Re: "Meeting on the Maddie case between British police and Portuguese authorities"

by noseyparker 15.03.15 13:06

Tony Bennett wrote:
Mo wrote:Do you think then Tony that the U.K. Attorney-General's Department and the British Ambassador have been invited to clear the McCanns and Tapas 7 once and for all?
YES. I think DCI Nicola Wall will have presented her provisional conclusion to the meeting - "probably burglar who murdered Madeleine in G5A and then carried her off and was seen by the Smiths...unfortunately he may never be found" - and all those present at last week's meeting (who will I am sure have been heavily briefed from the highest level in both the U.K. and Portugal) were probably just there to discuss the timing of any formal announcement, possibly planning simultaneous announcements in both countries. It will be announced that both of the formal investigations (U.K. and Portugal) will be closed again -'unless there is new and credible evidence'. They might even be discussing how to announce the news on a 'good day to bury bad news'.

The McCanns will be informed well in advance and will be prepared, with a statement paying tribute to the Met Police for 'having done all that they possibly can', probably adding: 'But we still have hope...'

If that is whats happening wouldn,t their have to be an inquest by a coroner?

by **Tony Bennett** 15.03.15 13:10

noseyparker wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:
Mo wrote:Do you think then Tony that the U.K. Attorney-General's Department and the British Ambassador have been invited to clear the McCanns and Tapas 7 once and for all?
YES. I think DCI Nicola Wall will have presented her provisional conclusion to the meeting - "probably burglar who murdered Madeleine in G5A and then carried her off and was seen by the Smiths...unfortunately he may never be found" - and all those present at last week's meeting (who will I am sure have been heavily briefed from the highest level in both the U.K. and Portugal) were probably just there to discuss the timing of any formal announcement, possibly planning simultaneous announcements in both countries. It will be announced that both of the formal investigations (U.K. and Portugal) will be closed again -'unless there is new and credible evidence'. They might even be discussing how to announce the news on a 'good day to bury bad news'.

The McCanns will be informed well in advance and will be prepared, with a statement paying tribute to the Met Police for 'having done all that they possibly can', probably adding: 'But we still have hope...'
If that is what's happening, wouldn't there have to be an inquest by a Coroner?

NO.

No body, so no inquest in Portugal.

Did Madeleine go missing in the U.K. or within U.K. territorial waters? - No, so no inquest in the U.K.

P.S. Have you reconsidered your support for Robert Green yet?

by jeanmonroe 15.03.15 13:39

@TB

That leaves four possibilities, I think:

1. Operation Grange has finally decided who the abductor is, he is alive, and Grange wants the full co-operation of the Portuguese authorities to arrest, charge and prosecute him, or

2. Operation Grange has finally decided who the abductor is, he is dead, and Grange want the co-operation of the Portuguese police to rubber-stamp its identification of the abductor - with a view to a press conference and formal announcement to that effect in the coming weeks or months, or
-------------------------------------------------

He,.................. HE?

So the 'burglator' WAS a HE, then?

Despite Gerry McCann's 'statement' that 'the 'abductor' has 'been having a laff, these lat six years. He. SHE or THEY are still out there, waiting to strike again'?

HE, SHE or THEY, have NOT 'struck' AGAIN, since the 3rd May 2007, have they, Gerry?

Indeed HE, SHE, or THEY didn't 'strike' in the SEVEN years BEFORE the 3rd May 2007, did they, Gerry?
--------------------------------------------------------------

I think DCI Nicola Wall will have presented her provisional conclusion to the meeting - "probably burglar who murdered Madeleine in G5A and then carried her off and was seen by the Smiths...unfortunately he may never be found"
------------------------------------------------------

DCI Wall's 'provisional CONCLUSION'?

or is that

DCI Wall's PERSONAL 'conclusion'? (belief?)

WHY should DCI Wall's 'provisional/personal 'conclusion' be MORE 'acceptable' than GA's and PJ's 'conclusion'?

It wouldn't be and 'isn't', without 'concrete 'evidence', imo.

Finally,

How would this OG 'scenario' CLEAR the McCanns, their 'friends', or persons they 'know', and 'eliminate' them from possible 'involvement' in Madeleine's 'disappearance'?

Just one copper's 'say so' does NOT!

