pinkish clothes, and would be difficult to identify. So those who say they saw Madeleine on May 3rd could, understandably, be mistaken. Also, would the 'nannies' be in the habit of taking photos of the children during the day, to send to their parents, as they do in some pre-schools?

by crusader 16.07.22 9:31

Cakelover wrote..
Also, would the 'nannies' be in the habit of taking photos of the children during the day, to send to their parents, as they do in some pre-schools?

You would think so, but to date, none have been seen, well not as far as we know.

I would think the Mccann's would have taken some of Madeleine and the twins at their creche to show the doting Grandparents what a great time they were having.

by Verdi 16.07.22 13:40

crusader wrote:Whether she was alive or not on 3rd May, I believe she was removed from 5a on this night.

Eddie the EVRD alerted to the scent of death in apartment 5a Ocean Club, inconclusive maybe but nonetheless evidence in it's own right - a very strong indication that Madeleine McCann had died, or a corpse had been place in the apartment. Strong evidence that the scent detected was indeed the corpse of Madeleine McCann, supported by many other indicatives.

It would be very risky, I venture to suggest foolhardy, to store a dead body in a relatively hot apartment. The stench of a dead body is unforgettable, not something that can be disguised in any way nor contained.

The only explanation therefore could be a sick Madeleine prior to death, a scenario also very risky to cover-up for so many reasons.

It's my belief the alarm was raised late on the night of Thursday 3rd May 2007 for good reason, nothing whatsoever to do with when or where or why Madeleine had met her fate.

Firstly, it gave the opportunity for the group to clean-up so to speak, not forensically clean-up but to clean-up their act -literally! The ideal time would be only hours before their scheduled departure from the Ocean Club - just imagine the confusion caused, fellow holidaymakers, the Ocean Club staff and above all else .... the police!

Under the circumstances, what group would prioritize drawing a time line, two versions?

Five'ish days would allow plenty of time to 'prepare' the eventual alert - the inclusion of the police. The police they later so diligently tried to discredit and shame when matters strated to point in the wrong direction !?!

No, 'we can never move forward from this point unless it can be proved beyond a shadow of doubt Madeleine was alive after 29th April.'

Well 'we' can't do that but what we can do is highlight all the apparent documented discrepancies and keep poking the porkers who continue to treat the case as 'an abduction' and/or 'missing person'. Exactly what we have been doing for the past thirteen years +.

Hence my bringing this thread back into focus.

by **Jill Havern** 16.07.22 15:28

Verdi wrote:
It would be very risky, I venture to suggest foolhardy, to store a dead body in a relatively hot apartment. The stench of a dead body is unforgettable, not something that can be disguised in any way nor contained.

Absolutely it's unforgettable.

I don't believe Madeleine's body was in the apartment until the 3rd - the stench would have been awful and there would have been no need to bring in the dogs to determine if there had been a cadaver in there. The police would have known immediately.

I believe Maddie was already in a freezer well before then.

by **PeterMac** 16.07.22 15:43

IF Madeleine had been alive and well all week, with what would we expect to have been presented ?
*. Photos and videos. Lots of them. Including sailing, playing tennis, swimming, going into and from the Creche, posed smiling with her nannies, posed smiling with the other children of similar age in the Tapas group, mucking about on the beach, just sitting on the sofa in the apartment, and especially having something to eat.
*. Photos of, or the actual craft work from the creche, the lobster picture, the spaceship, the Happy Handprint stars, the salt dough rockets, the postcards, the planets, moon pictures, the funky footprints, the space pictures
*. Photos of them all at high tea, having ice creams, walking along or on daddy's shoulders, and even of them all in bed or having the sing-song bouncing up and down on Madeleine's bed.

Remember that the McCanns had a relatively top-of-the-range camera.
The Canon Powershot A620 was capable of taking hundreds of photos and a lot of video

We would also expect
* Photos of Madeleine taken by other parents as she played with their children.

But we get - - - nothing

Just the Play Area photos taken on Saturday 28th around 5pm
and the Pool Photo taken on Sunday 29th at lunchtime
Not for nothing did Kate describe it as the LAST photo

And if it had actually been taken on Thursday 3rd, where are all the photo from the intervening days ?
Answer: There aren't any, because it wasn't.

