Question about a detail (timelines)

by Trajan 23.11.13 15:07

I have a question concerning details of the two timelines of the tapas9: In the picture we see the first version 3rd May, and the second one altered and signed by Gerry McCann. The last one he gave to the PJ. Well my question is:

- Gerry gave the altered tapas-timeline to PJ on 4th (?).
- Then the first tapas-timeline was surely not intended to be given to the PJ.
- How and when got the PJ knowledge of the first tapas-timeline?

by Guest 23.11.13 16:10

Trajan wrote:

I have a question concerning details of the two timelines of the tapas9: In the picture we see the first version 3rd May, and the second one altered and signed by Gerry McCann. The last one he gave to the PJ. Well my question is:

- Gerry gave the altered tapas-timeline to PJ on 4th (?).
- Then the first tapas-timeline was surely not intended to be given to the PJ.
- How and when got the PJ knowledge of the first tapas-timeline?

Straight for the jugular, are we?

Very good!

by worriedmum 23.11.13 19:04

This is not an answer Trajan but some further observations and questions.
Firstly am I correct in thinking this was written by ROB?
If so, it appears he has written this with a sense of audience as he writes about himself in the third person. Who was it intended for?
Could some-one decipher for me the entries corresponding to 9.50 and 9.55 on the first timeline?

by Guest 23.11.13 20:18

You know what they say about doctors' handwriting being awful!

9.50 Rob returns.

9.55 Kate reaches (?) Madeleine

Not sure about the middle word.

by canada12 23.11.13 20:38

Looks to me like the middle word is "reaction" ?

by canada12 23.11.13 20:42

If I were investigating my main question about these 2 timelines would be who was in the room when they were written?

I'm assuming they were written within an hour or two of the discovery of Madeleine's absence.

But if they were written when Gerry was in the room, he'd obviously know about Tannerman because it's right there, next to Jane's checktime.

So it would make a lie out of their statements that there was a delay telling Kate and / or Gerry about Tanngerman until much later.

by worriedmum 23.11.13 20:50

Yes the handwriting is difficult to read. I wondered if it said 'RM' at 9.50?

by Guest 23.11.13 20:50

It's difficult to decipher, as it should be, written by a doctor .... However, IMO for one, they're both the same handwriting, e.g. Russel's. The first one nervously and/or insecure, the second one more robust. Matt's visit is indeed completely missing from the 2nd and final version. This 2nd version also introduces the "poorly daughter" for Russ. On version one, but I cannot be sure for the life of me, I tend to read "Kate reaned Madeleine" ...

by notlongnow 23.11.13 21:12

Have to say if i was investigating i'd be shocked that they have written a time line.
Guessing this was wrote very early after maddie was missing.

If KM thinks they have taken her the thought of a time would only be in your thinking when the police asked for one probably the following day.

You'd have one chance maybe looking for your kid,after that it maybe to late.

The thought that you'd sit down and write a time in my opinion is nuts.

by Mirage 23.11.13 21:13

Looks like: "Note re & Del Madeleine".

I've had the magnifier on it and nearly driven myself mad. But I think they are 3 separate words abbreviated.

I initially wondered if the first word was Kate with an odd K. But comparing it with the 2nd timeline K is properly formed on Kate. So I believe it is Note

by ekatae 23.11.13 21:22

I am reading 'Kate raised the alarm' the 'the' being close to the alarm.....

by ekatae 23.11.13 21:24

2nd timeline: Alarm raised also Kate....

by Mirage 23.11.13 21:32

ekatae wrote:I am reading 'Kate raised the alarm' the 'the' being close to the alarm.....

Just to be clear, I'm looking at the first timeline on the left. I'm seeing:

9.55pm "Note re & Del Madeleine".

10pm Alarm raised.

by ekatae 23.11.13 21:37

2nd could be alarm raised by Kate, but by looks like 'also'....

by Hicks 23.11.13 21:42

Interesting then that Matts check at 9.30 is missing on the second list.

Could it be that Matt was the one who found Madeleine? Was it he who Mrs Carpenter heard calling 'Madeleine?

by ekatae 23.11.13 21:42

2nd is definitely Alarm raised after Kate.....

by ekatae 23.11.13 21:48

1at... Kate raised Malarm... M being Madeleine....

by Guest 23.11.13 23:38

From mccannfiles, here is the timeline........

