Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

by ChippyM 08.10.14 11:30

An interview was just posted on another thread by member Baldrick ( I hope you don't mind me borrowing it!)

Sir Bernard Hogan Howe is doing a Q and A session and is asked about the 'trolling' dossier.

It's from BBC london, drive time with Eddie Nestor (from 25 minutes) http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/p02789bx

I've transcribed the first few sentences;

EN - Tell me about that file that was handed to you re. the McCanns, you know, concerned individuals and certainly that storie's been in the headlines with tragic consequences...yesterday. A file handed to you? Are you looking at it at the minute?

BHH - no what happened, well first of all, you may have seen over the last 10 days we've launched a cyber crime unit, about 500 officers. Thats really intended to target people who steal things, not necessarily bullying , I think that's going to be a real challange to us in the future just in terms of volume.

But in terms of that file, what happened if you recall was that the family handed to our team that are investigating the, or reviewing the murder of...of sorry, reviewing the missing girl. errr the McCann daughter. The file was handed to that team and we were liasing with Leicestershire police which is where the McCann family live.....

So there are two things here. BHH seems quite sure this is a murder case. ..... and 'the family handed to our team' means what?

Were the McCann family 'handed to his team' or did a certain family hand the file to his team?

In the rest of the answer, he goes on to say that racism, blackmail, or actual threats to harm some one would be considered criminal online, defamation would not and only be a civil matter, which sounds pretty much like there was no case against BL. Emphasising the cyber crime unit deals with things being 'stolen' sounds a bit like BHH is a bit peeved at being given a silly tit for tat 'trolling' dossier. I could be wrong.

Anyway it's the MURDER word that jumped out at me with this!

by Guest 08.10.14 11:34

".. the family.."

Interesting.

by ChippyM 08.10.14 11:38

BlueBag wrote:".. the family.."

Interesting.

As is all the umming and ahhing. and the 'if you recall' , 'the family'.......no we don't recall what happened when the dossier was given to police Bernard, we weren't there, that's why someone is asking you!

by HelenMeg 08.10.14 11:38

Apart from anything else, is this man competent to be in the role he's in?

by ChippyM 08.10.14 11:42

HelenMeg wrote:Apart from anything else, is this man competent to be in the role he's in?

I have wondered. remember when he had to be reminded what Operation Grange was?

Either it's a front and he purposefully uses his apparent incompetence not to get involved in certain subjects......or he is a bit thick and easily controlled. Given a nice important job and told what to say and think. A bit like the debate that surrounds Andy Redwood really!

by Guest 08.10.14 11:49

ChippyM wrote:
BlueBag wrote:".. the family.."

Interesting.

As is all the umming and ahhing. and the 'if you recall' , 'the family'.......no we don't recall what happened when the dossier was given to police Bernard, we weren't there, that's why someone is asking you!

Could someone who is in the dossier ask the Police who gave them the dossier?

That would seem fair.

There are a number of people here.

by aiyoyo 08.10.14 11:57

BlueBag wrote:
ChippyM wrote:
BlueBag wrote:".. the family.."

Interesting.

As is all the umming and ahhing. and the 'if you recall' , 'the family'.......no we don't recall what happened when the dossier was given to police Bernard, we weren't there, that's why someone is asking you!

Could someone who is in the dossier ask the Police who gave them the dossier?

That would seem fair.

There are a number of people here.

I thought BHH made it clear it was the "family" that handed the file to OG.

One newspapers (can't remember which, might have been The Mirror) reported it was the McCann who handed the dossier over to police, unless that was a misprint.

by Guest 08.10.14 11:59

aiyoyo wrote:
BlueBag wrote:
ChippyM wrote:
BlueBag wrote:".. the family.."

Interesting.

As is all the umming and ahhing. and the 'if you recall' , 'the family'.......no we don't recall what happened when the dossier was given to police Bernard, we weren't there, that's why someone is asking you!

Could someone who is in the dossier ask the Police who gave them the dossier?

That would seem fair.

There are a number of people here.

I thought BHH made it clear it was the "family" that handed the file to OG.

One newspapers (can't remember which, might have been The Mirror) reported it was the McCann who handed the dossier over to police, unless that was a misprint.

Actual names of people are required.

by Baldrick 08.10.14 12:01

Well if it was the Family, you have to ask why....surely they know the police would not act on it. And with the last poss sighting (snowboard girl)
Things must be getting desperate.

by bobbin 08.10.14 12:02

ChippyM wrote:An interview was just posted on another thread by member Baldrick ( I hope you don't mind me borrowing it!)

