Re: Summers & Swan Ch 25 + 26

by lj 12.05.15 18:49

aiyoyo wrote:Pathetic !

Who ever heard of acclaimed writer adding addendum chapters to replug book, blaming trolls for his first edition flop?

Using expert's opinion (expert he cannot name) on blood pattern forensic to discredit the cadaverine detection dog is a joke. What has dog positive signals on cadaverine detection got anything to do with blood splatter pattern forensic?

How credible is his claim that his colleague is his source for the data on trolls and tweets?
For one thing, writer does not have colleague. For another thing, even if he (Summers) has one, why would his colleague who is not associated to, not related to, and not knowing Kate & Gerry be interested in anti-Mcs trolls, let alone be interested to monitor and keep tabs on anti mcs activities on social media?

The type of details/data on trolls and tweets included in chapter 25 can only have come from a source close to McCanns. And, they wonder why people believe they are another arm of Pro-Mcs propaganda !

They don't give any argument, not even a silly one, that discredits the dogs. He just mentions the dogs, than mentions 2 phony scientists, and that's it. Not how, or where, or what.

As one of his "experts" says "it's all a lot of nothing".

In the mean time judge
de Melo e Castro declared the findings of the dogs proven facts.

by missbeetle 12.05.15 18:52

Has anyone actually seen a paperback copy of this book on sale anywhere?

by aiyoyo 12.05.15 18:55

Enid O'Dowd wrote:Surely a publisher brings out a new/updated edition of a book when

(1) the first print run is sold out or almost sold out

and

(2) the publisher anticipates reasonable sales of the new edition, enough to cover printing and marketing costs as an absolute minimum.

Since the first edition flopped and there must have been heavy marketing costs, why would a publisher produce an updated edition at this point in time to add to losses?

This makes me suspect that this new edition has been paid for by a supporter or from the Fund. I can’t see that any publisher wanting to stay in business would throw good money after bad.

You are not the only person thinking that.

The contents of the two chapters are a dead giveaway.
Only those with vested interest could have supplied S&S with that kind of detail on trolls and tweeters.

Also, why should it concern S&S if people believe the dogs evidence or not? It's only mattered to those that this has an implication for.
Why the need to create a chapter focusing on discrediting the dogs, using experts opinions (not even convincing) to prop up their stance? Why should authors adopt a stance in the first place? Where is the objectivity in that? Should it not suffice just to put out the facts and let people discern for themselves?

They know the dogs findings put paid to their stories, but that should not have been concern of authors.

It's a case of the more they paint the worst it gets.

Likely the revision wasn't the publisher's idea hoping to turn around the flop since bad review is hard to reverse, revised chapters or not, given that people already know the main thrust of the book.
It must have been S&S own ideas. Question is - backed by who or encouraged by who though? We can easily deduce that.

ETA: Let's see if the book review is going to improve !
Or he might have to ask all their little helpers to do repeat the same old thing again.
S&S actually told us that was how they countered bad review. Spectacular own goal that admission.

by Guest 12.05.15 19:00

s-and-s, are quite funny people, first the tell us there is a brittish senior police officer working on an ongoing investigation, in breach of his oath of silence.

But, but, then they also tells us the brittish police did not a very best job , while they had to fulfill the job of advisors in the gathering of the forensic material in portugal.

They also send out some horrible unreliable bad brittish dogs.

And then even an irish forensic expert that was asked for a opinion, based on a file that is partly translated by an amateur anti.
I tried that over here, but no chance any forensic expert would comment his opinion, without a authorized translation. They told me that would be highly inappropriate in their profession.

Well , it means that grange can leave keep their money in the pocket, for retesting the forensic material that is left, as your dr. maureen s. made it clear it would not stand up in court because of lack of quality. Isn't that hindering a active investigation? Nice job s-and-s!

by lj 12.05.15 19:09

onehand wrote:s-and-s, are quite funny people, first the tell us there is a brittish senior police officer working on an ongoing investigation, in breach of his oath of silence.

But, but, then they also tells us the brittish police did not a very best job , while they had to fulfill the job of advisors in the gathering of the forensic material in portugal.

