Re: Gerry McCann's brother-in-law, Tony Rickwood, removes his depraved images of women drowning from an internet site

by Smokeandmirrors 24.12.13 0:07

plebgate wrote:How many more times are we going to hear the words witch hunt. Boring imo.

IMO there is no witch hunt. Tony and others have researched this man and his website and reported their findings.

Witch hunt don't make me laugh!

Seems to me a certain few are making a witch hunt against Tony because of his research about this man.

Exactly, and one wonders why. Where do their "interests" lie I wonder? If people want to support the creation of images portraying women floundering to an almost certain death as "creative" or "artistic", well that's their free will being exercised, but just think how you'd feel if your wife or daughter or mother had her picture incorporated into such imagery for a bunch of fetishists on the internet. It would take on a different complexion then.

by plebgate 24.12.13 0:09

It sure would Smoke and Mirrors, it sure would.

by chillyheat 24.12.13 0:11

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"I Knew nothing about anything...Honest!..And anyway, my husband had limited access to computers as I was busy worrying about my next holiday. I used the computer for Trip Advisor. Its important to write reviews about trips...Even though Madeleine had recently disappeared"

by plebgate 24.12.13 0:14

First thing I would do is google the name of a person being brought into the family and if I found that they had what I believe to be an" unsavoury hobby" I would certainly avoid that person and strongly advise the family member to do the same.

by ProfessorPPlum 24.12.13 1:01

I just think it's a pity that an intelligent contributor gets thrown off because someone decides he/she is being abusive. What I saw was Veritas's growing frustration with people not dealing head-on with points he/she (can I stop that and just say 'he'?) made. And behind all that, a discomfort with the speed at which people concluded TR to have used his (unproven) photoshop skills to manipulate key MM images (unproven).

It was also a pity that as soon as the majority here didn't like his line of questioning (at least it seemed this way to me), they started to find fault with him: his intelligence, his supposed terrible insults - to the point where people started saying, whether joking or serious I don't know, that he = Blacksmith. Someone else decided that because he didn't agree with the majority, it must be proof that his agenda is to stop Tony Bennett asking questions about Rickwood.

Put another way, Veritas being booted off this forum is likely to to support the point Blacksmith was making in his most recent piece.

by BlondSurfer 24.12.13 1:21

Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.

by Cristobell 24.12.13 1:32

Smokeandmirrors wrote:
plebgate wrote:How many more times are we going to hear the words witch hunt. Boring imo.

IMO there is no witch hunt. Tony and others have researched this man and his website and reported their findings.

Witch hunt don't make me laugh!

Seems to me a certain few are making a witch hunt against Tony because of his research about this man.

Exactly, and one wonders why. Where do their "interests" lie I wonder? If people want to support the creation of images portraying women floundering to an almost certain death as "creative" or "artistic", well that's their free will being exercised, but just think how you'd feel if your wife or daughter or mother had her picture incorporated into such imagery for a bunch of fetishists on the internet. It would take on a different complexion then.

What artists create is beyond our control Smokeandmirrors - we either like it or we don't, or of course we might just be completely indifferent. To imply our indifference equates to our having deviant interests of our own is a bit harsh. As juicy as the subject matter is, I have not visited the deviant art site because there are other aspects of this case that interest me more. As indeed do wider debates outside of this forum.

Unfortunately the notion of 'women in peril' has formed part of art, literature and popular culture since time began, and there may even be cave drawings of women tied to rocks while giant predators loomed. It is a fantasy firmly entrenched in our culture, indeed it is dominant in cultures throughout the world, usually ending with the Prince rescuing the Princess and everyone living happily ever after. Rickwood's strange hobby may simply be a follow on from those ideas, though I don't recall anyone mentioning any heroic rescue.

I am not defending him, he appears to be within the inner circle and I hope that Scotland Yard are investigating this aspect thoroughly.

by **tigger** 24.12.13 5:27

Cristobell wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:
plebgate wrote:How many more times are we going to hear the words witch hunt. Boring imo.

