Even drug and bomb sniffing dogs can be misled!

Guest001 wrote:Good heavens! Garth. The extraordinary lengths you are going to try and discredit sniffer dogs anyone would think you had been the subject of sniffer dog investigation yourself.   

carly1979 wrote:whats the matter garth your preecious forum just a thought you know has been shut down where will you go now?

25. TERMINATION


a) By ProBoards


WITHOUT LIMITING ANY OTHER PROVISION OF THIS AGREEMENT, PROBOARDS
RESERVES THE RIGHT TO, IN PROBOARDS' SOLE DISCRETION AND WITHOUT NOTICE
OR LIABILITY, DENY USE OF THE WEBSITE AND/OR SERVICES TO ANY PERSON FOR
ANY REASON OR FOR NO REASON AT ALL, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION FOR ANY
BREACH OR SUSPECTED BREACH OF ANY REPRESENTATION, WARRANTY OR COVENANT
CONTAINED IN THIS AGREEMENT, OR OF ANY APPLICABLE LAW OR REGULATION.

Me wrote:

carly1979 wrote:whats the matter garth your preecious forum just a thought you know has been shut down where will you go now?

Just seen that this morning. Reason given:

25. TERMINATION


a) By ProBoards


WITHOUT LIMITING ANY OTHER PROVISION OF THIS AGREEMENT, PROBOARDS
RESERVES THE RIGHT TO, IN PROBOARDS' SOLE DISCRETION AND WITHOUT NOTICE
OR LIABILITY, DENY USE OF THE WEBSITE AND/OR SERVICES TO ANY PERSON FOR
ANY REASON OR FOR NO REASON AT ALL, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION FOR ANY
BREACH OR SUSPECTED BREACH OF ANY REPRESENTATION, WARRANTY OR COVENANT
CONTAINED IN THIS AGREEMENT, OR OF ANY APPLICABLE LAW OR REGULATION.

Wonder if all the offensive bile against Tony Bennett has caused this?

Garth wrote:Get on there bird, is this the same 'generalising' argument that is used to suggest that 8 out of 10 kidnappings normally have a family member involved? lol

Sucks doesn't it!

Garth wrote:Exactly my point Molly.........it is then!

Hey Me, its not my new found expertise if you read.........even though I know that may pose a problem for you!

Garth wrote:Exactly my point Molly.........it is then!  
 
Hey Me, its not my new found expertise if you read.........even though I know that may pose a problem for you!  

LittleMissMolly wrote:

Garth wrote:Exactly my point Molly.........it is then!

Hey Me, its not my new found expertise if you read.........even though I know that may pose a problem for you!

Now, now Garth - don't be deliberately obtuse ... one or two questionable 'experiments' on the abilities of some cadaver dogs are in no way comparable to worldwide crime statistics relating to all child abduction/child abuse cases.

Engage that logical thinking you are always espousing and stop introducing straw men there's a pet.

Article by Dr Rosemary Claire Taylor MA MB BChir (Cantab)
Olfaction, the act or process of smelling, is the primary special
sense possessed by dogs. A dog’s sense of smell is a thousand times more
sensitive than humans. Dogs have more than 220 million olfactory
receptors in their nose, whereas humans only have 5 million. Specially
trained dogs have been used to locate forensic cadaver material and
disaster survivors. Highly trained dogs assisted the emergency services
in the aftermath of the terrorist attack on the World Trade Centre on
September 11th, 2001.
Cadaver dogs need to undergo rigorous training. Prior to beginning a
specialised training programme, these dogs need to have basic obedience
skills. The cue a dog uses to indicate forensic material depends on the
trainer. Some dogs are trained to bark to indicate cadavers, whereas
others scratch at the area in the crime scene. Dogs are given a verbal
cue to start searching, and directional cues such as “check it out” to
indicate an area requiring a more detailed search.
A variety of breeds can be trained to hunt forensic material.
Bloodhounds, springer spaniels and labradors are commonly used. Trained
cadaver dogs have the ability to detect decomposing bodies beneath
running water, for example when a corpse is weighted down, and placed at
the bottom of a river.
I have done a thorough search of academic journals on this subject, and will present my findings as follows:

