Re: The latest McCann suspect: Scotland Yard has revealed vital new information about a suspect wanted in connection with the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

by Guest 09.06.20 7:08

Let the flaming begin. i only came here to see if there was any further info being shared by interested people- not a place where assholes hang out.

Interesting set of new members recently.

by Liz Eagles 09.06.20 7:25

I'm leaving the forum because someone called me an asshole.

by **PeterMac** 09.06.20 7:32

The correct English term is Arsehole.

by **Jill Havern** 09.06.20 7:32

TimN wrote:Regarding my vile writing - excuse me Mr. Prose, the message was clear and it was written in a style that is completely acceptable in forums- analogous or akin to short conversational hand. We dont want to go off on an English language tangent do we?

It might be completely acceptable in motorbike or porn forums, but not in a forum where members have spent eleven years reading official police files and researching the death of a three-year-old girl and subsequently campaigning for a proper investigation.

You are clearly in the wrong forum.

byebye

by Armchair-defective 09.06.20 9:08

Tims insistence he has researched all dogs and found them 'unreliable'
( without it seems noticing Martin Grimes still contributes to research on the matter with various scientists and academics)....has reminded me of
Redwoods 'may not have left apartment 5A alive' quote. Could it be relevant to this current 'suspect'? That was in 2013 If I remember correctly, so was this the same time the German Crimewatch appeal flagged up Bruckner?
I would be absolutely amazed if they could fit Bruckner sneaking into 5a in the McCann's timeline, it seems impossible but if they did....does that not mean all the McCann supporters denigrating Martin Grime for years would then want to go along with the dogs being correct about a death in 5a?

by **Mainline** 09.06.20 9:45

Here is a scientific article published in April 2007 on cadaver dogs.

The dogs were trained with carpet squares, contaminated by humans deceased under <3 hours. They were able to alert to squares that had a minimum exposure of 2 minutes.

So, taking this back to CB. Why would the dogs alert behind the sofa and in the parents' bedroom, unless she had been dead for a number of hours and moved between those two locations? Are we to believe he killed her, hung around for a couple of hours, hid her behind the sofa when someone came to check, then decided to stay longer with her in the bedroom, before taking her off to wherever? Isn't the narrative meant to be that he was in and out and able to flatten himself behind the bedroom door when Gerry nearly caught him?

The dogs' evidence shreds any logical abduction theory to shreds.

ETA - 2006 article on the same dogs locating remains of Attracta Harron.

by **PeterMac** 09.06.20 9:51

http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.com/2016/08/chapter-9-on-reliability-of-cadaver-dogs.html

by MaddieMay13YEARS 09.06.20 10:02

Have done transcript GMB item from this morning.
I have abbreviated questions from studio. The Report for GMB reporter is the gist of what he said.

What German reporter said is verbatim (as far as I could catch)

Interestingly the issue of the restaurant register entry which I queried on here, and was asked to ignore as there was NO record of it, was raised in this news item?

Reporter in Germany Editor in Chief Bild

Well, from what we know this is all evidence that is so-called suspect knowledge, which means that ONLY the suspect in this case will know about these details and that’s why German police and German authorities have been absolutely sealed. We’ve talked to our top political sources in the past days about this. Even they weren’t told about these pieces of evidence that made clear to German authorities as they have pointed out that Madeleine McCann is dead. They have not revealed anything about that to anyone outside the investigation because from what we understand, they’re still trying to leverage that against the suspect but also use it to verify with any possible lead that would come in now, anyone who may have witnessed from 13 years ago to verify if the details these e witness may be providing actually correspond with the so called suspect knowledge to make sure that they are really on to something and not after 13 years following another dead lead.

Studio - Asks about information/insight public prosecutor has

Yes he is, and that insight that he has points in the direction that they have an idea of how Maddie McCann died, of how she died, how the killing was actually done but they do not know and that is something they frankly admit, and it doesn’t seem like tactic,seems to be the truth.

They do not know where the body for example may have been buried.

What they are pursuing now is different people that were close to Christian Brueckner especially in his Portugal years, and one woman of German decent turned up who was running a, ironically a foster home there in Portugal where Christian Brueckner had access to it, and they’re trying to track down that woman but also a former girlfriend who was under age when she lived in, with Christian Brueckner both here in Germany but also in Portugal where he took her and then she was then deported back to there.

We have talked to that family they’re saying that she’s in hiding, Christian Brueckner’s former girlfriend is in hiding, and is protected by her brothers it’s a large family. Doesn’t even want to talk to authorities. So it seems you know they have these pieces of information to verify anything a possible witness may say. But so far they are still lacking that witness.