Sir Bernard Hogan Howe is doing a Q and A session and is asked about the 'trolling' dossier.

It's from BBC london, drive time with Eddie Nestor (from 25 minutes) http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/p02789bx

I've transcribed the first few sentences;

EN - Tell me about that file that was handed to you re. the McCanns, you know, concerned individuals and certainly that storie's been in the headlines with tragic consequences...yesterday. A file handed to you? Are you looking at it at the minute?

BHH - no what happened, well first of all, you may have seen over the last 10 days we've launched a cyber crime unit, about 500 officers. Thats really intended to target people who steal things, not necessarily bullying , I think that's going to be a real challange to us in the future just in terms of volume.

But in terms of that file, what happened if you recall was that the family handed to our team that are investigating the, or reviewing the murder of...of sorry, reviewing the missing girl. errr the McCann daughter. The file was handed to that team and we were liasing with Leicestershire police which is where the McCann family live.....

So there are two things here. BHH seems quite sure this is a murder case. ..... and 'the family handed to our team' means what?

Were the McCann family 'handed to his team' or did a certain family hand the file to his team?

In the rest of the answer, he goes on to say that racism, blackmail, or actual threats to harm some one would be considered criminal online, defamation would not and only be a civil matter, which sounds pretty much like there was no case against BL. Emphasising the cyber crime unit deals with things being 'stolen' sounds a bit like BHH is a bit peeved at being given a silly tit for tat 'trolling' dossier. I could be wrong.

Anyway it's the MURDER word that jumped out at me with this!

Thanks for the wording above.
It does sound like the family handed the file to the MET, but that was BHH 'conversational' so not necessarily the actual fact. That would need verifying.
However, BHH did say in answer to 'where does abuse become a criminal offense' ... if it is 'racist' 'threatening', if you threaten to kill someone it becomes a crime and can go to prison for 10 years ... if they believe it, and you want them to believe it.

So those ghastly tweets to Brenda, from Raaine/dirndllass threatening her, are far more likely to be considered a criminal offense.

by ChippyM 08.10.14 12:21

bobbin wrote:
Thanks for the wording above.
It does sound like the family handed the file to the MET, but that was BHH 'conversational' so not necessarily the actual fact. That would need verifying.
However, BHH did say in answer to 'where does abuse become a criminal offense' ... if it is 'racist' 'threatening', if you threaten to kill someone it becomes a crime and can go to prison for 10 years ... if they believe it, and you want them to believe it.

So those ghastly tweets to Brenda, from Raaine/dirndllass threatening her, are far more likely to be considered a criminal offense.

I agree with what you say and I suppose BHH could have been trying to set up the answer to this carefully in his mind, he was thinking along the lines of giving an overview for simpletons in reminding us that it was the McCanns who were the subjects of the so called 'abuse'.

Then again if that were the case why didn't he just say the McCanns first off instead of 'the family'? That smacks of trying really hard not to name the family but slipping up! yes it's conversational so not proof as you say.

by ChippyM 08.10.14 12:35

aiyoyo wrote:

I thought BHH made it clear it was the "family" that handed the file to OG.

One newspapers (can't remember which, might have been The Mirror) reported it was the McCann who handed the dossier over to police, unless that was a misprint.

I don't know if this is it Aiyoyo or a version of it. I found a link to it through Joana Morais' blog (thankyou).

http://www.closeronline.co.uk/2014/10/madeleine-mccann-kate-and-gerry-mccann-call-police-after-being-attacked-by-twitter-trolls#.VDUgOWRdXWH

Kate and Gerry McCann have contacted the police after being subjected to threats from vile Twitter and Facebook trolls.
Shockingly, many of the 80 messages posted on various social media platforms called for the parents of missing Madeleine McCann to be tortured or killed.
Even more alarmingly, some of the threats were even aimed at the McCann’s two remaining children.
One of the tweets read: “These 2 [the McCanns] should burn in hell."
Other trolls wrote: "I hope that the McCanns are living in total misery" and "I want to see them smashed up the back of a bus or trampled by horses".
The McCanns reported the abuse to police after threats were directed at their young children.

A dossier containing the messages was also provided to the police by campaigners supporting the McCanns and their search for missing daughter Maddie.