Incidentally with a digital camera, unless one is highly skilled at framing and construction and everything goes perfectly, it is very usual to take several versions of the same photo.
Where are the other versions of the Pool Photo ?

by **PeterMac** 16.07.22 15:50

Verdi wrote:

It's my belief the alarm was raised late on the night of Thursday 3rd May 2007 for good reason, nothing whatsoever to do with when or where or why Madeleine had met her fate.

Firstly, it gave the opportunity for the group to clean-up so to speak, not forensically clean-up but to clean-up their act -literally! The ideal time would be only hours before their scheduled departure from the Ocean Club - just imagine the confusion caused, fellow holidaymakers, the Ocean Club staff and above all else .... the police!

Thursday evening was perfect because it gave the PJ the whole of Friday to interview them before letting them go home.
Had it been the Friday evening the PJ would have been justified in trying to prevent their leaving on Saturday morning.
Any earlier and the PJ would have been able to go back and re-interview one or two when the discrepancies became obvious
concentrating on whichever they thought was the weakest.

by crusader 16.07.22 15:55

I Meant to say whether she was alive or not before the the 3rd May.

I still think she died on Thursday and her body was removed that same night.

I agree Madeleine was not kept in the apartment for long after her death.

As I think she died on the Thursday, I can't agree she was ever in a freezer.

by Silentscope 16.07.22 16:30

Verdi wrote:
It's my belief the alarm was raised late on the night of Thursday 3rd May 2007 for good reason, nothing whatsoever to do with when or where or why Madeleine had met her fate.

Silentscope:
The good reasons being.

1. The Tapas Bar was to be used for a Tennis Club meeting on Friday.
2. The U.K. Polls were due to close at 22:00 on Thursday night.
3. If any U.K. Politicians were informed of what happened early on in the week, they would not want the Public distracted from Electioneering by the disappearance of a Child abroad.

I think that they already knew that a big Story was about to come out.
Which is why those calls were whooshed.

by Verdi 16.07.22 17:27

The absence of Madeleine and twins photographs and video footage - the most compelling evidence asides from forensics.

It's also been highlighted in the past, the strange movements of the dastardly duo during the week - in their own words and documented for posterity. Leaving the apartment separately by different doors, taking different concealed routes from A to B, dropping the kids off at day care separately, making their own arrangements for breakfast and lunch, never seen together as a family of five - two adults and three very young dependent children taking a family holiday.

Little snippets of information drip dripped over the ensuing days, weeks and months - even years.

It's all there - documented as I say for posterity.

Not forgetting the neglected video footage of Madeleine boarding the aircraft at Midlands airport on Saturday 28th April 2007 and later on the airport transit bus - taken by David Payne if I remember rightly.

by Silentscope 16.07.22 17:39

Not one Holidaymaker OUTSIDE of the Tapas group has produced any Photo during that week.

The Worlds greatest missing Person enquiry, and not one Holidaymaker in PDL captured Madeleine at the OC, the Beach, or anywhere else she was supposed to have been?

Ludicrous?

by **Tony Bennett** 16.07.22 22:59

Looking back at the information we have in the PJ files, the first indication that something was badly amiss was the strange and apparently sudden decision on Sunday evening to change to demanding that the Tapas restaurant be booked for the rest of the week. Even the Ocean Club receptionist couldn't figure out why this was necessary or desirable.

One question we've never really delved into on the forum is whether, if something deadly happened to Madeleine earlier that Sunday, the twins were present when 'it' happened.

I personally doubt it, because I don't think the twins were aware of what actually happened to Madeleine.

Remember Amelie, when she saw Madeleine's ACTUAL pyjamas:

"Maddie's jammies! Where is Maddie?"

by Verdi 17.07.22 1:52

PeterMac wrote:Thursday evening was perfect because it gave the PJ the whole of Friday to interview them before letting them go home.
Had it been the Friday evening the PJ would have been justified in trying to prevent their leaving on Saturday morning.

Precisely!

