WHO INFORMED WHO - THE NANNIES AND MADDIE"S DISAPPEARANCE

by skyrocket 15.10.16 14:11

Although there are a number of witnesses who state that Madeleine's 'disappearance' had already become general knowledge at some time between about 9.15pm and 9.45pm, I am concentrating on what we are told by the nannies and the other British employees.

Kate McCann went to do her check around 10pm on 3 May. In his 10 May statement Gerry McCann ties the time down to precisely 10.03pm (note this is after a full week of deliberation), and he states that his wife was gone for around 10 minutes before returning with the news of Madeleine's disappearance. So we are already at around 10.13pm.
The group then rushes back to 5A and a quick search is carried out in the apartment, taking the time to around 10.16pm - 10.20pm. GM then goes to check the window blinds from outside. The male members of the group then leave the apartment to carry out cursory searches in the vicinity of the tapas bar area and the streets/car parks adjacent to block 5, shouting out 'Maddie' as they go. The time now is around 10.20/10.25pm, so the very earliest (according to the Mc's/tapas 7's statements) that anyone at all could be aware of a missing child would have been around 10.20pm. And, anyone who did hear the searches at this time would have to have been close to block 5.

When they hear about Maddie's disappearance:

The creche supervisor, Lindsay Johnston, is home alone.

Nannies Charlotte Pennington, Amy Tierney (head of mini and baby clubs) and Jaqueline Williams are running the drop in evening creche, which we are told is above the OC main reception on Rua Direita, at least 5/6 minutes walk from block 5/tapas area.

Nannies Cat Baker and Lynne (Rhiannon) Fretter are in their apartment, sleeping.

Nannies Kirsty Maryan, Leanne Wagstaff and Sarah Williamson have left their apartment/s and are on their way out for the evening.

Nannies Emma Wilding, Susan Owen, Shinead Vine and Stacy Portz (head of toddlers and juniors/kids) are in the Mirage Bar next to the Millenium Restaurant site with colleagues Najoua Chekaya (aerobics) and Hayley? (possibly Aldridge - sports massage therapy, for whom there is no statement in the files; Hayley Crawford states that she was at home in Lagos with her Portuguese boyfriend - see later).

Nanny Pauline McCann is an unknown as she is the only one who there is no information for regarding the night of 3 May.

We are told by Charlotte that at 10.15pm an 'unknown woman' enters the evening creche and tells them that a child called 'Maddie' or Maggie' is missing. Jaqueline repeats this but puts the time at 10.05pm and, states that the woman is the mother of a toddler 2. The mother would have had to have been outside block 5 at the instant the searches started and would have had to have run down to the evening creche immediately, even to have arrived there at around 10.23pm.

The 3 nannies assume that it must be Madeleine McCann and both Charlotte and Jaqueline tell us that Amy phones to confirm this. Charlotte specifically says that Amy phones Lindsay (supervisor) and Jaqueline says that Amy phones a colleague and it is confirmed that Madeleine is missing.

However, Lindsay states the following:

'She indicates that on May 3rd 2007, at around 10.20pm, she was informed by her colleague Amy T. that Madeleine McCann had disappeared'.

So who told who?

There appears to be no set procedure to inform childcare staff of a missing child. Kirsty, Leanne and Sarah apparently meet Amy (again) at 10.30pm, looking in bushes with a torch, and she informs them. There is no mention of Amy being with anyone else.

At 10.45pm, searchers enter the Mirage Bar and the 6 female MW employees are informed that a 3 year old child is missing. Susan states that the group began searching from the adjacent Millenium Restaurant whereas Shinead says that they organised themselves into groups and started searching, 'leaving from the tapas restaurant'.

In her 6 May statement, Cat Baker says nothing about how she found out about the disappearance but (Lynne) Rhiannon Fretter whom she shared an apartment with tells us that, at about 11.30pm, Leanne had arrived at the flat and told them. However, in her April 2008 rogatory, Cat Baker states that Leanne and Emma turned up at 10.30/10.35pm and told both her and Rhiannon about Madeleine being missing.

At 10.25pm Lindsay has already apparently arrived at the tapas area and has initiated the 'missing child' procedure. She is unspecific about who helps her oversee this. Emma Knight (Hotel Manager) says she was phoned by Lindsay at 10.17pm and met with both Lindsay and Amy T. (who she refers to as the 'Service Manager') near to the Tapas Bar, where they initiated the procedure.