1. Cadaver dogs are known as valuable forensic tools in
crime scene investigations. Scientific research attempting to verify
their value is largely lacking, specifically for scents associated with
the early postmortem interval. The aim of our investigation was the
comparative evaluation of the reliability, accuracy, and specificity of
three cadaver dogs belonging to the Hamburg State Police in the
detection of scents during the early postmortem interval.
Carpet squares were used as an odor transporting media after they had
been contaminated with the scent of two recently deceased bodies
(bodies are all less than 3 hours old). The contamination occurred for 2
min as well as 10 min without any direct contact between the carpet and
the corpse. Comparative searches by the dogs were performed over a time
period of 65 days (10 min contamination) and 35 days (2 min
contamination).
The results of this study indicate that the well-trained cadaver dog
is an outstanding tool for crime scene investigation displaying
excellent sensitivity (75-100), specificity (91-100), and having a
positive predictive value (90-100), negative predictive value (90-100)
as well as accuracy (92-100).
Reference:
Cadaver dogs–a study on detection of contaminated carpet squares.
Oesterhelweg L, Kröber S, Rottmann K, Willhöft J, Braun C, Thies N, Püschel K, Silkenath J, Gehl A.
Institute of Legal Medicine, University Medical Center Hamburg, Germany.

Notes on the scientific terminology in this study;
Sensitivity means the number of correct detections out of 100. Here,
all dogs managed to correctly identify 75-100 carpet squares out of 100.
This is a good success rate.
Specificity describes the number of false identifications. A
sensitivity of 91 out of 100 means, at most, there are 9 false positives
in a sample of 100 uncontaminated squares. This is a good specificity,
much higher than cervical screening, which can detect far more false
positives.
The Positive Predictive Value can be defined as;

In other words, out of 100, there are 75-100 true positives, and 0-9
false positives. A positive predictive value describes the percentage
chance, if a sample is contaminated, that the dog will discover it. The
value of 90-100 means that, out of 100 contaminated squares, at least 90
are correctly identified by the dog.
The Negative Predictive Value can be defined as;

In other words, out of 100, there are 0-9 false positives and 0-25
false negatives. A negative predictive value describes the chance that,
if a sample is not contaminated, the dog will correctly identify the
sample as clear of human remains. The study quotes a negative predictive
value of 90-100. This means only 0-10 ‘clean’ squares are wrongly
identified as contaminated by the dogs.
Accuracy is the degree to which the evidence presented by the dogs
matches known information about which squares were marked. The accuracy
of dog detection is presented as 92-100. This means that dogs correctly
identify carpet squares as ‘marked’ or ‘unmarked’ in at least 92 cases
out of 100. This is an impressive accuracy score.
In addition, I think it is important to consider that this is an
experiment, not real life. In reality cadaver dogs are given more time
to assess possible traces of human remains. Hence in a true police
setting, cadaver dogs are more likely to give accurate information.

2. Specially trained air scent detection canines (Canis
familiaris) are commonly used by law enforcement to detect narcotics,
explosives or contraband, and by fire investigators to detect the
presence of accelerants. Dogs are also used by police, military, and
civilian groups to locate lost or missing persons, as well as victims of
natural or mass disasters. A further subspecialty is “cadaver”
searching, or the use of canines to locate buried or concealed human
remains.
Recent forensic investigations in central Alberta demonstrated that
the use of cadaver dogs could be expanded to include locating partial,
scattered human remains dispersed by repeated animal scavenging. Eight
dog-and-handler teams participated in a two-month training program using
human and animal remains in various stages of decay as scent sources.
Ten blind field tests were then conducted which simulated actual search
conditions. Recovery rates ranged between 57% and 100%, indicating that
properly trained cadaver dogs can make significant contributions in the
location and recovery of scattered human remains.
Reference:
J Forensic Sci. 1999 Mar;44(2):405-8.
The use of cadaver dogs in locating scattered, scavenged human remains: preliminary field test results. Komar D.
Department of Anthropology, University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada.