The PJ had no reasonable opportunity to further question holidaymakers, or even anyone else considering the ensuing chaos. That much is evident from the PJ files.

by Verdi 17.07.22 2:27

Given the circumstances presented by the McCanns and their group of friends, the PJ's priority in the initial hours was to determine if anything suspicious could be ascertained through visual photographic evidence. There is no way of knowing if any fellow holidaymakers photographs had/have been presented for examination by the PJ, nor indeed the CEOP after Jim Gamble's appeal. Aside from the Foster family which provided nothing useful.

The PJ were looking for anything suspicious in the background of holiday makers photographs, not looking for images of Madeleine McCann.

Holiday makers generally take photographs of their own family/group, not strangers.

It doesn't help to sow barren seeds.

by **Tony Bennett** 17.07.22 9:11

Verdi wrote:The PJ were looking for anything suspicious in the background of holiday makers photographs, not looking for images of Madeleine McCann.

Holiday makers generally take photographs of their own family/group, not strangers.

Jim Gamble was on the case early asking for photos to be sent to him.

I wonder if he consulted with the PJ before making this announcement to the British press.

Of course we now have evidence that he had drawn up a 'dummy' Madeleine page on the CEOP website during Monday 30 April, no doubt as the result of an urgent 'phone call from Praia da Luz late Sunday or early Monday. It was already for 'go' after 10pm Thursday. And his friend Mark Williams-Thomas was soon despatched to Praia da Luz to tell the world how appalling was the PJ's inept handling of the 'abduction' by 'paedophiles'.

by CaKeLoveR 17.07.22 9:33

How on earth did Gamble get away with asking for photographs? The police should have stepped in at that point. They couldn't stop Mitchell from asking for money, I suppose, but everybody in the world should have started questioning the motives of these two, and their requests.

by Doug D 17.07.22 12:03

Verdi:

'Holiday makers generally take photographs of their own family/group, not strangers.

It doesn't help to sow barren seeds.'

Like this 'typical' holiday snap of their own family, which just happens to capture at least two other holiday groups in the background. In such a holiday complex it's pretty much impossible not to capture infiltrators in this sort of photo.

If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week? - Page 10 Fplay10

by Verdi 17.07.22 14:35

Doug D wrote:Verdi:

'Holiday makers generally take photographs of their own family/group, not strangers.

It doesn't help to sow barren seeds.'

Like this 'typical' holiday snap of their own family, which just happens to capture at least two other holiday groups in the background. In such a holiday complex it's pretty much impossible not to capture infiltrators in this sort of photo.

Yes and as I said ....

If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week? - Page 10 Scre2525

.... in context!

by Verdi 17.07.22 15:13

The night of 3rd May 2007, taken from Kate McCann's autobiographical novel, madeleine..

Despite the horror of the situation, some sense of the necessity to approach the crisis calmly and methodically appeared to kick in among our friends as they tried to exert a modicum of control over the chaos. What could be done? What should be done? Aware that we were only an hour and a quarter’s drive from southern Spain, and beyond that lay the borderless continent of Europe – not to mention the short hop across the Strait of Gibraltar to north Africa – David was saying, ‘We need roadblocks set up. The borders to Spain, Morocco and Algiers need to be alerted.’

Russell later asked us for our digital photos of Madeleine and went off somewhere with our camera.

by Verdi 17.07.22 15:31

Kate McCann wrote:A week had now passed since Madeleine’s abduction. Later that day, Thursday 10 May, the Portuguese police held a press conference, at which they released a photograph of a pair of the same Marks and Spencer pyjamas Madeleine had been wearing and confirmed that they were winding down the ground search.

Meanwhile, Gerry and I, along with a couple of our friends, were called back to the police station in Portimão. The police were much friendlier on this occasion and the junior officers, at least, gave the impression that by this time they were working very hard. Gerry was taken in to be interviewed while I remained downstairs.

I made use of the long wait I anticipated by sitting down with a notebook, pen and my camera, containing dated photographs of the holiday, and trying to write a detailed account of everything that had happened the week before.

If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week? - Page 10 Scre2526

If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week? - Page 10 2049

If Madeleine McCann died on Sunday 29 April, what was really going on behind the scenes that week?

Which of these is the single most important reason for you believing that Madeleine died before Thursday?