John Hill (OC Manager) states that he was phoned and informed of the disappearance at around 10.28pm on his mobile by Lindsay. He immediately leaves his home and arrives at the Tapas area 5 minutes later. He phones George Crossland (previous partner in the OC and current Administrator, who is home alone). Crossland states that he was contacted by Hill at around 10.15pm and that he left home and arrived around 10.25pm. As soon as he has heard, Crossland phones Silvia Batista (Maintenance Services Director) at home with her husband Joao Batista (Head of Maintenance). The Batista's state that the phone call came at 10.30pm and that they arrived at the tapas area between 10.30pm and 11pm (Silvia states it was just as the GNR were arriving at the main reception). However, Crossland states that both the Batista's were already there, along with Hill, when he arrives at about 10.25pm.

Amy Tierney also says the following in her 6 May statement:

'She confirms that, on the night of the disappearance she was on duty and immediately went to the bedroom to see if the girl was hiding. She saw that the shutter was raised and that the window was partially open. It was then that she began to look in the wardrobes to see if the girl was hiding.

The first idea that occurred to her was that the girl could have left by her own means, however after checking that the window was open and the shutter raised she asked the parents whether Madeleine's shoes were there, to which they replied that they were, these facts led her to think that Madeleine could have been taken by someone'.

Gerry McCann says the following in his 10 May statement:

'Then he closed the external blinds, made his way to the outside and tried to open them, which he managed to do, much to his surprise given that he thought that that was only possible from the inside. They continued with searches outside around the various apartment blocks, the deponent having asked MATHEW who went to the secondary reception [where] the event was communicated to the local police, since he had no doubt that his daughter had been kidnapped [abducted]'.

Skipping over the facts that the forensic team failed to find GM's finger prints on the blinds/window or that the tapas (secondary) reception was closed in the evenings, it seems probable that GM left the blinds in the closed position because, according to Dianne Webster, the blinds were closed when she got to 5A about 5/10 minutes after KM had raised the alarm.

Amy found out about Madeleine's disappearance, around 10.20pm (remember the mother had to bolt down to the creche after hearing the initial searchers shouting, close to 5A). She then made a phone call to Lindsay. Then she is a very busy woman - she is with Lindsay and Emma at the tapas at around 10.17pm, helping to sort out the search procedure; she is in the McCanns' apartment (before the window/blinds are shut); and she is searching in bushes and meeting 3 of her colleagues at 10.30pm.

Later, despite Emma Knight having been specifically allocated to look after the McCanns' needs and being with them from before midnight to about 4.30am in the morning; and the fact that John Hill the OC Manager was glued to the tapas search base all night; Russell O'Brien seeks out Amy who is at her desk (at midnight) in the creche building next to the tapas bar to ask if she has a memory stick reader to print off photos.

Just as an aside, Emma Knight clearly states that a new apartment (4G, I think off the top of my head) was provided for the McCanns; that the twins' cots were transferred there and that when she left at 4.30am KM and Fiona were both there sitting on the sofa holding one twin each. The Mc's and the tapas 7 statements say that although the Mc's were allocated a new apartment, they moved up to the Payne's flat (5H) with the cots and the twins. Just another anomaly.

Regarding Hayley Crawford (Pool Bar), strangely she is listed as a nanny on the following list:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Also, Shinead states that 'She adds that the staff dedicated to the children total 15, and who work in turns between the hours of 19H30 and 23H30', which is one more than the number of names given elsewhere. As Hayley's work finishes daily at 6pm, it may be that she was working as a baby sitter in the evenings, although no mention is made of this. In her statement she was driving the streets of Luz on 3 May, with her boyfriend, between the hours of about 8.30pm and 9.10pm, passing by 5A and stopping at the OC main reception building.

So, backing up to 10.15pm/10.20pm - why did Lindsay say that Amy told her about the disappearance and yet Charlotte and Jaqueline say that Lindsay confirmed the disappearance? Who knew first and how?

by JohnyT 15.10.16 18:59

Whoa.....just hold on a sec........Nanny Pauline McCann.........the name coincidences in this are unreal...............
JohnyT

by skyrocket 15.10.16 22:41

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - yes, an unfortunate surname for anyone else there at the time to have.

Regarding the timing of when the alarm was actually raised i.e. I'm taking this as the time the group left the tapas restaurant, and my reference above to other statements indicating an earlier time frame, Arlindo Pelega's (OC Executive Chef) recollections are particularly interesting, IMO.

'When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one.
. After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant, in the left hand direction, toward the side opposite the pool, and passed by the esplanade. He remembers having seen in that esplanade, one table, occupied by three couples, without children, and all of them adults. On the esplanade, he encountered no one else.
. A few minutes later, when it was around 21H20, he heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few meters away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. Given the importance of this, believed that he should be in the surroundings. At that moment, he did not leave the area of the restaurant, and did not have the opportunity to check if the vehicle mentioned before was situated in the same location;
. Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples;'

So Pelega gives the time the alarm was raised as around 9.20pm. Note also that there is no mention of a couple dining (the Sperreys were shown as booked in at 9pm). If Pelega arrived at about 9.10pm, it is feasible that the Carpenters had just left. Remember that Carolyn Carpenter thought she heard someone calling 'Madeleine, Madeleine,' in the distance just before they entered their apartment in block 6 (across the road from block 5).