Piers Morgan then states that he has been following this case very very closely for 15/16 years? He thinks Germans have got their guy.

The GMB reporter then agrees with Piers Morgan.

Reporter continues:

I think the real problem we had initially with the investigation was back to those early days when we were on the scene just days after Madeleine’s disappearance is that there was no forensic taken at all from the apartment, and the law was apparently at the time that you are not considered a missing person until after 48 hours which is absolutely ludicrous when you think of those golden hours when someone first disappears to try and find them.   So, the police turned up reluctantly a few days later and carried out some small investigation. So, all of that crucial investigation if there was an accomplice with this suspect they would have left some DNA, some science, some cigarette butts around the apartment if they were watching the apartment for example but none of that was taken
So here we are thirteen years later it is incredibly difficult for the Metropolitan Police, for the German police now who are involved with this investigation and scrambling around trying to find a crucial piece a key piece of the jigsaw puzzle to try to unlock what happened to Madeleine.

But in terms in terms of all the people I’ve been speaking to the contacts back then in light of this new information this certainly is very very significant. They have said categorically that they believe that Madeleine is no longer alive.   They haven’t said what evidence they do or don’t have. But clearly they are being very open now trying to force the suspects hand if you like, trying to maybe get him to reveal in prison, although we understand they haven’t actually spoken to the suspect Christian Brueckner yet.    He has not shown any indication yet that he wants to take part or help with this investigation.

So, at the minute it really is up to a new piece of information coming forward from the public and from holiday makers in Praia da Luz at that time.

This is what strikes me you’d think that after so many investigations and appeals that all of that would have been exhausted but clearly not.   So maybe a photograph or something someone saw at that time that may just help.

Studio:

Someone at hotel may have unwittingly given away that McCann kids on their own as it was written in the staff message book? Is that verifief that this has led to the suspect knowing kids were on their own?

German reporter:

Well that is one of the very tragic details in this investigation because from everything we can see the parents wanted to take the best possible care of their children ad that is what may have led or help lead to this.

We know that this detail is part of the investigation.   We know that this is in the German Police Files so to say. So, it is on record, it is being investigated officially.   If that is really what tipped…possibly Christian Brueckner off, and to this point you know, German investigators are very certain they have the right guy, but if that was the detail that tipped him off, that is not absolutely clear yet, it is one of the details they are looking at it is on record, but it’s not clear that…it’s not even clear so far from what we understand from German investigators that he was actually going, that Christian Brueckner, if it was him, was actually going after a child when breaking to that apartment.

He had a long record of hotel break ins, and you know that apartment was kind of an easy target it was a basement, an open basement window basically so you know it could have been the investigators are not sure because they have not questioned Christian Brueckner about this so far if this started as a break in or if he was a predator going after a child.

by theomega 09.06.20 10:40

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/madeleine-mccann-case-key-irish-witness-in-investigation-doesnt-recognise-new-suspect-39268140.html?fbclid=IwAR10nYb6to0bDBCKCBwIpdx6LNfOtWTLWXzvn6x69mT_60CpSDePx5sdp0I

by crispbee2000 09.06.20 11:02

Mainline wrote:Here is a scientific article published in April 2007 on cadaver dogs.

The dogs were trained with carpet squares, contaminated by humans deceased under <3 hours. They were able to alert to squares that had a minimum exposure of 2 minutes.

So, taking this back to CB. Why would the dogs alert behind the sofa and in the parents' bedroom, unless she had been dead for a number of hours and moved between those two locations? Are we to believe he killed her, hung around for a couple of hours, hid her behind the sofa when someone came to check, then decided to stay longer with her in the bedroom, before taking her off to wherever? Isn't the narrative meant to be that he was in and out and able to flatten himself behind the bedroom door when Gerry nearly caught him?

The dogs' evidence shreds any logical abduction theory to shreds.

ETA - 2006 article on the same dogs locating remains of Attracta Harron.

The dogs are remarkable, but they are only as good as their trainer/handler. In this case we are talking about Martin Grime, one of the best in the world. An ex work colleague who received Queen's Honours for counter-terrorism work is a personal friend of Martin's after working with him on a number of cases. These people have saved lives and resolved numerous crimes through their expertise and dedication. As we know Martin is still working in the US for the FBI and other international crime bodies. What does Kate say about this person "******* tosser". Or words to that effect.