They also send out some horrible unreliable bad brittish dogs.

And then even an irish forensic expert that was asked for a opinion, based on a file that is partly translated by an amateur anti.
I tried that over here, but no chance any forensic expert would comment his opinion, without a authorized translation. They told me that would be highly inappropriate in their profession.

Well , it means that grange can leave keep their money in the pocket, for retesting the forensic material that is left, as your dr. maureen s. made it clear it would not stand up in court because of lack of quality. Isn't that hindering a active investigation? Nice job s-and-s!

You're on a roll onehand

by TheTruthWillOut 12.05.15 19:19

Does anyone else feel that this second addition of the book indicates that OG isn't a whitewash for the M's?

Of course a whitewash for the government can't be ruled out, but TM surely wouldn't bother with this desperate attempt of manipulating/frightening the public if OG were in their back pocket?

by aiyoyo 12.05.15 19:35

onehand wrote:s-and-s, are quite funny people, first the tell us there is a brittish senior police officer working on an ongoing investigation, in breach of his oath of silence.

Quote S&S "The authors' conversations with sources over several months , however, suggest a different reality. A senior source told the authors it was 'business as usual. We're just working through the jobs, one by one."

A sr source (in the Police) without name ! And we are supposed to buy that !
Lying through as many teeth comes to mind.......

And then even an irish forensic expert that was asked for a opinion, based on a file that is partly translated by an amateur anti.
I tried that over here, but no chance any forensic expert would comment his opinion, without a authorized translation. They told me that would be highly inappropriate in their profession.

We are led to believe Mcs spent 100K having the files translated.
So it's possible they got a copy from the Mcs. Nonetheless that is still not certified official copy, just mc-translated copy.

Well , it means that grange can leave keep their money in the pocket, for retesting the forensic material that is left, as your dr. maureen s. made it clear it would not stand up in court because of lack of quality. Isn't that hindering a active investigation? Nice job s-and-s!

How dare you? Ha Ha....
It's supposed to the newest, the latest version of definitive account. Wonder how many more "definitive" accounts they have to play with? You'd think "definitive" account means just that "definitive"....

by Liz Eagles 12.05.15 19:43

Definitive......

I looked up antonyms for 'definitive' and here are a few....

ambiguous

imprecise

indefinite

inexact

questionable

uncertain

incomplete

inconclusive

interim

temporary

by aiyoyo 12.05.15 19:55

aquila wrote:Definitive......

I looked up antonyms for 'definitive' and here are a few....

ambiguous

imprecise

indefinite

inexact

questionable

uncertain

incomplete

inconclusive

interim

temporary

They obviously believe in Superlative -

Definitive

More Definitive

More than More Definitive

Most Definitive

More than Most Definitive

New Definitive

Newer than New Definitive

Latest Definitive

Up-to-date Definitive

In-trend Definitive

Current Definitive

Flow-with-the-tide Definitive

Bang on the money Definitive

Bet safe Definitive

Litigation-proof Definitive

Lying Definitive

.......

by whatsupdoc 12.05.15 19:56

After further searching, I have found that Faithlilly did the transcribing yesterday morning @ 1132 from extra chapters of a paperback edition. Thanks to Faithlilly for all the work.

MCF forum, Main Mc Thread 7 , page 243. So chapters 25+26 should be able to be verified by acquiring the latest paperback edition.

I noticed she typed Loking for Madeleine which ties up with the copy we have.

by aiyoyo 12.05.15 22:15

Isabelle McFadden @QUEENdePORTUGAL
[ltr]I brought down Summers&grandbaby with 1 single amazon review. CIA called they want me to bring down #isis #mccann[/ltr]
Retweeted by MrsWaspie

She escaped Martin Brunt doorstepping because she is based in Uncle Sam soil, but didn't escape S&S poison pen.

by Jauna Loca 13.05.15 19:08

whatsupdoc wrote:Chapter 25 mentions the poor reviews of Summers & Swan book...

Looking for Madeleine

Chapter 25.