IMO there is no witch hunt. Tony and others have researched this man and his website and reported their findings.

Witch hunt don't make me laugh!

Seems to me a certain few are making a witch hunt against Tony because of his research about this man.

Exactly, and one wonders why. Where do their "interests" lie I wonder? If people want to support the creation of images portraying women floundering to an almost certain death as "creative" or "artistic", well that's their free will being exercised, but just think how you'd feel if your wife or daughter or mother had her picture incorporated into such imagery for a bunch of fetishists on the internet. It would take on a different complexion then.
What artists create is beyond our control Smokeandmirrors - we either like it or we don't, or of course we might just be completely indifferent. To imply our indifference equates to our having deviant interests of our own is a bit harsh. As juicy as the subject matter is, I have not visited the deviant art site because there are other aspects of this case that interest me more. As indeed do wider debates outside of this forum.

Unfortunately the notion of 'women in peril' has formed part of art, literature and popular culture since time began, and there may even be cave drawings of women tied to rocks while giant predators loomed. It is a fantasy firmly entrenched in our culture, indeed it is dominant in cultures throughout the world, usually ending with the Prince rescuing the Princess and everyone living happily ever after. Rickwood's strange hobby may simply be a follow on from those ideas, though I don't recall anyone mentioning any heroic rescue.

I am not defending him, he appears to be within the inner circle and I hope that Scotland Yard are investigating this aspect thoroughly.

I think your basic premise is wrong here. You speak of 'artists' so I presume you think Rickwood is an artist. Drawing a picture doesn't make you an artist anymore than writing a poem makes you a poet. Or taking photographs makes one a photographer.
Rickwood has learned to press a number of buttons to create images so we can see the results of his limited imagination.
That's it.

There are many people who can draw and paint - such as the street artists who will draw a portrait in half an hour but that's not art. Art is like a language you can learn but if you have nothing to say it's not art. This applies equally to the art of writing which is why biographies rarely if ever, win prizes, It's writing - such as 'madeleine' but it ain't literature.

by **Tony Bennett** 24.12.13 7:13

BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female I have known her forum persona for a good few years,

Ah! So she has a 'forum persona'. So she develops a special identity for the forum?

she is a very clever (brainy) person.

I've never seen evidence of that on this forum. I saw someone who tied herself in knots over Rickwood. I saw someone who was capable of a great deal of venom against others. I saw someone who easily became angry and used convoluted long paragraphs to express that anger

She is a bit fiery

Unpleasant, and rude to others

but she's an ok kind of woman.

According to 'BlondSurfer'

by **Tony Bennett** 24.12.13 7:20

Cristobell wrote:
Unfortunately the notion of 'women in peril' has formed part of art, literature and popular culture since time began, and there may even be cave drawings of women tied to rocks while giant predators loomed.

Well, no, there aren't

It is a fantasy firmly entrenched in our culture, indeed it is dominant in cultures throughout the world,

Dominant?

usually ending with the Prince rescuing the Princess and everyone living happily ever after. Rickwood's strange hobby may simply be a follow on from those ideas,

Merely a 'cultural thing', then?

though I don't recall anyone mentioning any heroic rescue.

Indeed, very much to the contrary, Cristobell, giving his 'artwork' titles such as:

"Helpless"

"Sinking fast"

"OMG!"

"Chillin'", and

"No escape".

by Guest 24.12.13 7:35

BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.

According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

by aiyoyo 24.12.13 7:46

tigger wrote:
Cristobell wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:
plebgate wrote:How many more times are we going to hear the words witch hunt. Boring imo.

IMO there is no witch hunt. Tony and others have researched this man and his website and reported their findings.

Witch hunt don't make me laugh!

Seems to me a certain few are making a witch hunt against Tony because of his research about this man.