So 2 dogs trained by the best, separately both indicate at the same place. I ignore people that are happy to ignore the dog evidence ;o)

by Stffl 09.06.20 11:22

MaddieMay13YEARS wrote:Have done transcript GMB item from this morning.
I have abbreviated questions from studio. The Report for GMB reporter is the gist of what he said.

What German reporter said is verbatim (as far as I could catch)

Reporter in Germany Editor in Chief Bild

Well, from what we know this is all evidence that is so-called suspect knowledge, which means that ONLY the suspect in this case will know about these details and that’s why German police and German authorities have been absolutely sealed. We’ve talked to our top political sources in the past days about this. Even they weren’t told about these pieces of evidence that made clear to German authorities as they have pointed out that Madeleine McCann is dead.

As someone who was living there at the time I wouldn't be surprised CB is simply more familiar with the case and maybe he just told someone something like: "yeah she's dead, mate. She died in the appartment, behind the sofa" and the German police sees this as the so-called "suspect knowledge"

by **Mainline** 09.06.20 11:27

https://www.cmjornal.pt/multimedia/videos/detalhe/cmtv-mostra-reconstituicao-do-homicidio-de-joana

Edit - Video appears not to be playing. Details here in Algarve Daily. Joana Cipriano's uncle admitted to feeding her remains to pigs. CB would be well aware of that case and it's telling he's not been linked to it yet.

by cookiemuncher 09.06.20 12:45

I've been reading the forum for a very long time and have also read many of the PJ files and Tapas interviews, so I thought I would join in and give my take on things for what it's worth -

Martin Smith the Irish man who left the bar with his family said that when he saw Gerry McCann walking down the plane steps when the McCanns came back to the UK holding Sean he looked like the man
that passed him in the street in PdL and was carrying the child in exactly the same way. That's what jogged his memory.

The man he passed didn't respond when either Mr Smith or his wife said "is she asleep". Was that because GM's Scottish accent would have given him away.

The daughter said that the man carrying the child had beige trousers on with buttons down the side. There were a pair of trousers photographed on the McCanns' bed, the photo taken by the PJ. This photo
was taken sometime before the Smith's witness statements after they returned to Ireland.

The Tapas friends checked on the McCanns' apartment apparently on a regular basis but the McCanns never checked on the Tapas friends' apartments. The only check that Kate McCann did on her own children
was when she discovered Madeleine "missing". Was it all pre-arranged.

One of the Tapas men (I can't remember who now) said that he looked into the McCann's childrens' bedroom and saw the twins breathing, but one of the cots, the one on the same side as the door on the right, had a solid wooden end to it, so he would have had to walk into the bedroom and look over the end of the cot to see the twins breathing,
whereas he didn't say he saw Madeleine whose bed was on the left hand side of the door entrance and he would have had a clear view of her bed.

On the Crimewatch reconstruction it showed the door of the children's bedroom opening from right to left, therefore obscuring the view of Madeleine's bed, when in fact the door opened from left to right which would have given any one looking at the children a clear view of Madeleine's bed. Why did Crimewatch do that and twist the facts?

The McCanns' apartment had many blood spots on the tiles, up the walls and on the curtains behind the sofa. If I remember I think there were also blood spots on the back of the sofa. They were all photographed by the PJ and are in the files. There was blood also in between the tiles in the grouting but the blood had been diluted by
vigorous cleaning. The sofa had been pushed up against the wall and the curtains but the blood dog, Eddie or Keela, indicated to the blood spots. There was talk a long time ago that a tracheostomy may have been performed on Madeleine when she was found dying on the floor. That would have accounted to the spurts of blood. Kate McCann mentioned in her book that Madeleine was obsessed with her engagement ring, which seems a strange thing to put in the book. Did Madeleine swallow the ring when she was playing with it if she was left alone when Kate had a shower or even if the children were left alone whilst the McCanns were wining and dining and she was found on the floor choking.

Somrone mentioned about the McCann's Catholic faith, but even KM's mother stated in a TV news interview that she "didn't know why Kate asked for a Catholic priest (when Madeleine went missing) as she wasn't particularly religious". Oops someone forgot to tell KM's mother to keep her mouth shut. Not that it makes much difference in the disappearance of Madeleine but it helps the McCanns to look "religious and saintly".