This study was written in 1999. Nonetheless, in situations where
there are scattered human remains, dogs identify them in 57-100% of
cases.

3. The detection of human remains that have been
deliberately buried to escape detection is a problem for law
enforcement. Sometimes the cadaver dog and handler teams are successful,
while other times law enforcement and cadaver dog teams are frustrated
in their search. Five field trials tested the ability of four cadaver
dog and handler teams to detect buried human remains.
Human and animal remains were buried in various forested areas during
the summer months near Tuscaloosa, Alabama. The remains ranged in
decomposition from fresh to skeletonised. Cadaver dogs detected with
varying success: buried human remains at different stages of
decomposition, buried human remains at different depths, and buried
decomposed human and animal remains.
The results from these trials showed that some cadaver dogs were able
to locate skeletonised remains buried at a significant depth. Fresh and
skeletonised remains were found equally by the cadaver dogs along with
some caveats. Dog handlers affected the reliability of the cadaver dog
results. Observations and videotape of the cadaver dogs during field
trials showed that they were reliable in finding buried human remains.

Reference:
J Forensic Sci. 2003 May;48(3):617-21.
Cadaver dog and handler team capabilities in the recovery of buried
human remains in the southeastern United States.Lasseter AE, Jacobi KP,
Farley R, Hensel L.
Department of Anthropology, University of Alabama, Tuscaloosa, AL 35487-0210, USA.
This is an impressive study. The salient points are that cadaver dogs
can identify a corpse, or a piece of a corpse, which had been buried at
a significant depth. This gives the dog handlers an opportunity to
investigate a more ‘real life’ crime scene. Following a murder, it is
normal for a criminal to hide any human remains, often by burying the
corpse. It appears that these dogs can still detect the ‘smell of
death’, when a body part is buried deep in a forest.

The Enhanced Victim Recovery Dog (EVRD) ‘Eddie’was deployed in a wide area screening capacity within the outer boundaries of the HDLG with no alert indications or behaviour changes evident. The search was recorded via GPS data logging equipment attached to the dog’s collar to ensure complete area coverage.


Geophysical anomalies identified by other assets, were probed and subjected to EVRD screening. No alert indications were forthcoming.


A large amount of animal bone historically deposited in the grounds of HDLG as garbage was ignored.


The EVRD was deployed tactically within the ground floor of the premises where a continuing alert indication of varying strength was given in the western aspect. The weakest being in the south-western corridor, the strongest and most significant being in the north-western stairwell.


The reactions of the dog are explained as scent travelling through ‘chimneys’ such as conduit, electric cable ducting, which transects from the north west stairwell along the western corridor in a southerly direction.


Anecdotal witness evidence was suggestive of juvenile human bones being recovered from the area of the north-western stairwell during recent building renovations in 2003.


Human remains deposited within the ground in that area would contaminate the ground, and any porous material within it. The dog’s reactions were therefore consistent with this scenario. The area was therefore subjected to intrusive archaeological excavation.


A fragment of what the forensic anthropologist describes as being possibly human juvenile skull was recovered from within a Victorian context of the excavation. The fragment was shipped to the U.K. for confirmation of substance, species, carbon dating and DNA testing. The laboratory conducting the analysis reported confused and conflicting findings therefore no conclusion is available at this time. Other burnt bone fragments were also recovered from the context within this area. The dating of the context is Victorian, outside the time spectrum of a homicide enquiry at this time. Therefore further testing will be the subject of a forensic submission review later in the enquiry.