It's dated the 2nd of October, is it an innaccuracy, just a coincidence or a co-ordinated effort to silence 'trolls' / McCann critics?

by HelenMeg 08.10.14 12:35

Baldrick wrote:Well if it was the Family, you have to ask why....surely they know the police would not act on it. And with the last poss sighting (snowboard girl)
Things must be getting desperate.

Things must indeed be getting desperate

by Tangled Web 08.10.14 12:42

our team that are investigating the, or reviewing the murder of...of sorry, reviewing the missing girl.

This jumped out at me! Seems like he slipped up and said 'investigating the murder of' instead of 'reviewing the missing girl'.

Accidentally on purpose???? I seem to remeber this happened a while back and his words were changed in the actual media reports.

by MRNOODLES 08.10.14 12:45

IMO it confirms what's been said before. The parents get their family to monitor what's being said about them.

The 'm' word slip, gives me a little hope that perhaps OG are trying to do the right thing.

by jozi 08.10.14 12:47

HelenMeg wrote:
Baldrick wrote:Well if it was the Family, you have to ask why....surely they know the police would not act on it. And with the last poss sighting (snowboard girl)
Things must be getting desperate.
Things must indeed be getting desperate

If they did indeed know that the Police would not act, then who gave Sky News and MB the ammunition to act out the Billy Bully tactics, knowing it was against the law !!! Why are they not now being investigated........

by Baldrick 08.10.14 12:49

MRNOODLES wrote:IMO it confirms what's been said before. The parents get their family to monitor what's being said about them.

The 'm' word slip, gives me a little hope that perhaps OG are trying to do the right thing.

Lets hope so, things cannot continue. This is getting out of hand now

by ChippyM 08.10.14 12:51

he has used the word murder before with this case. 20th Feb. 2014 on radio 5 live.

"Sir Bernard Hogan-Howe: I'm just going to... Let me just... let me just help. Where we are at the moment: We've sent three letters of request for international assistance to the Portuguese, errr... Judiciary, because that's the way their system works, and also with the police - we are working closely with them. Errm... obviously the Portuguese police have got a line of inquiry which is different to the Metropolitan Police's but we're working together to try and resolve that. Errm... we're trying our best to keep the family informed and I think in the middle of all this, quite often their torment gets lost. Have they lost a child or, errr... by being murdered or... sadly... or have they lost a child by someone else stealing them.

Nicky Campbell: Awful."

Yes Nicky I agree with you for once!

Again a large amount of errrmms.

by Dont Make Me Laff 08.10.14 12:53

our team that are investigating the, or reviewing the murder of...of sorry, reviewing the missing girl. - ooops BBH - you've said it now, look out you may be carter-rucked soon

by jeanmonroe 08.10.14 13:07

Just an 'aside'

BHH: " it WAS our (Met) SNIFFER dogs that 'alerted' to chief 'suspect's' CADAVAR in Alice Gross 'case'

Still 'notoriously unreliable' EVRD dogs, Gerry?

Have the 'compilers' of the 'troll dossier' been interviewed or do the police 'just take their word for 'it'"?

The WORST 'trolls' ARE 'PRO-MCCANN' supporters (the 'compilers' of the 'dossier')

As 'evidenced' by that McCann supporting 'lady' (dirndllass = Cindy Martin http://www.pinterest.com/dirndllass/) er, disgusting, life threatening, 'tweets' about/to BL, discovered yesterday.

WILL the UK police, or FBI, having jurisdiction for 'Hawaii', be 'investigating' Cindy Martin?

(A 'visit' to Hawaii would be a lovely 'jolly' for OG officers, wouldn't it? Portugal is 'so last year'!)

by Bishop Brennan 08.10.14 13:09

jozi wrote:
HelenMeg wrote:
Baldrick wrote:Well if it was the Family, you have to ask why....surely they know the police would not act on it. And with the last poss sighting (snowboard girl)
Things must be getting desperate.
Things must indeed be getting desperate
If they did indeed know that the Police would not act, then who gave Sky News and MB the ammunition to act out the Billy Bully tactics, knowing it was against the law !!! Why are they not now being investigated........

If BHH is telling us that it was a member of the McCann family that handed the dossier to the police, then perhaps that same family member gave the dossier to Martin Brunt / Sky News - correctly assuming Brunt would leap like an over-eager dog at the bait?

