Photographs Revisited - general
The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™ :: Madeleine Beth McCann :: Photographs of Madeleine McCann's fateful holiday
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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Okay, Verdi’s post indicates to me that I may have given the wrong impression. I’m not arguing that the photo was not taken on Sunday, April 29th. I am also not arguing that the photo wasn’t taken at solar zenith. As short as the shadows are on Madeleine and Amelia, I completely agree with PeterMac that they were taken between the hours of 12:30 pm and 2:30 pm. In fact, the McCanns adamant stance that the photo was taken at solar zenith is what led me to believe that the original photo might have been taken at solar zenith and they lined up the elements that they added or manipulated to give the appearance that they lined up with solar zenith. It is interesting to note that the shadows in the photo actually lie upon the solar zenith line. It’s only that the source is in the wrong position. Move the sun from the northeast to the southwest and you have solar zenith. This, I believe would make it easier to manipulate the photo without getting caught right away.. I do, however, have serious doubts about Jerry. I do not believe he was in the original image. What I do think is possible is that they used a photograph of Jerry taken on Sunday about an hour so later than the one of the girls. It would not be solar zenith, but the shadows would still be going in the same direction. This would explain the discrepancies between the short shadows on the girls and the longer shadows on him.. I had initially theorized that the reason fo the dates being wrong was because they didn’t take Daylight Savings Time into account. Yet, when I looked it up in PeterMac’s book, he says solar zenith is at 1.29. I don’t know if he’s taking Daylight Savings into account. However, if he is, then the photo of the girls could have been taken at the solar zenith of 1.29 while the one of Jerry was taken an hour later at 2.29.
While I don’t know how popular the theory is, mine actually unintentionally supports the one about the reflection in Jerry’s sunglasses being rotated. When flipped horizontally, it seems to be a reflection of the background in the pool photo where Jerry was sitting. This is understandable if the photo was taken when he was on the opposite side of the pool from where he is in the photograph. There is a shadow in the reflection and when viewed horizontally and flipping it, as it is a reflection, it would lay in rhe direction of solar zenith. However, the shadow is a bit long for solar zenith, and this could be explained by the hour time difference between the two photos. The edge of Amelie’s hat can be seen in the reflection, so what they may have been doing is just sitting around the pool area while Kate was taking several pictures of them.
I realize that some people believe that the sunglasses were not purchased until Tuesday, May 1. However, the only person with a firsthand account of this seems to be Kate and considering the pack of lies she has told, I’m really not inclined to believe it without further proof. She could have just been saying that to bolster the fact that the last photo was taken around lunchtime on Thursday. If not for the sunglasses, there really is no reason for Jerry to be in the photograph. It is interesting to note that it was Tuesday, either the day of or the day after many people believe something tragic happened to Madeleine, that Jerry decided he suddenly needed sunglasses. The weather really wasn’t sunglasses’ weather at that point. And possibly the reflection in the glasses was flipped to edit Kate out. Jerry is looking right at her, so she should be in the reflection, and we are actually seeing only the background reflected in one lens. If it is supposed to be horizontal what would the reflection in the other lens show?
So at least as far as I can tell, it wouldn’t really take much editing. The shadows would line up.along the solar zenith line. Only Jerry’s is out of sync, but then obviously they didn’t do a good job of editing it. And the same could be said for the horizontal flip in the sunglasses. The biggest problem would be the background. I know how difficult it is to change that without tipping someone off. If that’s what happened, I don’t know how they did it. That is the weakest part of my theory.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Suncalc: Silentscope
Having rotated the Satellite image to get the tree and the back wall to line up properly, it seems to be that the photo was taken around a time window of approximately 13:21 to 13:29 UTC +1.
(Solar zenith was 13:32:03 on the 1 May which was the first day that Kate said Gerry bought his sunglasses)
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Fourteen years of study and analysis gone in a puff of bluster!
I ask again, did you/have you/will you thoroughly read and absorb the full content of PeterMac's e-book and the wealth of member contribution to this subject here on CMOMM? A rhetorical question of course.