To many of the online 'antis', it has seemed not to matter that Gerry and Kate McCann are the distressed parents of a missing child, a couple not known to have committed any wrongdoing. Their friends and acquaintances, including those who accompanied them on the ill-fated holiday in 2007, Gerry's sister Philomena- CEOP's former chief Jim Gamble- have also suffered abuse. Publication of this book made the author's targets too.

Interesting wording, don't you think? What Hobs calls leaking? Not, you notice, "a couple known not to have committed any wrongdoing".

by lj 13.05.15 19:37

Jauna Loca wrote:
whatsupdoc wrote:Chapter 25 mentions the poor reviews of Summers & Swan book...

Looking for Madeleine

Chapter 25.

To many of the online 'antis', it has seemed not to matter that Gerry and Kate McCann are the distressed parents of a missing child, a couple not known to have committed any wrongdoing. Their friends and acquaintances, including those who accompanied them on the ill-fated holiday in 2007, Gerry's sister Philomena- CEOP's former chief Jim Gamble- have also suffered abuse. Publication of this book made the author's targets too.

Interesting wording, don't you think? What Hobs calls leaking? Not, you notice, "a couple known not to have committed any wrongdoing".

Good catch. I think they want to sound smart and legally savvy, while in fact they give the plot away.

by aiyoyo 13.05.15 20:10

TheTruthWillOut wrote:Does anyone else feel that this second addition of the book indicates that OG isn't a whitewash for the M's?

Of course a whitewash for the government can't be ruled out, but TM surely wouldn't bother with this desperate attempt of manipulating/frightening the public if OG were in their back pocket?

No one knows.
Not even McCanns it seems, going by S&S info in chapter 26, undoubtedly sourced from McCanns via 2nd or 3rd hand intermediary.

On one hand we are told the current DCI in charge is an "experienced veteran on homicide cases".
On the other hand we are also told she was left a legacy of intruders by DCI Redwood to follow up.
Redwood who during his watch was chasing an array of intruders, hoping for a breakthrough, that maybe will "match a telltale fingerprint or DNA laying forgotten in the exhibit store in Algarve."
How that is going to progress the abduction investigation is the $64M question, since no forensic trace of an intruder was found in 5a.

Also, we are told OG supplies HO with its case progress reports every quarterly. What of, again, is a $64 question?
Imagine, Home Officer getting regular reports from an experienced veteran homicide case DCI and the content is all about historic intruders her team can't narrow down? How does OG hope to justify and reconcile that? There is just such a disconnect of expertise to the type of investigation.
Moreover, we're given to believe that HO is happy to bank roll this operation (money is no objection) indefinitely despite getting regular reports on nothing crucial or potential prospect, except rubbish about intruders.

You'd think an acclaimed writer would realise he had been told a whole load of bollox by his source that simply does not add up -- but apparently not -- he was happy to put his name on such shite. Naive or gullible? And he wonders why people believe he's a pro-mccann propagandist !

by jeanmonroe 13.05.15 23:48

Book sales...missbeetle:
.
Has anyone actually seen a paperback copy of this book? (by S&S)
--------------------------------------

YEP!.............ME!

My OH put a copy in our 'loo'! He said, 'just in case, we run out of 'bog roll'

by **PeterMac** 14.05.15 7:11

Jauna Loca wrote:Chapter 25 mentions the poor reviews of Summers & Swan book...
Looking for Madeleine
Chapter 25.
To many of the online 'antis', it has seemed not to matter that Gerry and Kate McCann are the distressed parents of a missing child, a couple not known to have committed any wrongdoing. Their friends and acquaintances, including those who accompanied them on the ill-fated holiday in 2007, Gerry's sister Philomena- CEOP's former chief Jim Gamble- have also suffered abuse. Publication of this book made the author's targets too.

Im the strange world inhabited by those who unconditionally support the McCanns, Leonor Cipriano, and the rest
"wrongdoing" obviously does not include serial abandonment of three children all under the age of four, for five nights in sucession, in a cold, dark and unlocked apartment out of eyesight and earshot, for considerable periods. (At least an hour, since the visits of half an hour on the Thursday were an increase in their security arrangements )

Well I am sorry, Winters and Goose, but that counts as SERIOUS WRONGDOING in my book, as I believe it does for any parent or grandparent anywhere in the civilised world.