There are a few other things I can think of but I will do it later. One thing I will mention is that the Daily Mail are printing plenty of comments regarding how useless the Portuguese police were in the investigation
but they were far from "useless" in fact I think they were more clever than SY wanted them to be. Their delving into the case was meticulous and time consuming, they never "left a stone unturned", probably much to the dismay of the Tapas 9. That's why they have to be vilified so rigourously by those who are afraid or being "found out". -

by Verdi 09.06.20 12:56

BlueBag wrote:
Let the flaming begin. i only came here to see if there was any further info being shared by interested people- not a place where assholes hang out.
Interesting set of new members recently.

For the most part, if there were any serious reason for joining a specific forum that's been running for 11 years - for that matter any forum focusing on the disappearance of a three year old child, they would have joined years ago.

Very telling considering the nature of the case revival. It sets the forum back years if allowed - maybe that's the intention.

by **PeterMac** 09.06.20 13:07

Good to hear from you. Always good to have another enquiring mind on the case.

One small point, the end of the cot on the right was dark brown opaque fabric, but not wood. These are folding travel cots, where the top rail on each of the four sided hinges downwards from the centre with a small button mechanism to release it. All four rails fold.
The fabric is printed with a teddy bear logo.

Your point however still stands. This photo shows that you would indeed have to step inside the room to look down into the cot to see that particular child breathing.
Yet more evidence that it simply did not happen, and that this part of the story was hurriedly altered when David Payne, for it was he, realised that he would be in the very precarious position of being
The Last Person To See Her Alive. which in a criminal investigation is not a happy place to be.
His change of story contained the usual lack of attention to detail which has led to the suspicion that both stories are pure invention, or so far removed from any objective ruth as to amount to the same thing.

The latest McCann suspect: Scotland Yard has revealed vital new information about a suspect wanted in connection with the disappearance of Madeleine McCann. - Page 20 Cots10

by cookiemuncher 09.06.20 13:27

PeterMac wrote:Good to hear from you. Always good to have another enquiring mind on the case.

One small point, the end of the cot on the right was dark brown opaque fabric, but not wood. These are folding travel cots, where the top rail on each of the four sided hinges downwards from the centre with a small button mechanism to release it. All four rails fold.
The fabric is printed with a teddy bear logo.

Your point however still stands. This photo shows that you would indeed have to step inside the room to look down into the cot to see that particular child breathing.
Yet more evidence that it simply did not happen, and that this part of the story was hurriedly altered when David Payne, for it was he, realised that he would be in the very precarious position of being
The Last Person To See Her Alive. which in a criminal investigation is not a happy place to be.
His change of story contained the usual lack of attention to detail which has led to the suspicion that both stories are pure invention, or so far removed from any objective ruth as to amount to the same thing.

Thanks Peter. I'm not very good with forums, I find them a bit daunting, so try and avoid them, although I enjoy reading them. I had to have 3 goes at posting my comments as I kept hitting the wrong keys and they kept disappearing!!

I always enjoy reading your posts, seeing as you have an insight into the criminal mind set, and I also read your own blog and ebook.

I have just been really upset with all the nonsense printed in the DM and other newspapers about this "scapegoat" and the insults being thrown at the PJ and felt I had to join in. It seems like we're being brainwashed for the final "hurrah", it's like pinning a tail on a donkey, any donkey will do, as long as the case is closed and the McCanns are deemed "!innocent".

by Rogue-a-Tory 09.06.20 13:41

TimN wrote:
Rogue-a-Tory wrote:
The dogs are no better than chance. Where's your evidence for that sweeping statement?

ive seen it in a few videos and articles on the use of dogs in the use of scent and how they are motivated.

i did a quick search and found this: its the national free broadcaster in Australia..in this case they were worse than chance..i.e. indicate wrong more times than right.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-03/fact-check-are-drug-dogs-incorrect-75-pc-of-the-time/10568410

there are loads of similar articles - many testimonies of dog handlers - the theme seems to be that they are good if they are used professionally and properly, and that comes down to many things. basically lots of variables and to suggest that a few hits in a room that has had the same people in it for days is , based on what we know about their accuracy, not worth pursuing. And I do note that quite a lot of language here does assume that the dogs were right, or at least were onto something.

Either way, if your entire case relies on dogs, then its pretty thin.

I cant see why CB couldve have just walked in, after being tipped off by his phone friend. He was lurking already, had opportunity, motive, an accomplice potentially...and all the stuff about the room and stories are simply the shit they got into because they thought it was a good idea to try to not have the 'opportunity' part - blamed on them.

And that's it.

Why cant it be that?..its the only theory that doesnt have any flaws or weaknesses. Its totally plausible. Every other story isnt.

That's all I'm saying. As a newbie i have noticed that the judge and jury had decided here...but I dont see how that could be considering everything is speculation and conspiratorial.