Meanwhile enjoy the forum and feel free to comment on any other aspect of this convoluting case - the Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann.
Oh and my the way in the interest of accuracy, it's Gerry with a G as in Gerald, not Jerry with a J as in Tom 'n Jerry!
ETA: This alone should keep you going for a while..
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Winter wrote:I am not comfortable with the idea that it is photoshopped, Verdi, and that is basically because I have read all the posts and the fourteen years of research. Photoshopping a picture and getting away with it would probably be harder than the McCanns pulling the wool over everyone’s eyes.
Excuse my hignorance, but doesn't this equate to photoshopping, or image manipulation, or image adjustment - call it what you will..
Winter wrote:In fact, the McCanns adamant stance that the photo was taken at solar zenith is what led me to believe that the original photo might have been taken at solar zenith and they lined up the elements that they added or manipulated to give the appearance that they lined up with solar zenith. It is interesting to note that the shadows in the photo actually lie upon the solar zenith line. It’s only that the source is in the wrong position. Move the sun from the northeast to the southwest and you have solar zenith. This, I believe would make it easier to manipulate the photo without getting caught right away.. I do, however, have serious doubts about Jerry. I do not believe he was in the original image. What I do think is possible is that they used a photograph of Jerry taken on Sunday about an hour so later than the one of the girls. It would not be solar zenith, but the shadows would still be going in the same direction. This would explain the discrepancies between the short shadows on the girls and the longer shadows on him.. I had initially theorized that the reason fo the dates being wrong was because they didn’t take Daylight Savings Time into account. Yet, when I looked it up in PeterMac’s book, he says solar zenith is at 1.29. I don’t know if he’s taking Daylight Savings into account. However, if he is, then the photo of the girls could have been taken at the solar zenith of 1.29 while the one of Jerry was taken an hour later at 2.29.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
If he turns himself left, it would cause the shadow on his T Shirt to fall one Solar hour later than the Children’s who were facing the Sun.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
That is not the issue.
The issue is whether it was taken on Thursday 3rd May 2007.
It wasn't.
It CANNOT have been taken on 3/5/7, nor yet on 2/5/7, 1/5/7, or even 30/4/7
It can ONLY have been taken on Sunday 29th April 2007.
That is the only possible day a genuine photo of that scene could have been taken.
But the McCanns have to insist it was, because it is the only evidence they can adduce that Madeleine was alive and well at lunchtime on that day.
And their insistence on this leads to another conclusion altogether.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Thanks to everyone else in the thread and thanks, PeterMac. I did say more once than once that I was not taking issue with you over what day the photo was taken and couldn’t possibly be taking issue over the time, as you said it was 12:30 to 2:30, and that’s what I believe. That’s was an argument Verdi made it into. I did wonder about photo manipulation, but only because of the shadow, which I wanted some clarification on. And that’s my only reason for posting in the forum. As questions that even vaguely challenge someone’s pet theory seem to start a war, please delete my membership. And I don’t really care if you delete my posts.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Winter wrote:... please delete my membership. And I don’t really care if you delete my posts.
I'm sorry you feel that way Winter but if you're determined it's better that you unsubscribe yourself, to avoid any future repercussion or misunderstanding. You can do so here..
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I see no reason to delete your posts.
Whatever your decision I wish you well.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Winter has once again highlighted that Peter Mac's analysis clearly demonstrates, beyond reasonable doubt, that the photo was taken on a different sunny day, that of saturday the 29th April and not the cold and cloudy grey thursday 3rd may, as purported by the McCann's. The McCanns, Clarry and the british press all used the photo Exif time date stamp to legitimise their claim that MBM was alive on that day and on that hour.
Fair Dinkum Busted! The Exif 'last' photo data, in the form of the time/date field was PC manipulated and we can once again recognise it as another manipulated lie.