The end result of giving Brunt the dossier was fatal. Any link therefore between Martin Brunt and the McCann Family / their internet monitor would be an important line of enquiry in the upcoming inquest. It may also form part of any criminal proceedings that follow.

by Guest 08.10.14 13:15

Bishop Brennan wrote:If BHH is telling us that it was a member of the McCann family that handed the dossier to the police, then perhaps that same family member gave the dossier to Martin Brunt / Sky News - correctly assuming Brunt would leap like an over-eager dog at the bait?

You have to think so.

Also Stephen Wright of the Daily Mail who appears to have been working in tandem with SKY.

How does that work? What is the relationship between SKY and the Daily Mail?

by biggles 08.10.14 13:29

BlueBag wrote:
Bishop Brennan wrote:If BHH is telling us that it was a member of the McCann family that handed the dossier to the police, then perhaps that same family member gave the dossier to Martin Brunt / Sky News - correctly assuming Brunt would leap like an over-eager dog at the bait?

You have to think so.

Also Stephen Wright of the Daily Mail who appears to have been working in tandem with SKY.

How does that work? What is the relationship between SKY and the Daily Mail?

Might the relationship between the proprietors of SKY & DM, and their relationship with 'the establishment' be more revealing?

DM is particularly hard to understand as it is owned by DMGT - a huge media conglomerate. "Jonathan Harmsworth, 4th Viscount Rothermere is the chairman and controlling shareholder of the company" according to wiki.

http://www.intmensorg.com/pressbarons2.htm

by jeanmonroe 08.10.14 13:33

Are the 'compilers' of the 'dossier' HIDING IN PLAIN SIGHT?

"It's not us guv doing or saying NASTY things, it's THEM lot, or we wouldn't have 'compiled' ANYTHING, that could LEAD back to us, would we?"

TOO LATE.............. PAMELA GURNEY aka JENCALO_AMORAL aka TRULYJUDY73!

Do you honestly think that YOUR 'tweets/remarks/comments' to 'people' haven't also been 'screenshotted/saved'?

THEY HAVE, oh NAIVE one!

And the UK (leicestershire and Metropolitan) police might well shortly be 'receiving' ANOTHER 'dossier' 'detailing' the filthy, disgusting, vile, 'abuse' people, who have the temerity, to not believe the McCann's 'story' without question, get from the likes of yourself and 'others'!

Good luck with that 'one' PAMELA GURNEY, when the police 'come a knocking' on YOUR door!

by jeanmonroe 08.10.14 13:40

However, BHH did say in answer to 'where does abuse become a criminal offense' ... if it is 'racist' 'threatening', if you threaten to kill someone it becomes a crime and can go to prison for 10 years ... if they believe it, and you want them to believe it.

So those ghastly tweets to Brenda, from Raaine/dirndllass threatening her, are far more likely to be considered a criminal offence.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

LET'S SEE WHAT 'BALLS' DCI MAHOGANY HAS TO 'INVESTIGATE' THAT 'LIFE THREATENING', MCCANN FAMILY 'SUPPORTING', TROLL!

EVERYBODY on social media (including MWT, who has 'commented' on it, J GAMBLE) the POLICE, ALL of the UK 'MEDIA' (papers and TV) KNOW, KNOW about the life threatening, vile, 'tweets' sent about and to BL.

BUT HAVE YOU HEARD A SINGLE 'MENTION' OF THAT, ON or IN THE UK 'MADIA' TODAY?

THOUGHT NOT!

by Joss 08.10.14 13:43

jeanmonroe wrote:Just an 'aside'

BHH: " it WAS our (Met) SNIFFER dogs that 'alerted' to chief 'suspect's' CADAVAR in Alice Gross 'case'

Still 'notoriously unreliable' EVRD dogs, Gerry?

Have the 'compilers' of the 'troll dossier' been interviewed or do the police 'just take their word for 'it'"?

The WORST 'trolls' ARE 'PRO-MCCANN' supporters (the 'compilers' of the 'dossier')

As 'evidenced' by that McCann supporting 'lady' (dirndllass = Cindy Martin http://www.pinterest.com/dirndllass/) er, disgusting, life threatening, 'tweets' about/to BL, discovered yesterday.

WILL the UK police, or FBI, having jurisdiction for 'Hawaii', be 'investigating' Cindy Martin?

(A 'visit' to Hawaii would be a lovely 'jolly' for OG officers, wouldn't it? Portugal is 'so last year'!)