If the above time frame is correct, then we might surmise that 9.15pm/9.20pm was the planned time zero. Did something happen after the plan had been put into motion that put a serious spanner in the works and required the time frame to be shifted forward about 45 minutes? But once started at 9.20pm, the first 'alarm' couldn't be retracted. After 10pm there were then 2 separate 'time lines' running concurrently but out of phase throwing all the testimonies into complete confusion.

This might have been Gerry McCann's 'complete disaster' and may account for the need to write out 2 garbled time lines - not necessarily for the police but for the group to try and cement in everyone's minds what the official time line was going to be. Then we have the typed out time line presented from the group as a whole to the PJ just before the second round of interviews took place on the 10 May - as if the group are saying this is what and when it happened FULL STOP. Such odd behaviour. So many red flags.

by JRP 16.10.16 16:46

As a bit of a newbie, it's good to see all these times and contradictions put together, who told who and what each was doing when they were told is very interesting. A lot of work put into putting it together.

I would guess that some of these people did spring into action, as most of us would if we were told a little girl was missing.
Certain time discrepancies may be due to some people simply not noticing the time, or noticing but forgetting, as more pressing matters took precedent.

But, if something did happen to Madeleine earlier in the week, then some of those people mentioned must have already known Madeleine was "missing".
While it's interesting to ask who told who, there is another question or two.
Who already knew?
Who genuinely made time errors, and who made deliberate errors?

by Verdi 17.10.16 13:13

Putting aside the temptation to look for some clue that just doesn't exist, take the situation back to it's raw state.

You are working, the day is just like any other day, nothing unusual happening until at around 10:00 pm one night, your work place is thrown into chaos by a frantic parent screaming that her child has disappeared form her bed - what would any sound minded person do? Yes of course, you would help in any way possible. The reaction by Ocean Club staff and guests etc., would have been the same whatever day or time the alarm was raised, it bears no reflection on the time and day of Madeleine's disappearance.

It was said by one or more of the witnesses formally interviewed, that Warners management immediately implemented their missing child policy, something I can't fault, yet I see a hazy area around this. A child is unlikely to disappear whilst being under the care of a night time baby sitter, the service made available by Warners, nor the night time creche care. It therefore seems that the missing child procedure adopted by Warners, was essentially applicable to day care. I have always wondered why the child care workers were said to have been alerted on mass on the night of 3rd May 2007. In fairness to them, a few of them off duty, maybe out on the razzle, maybe sleeping - why should they be specifically called in? By all accounts, Madeleine didn't disappear whilst under the watch of a childcare worker, she disappeared from her bed under her own parents watch - or not, as the case maybe.

I strongly suspect, in a panic situation it was a case of all hands on deck, rather than implementing a specific company procedure. I pay no attention to who told who what and when, the Ocean Club would have been in chaos and again in fairness to the staff, they are unlikely to be exact with timing and other detail.

However, there are one or two or three childcare workers who excite interest over and above the others. They have been the subject of many threads on this forum and I believe, also discussed elsewhere - I personally don't believe all the child care workers and other Ocean Club staff were involved with any lengthy deception. It's a matter of sorting the wheat from the chaff thumbsup

to all the hours dedicated by forum members for doing just that!

On with the motley!

by sar 17.10.16 13:45

Sorry for indiscriminate cutting & pasting!!!! Thanks to the OP's.

Find the following of interest, particularly the seeming "black hole" that always seems to surround this strange geographic conundrum that is the "drop in evening creche above the main reception" Perhaps I've forgotten or never quite understood this provision, but always perplexed that no one found this a strange arrangement? Maybe it's just something that sticks in my mind? Not to mention Nanny Pauline McCann!!!! [insert goggly eyes on springs emoticon] .....and no statement!! Cripes! Furthermore a typed out timeline handed in to the PJ, again my memory is perhaps not what it should be but this is more than astonishing!!

Thanks to all to help make this forum possible and to those who look, read and contribute.

xxxxxxxxxxx

Nannies Charlotte Pennington, Amy Tierney (head of mini and baby clubs) and Jaqueline Williams are running the drop in evening creche, which we are told is above the OC main reception on Rua Direita, at least 5/6 minutes walk from block 5/tapas area.