Timeline 1 (as per sticker book above)

8:45. pm

Matt returns 9.00-9.05 - listened at all 3
- all shutters down

Jerry 9.10-9.15 in the room + all well
? did he check

9.20/5 - Ella Jane checked 5D sees stranger & child

9.30 - Russ. Ella Matt check all 3

9.35 - Matt check see twins

9.50 - Russ returns

9.55 - Kate realised Madeleine

10pm - Alarm raised

Timeline 2 (as per sticker book above)

8.45pm. all assembled at poolside for food

9.00pm. Matt Oldfield listens at all 3 windows 5A, B, D ALL shutters down

9:15pm Gerry McCann looks at room A ? Door open to bedroom

9:20pm Jane Tanner checks 5D - [sees stranger walking carrying a child]

9.30 Russell O'Brien in 5D. Poorly daughter
l

9.55pm

10:00pm. Alarm raised after Kate

Gerald

Madeleine's book

Madeleine's parents ripped off both covers, the front and the back, from a book belonging to Madeleine, in order to write on the inside the timing for each person. Russell O'Brien was involved with the drawing up of the timing. The book was seized by the GNR on the night of the disappearance. These covers would be attached to the case file, as elements of the investigation, on September 7th 2007, although seized during the night of 3rd to 4th May. Here are the terms on which the seizure document was based.

Terms of seizure:

At this time, it is considered of interest to the investigation to attach to the present deed, two covers of a child's book, on the inside covers of which is a schedule for supervision, hand-written by one of the McCann couple's group of friends and participant in this deed by name of Russell O'Brien.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id30.html

by Guest 23.11.13 23:41

Now where would we be without you and dear Nigel ... airkiss

by ekatae 24.11.13 0:26

It's difficult to decipher, as it should be, written by a doctor .... However, IMO for one, they're both the same handwriting, e.g. Russel's. The first one nervously and/or insecure, the second one more robust. Matt's visit is indeed completely missing from the 2nd and final version. This 2nd version also introduces the "poorly daughter" for Russ. On version one, but I cannot be sure for the life of me, I tend to read "Kate reaned Madeleine" ...''

Thank God for Nigel...!! (whoever posted this) 'reaned;.....????? spin

by lj 24.11.13 6:06

ekatae wrote:It's difficult to decipher, as it should be, written by a doctor .... However, IMO for one, they're both the same handwriting, e.g. Russel's. The first one nervously and/or insecure, the second one more robust. Matt's visit is indeed completely missing from the 2nd and final version. This 2nd version also introduces the "poorly daughter" for Russ. On version one, but I cannot be sure for the life of me, I tend to read "Kate reaned Madeleine" ...''

Thank God for Nigel...!! (whoever posted this) 'reaned;.....?????

The first one likely under the influence of alcohol.

by **PeterMac** 24.11.13 8:58

This is what was posted some years ago on mccannfiles

8:45. pm Matt returns
9.00-9.05 - listened at all 3
- all shutters down

Jerry 9.10-9.15 in the room + all well
? did he check

9.20/5 - Ella Jane checked 5D sees stranger & child

9.30 - Russ. Ella Matt check all 3

9.35 - Matt check see twins

9.50 - Russ returns

9.55 - Kate realised Madeleine

10pm - Alarm raised

Timeline 2 (as per sticker book above)

8.45pm. all assembled at poolside for food

9.00pm. Matt Oldfield listens at all 3 windows 5A, B, D ALL shutters down

9:15pm Gerry McCann looks at room A ? Door open to bedroom

9:20pm Jane Tanner checks 5D - [sees stranger walking carrying a child]

9.30 Russell O'Brien in 5D. Poorly daughter
l
9.55pm

10:00pm. Alarm raised after Kate

Gerald

by oakeso 24.11.13 9:16

Trajan wrote:In the picture we see the first version 3rd May, and the second one altered and signed by Gerry McCann. The last one he gave to the PJ. Well my question is:

- Gerry gave the altered tapas-timeline to PJ on 4th (?).
- Then the first tapas-timeline was surely not intended to be given to the PJ.
- How and when got the PJ knowledge of the first tapas-timeline?

Trajan, can you provide a link to support the second picture was altered and signed by Gerry and that he gave it to the PJ on 4th?

Thanks.