There's another, more senior, cop, who stated, in a UK court room, that '.........there is no 'evidence' to eliminate the McCann's from possible 'involvement' in Madeleine's 'disappearance'"

So WHICH 'copper' is RIGHT?

by noseyparker 15.03.15 13:55

Tony Bennett wrote:

P.S. Have you reconsidered your support for Robert Green yet?

This was a post about the Mccann,s not Robert Green.You seem to want to provoke some kind of reaction to previous posts on the Hollie Greig case,put your B.S. in the appropiate thread if you have anything relevant to ask.Thank you

by mysterion 15.03.15 14:29

The meeting is reported in the Sunday Express on line. Not allowing any comments. Don`t know the reason. Can`t do a link from my tablet.

by jeanmonroe 15.03.15 14:34

XTC wrote:
---------------------------------------------------------

Because DCI Wall had better be sure that the child in question was ACTUALLY IN in the place where it was alleged she was abducted or removed from

If not ( patsy's included ) any sharp lawyer is going to ask that question.

"Assumption" is useless in this case as there is no forensic evidence that Madeleine was in 5a.

Like the witnessing in general it's all hearsay. No objective proof.
----------------------------------------------

A super VALID 'point' by XTC.

And XTC's 'observation' puts DCI Wall's 'reputation and career' ON THE LINE!

All she 'knows' is that Madeleine McCann is 'missing'

NOT 'when, how or WHERE from'

Other than what she's been TOLD only by the parents of the 'missing' child.

Jane Tanner did NOT 'see' Madeleine McCann 'being abducted'

Matthew Oldfield did NOT 'see' Madeleine McCann,in her bed, in apartment, G5A.

The Smith 'family' did NOT 'see' Madeleine McCann 'being abducted'

The VERY 'last' person' to 'see' Madeleine, in her bed, in apartment, G5A, was (admitted on record) the now 'missing' child, was that child's own father, Gerry McCann. (so he says)

DCI Nicola Wall cannot, and, imo, would ever NOT, swear on oath, that Madeleine McCann WAS 'abducted' from apartment G5A.

So a 'provisional conclusion' from her that Madeleine 'was probably/might of been/could have been 'abducted' by a burglator, and 'removed' from apartment G5A' would not and could not, be upheld ANYWHERE as a satisfactory, or legally binding, 'outcome' to an almost 4 years, £11+ million 'investigation'

Otherwise GA's 'conclusions' might also be 'probably' RIGHT, also!

by jeanmonroe 15.03.15 15:09

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/564100/Madeleine-McCann-latest-Police-progress-crucial-summit-meeting-Portugal

Madeleine McCann inquiry: Police make progress at crucial summit meeting with Portuguese

BRITISH police have met with Portuguese prosecutors for a crucial summit meeting over the Madeleine McCann inquiry.

Published: 12:33, Sun, March 15, 2015

By John Twomey

Scotland Yard detectives had detailed discussions with the Portuguese over the vital next steps in the multi-million pound probe.

It is understood to be the first time officers from Operation Grange have met officials in Lisbon since 11 key witnesses were re-interviewed in December.

Similar meetings are planned for the near future as the eighth anniversary of Madeleine’s disappearance approaches.

The Metropolitan Police declined to comment on the latest summit. A spokesman said: “We are not providing a running commentary.”

Madeleine’s parents Kate and Gerry are given regular updates on progress of the investigation.

In their last public message, the couple, from Rothley, Leicestershire, said: “It’s very apparent that the determination of the Metropolitan Police remains steadfast.”

Operation Grange was set up in 2011 after the McCanns appealed directly to Prime Minister David Cameron and Home Secretary Theresa May.

So far, it was cost around £10 million.

Madeleine was three when she vanished from the family’s holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on the Algarve in May 2007.

Former GP Mrs McCann and her heart doctor husband, both 46, have never given up hope that their daughter is still alive.

by aiyoyo 15.03.15 15:15

NickE wrote:A working meeting with the Portuguese authorities to strengthen cooperation in searches.

By Tania Laranjo
"Hour and a half meeting. The stage was the Attorney General's Office; the protagonists, British and Portuguese authorities. The goal was the same as has already caused other such meetings. Strengthen the link between the authorities of both countries, cementing bonds that allow a joint investigation to clarify the Maddie case. The leader of the British police team, Nicola Wall, was one of attending the meeting. The side of the Judicial Police, the representation was taken by Pedro do Carmo magistrate, assistant national director. Also the attorney general district and the investigation of the holder which remains open in Faro County were present.
It was also asked to participate a representative of the Attorney General of the English Republic and the British ambassador. This was the second meeting of Nicola Wall with the highest representatives of the process.
The English provincial happened late last year to Andy Redwood, who retired from the Metropolitan Police Service. Nicola Wall transferred from the Homicide and Serious Crimes division to Grange operation, investigating the disappearance of British child, the May 3, 2007, the room where he slept with two twin brothers, younger, in an apartment of a tourist village, in Praia da Luz in the Algarve.
The case was closed and then reopened, but nothing new was found, all scenarios remain open".