Exactly, and one wonders why. Where do their "interests" lie I wonder? If people want to support the creation of images portraying women floundering to an almost certain death as "creative" or "artistic", well that's their free will being exercised, but just think how you'd feel if your wife or daughter or mother had her picture incorporated into such imagery for a bunch of fetishists on the internet. It would take on a different complexion then.
What artists create is beyond our control Smokeandmirrors - we either like it or we don't, or of course we might just be completely indifferent. To imply our indifference equates to our having deviant interests of our own is a bit harsh. As juicy as the subject matter is, I have not visited the deviant art site because there are other aspects of this case that interest me more. As indeed do wider debates outside of this forum.

Unfortunately the notion of 'women in peril' has formed part of art, literature and popular culture since time began, and there may even be cave drawings of women tied to rocks while giant predators loomed. It is a fantasy firmly entrenched in our culture, indeed it is dominant in cultures throughout the world, usually ending with the Prince rescuing the Princess and everyone living happily ever after. Rickwood's strange hobby may simply be a follow on from those ideas, though I don't recall anyone mentioning any heroic rescue.

I am not defending him, he appears to be within the inner circle and I hope that Scotland Yard are investigating this aspect thoroughly.

I think your basic premise is wrong here. You speak of 'artists' so I presume you think Rickwood is an artist. Drawing a picture doesn't make you an artist anymore than writing a poem makes you a poet. Or taking photographs makes one a photographer.
Rickwood has learned to press a number of buttons to create images so we can see the results of his limited imagination.
That's it.

There are many people who can draw and paint - such as the street artists who will draw a portrait in half an hour but that's not art. Art is like a language you can learn but if you have nothing to say it's not art. This applies equally to the art of writing which is why biographies rarely if ever, win prizes, It's writing - such as 'madeleine' but it ain't literature.

I second that Tigger.
The production of some images out of fetish impulses of woman sucked into quicksand does not an artist made, neither is that sort of fetish mainstream.

by **Tony Bennett** 24.12.13 7:57

admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

So BlondSurfer is a liar?

Should a deliberate liar remain a forum member?

by Guest 24.12.13 8:00

Tony Bennett wrote:
admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

So BlondSurfer is a liar?

Should a deliberate liar remain a forum member?

Hmmmm.....let me think. She's contributing quite a bit to the games threads Tony. Important stuff, that.

by **Tony Bennett** 24.12.13 8:11

admin wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:
admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

So BlondSurfer is a liar?

Should a deliberate liar remain a forum member?
Hmmmm.....let me think. She's contributing quite a bit to the games threads Tony. Important stuff, that.

BlondSurfer's history here:

1. Joined 30 January 2012. Six days before my contempt of court trial began. Made a post saying s/he was 'going to have a nosey around'.

2. On the same day, made five posts on five different games threads - then never contrributed to them again.

3. A four-word post on 27 October 2013.

4. Then lies about Veritas being a 'very' clever woman.

That's her/his 8 posts so far!

by **tigger** 24.12.13 8:30

admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

So few options! Can we also have hermaphrodite? winkwink

@Bobbin: I need a much bigger screen ...........

by bobbin 24.12.13 8:35

Smokeandmirrors wrote:It's a shame Blacksmith needs to resort to bile and vulgarity.

I might have missed this bit. Which page is the BS writing on. It's a fast moving thread. friends

by bobbin 24.12.13 8:39

tigger wrote:
admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

So few options! Can we also have hermaphrodite?

@Bobbin: I need a much bigger screen ...........

Other options - 'Don't know.'
re screen, would a Wide Cinema Screen do ? There's 10 of them in town, all under one big roof.

by BlondSurfer 24.12.13 8:43

admin wrote:
BlondSurfer wrote:Just to say.

Veritas is female i have known her forum persona for a good few years,she is a very clever (brainy) person.She is a bit fiery but she's an ok kind of woman.
According to his email address he's not a woman.
Muratfan likes to pretend he's a woman too.
Confusion is good, though, apparently.

I knew Veritas from "The Mirror forum" if it is someone using her name then that is not my fault.The way the poster posted came across as the Veritas that i knew from the poster i knew from the "Mirror" and other forums.

by aiyoyo 24.12.13 8:44

bobbin wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:It's a shame Blacksmith needs to resort to bile and vulgarity.
I might have missed this bit. Which page is the BS writing on. It's a fast moving thread.