Wrongdoing also includes deliberate lying to Police officers, and collecting money from OldAge Pensioners and children by false pretences. But that is another story.

by Lands_end 14.05.15 7:55

In one significant are, moreover, there has been a development. While the Mer has earlier said it was studying eighteen incidents in which an intruder had broken into properties housing British families between 2002 and 2010- well after Madeleine's disappearance- the figure had now risen. Police were now analysing as many as twenty-eight over a period starting as early as 2002. 'The offences are not all the same,' a source said. 'Some involve not children but teenagers or young women......but there are similarities. We're seeing a consistent theme.

In an extract from whatsupdoc above; this is tantamount to saying:

Police now see that there is a consistent similarity in all cases of DWI / DUI reported at roadside screening tests indication. They are now almost certain that this common theme is ...............................................................................
ALCOHOL

by Guest 14.05.15 8:05

Lands_end wrote:In one significant are, moreover, there has been a development. While the Mer has earlier said it was studying eighteen incidents in which an intruder had broken into properties housing British families between 2002 and 2010- well after Madeleine's disappearance- the figure had now risen. Police were now analysing as many as twenty-eight over a period starting as early as 2002. 'The offences are not all the same,' a source said. 'Some involve not children but teenagers or young women......but there are similarities. We're seeing a consistent theme.

In an extract from whatsupdoc above; this is tantamount to saying:

Police now see that there is a consistent similarity in all cases of DWI / DUI reported at roadside screening tests indication. They are now almost certain that this common theme is ...............................................................................
ALCOHOL

None of them involve a planned abduction of a 4 year old child and none of them were by someone who was left ZERO evidence of ever having been there.

It's clutching at straws.

by Lands_end 14.05.15 8:23

BlueBag wrote:
Lands_end wrote:In one significant are, moreover, there has been a development. While the Mer has earlier said it was studying eighteen incidents in which an intruder had broken into properties housing British families between 2002 and 2010- well after Madeleine's disappearance- the figure had now risen. Police were now analysing as many as twenty-eight over a period starting as early as 2002. 'The offences are not all the same,' a source said. 'Some involve not children but teenagers or young women......but there are similarities. We're seeing a consistent theme.

In an extract from whatsupdoc above; this is tantamount to saying:

Police now see that there is a consistent similarity in all cases of DWI / DUI reported at roadside screening tests indication. They are now almost certain that this common theme is ...............................................................................
ALCOHOL

None of them involve a planned abduction of a 4 year old child and none of them were by someone who was left ZERO evidence of ever having been there.

It's clutching at straws.

Absolutely. Op Grange could state that their momentum development revelation moment was:

Having established that this was an ABDUCTION because we were told to by the McCann's team of experts we have conducted extensive investigation and are now almost certain that despite there being no sign of entry, exit or a struggle the ABDUCTOR was ......................................................................................................................................................................................................
Human.

by **PeterMac** 14.05.15 8:46

It is now 8 years since Madeleine disappeared.

How many abductions were there in the 8 years BEFORE
How many abductions have there been in the 8 years SINCE.

Madeleine is (would be) now 12, and obviously of no further interest to a predaory Paed**** whose interest is in children of the age of 3.
So has he replenished his stock,
And if not, why not.

The whole burglar story is clearly Mitchell inspired "look over here"

by Lands_end 14.05.15 9:45

PeterMac wrote:It is now 8 years since Madeleine disappeared.

How many abductions were there in the 8 years BEFORE
How many abductions have there been in the 8 years SINCE.

Madeleine is (would be) now 12, and obviously of no further interest to a predaory Paed**** whose interest is in children of the age of 3.
So has he replenished his stock,
And if not, why not.