Translated with google.
Ler mais em: http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/nacional/portugal/detalhe/pgr_recebe_ingleses.html

Thanks Nick E.

To summarise from that:

Meeting venue was at Attorney General's office

In attendance :
Portuguese side -
Pedro do Carmo, Magistrate
Assistant National Director
District Attorney General
Chief Investigator - Faro County

UK side
DCI Nicola Wall
Attorney General
British Ambassador

Second meeting of this kind (with highest authorities ) by DCI Wall since she succeeded Redwood.

It is not the usual periodic operational meeting between PJ and Met Police.
Given the designation of the attendees, it was a meeting involving people with the power to decide if the case can go forward to prosecution ie strength of case for court.

Involving the British Ambassador in the judiciary/law enforcement agencies meeting is a stange one. Why would they need the British Ambassador there unless it has got to do with containing diplomatic issue - relationship sensitive issue - between the two countries.

Meeting with Magistrate/Prosecutor is a good sign, involving British Ambassador is also a good sign imv. Since if this is about prosecuting a swarthy smelly binman / burglar / foreigner oddball there would be no need to involve the British Ambassador.

They have got to be looking at a prosecutable case against UK citizen/s to have involved diplomat.

by stillsloppingout 15.03.15 23:03

aiyoyo wrote:
NickE wrote:A working meeting with the Portuguese authorities to strengthen cooperation in searches.

By Tania Laranjo
"Hour and a half meeting. The stage was the Attorney General's Office; the protagonists, British and Portuguese authorities. The goal was the same as has already caused other such meetings. Strengthen the link between the authorities of both countries, cementing bonds that allow a joint investigation to clarify the Maddie case. The leader of the British police team, Nicola Wall, was one of attending the meeting. The side of the Judicial Police, the representation was taken by Pedro do Carmo magistrate, assistant national director. Also the attorney general district and the investigation of the holder which remains open in Faro County were present.
It was also asked to participate a representative of the Attorney General of the English Republic and the British ambassador. This was the second meeting of Nicola Wall with the highest representatives of the process.
The English provincial happened late last year to Andy Redwood, who retired from the Metropolitan Police Service. Nicola Wall transferred from the Homicide and Serious Crimes division to Grange operation, investigating the disappearance of British child, the May 3, 2007, the room where he slept with two twin brothers, younger, in an apartment of a tourist village, in Praia da Luz in the Algarve.
The case was closed and then reopened, but nothing new was found, all scenarios remain open".

Translated with google.
Ler mais em: http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/nacional/portugal/detalhe/pgr_recebe_ingleses.html

Thanks Nick E.

To summarise from that:

Meeting venue was at Attorney General's office

In attendance :
Portuguese side -
Pedro do Carmo, Magistrate
Assistant National Director
District Attorney General
Chief Investigator - Faro County

UK side
DCI Nicola Wall
Attorney General
British Ambassador

Second meeting of this kind (with highest authorities ) by DCI Wall since she succeeded Redwood.

It is not the usual periodic operational meeting between PJ and Met Police.
Given the designation of the attendees, it was a meeting involving people with the power to decide if the case can go forward to prosecution ie strength of case for court.

Involving the British Ambassador in the judiciary/law enforcement agencies meeting is a stange one. Why would they need the British Ambassador there unless it has got to do with containing diplomatic issue - relationship sensitive issue - between the two countries.

Meeting with Magistrate/Prosecutor is a good sign, involving British Ambassador is also a good sign imv. Since if this is about prosecuting a swarthy smelly binman / burglar / foreigner oddball there would be no need to involve the British Ambassador.

They have got to be looking at a prosecutable case against UK citizen/s to have involved diplomat.

It would appear to be the case . but nothing would surprize me anymore .
The problem as has been alluded to , if they conclude a whitewash , what happens if , a body turns up ?, irrefutable evidence turns up? . a Tapas gang member goes mad and shouts from the roof tops .? .

