Re: Ben Needham cold case is reopened by British police

by **tigger** 20.10.12 15:42

Finn wrote:
bristow wrote:'Notoriously unreliable' eh?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2219429/Ben-Needham-search-If-Bens-bones-life-over.html#ixzz29l2Idkuw

So distressing. A mother whose life is finished if she discovers her son is dead.

A digger driver who came forward having excavated on that day and builders who swore that wet cement had been tampered with.

You'd have to ask why these issues weren't addressed on the day and what good it was to leave people still wondering 20 years on.

I think the 'uncle' was very young himself? Early teens I seem to remember. There were also reports of Ben having been seen in the company of gipsies.
Even so, it's very strange to come up with that evidence and that nothing was done at the time.

by Guest 22.10.12 20:38

Heartbreaking video here on link below, of Ben's mom making an emotional appeal..........

http://news.sky.com/story/1001000/ben-needhams-mother-makes-emotional-plea

Ben Needham's Mother Makes Emotional Plea

Kerry Needham says she believes her son is alive and pleads with anyone who knows where he is to "help end my family's pain".

by **PeterMac** 22.10.12 22:29

I watched it. And found it very distressing that she has allowed herself to continue to "believe" in something so irrational for 21 years, to the extent that she has already said that when the truth is revealed "her life will be over".
Sadly I think that my be a very simple prediction.
Her body language, her shaking hands, tremulous voice and so on, was convincingly real.
I believe she is urgent need of psychiatric help.

by Guest 22.10.12 22:41

PeterMac wrote:I watched it. And found it very distressing that she has allowed herself to continue to "believe" in something so irrational for 21 years, to the extent that she has already said that when the truth is revealed "her life will be over".
Sadly I think that my be a very simple prediction.
Her body language, her shaking hands, tremulous voice and so on, was convincingly real.
I believe she is urgent need of psychiatric help.

***
I think so too. Reading from a paper ... shaking and shivering ... the truth may be soon upon her ...
I was only slightly worried at her stressing that the family couldn't be involved ...

by Guest 22.10.12 23:44

Châtelaine wrote:
PeterMac wrote:I watched it. And found it very distressing that she has allowed herself to continue to "believe" in something so irrational for 21 years, to the extent that she has already said that when the truth is revealed "her life will be over".
Sadly I think that my be a very simple prediction.
Her body language, her shaking hands, tremulous voice and so on, was convincingly real.
I believe she is urgent need of psychiatric help.
***
I think so too. Reading from a paper ... shaking and shivering ... the truth may be soon upon her ...
I was only slightly worried at her stressing that the family couldn't be involved ...

Chatelaine, I didn't hear that?? Perhaps I am tired, but listened again ???

by Guest 22.10.12 23:50

There's nowhere in this short clip that she says that the family couldn't be involved.

by dragonfly 23.10.12 0:10

Jean wrote:There's nowhere in this short clip that she says that the family couldn't be involved.

hi Jean I think she meant that she is stressing 'thinking her family could be involved not actually said

by dragonfly 23.10.12 0:16

Châtelaine wrote:
PeterMac wrote:I watched it. And found it very distressing that she has allowed herself to continue to "believe" in something so irrational for 21 years, to the extent that she has already said that when the truth is revealed "her life will be over".
Sadly I think that my be a very simple prediction.
Her body language, her shaking hands, tremulous voice and so on, was convincingly real.
I believe she is urgent need of psychiatric help.
***
I think so too. Reading from a paper ... shaking and shivering ... the truth may be soon upon her ...
I was only slightly worried at her stressing that the family couldn't be involved ...

I know you should not comment until you have walked in another persons shoes, but from my understanding from reading other missing peoples stories , I have read some people would prefer some sort of closure even with the worst news than the pro longed agony of never knowing ,

by Guest 23.10.12 0:19

I can only say that's not the impression I get, Dragonfly. She is adamant that her son is alive and she begs that people help to end her family's suffering.

It is so sad that after all these years she hasn't been able to come to terms with the fact that Ben is almost certainly dead and to move on for the sake of her daughter.

I agree that she needs psychiatric help.

by dragonfly 23.10.12 0:34

Jean wrote:I can only say that's not the impression I get, Dragonfly. She is adamant that her son is alive and she begs that people help to end her family's suffering.

It is so sad that after all these years she hasn't been able to come to terms with the fact that Ben is almost certainly dead and to move on for the sake of her daughter.