I note Silentscope's point, derived from his analysis using the SunCalc tool that due to Gerry McCann's angular, poolside positioning, his shadow length and shadow angles all differ to those of his 2 daughters. This inconsistency implies that his photographic image was rendered at a different solar time (day/hour). I don't propose we dwell on this at this juncture, as any debate would pull us away from the hard evidential fact that the date of last photo was not as per the McCann claim and the EXIF data.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
They arrived on Saturday 28th, but late afternoon, so only in time for the Children's play area photos, which show a sunny day with large fluffy cumulus clouds – as do all the other hundreds on Flickr
Sunday was cloudless until the evening.
Then the cold weather front moved across from the North west, and did not clear until very late on Thursday evening.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
To my knowledge it's the only Madeleine holiday photograph to reveal such information.
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Page 588- MBM taken in Portugal at 17:15 on Wednesday May 2, 2007
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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EUMETSAT / Heidelberg University.
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Winter
Silentscope wrote:In the PJ Files there is the Photo of Madeleine in the door of a Playhouse. It is not revealed how the PJ knew the Date and Time?
Page 588- MBM taken in Portugal at 17:15 on Wednesday May 2, 2007
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Not sure what point you are trying make here but the above reference is not taken from the actual PJ files per se, the images are documented in the PJ files but the interpretation of the images was compiled by one of the volunteer translators, in this instant one ALBYM with the help of Lizzy 'HiDeHo' Taylor, who tried to identify the content of the black and white images taken and documented in the PJ files.
It's all made clear in the link you provided.
The images are those taken by the McCann holiday group, surrendered to the PJ. The McCanns with the help of their relation Michael Wright, selected specific images to hand-over to the PJ - the poolside image was not one of them!
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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So I have to ask why? Why did they not have a more recent picture of her available for that first release?
Answer:
The Tapas 9 withheld - and then selected Photos for release, instead of making everything of possible use available straight away. What they chose to supply was of little use.
The Tapas 9 did not withhold photographs from the PJ. The McCanns with the help of their relative Michael Wright selected specific photographs from their own equipment before handing over to the PJ.
08-Outros Processos Vol VIII Page 549
NUIPC 201/07.0 GALGS
Visualisation and Analysis of Photographs
On this date, I state that the photographs contained on a CD delivered to this police force by Gerald McCann have been visualised and analysed, some of them are from the holiday period that the McCann family spent at the Ocean Club in PdL, beginning on the 28th April 2007.
The visualisation and analysis of these images that was carried out reveals that there are several photographs of interest to the investigation, in which it is possible to visualise Madeleine McCann.
Portimao, 09 May 2007
Signed by
Inspector Ricardo Paiva
Outros Processos Vol VIII
Page 550
NUIPC 201/07.0 GALGS
Visualisation and Analysis of Photographs
On this date, I state that the photographs contained on a CD delivered to this police force by Michael Wright, a relation of the McCann couple, relating to the holiday period that the McCann family spent at the Ocean Club in PdL, beginning on the 28th April 2007.
The visualisation and analysis of these images that was carried out reveals that there are several photographs of interest to the investigation, in which it is possible to visualise Madeleine McCann, as well as different adults and children that made up the group of friends who were on holiday together with the McCann couple in PdL, which is why these photographs, joined to the report, were printed.
Portimao, 09 May 2007
Signed by
Inspector Ricardo Paiva
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Allowing them to view the Original Photos.
All of them, not just the ones I THINK are helpful!
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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- well, briefly anyway, until Tony Blair's government PR team arrived and this happened
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
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NahSilentscope wrote:The ‘praying like an Arab’ routine did not last long did it?
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Re: Photographs Revisited - general
Silentscope wrote:In the PJ Files there is the Photo of Madeleine in the door of a Playhouse. It is not revealed how the PJ knew the Date and Time?
Page 588- MBM taken in Portugal at 17:15 on Wednesday May 2, 2007
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It is interesting, because those two photos were very clearly taken on Saturday 28th after they had checked in and sorted out the apartment
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» Photographs
» Photographs and memories
» Is this the only photo of Kate on holiday?
» Further Analysis of the Last Photo
The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™ :: Madeleine Beth McCann :: Photographs of Madeleine McCann's fateful holiday