Nearly everybody I talk to thinks they are involved now in some way , simply because as has been pointed out to me , there is no proof that they did NOT do it . Logical really .

by maebee 16.03.15 0:08

Madeleine was three when she vanished from the family’s holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on the Algarve in May 2007.

An improvement on "abducted".

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 0:16

"Similar meetings are planned for the near future as the eighth anniversary of Madeleine’s disappearance approaches."
----------------------------------------------

"meetings ARE 'planned' for the near FUTURE......"

So, no 'UTMOST pressing URGENCY' to 'find' a 'live' Madeleine BEFORE 3rd May 2015, 'eighth anniversary' by 38 full time police/staff at OG, and rescue her from her 'hellish lair' within 10kms of PDL?

The 'cat' (FINALLY?) out of 'the bag' with regards to £11+million, taxpayer funded, 'investigation' at OG?

They are NOT 'looking for/searching for' a 'live' Madeleine. imo.

They (OG) 'know', that we 'know', that they have not, never have, and are not, 'searching' for a 'live' Madeleine, imo.

So WHY keep up the 'pretence'? (of pretendy 'searches')

WHY?

What do Cameron and May really 'know' about this 'case'? (if anything?)

If i were T May, allocating/authorising, PUBLIC money, £6,778, daily, to this 'investigation', i'd be 'asking' OG, DCI Wall, EVERY week, nae, EVERY DAY, what have you 'discovered' today?

Perhaps an e-mail to the Public Accounts Commitee might 'chivvy' things along!

thinking

by maebee 16.03.15 0:18

what happens if a body turns up ?

Not gonna happen:( Well disposed of, imo).

a Tapas gang member goes mad and shouts from the roof tops .?

Why hasn't this happened before now? 8 years and not a word of truth from any one of the 9. It's up to Nicola Wall now.

by G-Unit 16.03.15 0:43

maebee wrote:
what happens if a body turns up ?

Not gonna happen:( Well disposed of, imo).

a Tapas gang member goes mad and shouts from the roof tops .?

Why hasn't this happened before now? 8 years and not a word of truth from any one of the 9. It's up to Nicola Wall now.

Maybe it's up to the PJ who have been following their own lines of investigation? I wonder who 'called' the meeting? Was it the Portugese authorities who have found something and invited everyone? Perhaps they are calling the shots.

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 0:46

As PMac 'pointed' out there are NOW FOUR, high 'profile', women (HM, lead investigator, PJ, of 're-opened' case, the new AG and the 'Judge' at libel case and DCI Wall, a 25 year, 'career' cop at OG) 'involved' in this 'case'

All of which are probably not 'emanoured, taken in', by 'fluttering' eyes, 'theatricals' from a certain er, 'someone'

Or 'impressed', in the least, by a certain 'Jock the lad'! (who changes his 'story' at almost every 'interview' he gives)

Can you 'imagine' the 'scene' at Rothley Towers, if, IF, these people were 'nailed' by a 'little' WOMAN? (DCI Wall)

I can almost 'hear' Tiny Tear's ballistic 'effing and blinding' 'now'.

Can't wait! winkwink

by G-Unit 16.03.15 0:53

I wonder what one calls a female who questions one? F***ing T***er wouldn't do, would it?
laughat

by fz2 16.03.15 0:57

jeanmonroe wrote:As PMac 'pointed' out there are NOW FOUR, high 'profile', women (HM, lead investigator, PJ, of 're-opened' case, the new AG and the 'Judge' at libel case and DCI Wall, a 25 year, 'career' cop at OG) 'involved' in this 'case'

All of which are probably not 'emanoured, taken in', by 'fluttering' eyes, 'theatricals' from a certain er, 'someone'

Or 'impressed', in the least, by a certain 'Jock the lad'! (who changes his 'story' at almost every 'interview' he gives)

Can you 'imagine' the 'scene' at Rothley Towers, if, IF, these people were 'nailed' by a 'little' WOMAN? (DCI Wall)

I can almost 'hear' Tiny Tear's ballistic 'effing and blinding' 'now'.

Can't wait!