I agree that she needs psychiatric help.

Jean That video wont upload fir me I have not seen it, I was just stating what I thought the other poster thought, Kerry is aware of the theory of the bike accident as seen on this video

by aiyoyo 23.10.12 4:03

Her body language is in total contrast to the other pair. Hers is genuine just as the other pair is contrived.

by Guest 23.10.12 6:06

There can sometimes be a difference between one's private thoughts and a public disclosure. In this distressing interview Kerry's lips are saying one thing and her voice and body language is saying another.

I'd quite frankly question the need to disclose the clip to the media in the first place. How far does this type of thing need to go exactly?

by sami 23.10.12 7:19

aiyoyo wrote:Her body language is in total contrast to the other pair. Hers is genuine just as the other pair is contrived.

Aiyoyo, I agree. When I saw Kerry Needham on tv my heart broke. She is truly distressed and clearly in turmoil. It is a case of be careful of what you wish for. She wants her child found, I do not think she knows any longer what a "good" outcome would be.

When the McCanns use excuses about Kate not being maternal enough, as the reason for the public doubting them, she really should look at that footage of Kerry. I am not suggesting everybody should act in the same manner and personally I could do without looking at such terrible tragedy on t.v. It might explain in some small way to the McCanns though where people are coming from. There is no arrogance, no real talk of herself. She mentions her family, acknowledges the people of Kos who are helping. So quite apart from the physical emotions, Kerry Needhams words are so very heartfellt and true. Quite obviously not scripted by a PR spokesperson, not defensive and straight from the heart. She does not care what questions are asked about her or of her, she wants the answer to only one question - where is her child. That is the difference for me between the two women, for me.

by bobbin 23.10.12 8:49

dragonfly wrote:
Jean wrote:I can only say that's not the impression I get, Dragonfly. She is adamant that her son is alive and she begs that people help to end her family's suffering.

It is so sad that after all these years she hasn't been able to come to terms with the fact that Ben is almost certainly dead and to move on for the sake of her daughter.

I agree that she needs psychiatric help.

Jean That video wont upload fir me I have not seen it, I was just stating what I thought the other poster thought, Kerry is aware of the theory of the bike accident as seen on this video

Det. Supt. Matt Fenwick, of South Yorkshire police, strikes me as one of the best and most sympathetic allies to have running this search.
I don't blame Kerry for holding on to her belief and hope.
How many of us could actually sit down and say, OK, on the basis that so much time has now passed, we'll now take it that our child must be dead.
We'd better just forget about him/her and get on with the rest of our lives.
I couldn't. I'd need proof of the death, beyond any doubt whatsoever, before I could stop looking.
And I would be thinking of the life and things that such a child would be doing now, somewhere in the world.
Kerry is a 'looker', searching and searching, unlike some who just 'purport' to be searching.
Some want an answer, some already know the answer. Ben Needham cold case is reopened by British police - Page 3 173510

Ben Needham cold case is reopened by British police - Page 3 173510

AIMO

by aiyoyo 23.10.12 10:08

Exactly, and Kerry Needham whatever be her profession is eloquent, and put the point across very well that she will never stop looking until she knows what happened to Ben, and will do all she can to find him even if it means supporting and helping the Police all the way, whatever option the Police are exploring she went along. The emotion of congruent came across clearly.

Unlike a certain pair, where that woman (a doctor!) can't even string a sentence...all the hmm...ing...ermmm. ing and..rolling of eyes, heavy sighing, hand on chest, all play acting the madam in distress while grabbing the hand and crotch of her partner (another doctor with a permanent cocky smug) giving out the message "look at ME, POOR ME", nothing congruent in her words, a sign her words were far removed from her inner thoughts and feelings. She just cannot project the words with conviction because she was not speaking the truth, and that's the simple truth.

by bobbin 23.10.12 10:35

aiyoyo wrote:Exactly, and Kerry Needham whatever be her profession is eloquent, and put the point across very well that she will never stop looking until she knows what happened to Ben, and will do all she can to find him even if it means supporting and helping the Police all the way, whatever option the Police are exploring she went along. The emotion of congruent came across clearly.