On Blacksmith thread.
Warning: enter at your own peril!
Not pleasant at all, BS has descended to BB JATYK level.

by bobbin 24.12.13 8:48

aiyoyo wrote:
bobbin wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:It's a shame Blacksmith needs to resort to bile and vulgarity.
I might have missed this bit. Which page is the BS writing on. It's a fast moving thread.

On Blacksmith thread.
Warning: enter at your own peril!
Not pleasant at all, BS has descended to BB JATYK level.

Thanks aiyoyo, I'll go and look after I've had a strong cup of boiling water, with apple cider vinegar and Mediterranean herbs, and of course, my apple a day. Should be up to facing it then. big grin

by Smokeandmirrors 24.12.13 9:00

Arm yourself with disinfectant to sanitise your pc/laptop afterwards.

by plebgate 24.12.13 9:13

Keep up your excellent research Tony and others, it does seem to have hit a nerve with quite a few. smilie

by Bishop Brennan 24.12.13 9:50

Not much news on the forums these days. The top 2 threads on in the 'latest news' are not actually news at all...! I guess SY and PJ are enjoying the Festive Season. party

by Cristobell 24.12.13 10:42

tigger wrote:
Cristobell wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:
plebgate wrote:How many more times are we going to hear the words witch hunt. Boring imo.

IMO there is no witch hunt. Tony and others have researched this man and his website and reported their findings.

Witch hunt don't make me laugh!

Seems to me a certain few are making a witch hunt against Tony because of his research about this man.

Exactly, and one wonders why. Where do their "interests" lie I wonder? If people want to support the creation of images portraying women floundering to an almost certain death as "creative" or "artistic", well that's their free will being exercised, but just think how you'd feel if your wife or daughter or mother had her picture incorporated into such imagery for a bunch of fetishists on the internet. It would take on a different complexion then.
What artists create is beyond our control Smokeandmirrors - we either like it or we don't, or of course we might just be completely indifferent. To imply our indifference equates to our having deviant interests of our own is a bit harsh. As juicy as the subject matter is, I have not visited the deviant art site because there are other aspects of this case that interest me more. As indeed do wider debates outside of this forum.

Unfortunately the notion of 'women in peril' has formed part of art, literature and popular culture since time began, and there may even be cave drawings of women tied to rocks while giant predators loomed. It is a fantasy firmly entrenched in our culture, indeed it is dominant in cultures throughout the world, usually ending with the Prince rescuing the Princess and everyone living happily ever after. Rickwood's strange hobby may simply be a follow on from those ideas, though I don't recall anyone mentioning any heroic rescue.

I am not defending him, he appears to be within the inner circle and I hope that Scotland Yard are investigating this aspect thoroughly.

I think your basic premise is wrong here. You speak of 'artists' so I presume you think Rickwood is an artist. Drawing a picture doesn't make you an artist anymore than writing a poem makes you a poet. Or taking photographs makes one a photographer.
Rickwood has learned to press a number of buttons to create images so we can see the results of his limited imagination.
That's it.

There are many people who can draw and paint - such as the street artists who will draw a portrait in half an hour but that's not art. Art is like a language you can learn but if you have nothing to say it's not art. This applies equally to the art of writing which is why biographies rarely if ever, win prizes, It's writing - such as 'madeleine' but it ain't literature.

I am not sure why you are being so precious over the use of the word Art. You state the work of street artists is not 'art' - perhaps you can tell us what it is?

Perhaps you could also tell us how to distinguish between what can be classified as art and what cannot. Does a painting become Art once it has been recognised by the establishment? Until then does it remain in the 'not art' pile?

To be honest I dislike elitism in art and music, to me a splodgy drawing a 5 year old brings home from school is as much a precious work of art as a Rembrant.

You don't consider Rickwood an artist, your prerogative, but some do, it matters not one jot to me either way.

Gerry McCann's brother-in-law, Tony Rickwood, removes his depraved images of women drowning from an internet site