So Eddie and Keela's record remains in tact. 100% accurate.

by Rogue-a-Tory 09.06.20 13:46

BlueBag wrote:
Let the flaming begin. i only came here to see if there was any further info being shared by interested people- not a place where assholes hang out.
Interesting set of new members recently.

Indeed, think we've seen it all before.

by **Mainline** 09.06.20 14:14

https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/09/victim-asks-madeleine-mccann-detectives-review-her-case

by wallad 09.06.20 15:49

Mainline wrote:https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/09/victim-asks-madeleine-mccann-detectives-review-her-case

I'm intrigued as to this woman could tell he had "blonde eyebrows, and piercing blue eyes" when he had a mask "covering his whole head". And in the dark to boot!

by Doug D 09.06.20 15:56

Heriberto Janosch González makes a comeback, identifying what he thinks is the campervan parked in early May outside the villa CB supposedly left in a trashed state months before.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11817267/madeleine-mccann-new-image-campervan/

The ‘soaraway’ has also updated its schematic of the Ocean Club and the Mc’s apartment, but it’s still a pathetic attempt to twist reality.

The Tapas bar has moved even further to the right, next to the street reception, illustrating an almost unhindered view of 5A and they obviously feel the need to distort the scale and change things inside the apartment to try and make the fictions more plausible.

Furniture vanishes and moves, the door to MM’s room hangs the wrong way, concealing MM’s bed, the cots are switched so the blue netting ended one you can see through, is nearest to the door, and there is a nice clear path from the doorway to ‘whooshing window’, even if it is misplaced entirely behind the bed.

The front door is marked ‘to patio’, the parent’s windows should be full length patio doors, the scale takes the dining table into the middle of the room, rather than close to the window and why not at least make the kitchen look like a kitchen?

There are enough PJ photos to look at to get it right!

by cookiemuncher 09.06.20 16:25

Doug D wrote:Heriberto Janosch González makes a comeback, identifying what he thinks is the campervan parked in early May outside the villa CB supposedly left in a trashed state months before.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11817267/madeleine-mccann-new-image-campervan/

The ‘soaraway’ has also updated its schematic of the Ocean Club and the Mc’s apartment, but it’s still a pathetic attempt to twist reality.

The Tapas bar has moved even further to the right, next to the street reception, illustrating an almost unhindered view of 5A and they obviously feel the need to distort the scale and change things inside the apartment to try and make the fictions more plausible.

Furniture vanishes and moves, the door to MM’s room hangs the wrong way, concealing MM’s bed, the cots are switched so the blue netting ended one you can see through, is nearest to the door, and there is a nice clear path from the doorway to ‘whooshing window’, even if it is misplaced entirely behind the bed.

The front door is marked ‘to patio’, the parent’s windows should be full length patio doors, the scale takes the dining table into the middle of the room, rather than close to the window and why not at least make the kitchen look like a kitchen?

There are enough PJ photos to look at to get it right!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

It makes me feel physically sick that the Sun can twist facts so blatantly without any recourse for the fate of Madeleine. It seems Madeleine's life to them doesn't matter as long as they can twist the facts that the PJ were wrong all along. How can they print an image of the apartment that is totally contradictory to what it was?

They have some very sick minded journalists on the Sun, they know who they are. Shame on you all.....

SORRY I SEEM TO HAVE MESSED UP MY QUOTE, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX IT, DUH!!

by **Jill Havern** 09.06.20 17:07

cookiemunche wrote:
SORRY I SEEM TO HAVE MESSED UP MY QUOTE, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX IT, DUH!!

You need to write your post outside of the yellow quote box rather than within it.

Or switch to editor mode (the very last icon on the toolbar) and post after this: [/quote]

Welcome to the forum by the way singlerose

by cookiemuncher 09.06.20 17:19

Jill Havern wrote:
cookiemunche wrote:
SORRY I SEEM TO HAVE MESSED UP MY QUOTE, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX IT, DUH!!

You need to write your post outside of the yellow quote box rather than within it.

Or switch to editor mode (the very last icon on the toolbar) and post after this:

Welcome to the forum by the way singlerose

[/quote]

Thanks Jill. That's why I've been a reader for so long and not a contributor as I'm useless with forums. They frighten the life out of me.

by **Jill Havern** 09.06.20 17:23

Ah, you'll get used to it.

We're here to help. If you have any technical difficulties there's a sub-forum down the bottom for posting such questions if you get stuck.

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