Xxxxxx

Whoa.....just hold on a sec........Nanny Pauline McCann.........the name coincidences in this are unreal...............
JohnyT
Xxxxxxxxxxxx

Then we have the typed out time line presented from the group as a whole to the PJ just before the second round of interviews took place on the 10 May

by skyrocket 17.10.16 15:39

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - I agree with you completely that the majority of those who got embroiled in the tangled web of McCann world were innocents, doing all they could to help (as they saw it) to find a missing child. Also that the alarm/s have no bearing on the actual day/time of Madeleine's disappearance BUT, all this is far from irrelevant - every single minutiae of that evening is vitally important (IMO) in trying to work out what the deception was and who was involved. That includes what was said by whom at what time; who appears to have heard first; where people were when they heard; who then told who what. If several people say the alarm was raised between 9.20pm and 9.45pm, rather than the exact time of 10.13pm claimed by the Mc's, I have to ask why. I think it was HiDeHo (apologies if I'm wrong) who asked what was so important about 10pm? I agree. Why, if the alarm was triggered at around 9.20pm, didn't the group just run with that?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] - yes, wouldn't you think that as the only guests who could use the evening creche were those who were eating in the Tapas or Millenium Restaurants (if you hopped off into town you had to pay for baby sitters in your apartment), that MarkWarner would have organised said evening creche in one of those 2 locations???!!!! Particularly as both locations had facilities for children's clubs. No, far too sensible, let's make parents walk half a mile to a location no where near either restaurant - then we can have a good laugh when we have to drag them here in the middle of their steaks when little Johnny starts screaming (as apparently was the case with Jeremy Wilkin's son). MW were/are a big, experienced, consumer focused company - why wouldn't they make life as easy as possible for as many guests as possible?

I go back again to the resort map produced in Sep/Oct 2008 when the new look web site was launched after Madeleine's disappearance. No map existed online prior to 3 May as the OC was a hasty replacement for the Pedra del Rei resort further down the coast, which wasn't completed on schedule. However, the basic pre-3 May website clearly states that all the childcare of under 6 year olds is in Waterside Gardens (Tapas site). The NEW MAP uploaded in Sep/Oct 2008 shows ALL the under 6 year clubs on this site/or in a property directly behind the tennis courts in Waterside Gardens. Not sure about anyone else but it certainly sets my mind ticking over.

MW website content from 15 April 2007:
Located in the Waterside Garden is our fully equipped childcare centre offering our award winning childcare for children aged 4 months and upwards. There is a colourful crèche with an outdoor play area and the nannies organise regular beach trips and other supervised fun activities for the children. Hours are 9am till 12.30pm and 2.30pm to 5.30pm.
We offer a ‘dining out service’ (only available for parents using the Millenium and Tapas restaurants). in the crèche on a drop-in basis in the evenings for children aged 4 months to 9 years. For those parents wishing to dine at alternative restaurants in the village, babysitting is available on request at additional charge. Our Indy Club for 14-17 year olds is situated near the Ocean Club Gardens.

by sar 17.10.16 23:14

{@=2614}Sar{/@} - yes, wouldn't you think that as the only guests who could use the evening creche were those who were eating in the Tapas or Millenium Restaurants (if you hopped off into town you had to pay for baby sitters in your apartment), that MarkWarner would have organised said evening creche in one of those 2 locations???!!!! Particularly as both locations had facilities for children's clubs. No, far too sensible, let's make parents walk half a mile to a location no where near either restaurant - then we can have a good laugh when we have to drag them here in the middle of their steaks when little Johnny starts screaming (as apparently was the case with Jeremy Wilkin's son). MW were/are a big, experienced, consumer focused company - why wouldn't they make life as easy as possible for as many guests as possible?why wouldn't they make life as easy as possible for as many guests as possible?[/mention] wrote:

I go back again to the resort map produced in Sep/Oct 2008 when the new look web site was launched after Madeleine's disappearance. No map existed online prior to 3 May as the OC was a hasty replacement for the Pedra del Rei resort further down the coast, which wasn't completed on schedule. However, the basic pre-3 May website clearly states that all the childcare of under 6 year olds is in Waterside Gardens (Tapas site). The NEW MAP uploaded in Sep/Oct 2008 shows ALL the under 6 year clubs on this site/or in a property directly behind the tennis courts in Waterside Gardens. Not sure about anyone else but it certainly sets my mind ticking over.

MW website content from 15 April 2007:
Located in the Waterside Garden is our fully equipped childcare centre offering our award winning childcare for children aged 4 months and upwards. There is a colourful crèche with an outdoor play area and the nannies organise regular beach trips and other supervised fun activities for the children. Hours are 9am till 12.30pm and 2.30pm to 5.30pm.
We offer a ‘dining out service’ (only available for parents using the Millenium and Tapas restaurants). in the crèche on a drop-in basis in the evenings for children aged 4 months to 9 years. For those parents wishing to dine at alternative restaurants in the village, babysitting is available on request at additional charge. Our Indy Club for 14-17 year olds is situated near the Ocean Club Gardens.

...so in a sense, depending on each of our theories "direction of travel" - so to speak - someone could either be muddying the waters or trying to elucidate something???