Sorry for being pedantic but your over use of inverted commas and SHOUTING.......oops button it

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 1:22

fz2 wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:As PMac 'pointed' out there are NOW FOUR, high 'profile', women (HM, lead investigator, PJ, of 're-opened' case, the new AG and the 'Judge' at libel case and DCI Wall, a 25 year, 'career' cop at OG) 'involved' in this 'case'

All of which are probably not 'emanoured, taken in', by 'fluttering' eyes, 'theatricals' from a certain er, 'someone'

Or 'impressed', in the least, by a certain 'Jock the lad'! (who changes his 'story' at almost every 'interview' he gives)

Can you 'imagine' the 'scene' at Rothley Towers, if, IF, these people were 'nailed' by a 'little' WOMAN? (DCI Wall)

I can almost 'hear' Tiny Tear's ballistic 'effing and blinding' 'now'.

Can't wait!
Sorry for being pedantic but your over use of inverted commas and SHOUTING.......oops button it

OK, boss!

Oh, hang on,
=================================

fz2 wrote:

Searcher wrote:Could someone way what this headline means in terms of law? "Court reveals today proved matter .."?

(fz2) wrote:

Substitute "proved" with "provided".
===================================

A reply from YOU, to Searcher, above, with TWO, out of FOUR, words, in inverted commas!

POT, KETTLE, BLACK, i'd say!

Welcome to the forum........ 'Kate'!

by fz2 16.03.15 1:34

jeanmonroe wrote:
fz2 wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:As PMac 'pointed' out there are NOW FOUR, high 'profile', women (HM, lead investigator, PJ, of 're-opened' case, the new AG and the 'Judge' at libel case and DCI Wall, a 25 year, 'career' cop at OG) 'involved' in this 'case'

All of which are probably not 'emanoured, taken in', by 'fluttering' eyes, 'theatricals' from a certain er, 'someone'

Or 'impressed', in the least, by a certain 'Jock the lad'! (who changes his 'story' at almost every 'interview' he gives)

Can you 'imagine' the 'scene' at Rothley Towers, if, IF, these people were 'nailed' by a 'little' WOMAN? (DCI Wall)

I can almost 'hear' Tiny Tear's ballistic 'effing and blinding' 'now'.

Can't wait!
Sorry for being pedantic but your over use of inverted commas and SHOUTING.......oops button it

OK, boss!

Oh, hang on,
=================================

fz2 wrote:

Searcher wrote:Could someone way what this headline means in terms of law? "Court reveals today proved matter .."?

(fz2) wrote:

Substitute "proved" with "provided".
===================================

A reply from YOU, to Searcher, above, with TWO, out of FOUR, words, in inverted commas!

POT, KETTLE, BLACK, i'd say!

Welcome to the forum........ 'Kate'!

Anyone with English literacy would understand why I used inverted commas in that post.

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 1:42

Now, now, 'Kate', i'm old and not as literate as you, and can't write very good Queen's england.

by fz2 16.03.15 1:45

jeanmonroe wrote:Now, now, 'Kate', i'm old and not as literate as you, and can't write very good Queen's england.

Nice one, just don't give up your day job in favour of stand up comedy.

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 1:54

fz2 wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:Now, now, 'Kate', i'm old and not as literate as you, and can't write very good Queen's england.
Nice one, just don't give up your day job in favour of stand up comedy.

Two old ladies walking on the beach

A streaker ran past (or is that passed?)

One had a stroke, the other one, couldn't reach!

ps: I'm still sitting down!

by ultimaThule 16.03.15 2:01

G-Unit wrote:I wonder what one calls a female who questions one? F***ing T***er wouldn't do, would it?

Sometimes calling a female who is ~~one sly bitch~~ beyond the pale 'a F**ing T**ser,' or T***rette as the case may be, ain't gonna cut the mustard and it happens that ya gotta put your money where your big mouth is.

For my money jm may be loud, may be strident, may over egg the pudding but, while her heart's in the right place, she's got my vote. thumbup

Shine on ,jeanm, you crazy diamond... you'll still be sparkling vhen others have lost their lustre.

by lj 16.03.15 2:25

Jean our voice of common sense Mrs

by jeanmonroe 16.03.15 2:37

fz2 wrote:

"Anyone with English literacy would understand why I used inverted commas in that post."
================================================

I don't 'understand' (soz)

I'm just a 'thick' (soz again) bitch! daft1

by fz2 16.03.15 2:54

jeanmonroe wrote:fz2 wrote:

"Anyone with English literacy would understand why I used inverted commas in that post."
================================================

I don't 'understand' (soz)

I'm just a 'thick' (soz again) bitch!

Your interpritation of yourself.

"Meeting on the Maddie case between British police and Portuguese authorities"