If the U.K. & Hawaii have Extradition treaties then it could be a possibility if the FBI or authorities want to bring the person to account for cyber crimes.

by bobbin 08.10.14 13:49

Joss wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:Just an 'aside'

BHH: " it WAS our (Met) SNIFFER dogs that 'alerted' to chief 'suspect's' CADAVAR in Alice Gross 'case'

Still 'notoriously unreliable' EVRD dogs, Gerry?

Have the 'compilers' of the 'troll dossier' been interviewed or do the police 'just take their word for 'it'"?

The WORST 'trolls' ARE 'PRO-MCCANN' supporters (the 'compilers' of the 'dossier')

As 'evidenced' by that McCann supporting 'lady' (dirndllass = Cindy Martin http://www.pinterest.com/dirndllass/) er, disgusting, life threatening, 'tweets' about/to BL, discovered yesterday.

WILL the UK police, or FBI, having jurisdiction for 'Hawaii', be 'investigating' Cindy Martin?

(A 'visit' to Hawaii would be a lovely 'jolly' for OG officers, wouldn't it? Portugal is 'so last year'!)

If the U.K. & Hawaii have Extradition treaties then it could be a possibility if the FBI or authorities want to bring the person to account for cyber crimes.

Hawaii is one of the American states so USA /UK laws would apply.

by sallypelt 08.10.14 14:00

bobbin wrote:
Joss wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:Just an 'aside'

BHH: " it WAS our (Met) SNIFFER dogs that 'alerted' to chief 'suspect's' CADAVAR in Alice Gross 'case'

Still 'notoriously unreliable' EVRD dogs, Gerry?

Have the 'compilers' of the 'troll dossier' been interviewed or do the police 'just take their word for 'it'"?

The WORST 'trolls' ARE 'PRO-MCCANN' supporters (the 'compilers' of the 'dossier')

As 'evidenced' by that McCann supporting 'lady' (dirndllass = Cindy Martin http://www.pinterest.com/dirndllass/) er, disgusting, life threatening, 'tweets' about/to BL, discovered yesterday.

WILL the UK police, or FBI, having jurisdiction for 'Hawaii', be 'investigating' Cindy Martin?

(A 'visit' to Hawaii would be a lovely 'jolly' for OG officers, wouldn't it? Portugal is 'so last year'!)

If the U.K. & Hawaii have Extradition treaties then it could be a possibility if the FBI or authorities want to bring the person to account for cyber crimes.
Hawaii is one of the American states so USA /UK laws would apply.

If the person is American, then Americans have far more freedom when it comes to free speech, and in the eyes of American law, she/he won't be seen to have said anything worthy of punishment. Sad as it may seem.

by Rogue-a-Tory 08.10.14 14:08

HelenMeg wrote:
Baldrick wrote:Well if it was the Family, you have to ask why....surely they know the police would not act on it. And with the last poss sighting (snowboard girl)
Things must be getting desperate.
Things must indeed be getting desperate

Desperate & stupid. What exactly would a smart lawyer for an accused 'troll' encourage their client to say in defence? Any comments over 48 questions, statement inconsistencies, dogs, checking, photos etc would have to be reported in a high profile trial by MSM. TM are turkeys voting for Christmas IMO.

by Joss 08.10.14 14:09

bobbin wrote:
Joss wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:Just an 'aside'

BHH: " it WAS our (Met) SNIFFER dogs that 'alerted' to chief 'suspect's' CADAVAR in Alice Gross 'case'

Still 'notoriously unreliable' EVRD dogs, Gerry?

Have the 'compilers' of the 'troll dossier' been interviewed or do the police 'just take their word for 'it'"?

The WORST 'trolls' ARE 'PRO-MCCANN' supporters (the 'compilers' of the 'dossier')

As 'evidenced' by that McCann supporting 'lady' (dirndllass = Cindy Martin http://www.pinterest.com/dirndllass/) er, disgusting, life threatening, 'tweets' about/to BL, discovered yesterday.

WILL the UK police, or FBI, having jurisdiction for 'Hawaii', be 'investigating' Cindy Martin?

(A 'visit' to Hawaii would be a lovely 'jolly' for OG officers, wouldn't it? Portugal is 'so last year'!)

If the U.K. & Hawaii have Extradition treaties then it could be a possibility if the FBI or authorities want to bring the person to account for cyber crimes.
Hawaii is one of the American states so USA /UK laws would apply.

Yes, from what i know the two countries do have an extradition treaty from having followed the Meredith Kercher case.

Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Re: Sir Bernard Hogan Howe says Grange is a MURDER investigation in latest interview.

Latest topics