Unlike a certain pair, where that woman (a doctor!) can't even string a sentence...all the hmm...ing...ermmm. ing and..rolling of eyes, heavy sighing, hand on chest, all play acting the madam in distress while grabbing the hand and crotch of her partner (another doctor with a permanent cocky smug) giving out the message "look at ME, POOR ME", nothing congruent in her words, a sign her words were far removed from her inner thoughts and feelings. She just cannot project the words with conviction because she was not speaking the truth, and that's the simple truth.

Worse, far worse than that.
Kate McCann has projected the words of conviction as one from 'beneath' the gutter, IMO.
How eloquent, how lady-like, how professionally respectable,
f****** t*****, to the policeman trying to find the daughter she has inconveniently lost;
to Mrs. Fenn who offered to help, telling her in no uncertain words to ......;
to describing on page 129 of her book, for all the world to see, her daughter's privacy being destroyed.
This is one DISGUSTING woman. I'd be totally ashamed to behave anything like that in private, let alone in public.
She matches perfectly that poor excuse of a husband of hers who claimed that in terms of PR, Maddie's eye defect was a perfect "Marketing Ploy". How LOW, how tawdry, can you get. IMO

by Guest 23.10.12 12:08

Apologies to all. I must have mixed-up 2 videos. In another one she mentions the previous existing doubts about family involvement.

by **Tony Bennett** 23.10.12 12:18

Jean wrote:I take your point PeterMac about a teenager possibly making a rash decision. However, as we know only too well, considerably older and apparently responsible people are also capable of digging themselves into a bottomless pit! There was also an 11-year-old uncle - one wonders what if anything was his part in the story.

The uncle (Stepehn) was actually 17 years old and was riding a motorcycle whilst he and Kerry Needham were on Kos. The very morning that Ben was reported missing, Ben was playing outside with his uncle Stephen on and around his motorbike. Immediately after lunch that day, two things happened simultaneously: Stephen roared off on his motorbike, and Ben went missing.

These are some pertinent facts about the case. Also pertinent is that (as shown in a TV programme in 2002), Stephen, following being placed under hypnosis, had visions of Ben having died in a motorbike and even wondered aloud if he might have been responsible.

Now, bearing in mund all that, what I found most interesting about this interview with Kerry Needham is the passage from 35 secs in the video to 57 secs.

Here she makes some very interesting comments, I don't have them verbatim, but she says...

* 'it will be an elimination process'

* 'it will put all speculation to rest that Ben had an accident, or someone had an accident with Ben...on that particular day'

* 'I know it didn't happen...'

* 'when they rule out that he didn't die [near (Heracles?) the farm], they will be able to go on a worldwide search'.

+++++++

Why is she so sure that 'it never happened'?

by Pershing36 23.10.12 12:27

Tony Bennett wrote:
Jean wrote:I take your point PeterMac about a teenager possibly making a rash decision. However, as we know only too well, considerably older and apparently responsible people are also capable of digging themselves into a bottomless pit! There was also an 11-year-old uncle - one wonders what if anything was his part in the story.
The uncle (Stepehn) was actually 17 years old and was riding a motorcycle whilst he and Kery Needham were on Kos. The very morning that Ben was reported missing, Ben was playing outside with his uncle Stephen on and around his motorbike. Immediately after lunch that day, two things happened simultaneously: Stephen roared off on his motorbike, and Ben went missing.

These are some pertinent facts about the case. Also pertinent is that (as shown in a TV programme in 2002), Stephen, following being placed under hypnosis, had visions of Ben having died in a motorbike and even wondered aloud if he might have been responsible.

Now, bearing in mund all that, what I found most interesting about this interview with Kerry Needham is the passage from 35 secs in the video to 57 secs.

Here she makes some very interesting comments, I don't have them verbatim, but she says...

* 'it will end all speculation that he died in some sort of accident...on that particular day'

* 'I know it didn't happen...'

* 'when they rule out that he didn't die [near the farm], they will be able to go on a worldwide search'.

+++++++

Why is she so sure that 'it never happened'?

That is my suspicion about the incident. I remember watching the documentary when the uncle under went hypnosis and he chose to stop when question about the accident.