The whole burglar story is clearly Mitchell inspired "look over here"

C'mon PMac. Even you cannot deny that the "Hellish Lair" theory was unlikely to come to anything although goodness knows what research David Edgar had to do to even make it sound plausible enough for the media to report it. The simplest explaination for an abduction to go wrong was a burglary. Portuguese burglars are after all known worldwide to be very clever, masking their entry or exit even able to throw unsuspecting police of the scent by throwing a few red herrings. They also I am told carry drugs to sedate children with the key to their success undoubtedly being the painstaking observations of potential targets, sending bogus maintenance staff in to recce the area backed up with bogus collecters. They even have a contingency plan to dispose of children's bodies should they suddenly wake up and start crying. Their network is such that if one member of this evil burlring paedphile group is killed then all blame for crimes can be transferred to that person even if he is fat, smelly, drives a tractor or ( fill in the gaps this is getting boring).
Just put Gene Genie on to the case, he will find out the answer.

by Gaggzy 14.05.15 10:50

Angelique wrote:What enormous fun!

S&S have made themselves look silly again!

Someone should tell them that this can only get worse.

As Dr. What has said previously, they can't 'dis the dogs'. This is the only thing they can't get away from.

So they try and try to discredit them. In fact, when they brought in the dogs during the "digging" and only found only a sock I was tempted to think this was going to be part of the dissing. But they haven't gone that far yet. But I am expecting it.

As for Chapter 25, this IMO is trying to create a defence for what happened to Brenda Leyland. It's all wallpaper!

..... they should have quit when they were behind. big grin

by **PeterMac** 14.05.15 10:54

Interestingly, so far as I am aware the Hellish Lair was the last definitive explanation that Edgar and Mitchell gave.
They have never resiled from that position, but neither have they explained why they have never really bothered to look for it.

So we must assume
1 The McCanns and their apologists and supporters actually Believe that Madeleine is being held in this Hellish Lair, in the Lawless Hinterland within 10 miles of PdL (if I have the quote correct)
AND
2 That they cannot be bothered to look for her.

In the alternative
1 They were deliberately lying
or
2 They are incredibly stupid.

Or possibly both

by Gaggzy 14.05.15 11:23

Enid O'Dowd wrote:Surely a publisher brings out a new/updated edition of a book when

(1) the first print run is sold out or almost sold out

and

(2) the publisher anticipates reasonable sales of the new edition, enough to cover printing and marketing costs as an absolute minimum.

Since the first edition flopped and there must have been heavy marketing costs, why would a publisher produce an updated edition at this point in time to add to losses?

This makes me suspect that this new edition has been paid for by a supporter or from the Fund. I can’t see that any publisher wanting to stay in business would throw good money after bad.

I agree with this 100%. nod

by aiyoyo 14.05.15 11:37

Lands_end wrote:In one significant are, moreover, there has been a development. While the Mer has earlier said it was studying eighteen incidents in which an intruder had broken into properties housing British families between 2002 and 2010- well after Madeleine's disappearance- the figure had now risen. Police were now analysing as many as twenty-eight over a period starting as early as 2002. 'The offences are not all the same,' a source said. 'Some involve not children but teenagers or young women......but there are similarities. We're seeing a consistent theme.

In an extract from whatsupdoc above; this is tantamount to saying:

Police now see that there is a consistent similarity in all cases of DWI / DUI reported at roadside screening tests indication. They are now almost certain that this common theme is ...............................................................................
ALCOHOL

28 intruder cases going back to 2002 (till 2015?) isn't an awful lot by any statistics standard. Average 2 a year, furthermore of varying pattern, not following paedophile pattern is nothing at all.

No normal parents of a missing child would be buoyed by this line of enquiry, but the Mcs reportedly are.

If S&S were in K&G's shoes one wonders would they be happy if updated regularly by police they are following that line of enquiry that looks nothing remotely as if the Police is ever going to solve the case? Yet we are told repeatedly that Kate & Gerry are buoyed by the developments and are grateful for the continuity and for the conscientious works of the Police.

No genuine abducted child parents would be full of praise for Police for this kind of work....that leads nowhere, and seems to have no potential in getting to the abductor...

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