The EVRD gave a number of alert indications in the eastern wing of the building. Holes were drilled through the 3 inch thick wooden / insulated clad flooring to allow the dog scent access to the voids below. He identified areas of interest which supported anecdotal witness evidence. This prompted the complete removal of the flooring in 2/3 of the east wing.

Removal of the flooring revealed the original ground floor of the building including a large brick and rendered bath, original sinks and toilet area, play rooms etc. Renovations had enclosed the areas which then resembled ‘cellars’.


The EVRD was again deployed in a detailed search of these areas. Alert indications were forthcoming which, where appropriate, were confirmed using the human blood search dog.


The EVRD alert indications were confirmed by intrusive archaeological excavation and sieving. A significant number of bone fragments and teeth have been recovered which have been corroborated as human. The remains are at the present time undergoing forensic testing including carbon dating procedures.


Predominantly the human remains have been recovered from cellars 3, 4 and 5 which historically were one large classroom.


Control testing of the EVRD would suggest that although the dog alerted to specific areas where human remains were situated the entire top two inches of soil within this area is contaminated with human cadaver odour. Enquiries at this time are suggestive that the human remains were deposited in this area and covered with top soil in a deliberate act of concealment. The deposition could only have taken place during a period of time when the floor had been removed. Research into the historical renovation of the property suggests that the floor above cellars 3, 4 &5 was taken up in the late 60’s early 70’s.


Three indications by the human blood search dog were given in cellar one which, when subjected to presumptive testing, proved positive.


Two indications by the human blood search dog were given in the cellar entrance hall which when subjected to presumptive testing proved positive.


The EVRD provided alert indications in support of the human blood search dog.


Forensic samples were recovered and conveyed to the UK for further testing.


Other deployments of the EVRD were based upon the blind screening of soil samples and other areas from which suggestive intelligence is supported:


The EVRD was deployed to screen soil samples from certain contexts of archaeological excavation. A positive reaction was forthcoming from a context where it is reported human remains were uncovered and removed by builders in the area of the main electric feed in the north-western wing. There is some witness evidence to suggest that these remains were also human juvenile. Although the remains were examined by a pathologist they were not positively identified. In fact the pathologists report lists at least one bone that was ‘UNIDENTIFIED’. Measurements of the bones would tend to suggest that they may well have been juvenile human.


Karl Harrison’s archaeological theory of the burnt debris including human bone fragments and teeth being deposited in the east wing cellars from the west wing is contained within this report. This theory is suggestive that the solid fuel furnace in operation in the west wing around the time of 1960 – 1970 may have been used to dispose of human remains.


Enquiries to date are showing that the original solid fuel central heating and hot water supply furnace in the west wing was replaced in the late 60’s early 70’s with oil fired furnaces. This may have coincided with the floor in cellars 3, 4 & 5 being removed. This would explain the deposition of the bone fragments and teeth with ash deposits as being the

waste from the furnace upon decommissioning. It would also suggest some element of ‘guilty knowledge’.


Having considered options to support the theory a series of scent sample screening tests was completed using the EVRD These tests were yes or no answers to the presence of human remains decomposition scent. It does not rely on change in behaviour or handler judgement and is therefore more accurate.


The series of tests involved the use of samples of soot and debris from the chimney situated in the plant room that was in use at the time the solid fuel furnace was in operation. The tests were completed in such a way as to isolate the samples from containers, human ‘live’ scent and other distracters.


The tests clearly indicated the presence of human remains decomposition scent.


A forensic review team may be in a position to assist with further testing procedures to corroborate the dogs presumptive testing.


It is important to note that a substantial weight of animal bone has been recovered from the site as a whole. The EVRD has ignored all such material whilst alerting to confirmed human remains. This tends supports the scenario above.


Both the EVRD and Human blood search dog are presumptive screening assets. Any alert indications given MUST be forensically corroborated to be conclusive.


The entire building and grounds have now been screened and detail searched by the canine assets attached to the enquiry. Preparations are now underway to prepare for phase two at Victoria Tower.