I can barely remember it, however their was strong suspicion that the little boy may have been placed in the wet concrete of the foundations that were being laid. The builders were out at lunch and when they returned they felt the newly poured concrete look like it had been 'disturbed'. If the Greek police suspicion was right and the builders correct, then this search of the rubble will not find anything.

by **Tony Bennett** 23.10.12 12:37

Pershing36 wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:
Jean wrote:I take your point PeterMac about a teenager possibly making a rash decision. However, as we know only too well, considerably older and apparently responsible people are also capable of digging themselves into a bottomless pit! There was also an 11-year-old uncle - one wonders what if anything was his part in the story.
The uncle (Stepehn) was actually 17 years old and was riding a motorcycle whilst he and Kery Needham were on Kos. The very morning that Ben was reported missing, Ben was playing outside with his uncle Stephen on and around his motorbike. Immediately after lunch that day, two things happened simultaneously: Stephen roared off on his motorbike, and Ben went missing.

These are some pertinent facts about the case. Also pertinent is that (as shown in a TV programme in 2002), Stephen, following being placed under hypnosis, had visions of Ben having died in a motorbike and even wondered aloud if he might have been responsible.

Now, bearing in mund all that, what I found most interesting about this interview with Kerry Needham is the passage from 35 secs in the video to 57 secs.

Here she makes some very interesting comments, I don't have them verbatim, but she says...

* 'it will end all speculation that he died in some sort of accident...on that particular day'

* 'I know it didn't happen...'

* 'when they rule out that he didn't die [near the farm], they will be able to go on a worldwide search'.

+++++++

Why is she so sure that 'it never happened'?

That is my suspicion about the incident. I remember watching the documentary when the uncle under went hypnosis and he chose to stop when question about the accident.

I can barely remember it, however their was strong suspicion that the little boy may have been placed in the wet concrete of the foundations that were being laid. The builders were out at lunch and when they returned they felt the newly poured concrete look like it had been 'disturbed'. If the Greek police suspicion was right and the builders correct, then this search of the rubble will not find anything.

But the inspector said: 'We are taking the cadaver dogs'. The question may be whether or not a cadaver dog can detect the scent of a human corpse after it has been buried under a few feet of concrete for 20 years.

There is another video I saw very recently of Kerry speaking on Kos about Ben, she is either there now or was a few days ago. She was totally different from the calm, measured person she was on the other video. She could barely read out the script she was looking at and looked utterly distraught.

(can anyone find that other video?)

by Guest 23.10.12 12:42

Looking for your video Tony, but meantime here is the one where she says she knows an accident didn't happen................

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/oct/18/ben-needham-polce-excavate-toddler-kos?newsfeed=true

by Guest 23.10.12 14:26

I'm getting a bit muddled with the different videos but is this the one we're talking about - where Kerry seems to be on the point of meltdown?

http://news.sky.com/story/1001000/ben-needhams-mother-makes-emotional-plea

by Guest 23.10.12 14:31

Jean wrote:I'm getting a bit muddled with the different videos but is this the one we're talking about - where Kerry seems to be on the point of meltdown?

[url=http://news.sky.com/story/1001000/ben-needhams-mother-makes-emotional-plea

http://news.sky.com/story/1001000/ben-needhams-mother-makes-emotional-plea[/quote[/url]]

No, I have already posted that one Jean, I think Tony means another one, I have searched but can't find it.

by Guest 23.10.12 14:49

Sorry if this has been posted, they have found toys..............

Hunt for Ben Needham: Police dig up bits of children's toys in mound near where Ben was seen last

Bits of old toys that toddler Ben Needham may have been playing with when he disappeared have been uncovered by detectives searching for his remains.

Police excavation experts used a JCB digger to cut away massive chunks of the mound which they fear Ben could have been buried under in 1991.

They also swept the area with a metal detector and found chunks of toys – which could be the Dinky cars Ben had with him when he vanished.

The potentially dramatic development on the Greek island of Kos came as Ben’s mum Kerry almost collapsed yesterday while speaking about the search and continued to insist: “Ben is still alive.”

Det Supt Matt Fenwick, who is leading the 20-strong British team, said: “Bits of toys have been found, but we do not yet know if they are his.

"As you’ve seen, we’ve actually started to move the soil, move the ground.

“We have JCB diggers and officers out with spades ..............continued on link below......

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/ben-needham-dig-police-find-1393687

by **Tony Bennett** 23.10.12 16:54

Jean wrote:I'm getting a bit muddled with the different videos but is this the one we're talking about - where Kerry seems to be on the point of meltdown?

http://news.sky.com/story/1001000/ben-needhams-mother-makes-emotional-plea

Sorry, candyfloss and Jean, I think it was on the news last night - yes, she was close to meltdown